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Libertarian Thread (Was: Gary Johnson Thread) (1 Viewer)

I answered every question, and tried as much as I could to stick to just Yes and No, and I got 87% for Johnson, 82% Stein, 72% Clinton, 65% Castle, 58% Trump.  Seems reasonably accurate.  I think the key is to stick to Yes/No, and pick Least Important when those two answers don't really work for you.

 
I'm an example and been pretty honest about this throughout.  If I were in a close / swing state, I'd have to suck it up and vote Hillary.  Just too much to risk with the Supreme Court and civil liberties not to mention the many sided danger dice roll that Trump presents.

As I'm in NY and don't have to worry about that, I'm going GJ. As I did four years ago.
If you're in a faithless elector state, and neither candidate reaches 270 electoral college votes due to Johnson picking up states in a close race, the makeup of your state representatives in the House (who would vote in that case) is critical. I live in PA, and a majority of our HoR's are Republicans. As a faithless vote state, the Representatives are not breaking state law going against the state popular vote in the event 270 votes is not reached by a single candidate and voting however they wish to do so.

With that said, while I'm with Gary, if he really starts gaining momentum and gets into the debates, this election could be a complete unpredictable :tfp: if it's close and Johnson wins some states putting the above scenario into play.I'm kind of shocked this isn't being discussed more. I'm sure it will if Johnson makes it into the debates.

Those states without such laws are as follows: Kentucky, North Dakota, Louisiana, Arizona, Arkansas, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Minnesota, Delaware, South Dakota, Montana, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Georgia, Utah, Idaho, New Hampshire, Illinois, New Jersey, Indiana, West Virginia, Iowa, New York, Kansas

 
After tonight they are going to flip and Weld is going to be the top of the ticket.  He actually does have a bit more gravitas about him as compared to Gary.

 
If you're in a faithless elector state, and neither candidate reaches 270 electoral college votes due to Johnson picking up states in a close race, the makeup of your state representatives in the House (who would vote in that case) is critical.
Not quite sure where you are coming from (I'm missing the nuance, sorry). :shrug:

I will still be voting downballot for state and local elections. What am I missing here? 

 
What happens if no presidential candidate gets 270 Electoral votes?

If no candidate receives a majority of Electoral votes, the House of Representatives elects the President from the 3 Presidential candidates who received the most Electoral votes. Each state delegation has one vote. The Senate would elect the Vice President from the 2 Vice Presidential candidates with the most Electoral votes. Each Senator would cast one vote for Vice President. If the House of Representatives fails to elect a President by Inauguration Day, the Vice-President Elect serves as acting President until the deadlock is resolved in the House.
http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/faq.html

 
Like Weld a lot.
How we end up with what we do, with god knows how many Weld's that are out there (non ideologues who seem willing to compromise, think critically and dare I say, govern) is shameful.

I do really like Weld from what I see though. And while I'm sure we disagree on some key issues, he seems someone you can rationale discuss a solution with as opposed to just dig in your heels. 

 
How we end up with what we do, with god knows how many Weld's that are out there (non ideologues who seem willing to compromise, think critically and dare I say, govern) is shameful.

I do really like Weld from what I see though. And while I'm sure we disagree on some key issues, he seems someone you can rationale discuss a solution with as opposed to just dig in your heels. 
I think that's why I'm drawn to the Johnson/Weld ticket. They say the best presidents have been across the aisle leaders, willing to compromise. That's basically built into this party's philosophy. Big fan of this ticket.

 
Weld is the elder statesmen "progressive" Republican that I assumed would eventually have brought me under the wings of that party.   Had it not run so far, far away in the direction of crazy.

 
And he seems to be doing the better "politician" stuff: hitting talking points and telling stories. 
Honestly, if this ticket were reversed, I don't think 15% would be a question.  

I mentioned earlier how one of GJ's big detractions is his inability to sometimes clearly eloquate the base issue.  Thats a talking point, and providing context (telling stories as you put it). And general doofiness (I keep going back to that awful Samantha Bee showing).

 
I think his play to 15% and the debates needs to go through Hillary. Trump is self destructing as many would have suspected and Gary can always pummel him more if he gets on the stage for the debates, but I think he really needs to pivot to make his case against Hillary. She's getting the "I'm not Trump" bump coming out of her convention and he needs to stem that movement towards his cause.

If I were him, I'd be trumpeting that I were just as socially liberal as she was but would be more responsible with your tax money. That draws from both sides but also lets him position himself as a Hillary alternative much more so than he's done up to this point.
And that he'd be more responsible with national security, more responsible with meddling in the Middle East..as she has been reckless in those areas

 
How we end up with what we do, with god knows how many Weld's that are out there (non ideologues who seem willing to compromise, think critically and dare I say, govern) is shameful.

I do really like Weld from what I see though. And while I'm sure we disagree on some key issues, he seems someone you can rationale discuss a solution with as opposed to just dig in your heels. 
Independents are now 42 % of the electorate as of January....we are letting the party zealots who didn't defect pick the candidates that will get media coverage....time to for the 42% to stand up 

 
The "oops, terrorism" response does not elicit much confidence.  Understanding what he's saying, but you gotta message that a little better GJ.
 

 
:lmao:

Prostitution, really digging into how to make America great again!

JFC, who permitted this question? Bigger fish to fry.

 
Man, they really need to flip the ticket. I like them both, but I think Weld could hold his own - possibly - in a debate with Hillary and Trump. Johnson wouldn't get a word in with those two, he comes off way too soft to me.

 
Man, they really need to flip the ticket. I like them both, but I think Weld could hold his own - possibly - in a debate with Hillary and Trump. Johnson wouldn't get a word in with those two, he comes off way too soft to me.
Probably too late to make the change. They were both fine.  Surprised that didn't bring up taxes

 
Probably too late to make the change. They were both fine.  Surprised that didn't bring up taxes
Kind of did just not directly when the one lady asked about why she should vote for them as a Bernie supporter. Said that's his contrast, where he believes in small government. Missed the window to expand into tax policy, which is crucial to support why or why not that's a good or bad thing.

 
Just watched the townhall. Very impressive. They are well on the way to earning my vote. I wish they would have asked questions involving what they see as the role of government in regulating things like food, water, drugs, air, etc as typical libertarian policy leaves so much to the free market. Also want their views on global climate change as personally I think this is something we need to tackle in a meaningful way. I'm worried they may say it's not the government's role but personally if you believe the scientists we are talking a matter of national security.

I didn't necessarily like Gary's answer on guns but at same time appreciate that he's a realist. 

Finally, Weld is extremely likable.

Edit: avatar updated, at least for the moment.

 
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:lmao:

Prostitution, really digging into how to make America great again!

JFC, who permitted this question? Bigger fish to fry.
I actually think this is a huge issue.  Do to its black market nature, thousands of women and children are exploited.  Some are trafficked and enslaved.  Its not a good thing.  A legal market ends that stuff immediately.  Plus brings a billion dollar market into the realm of taxation.

 
I actually think this is a huge issue.  Do to its black market nature, thousands of women and children are exploited.  Some are trafficked and enslaved.  Its not a good thing.  A legal market ends that stuff immediately.  Plus brings a billion dollar market into the realm of taxation.
I agree with the thinking here, but I think getting him taken seriously is the more immediate need. Johnson/Weld should be able to do that based upon their platform, and hope to get into the debates. Harping on prostitution is IMO not helping the ticket get taken seriously.

 
I actually think this is a huge issue.  Do to its black market nature, thousands of women and children are exploited.  Some are trafficked and enslaved.  Its not a good thing.  A legal market ends that stuff immediately.  Plus brings a billion dollar market into the realm of taxation.
And the guy's question wasn't really about prostitution. His question was basically: Where do you stand on the more "out there" Libertarian stances? Prostitution was just the example the guy used in his question. 

 
Independents are now 42 % of the electorate as of January....we are letting the party zealots who didn't defect pick the candidates that will get media coverage....time to for the 42% to stand up 
Probably 70-80% of those people aren't independent.  Most are Rs who've become embarrassed to be part of the party over the last decade.  And now some are Ds who hate Clinton.

 
Relatedly... I was just looking at some new polls, and they're showing Johnson at 8% and 12%.  I think what's happening is that Trump's latest round of Gold Star goofballery has finally driven some Rs out of his corner and to Johnson.

FWIW, I haven't seen anything yet that suggests he or his party are building anything sustainable -- it appears to be mostly a protest vote.

 
Relatedly... I was just looking at some new polls, and they're showing Johnson at 8% and 12%.  I think what's happening is that Trump's latest round of Gold Star goofballery has finally driven some Rs out of his corner and to Johnson.

FWIW, I haven't seen anything yet that suggests he or his party are building anything sustainable -- it appears to be mostly a protest vote.
If there was ever an opportunity to gain 3rd party momentum, the 2016 election cycle is it. The best the two-party system could come up with is Hillary and Donald as America's choices. I like Johnson/Weld's politics, but even a protest vote gets the Libertarian party more attention. They should try to seize it.

 
If there was ever an opportunity to gain 3rd party momentum, the 2016 election cycle is it. The best the two-party system could come up with is Hillary and Donald as America's choices. I like Johnson/Weld's politics, but even a protest vote gets the Libertarian party more attention. They should try to seize it.
:goodposting:

 
Just watched the townhall. Very impressive. They are well on the way to earning my vote. I wish they would have asked questions involving what they see as the role of government in regulating things like food, water, drugs, air, etc as typical libertarian policy leaves so much to the free market. Also want their views on global climate change as personally I think this is something we need to tackle in a meaningful way. I'm worried they may say it's not the government's role but personally if you believe the scientists we are talking a matter of national security.

I didn't necessarily like Gary's answer on guns but at same time appreciate that he's a realist. 

Finally, Weld is extremely likable.

Edit: avatar updated, at least for the moment.
Can't speak to all of it but their policy on environment is the government should be involved because it's not a personal freedom issue but a greater good issue 

 
I hope the republican Trump voters who are voting for him just because he is not Hillary, quickly realize that Trump's chances of winning are going to zero with the way he is campaigning. A lot of my friends have been saying they won't vote for Johnson because he can't win. Well, with Trump self-imploding, he can't win either. Momentum is a funny thing and if Johnson gets some, there are whole lot of people whose loyalties to Hillary and Trump are thin enough that they could decide to jump onto the Johnson bandwagon (if it gets moving).

I am not expecting Johnson to win or even to come close, but it would not surprise me if it did actually happen.

 
I hope the republican Trump voters who are voting for him just because he is not Hillary, quickly realize that Trump's chances of winning are going to zero with the way he is campaigning. A lot of my friends have been saying they won't vote for Johnson because he can't win. Well, with Trump self-imploding, he can't win either. Momentum is a funny thing and if Johnson gets some, there are whole lot of people whose loyalties to Hillary and Trump are thin enough that they could decide to jump onto the Johnson bandwagon (if it gets moving).

I am not expecting Johnson to win or even to come close, but it would not surprise me if it did actually happen.
I think the big things the Libertarian party is lacking to make a serious run are money (to get the word out), a place in the debates (to get their platform out there front and center) and endorsements (to get their name out there in the press). As you can see from the DNCLeaks, the press controls things to an extent in what message gets sent out to the voters. It doesn't fit CNN or Fox's agenda for the Libertarians to rise, as their not aligned with the Libertarian party. This party will need some big help to move up and have a chance to seize the voters you mentioned above in light of what's going on with Trump's implosion and some voters' disdain for Hillary. I'd like for this movement to continue, but it needs a push to be taken seriously with the general voting population.

 
With Clinton having a (significant) boost in the polls, it appears that GJ is pulling from considerably more Republicans in PA and MI, as Hillary does better in polls with other parties included.  Seems that the recent barrage of ignorance by camp Trump may finally be forcing more Republicans to seriously look into other options. 

http://www.cnn.com/2016/08/04/politics/clinton-leads-trump-three-states/index.html
Insanity - Doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different outcomes. That's basically the Trump campaign right now vs. how it operated during the Republican primaries. People are looking for a lifeboat who are moderate Republicans, or are just flat out not on board with Trump as the nominee. It has arrived in the form of Johnson/Weld if they evaluate the Libertarian ticket vs. Trump Pence with an open mind.

 

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