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i guess my point is that if i were to hire an employee with zero experience, i would fully expect them to #### up for the first couple of years and then expect to see improvement.

Unless you think you can do better, which they obviously do.

But yes, it's all a big circle of flying cow dung.

We did draft a project immature party animal in JOhnny Football. He has acted like people pretty much thought he would, and has also been a total project on the field like we thought he would. Should we keep him cause we knew these things before drafting him? Bit of a more extreme analogy, but sometimes enough is enough. What's our record the last 25 games? How terrible have our 1st round picks and FA signings been?

It wasn't working, and was pretty clear it wasn't going to work, so we had to move on. I am sure Halsam expected them to #### up, but not completely #### the bed every week of the year for two years without ever washing it.

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Hard to agree that teams should want the offensive mind and QB whisperer at HC when most of the last Super Bowl winning coaches came up as DCs, while a lot of their QB gurus won their Super Bowls as position coaches then bombed as HCs.

Haven't added them all up, but pretty sure there have been a lot more successful DC to HC transitions than OC to HC, even in the modern era only.

Are we really going to compare the Browns or a team in their situation to the much more stable Patriots, Ravens and Packers organizations?

Teams no longer let a young QB prospect like Aaron Rodgers or Steve McNair or Carson Palmer sit for a year or years anymore. If you are a bad team, and one who has been bad for a while, odds are you don't have a stable QB situation. If you get a nice young QB prospect, he's not going to sit very long, if at all, he's going to get thrown into the fire.

Given those conditions, in the modern game, in current times, what is going to help him transition better to the NFL? A head coach with an offensive pedigree and a history with QB1s or a defensive guy?

GMs no longer get the rope to transition through 2-3 head coaches and head coaches no longer get the rope to transition between 2-3 QB projects.

If you stabilize your QB1 situation, you can bring the rest of your team up to speed in some fashion.

If you try to stabilize your defense, two things can happen. It fails, in which case you have a much shakier road to stability for QB1 development and no defense. Or your defense is a wild success, in which case, you win just enough to not get in the range of the top picks where the best QB1 prospects go, and your only option is to gut future drafts to trade up or mine the journeyman circuit in free agency for a JAG. You've essentially created a treadmill team, one not good enough to contend, but never quite bad enough to get that critical high draft pick it needs.

The fastest road to stability for many of these long suffering franchises is to stabilize the QB1 position. Sorry, I think this just bears out in the basic eyeball test. And these long suffering and battered franchises like the Browns likely have a shorter window and higher pressure to succeed against the odds.

solving and developing a QB can be easily achieved at a level below HC though. Plenty of hot prospects over the past decade that cut their teeth as QB coaches on someone else's stafff. In fact I suspect position coach and OC have a lot more face time with the young QB than any HC.

In DC for instance, both Zorn and Gruden were brought in for supposedly being good at handling young QBs. Both found they couldn't juggle all the responsibilities of HC and still work their QB magic. Cousins' emergence this season corresponds to the adding of a QB coach to the staff. Coincidence?

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The one thing that has to happen is to find a starting QB. McCown is OK for now. JF minus the baggage could have been ok for now. I have flipped flopped so many times on JF. I thought that Browns drafting was a huge mistake. A few months ago, I saw some potential and thought the Browns could try to build around him. Now I am back to just trading him for whatever you can get from Dallas and start fresh to avoid the huge JF distraction. The Browns need to focus on football, not the JF reality show.

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I have no idea how we are going to use analytics but there is a high school coach down in Arkansas who took a losing team and turned them into state champions using analytics. I had heard of him before but had forgotten about him. He is the guy who nearly always goes for it on fourth down and rarely punts. He also uses the on-side kick nearly every time as well.

He did an interview with ESPN Cleveland's Bruce Hooley and its interesting and really fun to hear this guy and his philosophy and how and why analytics works for him.

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=14526699

Kevin Kelley with Hooley and Dino

Hooley and Dino get a lesson on football analytics from Pulaski Academy Head Coach Kevin Kelley, nationally renowned for never punting and always onside kicking.

Edited by Bracie Smathers
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People are focusing too much on the draft in regards to all the analytics buzz. Sure, they will play a part of the draft process. But there are alot of other areas in which they are going to use the numbers. Free agency (huge, imo), game strategy (look at the one example Banner gave when he was on ESPN the other day), even practice. Those are simple...I'm sure there are countless other things they are going to try also.

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I think the Hue Jackson talk is a good move.

A guy who should have gotten another shot, and has a good rapport with players.

I think Cleveland could do a lot worse at HC.

He's just using us as leverage for a better contract with the Giants.

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Browns now finalizing deal to hire Bengals OC Hue Jackson as their next HC, per sources. Close to being wrapped up, per sources.

:thumbup:

Good news. hue knows the division. He has NFL HC experience. He is a leader of men. And since the owner announced the parameters of how the organization is structured, he obviously must have bought in.

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Some instant Twitter feedback.

--------

Can't imagine Browns could have done better than this, effectively slaying the 'no one wants to go there' storyline.

I’m pretty excited about Hue Jackson. This is a lot different from the Chud & Pettine hires.

Shane Alexander Retweeted Adam Schefter

Props to the Browns. You have to feel good about any of the Top 4-5 QB prospects going to Cleveland.

Love this hire for the #Browns. Jimmy Haslam is a closer.

Hue Jackson decided to come to Cleveland before even interviewing with the Giants &, based on reports, over the Niners! Great sign 4 future

I never thought the Browns would be able to land Hue Jackson. Nice coup for this team. Hopefully, he's the right guy.

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This is a very good hire. Hue did a good job in his brief as the HC of the Raiders.

I thought he did a good job on the field but was a little lacking in the CEO part of the job that is required of a head coach but I'm betting he learned from his time with the Raiders and will be better for it. I think it's a good hire as well.

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For fantasy impact you can almost guarantee the Browns sign Marvin Jones or Sanu, if not both.

Hue may also want to make a trade for AJ Mac.

Assuming AJ McCarron was a potential franchise QB (he isn't imo), why would the Bengals be willing to trade him within the division?

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Cleveland is Hue-Jack-City. :)

Possible fantasy ramifications.

--------------------------------------

Hue Jackson to Cleveland. Could Colin Kaepernick follow? ... #49ers, #Browns http://sacb.ee/5bI9

Knowing Hue, wouldn't be shocked if first words at presser are, "Hello everyone, I'm Hue Jackson. The Browns are releasing Johnny Manziel."

#Bengals OC Hue Jack's new city-Cleveland. Why was he such a hot candidate? "He's a leader." http://cin.ci/1RlTd06

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For fantasy impact you can almost guarantee the Browns sign Marvin Jones or Sanu, if not both.

Hue may also want to make a trade for AJ Mac.

Assuming AJ McCarron was a potential franchise QB (he isn't imo), why would the Bengals be willing to trade him within the division?

Not sure why that would matter if the compensation was fair. Also Hue may believe he could potentially be a franchise QB based on their experience together.

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This is a very good hire. Hue did a good job in his brief as the HC of the Raiders.

I thought he did a good job on the field but was a little lacking in the CEO part of the job that is required of a head coach but I'm betting he learned from his time with the Raiders and will be better for it. I think it's a good hire as well.

As my mom would say, 'He's got a mouth on him.'

Hue hasn't mastered the art of coach-speak. Maybe he has changed since his last chance in Oakland, but he wasn't a kid then, either. He's brash, and speaks his mind. He'll be a great interview.

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Great get. Thought he was the top HC candidate available, and obviously has AFC North familiarity.

Loved Kaep. Talked more than once about wanting him in the draft and SF "stole him." Wouldn't be shocked to see that marriage.

Good/Excellent offensive mind. Many players have had 'career years' under Jackson. Maximized AJ McCarron. Should be interesting. Work cut out for him in Cleveland but as good a hire as could be expected for any team needing a coach.

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Couldn't be more excited! Hue was my first choice for them, and I can't wait to see what he brings to the table. Just hearing the twitterverse excitement from players and all is worth it. Players from everywhere he has coached are calling out to congratulate him and speak some praise to the Browns. Definitely feels like the right hire, and brings some instant credibility among players and coaches.

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I honestly can't understand why he would take this job over the Giants. Hopefully Rohypnol wasn't involved.

NY isn't changing the way they do things. I read somewhere Cle might offer more input/power in regards to the 53 than NY would. Just recalling what I read...

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Other than initially trying to snub them out of their SB tickets I actually agree with the Browns handling of this. Why would you pay an outgoing staff to attend the Senior Bowl, network for another job and possibly get in some scouting work when the that knowledge is used by someone else.

Only thing that surprised me about this article is that is common place apparently for teams to pay for outgoing staffs to attend the Senior Bowl.

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Other than initially trying to snub them out of their SB tickets I actually agree with the Browns handling of this. Why would you pay an outgoing staff to attend the Senior Bowl, network for another job and possibly get in some scouting work when the that knowledge is used by someone else.

Only thing that surprised me about this article is that is common place apparently for teams to pay for outgoing staffs to attend the Senior Bowl.

THINKING AHEAD!!!!11!!

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For fantasy impact you can almost guarantee the Browns sign Marvin Jones or Sanu, if not both.

Hue may also want to make a trade for AJ Mac.

Assuming AJ McCarron was a potential franchise QB (he isn't imo), why would the Bengals be willing to trade him within the division?

Not sure why that would matter if the compensation was fair. Also Hue may believe he could potentially be a franchise QB based on their experience together.

Really? You think a team would want to give another team in their division a potential franchise quarterback? The compensation would have to be otherwise crippling to the other team in order for any team to even consider it.

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  • Joe Bryant changed the title to 2021 Cleveland Browns -

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