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Cleveland Browns (11 Viewers)
- Thread starter wadegarrett
- Start date
MAC_32
Footballguy
We'll never know, but it sure seemed like this is where Sashi's plan was going. His group did a good job mining the bottom of the barrell. Figure once those high picks stated becoming both selections and tools for more future assets that both silos would come together for a complete team - higher end starters + quality (cheap) depth.
Also, vets want to go to New England. Bill knows this. He can't build a roster around them, but he sure can build contingency plans with them involved. Just imagine if he could actually draft well too..
DocHolliday
Footballguy
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Those types of players avoid us and flock to the top teams though.
Players will take less money to go to NE and need more money to come here. We end up having to pay double or more what it takes NE to get a quality depth player.
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Peak
Footballguy
Hue had one job with the Senior Bowl, and he pissed that away too....ridiculous...
Don’t be shocked if #Browns aren’t invited to coach at senior bowl again this year. This is not an isolated opinion. - Darryl Ruiter
Don’t be shocked if #Browns aren’t invited to coach at senior bowl again this year. This is not an isolated opinion. - Darryl Ruiter
Bobcat10
Footballguy
Doesn't surprise me one bit with Huey.Hue had one job with the Senior Bowl, and he pissed that away too....ridiculous...
Don’t be shocked if #Browns aren’t invited to coach at senior bowl again this year. This is not an isolated opinion. - Darryl Ruiter
Peak
Footballguy
Hue could see an early exit in 2018 season, per JLC
Not a fan of LaCanfora, but I could see this happening. No owner should be happy with a 1-31 coach. If for some reason Haslam truly believes that Jackson didn't get a fair shot at winning in 2017, he has to perform right out of the gate in 2018. I'd have to think Hue is on a very short leash.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Hue had one job with the Senior Bowl, and he pissed that away too....ridiculous...
Don’t be shocked if #Browns aren’t invited to coach at senior bowl again this year. This is not an isolated opinion. - Darryl Ruiter
I remember that there was quite a stink raised about how bad it was for scouts to get any kind of read on the players during the practices.
Peak
Footballguy
I read that the way Hue handled the Sr Bowl last year, it wasn't a surprise. The Browns had somewhere over 50 representatives there, and the practices were viewed as unorganized and not very useful for game preparation.
amnesiac
beer is good
mr fancypants
Footballguy
IIRC it wasn't just a pure trade for the 2nd rd pick. The Browns also threw in a 2017 4th Rd. pick and receive a 2017 6th rd. pick back in the trade.
mr fancypants
Footballguy
The more crap you hear the more mind boggling it gets on how Hue was ever regarded as a top head coaching candidate in the 1st place.
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MAC_32
Footballguy
He has friends in the media. Friends Jimmy speaks with. It's not difficult to see the problem if you step out of your bubble, but Jimmy is comfortable inside his cocoon.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
It's just sad because, no joke, Browns fans are so loyal to their team.
Imagine if there was no "league" umbrella for teams to play under but instead operated in a sort of open market. How long ago would this business have had to declare bankruptcy and liquidate it's assets? They are the TWA/Enron/Lehman Brothers of the NFL.
I feel for fans because there really doesn't seem to be any light at the end of the tunnel.
Imagine if there was no "league" umbrella for teams to play under but instead operated in a sort of open market. How long ago would this business have had to declare bankruptcy and liquidate it's assets? They are the TWA/Enron/Lehman Brothers of the NFL.
I feel for fans because there really doesn't seem to be any light at the end of the tunnel.
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ghostguy123
Footballguy
BassNBrew
Footballguy
And 16 losses.
Amazing that management has been able to shape fan opinion to believe that they are doing a great job and actually applaud them for trading for bad and expensive players. I would much prefer trading a second for Grapolo than getting a second for Osweiler.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Fair to wonder, though, if the Browns would have had any shot of signing Garappolo long term after this season.
beer 30
Footballguy
Or that after going 1-31 he has, on multiple occasions, been reassured by the owner he will be welcomed back for a third season but hey
As far as Garappolo I still believe Belichick has a hard on for the Browns from his time coaching here and intentionally ####s them every chance he gets.
amnesiac
beer is good
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
True, but I don't think that would have been a great PR move either.
There has to be some sort of understanding in a situation like this between acquiring team and player that there would be a long term deal hammered out. I would imagine a guy like JG would be able to say to a team he didn't want to play for, "Sure, trade for me. But I have no intention on signing a long term deal. And that tag is really expensive."
ghostguy123
Footballguy
If no deal he gets tagged. There is no way around that. No idea what you are getting at, but whatever it is has no chance of happening.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
A good move is a good move despite anything else that happened.
Paying salary cap that wont affect our cap past this year for pick 35 was a good move no matter how much you hate the organization.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
I know he would get tagged but the player doesn't have to agree to a long term deal. See: Kirk Cousins. It's one thing to deal with it when you drafted the guy but another to trade into the situation.
And keep this in context. This was just along with the idea of "I would much prefer trading a second for Grapolo than getting a second for Osweiler".
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G
Guest
Guest
The 49ers have said they aren't worried because they can use the franchise tag. Jimmy G has been asked numerous times if he wants to be with the 49ers and he won't say. When Lynch was asked about it he wasn't worried about it. Jimmy G's side wanted contract talks to start after the season. Since, the 49ers have a lot of cap space and they want Jimmy G, can't see why he wouldn't sign. Jimmy G has played through his rookie contract and now will let his agent handle things.
PR move? Why should the 49ers worry about that? They already had to make a tough decision when they waived Bowman. They are smart enough to know everyone thinks they are experts. When they signed the free agents and drafted the players they wanted people complained, made fun, quite a bit of venom was displayed. The only way to shut up most of the complainers is to win. I saw the same thing during the Walsh years when a reporter complained about Montana and his wife not using birth control.
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Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
I wasn't talking about the 49ers situation. I was talking about a hypothetical Browns situation.
There had to have been at least a little mutual interest expressed in San Francisco.
The PR part was about attracting people to your team. I was saying if the Browns traded for JG without regards to his feelings about it, and essentially made him play for them whether he likes it or not by using the tag, that it would not make the organization look better to players considering where they're going to play next. And that's not something the Browns can afford.
I think there's a huge difference between the perception of the 49ers, who look like they've simply bottomed out, versus the Browns who are just simply the bottom.
hoffman0001
Footballguy
Your not getting Jimmy G, forget about it. I doubt any free agent QB that is worth starting will want to come to Cleveland regardless of the $$$, thery know they will lose 2-3 years o their career and QB's go to Cleveland to die. Luckily you have draft picks to pick yet another rookie QB. Good thing the Browns have such a great history of picking QB's.
I'm sure they will find away to pass on the find of the draft (Wentz, Watson) and find the bust (see all past rookie QB's drafted by the brokers the last 18 years).
Yay Browns......let's go to 1-15....dare to dream.
I'm sure they will find away to pass on the find of the draft (Wentz, Watson) and find the bust (see all past rookie QB's drafted by the brokers the last 18 years).
Yay Browns......let's go to 1-15....dare to dream.
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ghostguy123
Footballguy
We all would, but JG was never an option for a 2nd.
Even if he was it would have nothing to do with the Brock deal
Bobcat10
Footballguy
Exactly. If anything, it gave more ammo to get JG, who we probably had no shot at ever getting unless we grossly overpaid NE (include #1 overall, plus more, assuming it was possible).
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Up until he was traded for one.
Sashi botched that one, pure and simple. It could have been a home run too. Trade $16M of cap space, get the 2nd, flip that for JG, and sign him to a long term deal.
Those are not mutually exclusive. Trading for Osweiler plus the 2nd was a great move by itself. What else were they going to spend the money on? They were on the tanking plan and wanted to hold that equity. Picks are like value batteries, they don't start losing charge until you use them. If they had signed say AJ Bouye they would wasted 1-2 years of his playing potential. Instead they grab the 2nd and use it later when they can get all of the value out of it. Just imagine if Sashi weren't asleep at the wheel and they had gotten JG with it.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
I guess you are just now starting to pay attention to this?? JG was not available to the BROWNS
Bobcat10
Footballguy
There is a huge gaping hole here that nobody besides a few people within the Berea and NE walls can answer. You can't say what you said with certainty just like I can't (and don't) say that NE was never going to trade the Browns JG with certainty.
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Hankmoody
Footballguy
Nope, been watching since Halloween, when Sashi was out trick or treating with his kids instead of burning up the phones on the eve of the trade deadline. You have no idea if he would have been available to the Browns or not. Nobody does except for perhaps a select few between those two franchises.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
I sure can. JG was definitely available for a 2nd round pick and irrefutable proof exists. He was traded for a 2nd round pick. I didn't say Cleveland could have gotten him, nor did the guy I quoted. We'll never know if Cleveland could have gotten him or not because they never tried. I would be willing to bet large sums of money however, that if NEP was willing to take SFO's then they would have been at least equally as willing, if not more, to take Cleveland's, as that was projected to be higher at that moment in time. The only thing that might have affected that would be if JG had a strong preference against Cleveland. That's certainly possible. But again, no one knows because Sashi wasn't in even in the building, let alone making inquiries, when it mattered most.
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Bobcat10
Footballguy
You're saying with certainty that Sashi botched a JG trade by not ever trying to get JG. I'm not seeing where you get these so called facts. The only fact is what you bolded, what SF got JG for, and that has nothing to do with what Sashi may or may not have attempted for JG during his reign. I don't feel like I'm being stubborn or complicated here, so we'll just have to agree to disagree.
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Hankmoody
Footballguy
I've done nothing of the sort. I've said could, might, and maybe about 1/2 a dozen times around all of these. I've also said repeatedly we'll never know. What I did say is he botched the opportunity for it to happen by not ever trying, and that's because he did. It was widely reported that he didn't even know JG was available, and he wasn't in the building as of about 5:00 that night, you have to know this if you pay any attention to the Browns at all.
Bobcat10
Footballguy
You just said it again. That's what I said you said. There is nothing coulda, shoulda, might, or maybe about what I bolded. You're saying the Browns never contacted NE about JG in the 1.5 years Sashi reigned.
It's been WIDELY reported that the Browns have talked and made offers to NE about JG since Sashi took over, so I'm not sure how you can say the Browns never once, not a single time, tried to get JG. I'm sorry you've only paid attention to Hue's leaky ### in October.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
You do know opportunity means something that may or may not happen, right?You just said it again. That's what I said you said. There is nothing coulda, shoulda, might, or maybe about what I bolded. You're saying the Browns never contacted NE about JG in the 1.5 years Sashi reigned.
It's been WIDELY reported that the Browns have talked and made offers to NE about JG since Sashi took over, so I'm not sure how you can say the Browns never once, not a single time, tried to get JG. I'm sorry you've only paid attention to Hue's leaky ### in October.
Bobcat10
Footballguy
Wow, you said he NEVER TRIED to get the wonderful OPPORTUNITY to trade with the NE Patriots. This is not difficult. Sorry, I'm done. Carry on.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
In the post before that I specifically referred to the trade deadline, when he was actually traded (for a 2nd rounder). Those are two very different windows of opportunity. But sure, perhaps he was trying earlier in the season.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I'll start off with saying I have no idea whether or not the Browns and Pats had any discussions at the deadline about JG, but would Sashi really need to be in the office to do so? Couldn't he be on his cell?
Plus wasn't the story going around that the Browns and Bengals had a deal worked out for AJ McCarron - but the forms were faxed in too late? Doesn't that indicate that Sashi was around up until the last minutes of the deadline?
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
A free agent QB signs for many reasons and the top reason is money.
Minnesota has three QBs who can start and ALL OF THEM are unrestricted free agents.
The one with the most experience, Sam Bradford is on his third team and his contract is/was at $18 million+.
Only two teams have the sort of cap space to sign him, San Francisco and Cleveland who rank #1 and #2 in available cap space.
No other team that needs a starting caliber QB can compete with Cleveland if they want Bradford.
Sam would be a perfect veteran tutor/place holder for a rookie for a year or two and he'd 'likely' get a two year prove-it deal just as he did in Minnesota who can't afford to resign him or they'd lose Keenum or Teddy.
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Hankmoody
Footballguy
The reports were that he didn't even know JG was available until told later that the trade was completed. Even so, I don't know how you aren't in the office during the most important day a GM has in the regular season.
The McCarron trade was the next afternoon/evening, 4:00 trade deadline on the 1st.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
Bradfords broken down body is not what the Browns need. He will last a few games and the Browns will throw their next unprepared rookie onto the field for hue to mismanage and blame for their woes.
amnesiac
beer is good
exactly.
IF KC lets Alex Smith walk, i think he would be a great fit for Cleveland for a few years.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Free agency isn't loaded with Joe Montanas. Sam 'might' be the best option for what we want/need a veteran turor/place holder for a year or two. We absolutely need a veteran presence in the QB room this year.
Peak
Footballguy
I like the idea of trading for Alex Smith and letting him go for a year or two while the heir apparent learns/grows (whether it's Darnold, Mayfield, or Allen - just no "broken glass" Rosen). A 2nd rnd pick should be enough to get Smith, and any of the three mentioned will be available with Cleveland's first two picks. If Dorsey is as knowledgeable as folks around the league say he is, then this could be a turning point for this franchise.
