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[DYNASTY] 2010 Top 20 Rookies


EBF

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I have the 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.7, 1.9, 1.11, 1.12, 2.2, and 2.4 in a ppr dynasty. My team is aweful though with Crabtree being my only valuable dude. Is Arrelios Benn out of the first round? I want to get him at the 1.9 after i snag Bryant and Thomas. Is this illogical? i know his numbers slid but i still beleive, am i a fool if i take him as the 3rd wr off the board? Tate is normal to me and basically i see average amongst all the wr's except these 3. Not the wrong forum. I just want to know a solid opinion of Benn and his percieved RC value if anyone knows. Actually maybe the wrong forum.

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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:potkettle:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture. I don't know if other guys are feeling the same or not, but right now, at least for me, this entire class (especially the RBs and WRs) are very difficult to assess - much moreso than previous classes, IMO - and I still have quite a few concerns with this class.

Some of these concerns are as follows (each concern is not applicable to every top prospect, but each prospect has at least a couple of questions, IMO

RBs: Durability, receiving ability, explosiveness, smallish, speed

WRs: Ability to separate from NFL corners, focus, maturity, "system" players, RAC, quickness in and out of breaks, speed

I'm starting to believe that in general, there aren't a bunch of really clean prospects in this draft class, meaning that these guys all have at least a few warts...

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Todd Reesing, I see way too many Tony Romo similarities to ignoreKerry Meier, talented enough to play now and is still new to the position

I like both of these guys but don't see them getting drafted high. Reesing could be great but won't go high and owners would have to be patient, Meier is similar to Davone Bess.
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Don't sleep on Jordan Shipley, WR Texas.Kid was one of three finalists for the Biletnikoff award this year and is a 6-year senior, so he's mature at 24 yrs old.Shipley runs great routes, has a very high football IQ, and is deceptively fast. He has Hines Ward + Wes Welker love-child potential.

Why is he deceptively fast? Is he overweight? Does he run on an artificial limb? He looked just regular fast to me when I watched him in the BCS Championship game.Or is he deceptively fast in the same way that Bryant Gumbal and Colin Powell are deceptively intelligent?Speed is measured by the amount of time it takes to get from one point to another. There is no deception involved. The color of one's skin does not count as deception since it is in plain sight for everyone to see.People are either intelligent, fast, or gifted based on how gifted they are, not how gifted they are in relation to others of their same race and ethnicity. Deceptively fast is one of the more racist comments that is universally accepted by all.Not calling you a racist, it just always cracks me up when someone calls a white guy deceptively fast.
I love the term "high motor". It's usually used just to talk about white guys who aren't as physicall talented but make up for it with how hard they play.I know it's not only used on white guys, but I would say about 90% of the time I've heard it been used it's been a white DE or something.
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Blount is really beginning to intrigue me.

Didn't Kyper have him ranked number 2 RB prior to Boise St. incident?
He was in the top 5 for sure, other NFL gurus had him there as well.
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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:goodposting:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture. I don't know if other guys are feeling the same or not, but right now, at least for me, this entire class (especially the RBs and WRs) are very difficult to assess - much moreso than previous classes, IMO - and I still have quite a few concerns with this class.

ETA: Even Blount has moved up IMHO.

Some of these concerns are as follows (each concern is not applicable to every top prospect, but each prospect has at least a couple of questions, IMO

RBs: Durability, receiving ability, explosiveness, smallish, speed

WRs: Ability to separate from NFL corners, focus, maturity, "system" players, RAC, quickness in and out of breaks, speed

I'm starting to believe that in general, there aren't a bunch of really clean prospects in this draft class, meaning that these guys all have at least a few warts...

Take into consideration the All-star games that have been played guys like Joique Bell, Dexter McCluster, Andre Roberts (who NO ONE knew), and Jimmy Graham have turned heads and demand a closer look. They certainly are on my board now.
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I have the 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.7, 1.9, 1.11, 1.12, 2.2, and 2.4 in a ppr dynasty. My team is aweful though with Crabtree being my only valuable dude. Is Arrelios Benn out of the first round? I want to get him at the 1.9 after i snag Bryant and Thomas. Is this illogical? i know his numbers slid but i still beleive, am i a fool if i take him as the 3rd wr off the board? Tate is normal to me and basically i see average amongst all the wr's except these 3. Not the wrong forum. I just want to know a solid opinion of Benn and his percieved RC value if anyone knows. Actually maybe the wrong forum.

Benn is an enigma to me. On paper he should be right up there with Bryant and Thomas. He has the reputation and the physique to be in the discussion with those guys, but there's something missing. He isn't nearly as impressive as those two in games. He isn't as precise or explosive when running. He just doesn't really jump off the screen at you despite his obvious gifts. I think he will be there for you at 1.09 if you want him.
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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:mellow:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture. I don't know if other guys are feeling the same or not, but right now, at least for me, this entire class (especially the RBs and WRs) are very difficult to assess - much moreso than previous classes, IMO - and I still have quite a few concerns with this class.

ETA: Even Blount has moved up IMHO.

Some of these concerns are as follows (each concern is not applicable to every top prospect, but each prospect has at least a couple of questions, IMO

RBs: Durability, receiving ability, explosiveness, smallish, speed

WRs: Ability to separate from NFL corners, focus, maturity, "system" players, RAC, quickness in and out of breaks, speed

I'm starting to believe that in general, there aren't a bunch of really clean prospects in this draft class, meaning that these guys all have at least a few warts...

Take into consideration the All-star games that have been played guys like Joique Bell, Dexter McCluster, Andre Roberts (who NO ONE knew), and Jimmy Graham have turned heads and demand a closer look. They certainly are on my board now.
Yeah, I had no idea about Joique Bell before the Senior Bowl. I thought he looked pretty good that day. Does anyone have any highlights of the guy or any insight they might want to share on him?
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Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Most of the changes involve low profile players who weren't on my radar prior to the All-Star games. I'm also moving one or two big names around after further consideration.

I'm starting to believe that in general, there aren't a bunch of really clean prospects in this draft class, meaning that these guys all have at least a few warts...

I agree. There are only a handful of sure things this year. Even the RBs at the top have some question marks.

That's pretty typical. There are usually only 5-6 guys that I really have a good feeling about in a particular draft class.

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I have the 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.7, 1.9, 1.11, 1.12, 2.2, and 2.4 in a ppr dynasty. My team is aweful though with Crabtree being my only valuable dude. Is Arrelios Benn out of the first round? I want to get him at the 1.9 after i snag Bryant and Thomas. Is this illogical? i know his numbers slid but i still beleive, am i a fool if i take him as the 3rd wr off the board? Tate is normal to me and basically i see average amongst all the wr's except these 3. Not the wrong forum. I just want to know a solid opinion of Benn and his percieved RC value if anyone knows. Actually maybe the wrong forum.

I see your team havingQB:Bradford(1.11), Clausen(1.12)RB:Spiller(1.2), Mathews(1.3), Dwyer(1.4)WR:Crabtree, Bryant(1.1), Thomas(1.7....hopefully).TE:Gresham(2.2)Not a bad team IMO.
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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:thumbup:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture. I don't know if other guys are feeling the same or not, but right now, at least for me, this entire class (especially the RBs and WRs) are very difficult to assess - much moreso than previous classes, IMO - and I still have quite a few concerns with this class.

ETA: Even Blount has moved up IMHO.

Some of these concerns are as follows (each concern is not applicable to every top prospect, but each prospect has at least a couple of questions, IMO

RBs: Durability, receiving ability, explosiveness, smallish, speed

WRs: Ability to separate from NFL corners, focus, maturity, "system" players, RAC, quickness in and out of breaks, speed

I'm starting to believe that in general, there aren't a bunch of really clean prospects in this draft class, meaning that these guys all have at least a few warts...

Take into consideration the All-star games that have been played guys like Joique Bell, Dexter McCluster, Andre Roberts (who NO ONE knew), and Jimmy Graham have turned heads and demand a closer look. They certainly are on my board now.
Yeah, I had no idea about Joique Bell before the Senior Bowl. I thought he looked pretty good that day. Does anyone have any highlights of the guy or any insight they might want to share on him?
Look for the EBF 2010 Highlight thread.
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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:goodposting:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture.

More updates = more hits. Keeps you coming back.
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Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Most of the changes involve low profile players who weren't on my radar prior to the All-Star games. I'm also moving one or two big names around after further consideration.

I'm starting to believe that in general, there aren't a bunch of really clean prospects in this draft class, meaning that these guys all have at least a few warts...

I agree. There are only a handful of sure things this year. Even the RBs at the top have some question marks.

That's pretty typical. There are usually only 5-6 guys that I really have a good feeling about in a particular draft class.

OK! Yeah, I knew very little, if any, about some of these guys who did pretty well at the Senior Bowl. Maybe a hidden gem may be uncovered amongst (RBs) Bell and Miller, and (WRs) Roberts and Jeremy Williams......But at the combine, they will face much stiffer competition amongst the underclassmen who have yet to strut their stuff during this offseason evaluation period.

Guys who I wasn't all that interested in before but I'm starting to warm up to include QB Jarrett Brown, RBs Ben Tate and Leg Blount, WRs Taylor Price and J.Shipley, TEs Quarless, Jimmy Graham, and Dennis Pitta.

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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:popcorn:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture.

More updates = more hits. Keeps you coming back.
I guess.....'cause guys like me do come back.....although I don't think their mocks are that good, seem to switch positions/stances on players a bit too much. One day they don't like Dez Bryant , Dwyer, or Mathews at all, the next week or two these same guys are Top 25 talents? Go figure.

Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :pics:

Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:lmao:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture.

More updates = more hits. Keeps you coming back.
I guess.....'cause guys like me do come back.....although I don't think their mocks are that good, seem to switch positions/stances on players a bit too much. One day they don't like Dez Bryant , Dwyer, or Mathews at all, the next week or two these same guys are Top 25 talents? Go figure.

Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :o

Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

that limb you're on is pretty thick.
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I have the 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.7, 1.9, 1.11, 1.12, 2.2, and 2.4 in a ppr dynasty. My team is aweful though with Crabtree being my only valuable dude. Is Arrelios Benn out of the first round? I want to get him at the 1.9 after i snag Bryant and Thomas. Is this illogical? i know his numbers slid but i still beleive, am i a fool if i take him as the 3rd wr off the board? Tate is normal to me and basically i see average amongst all the wr's except these 3. Not the wrong forum. I just want to know a solid opinion of Benn and his percieved RC value if anyone knows. Actually maybe the wrong forum.

I see your team havingQB:Bradford(1.11), Clausen(1.12)RB:Spiller(1.2), Mathews(1.3), Dwyer(1.4)WR:Crabtree, Bryant(1.1), Thomas(1.7....hopefully).TE:Gresham(2.2)Not a bad team IMO.
With that huge collection of picks you would have a hard time not making your team respectable in a year or two. What Benson just posted would be an ideal scenario for you team.
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Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :blackdot: Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

I assume you'll be naming the best WR soon as it's always easier to take the field than one guy and I know you'll be willing to actually go out on a limb.
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Don't sleep on Jordan Shipley, WR Texas.Kid was one of three finalists for the Biletnikoff award this year and is a 6-year senior, so he's mature at 24 yrs old.Shipley runs great routes, has a very high football IQ, and is deceptively fast. He has Hines Ward + Wes Welker love-child potential.

I agree. Shipey will be the 2nd coming of Wes Welker and maybe better because I think he will be more of a TD target.
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New list of 30-35 players coming soon after the All-Star games.

There will be some radical changes and at least one previously unranked name in the top 10.

:thumbup:

Radical changes pre-combine? My question would then be what are you gonna do after the combine? Isn't the combine (and subsequent individual workouts) where most people's rankings get adjusted the most?

Not a knock on you (simply critiquing the process of most evaluators as they all want to be the one to stay in front of the information - e.g., walterfootball updating their mock drafts basically every day or two, this is absolutely ridiculous), but wouldn't it be more meaningful if we all gathered a bit more data before we make any dramatic shifts in stances and rankings? The combine and workouts along with their college tape will complete the picture.

More updates = more hits. Keeps you coming back.
I guess.....'cause guys like me do come back.....although I don't think their mocks are that good, seem to switch positions/stances on players a bit too much. One day they don't like Dez Bryant , Dwyer, or Mathews at all, the next week or two these same guys are Top 25 talents? Go figure.

Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :rolleyes:

Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

Wow what a brave and bold prediction. :lmao:
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Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :lmao: Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

I assume you'll be naming the best WR soon as it's always easier to take the field than one guy and I know you'll be willing to actually go out on a limb.
Yes, I will name the player whom I think will be better. But only after at least a couple of my rookie drafts as I have a 1.05-1.06 pick in a few drafts and am looking to acquire a similar pick in a few others to get my guy........And it's not Demaryious Thomas, either, he will bust.
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Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :shrug: Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

I assume you'll be naming the best WR soon as it's always easier to take the field than one guy and I know you'll be willing to actually go out on a limb.
Yes, I will name the player whom I think will be better. But only after at least a couple of my rookie drafts as I have a 1.05-1.06 pick in a few drafts and am looking to acquire a similar pick in a few others to get my guy........And it's not Demaryious Thomas, either, he will bust.
:wub: sure, nobody else in your leagues could form their own opinions; your stating your player here would change everything.
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Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :) Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

I assume you'll be naming the best WR soon as it's always easier to take the field than one guy and I know you'll be willing to actually go out on a limb.
Yes, I will name the player whom I think will be better. But only after at least a couple of my rookie drafts as I have a 1.05-1.06 pick in a few drafts and am looking to acquire a similar pick in a few others to get my guy........And it's not Demaryious Thomas, either, he will bust.
:lol: sure, nobody else in your leagues could form their own opinions; your stating your player here would change everything.
Or it could be a lot like last year when I was able to snare Harvin every time I wanted him around 1.07-1.09 until my late August rookie draft where I was sitting at 1.06 and an owner jumped up to 1.04 to grab him. Not saying for certain that my involvement in building the Percy Hype had a lot to do with it, but let's just say that I will not be opening avenues to the possibility of a similar experience this go-round. And who knows, maybe there are other guys in my leagues who will like the same guy(s) I do, and are sitting there with picks right after or before mine, so no need to divulge my intentions here.......not just yet, that is..... Besides, you guys all love Dez Bryant, he's the next Fitzgerald/Calvin/T.O. all rolled into one, right? As I recall, Crabtree was certain to be the next Fitz, Jerry Rice, HOF'er in waiting, etc., etc. And if anybody ever says that Demaryious Thomas could be the next Calvin, please certify them :lmao::loco: and have them committed on the spot..... :DDez Bryant = Braylon Jr.
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Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :hifive:

Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

I assume you'll be naming the best WR soon as it's always easier to take the field than one guy and I know you'll be willing to actually go out on a limb.
Yes, I will name the player whom I think will be better. But only after at least a couple of my rookie drafts as I have a 1.05-1.06 pick in a few drafts and am looking to acquire a similar pick in a few others to get my guy........And it's not Demaryious Thomas, either, he will bust.
:lol: sure, nobody else in your leagues could form their own opinions; your stating your player here would change everything.
Or it could be a lot like last year when I was able to snare Harvin every time I wanted him around 1.07-1.09 until my late August rookie draft where I was sitting at 1.06 and an owner jumped up to 1.04 to grab him. Not saying for certain that my involvement in building the Percy Hype had a lot to do with it, but let's just say that I will not be opening avenues to the possibility of a similar experience this go-round.

And who knows, maybe there are other guys in my leagues who will like the same guy(s) I do, and are sitting there with picks right after or before mine, so no need to divulge my intentions here.......not just yet, that is..... Besides, you guys all love Dez Bryant, he's the next Fitzgerald/Calvin/T.O. all rolled into one, right? As I recall, Crabtree was certain to be the next Fitz, Jerry Rice, HOF'er in waiting, etc., etc.

And if anybody ever says that Demaryious Thomas could be the next Calvin, please certify them :cool::loco: and have them committed on the spot.....

:D

Dez Bryant = Braylon Jr.

oof.
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Kremenull's first OOAL prediction......that's Out On A Limb.....check back for the outcome.... :goodposting: Although he should be pretty darn good, Dez Bryant will NOT be the best NFL WR in this class........

I assume you'll be naming the best WR soon as it's always easier to take the field than one guy and I know you'll be willing to actually go out on a limb.
Yes, I will name the player whom I think will be better. But only after at least a couple of my rookie drafts as I have a 1.05-1.06 pick in a few drafts and am looking to acquire a similar pick in a few others to get my guy........And it's not Demaryious Thomas, either, he will bust.
:lol: sure, nobody else in your leagues could form their own opinions; your stating your player here would change everything.
Or it could be a lot like last year when I was able to snare Harvin every time I wanted him around 1.07-1.09 until my late August rookie draft where I was sitting at 1.06 and an owner jumped up to 1.04 to grab him. Not saying for certain that my involvement in building the Percy Hype had a lot to do with it, but let's just say that I will not be opening avenues to the possibility of a similar experience this go-round. And who knows, maybe there are other guys in my leagues who will like the same guy(s) I do, and are sitting there with picks right after or before mine, so no need to divulge my intentions here.......not just yet, that is..... Besides, you guys all love Dez Bryant, he's the next Fitzgerald/Calvin/T.O. all rolled into one, right? As I recall, Crabtree was certain to be the next Fitz, Jerry Rice, HOF'er in waiting, etc., etc. And if anybody ever says that Demaryious Thomas could be the next Calvin, please certify them :hifive::cool: and have them committed on the spot..... :DDez Bryant = Braylon Jr.
Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.
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Todd Reesing, I see way too many Tony Romo similarities to ignoreKerry Meier, talented enough to play now and is still new to the position

I like both of these guys but don't see them getting drafted high. Reesing could be great but won't go high and owners would have to be patient, Meier is similar to Davone Bess.
Reesing bombed at the Sr. Bowl, he needs to pull a 180 to even get drafted. His flaws are much, much worse than I thought they were.My opinion is unchanged about Meier, I think he's a draft day afterthought because his speed won't time out but will be starting in a year or two as a #2 or #3.Taylor Price is a guy I forgot about before my previous post, he was hurt all year and was still the only positive in Ohio's otherwise lethargic offense. Healthy, he has starting potential. I liken him to Barnes and Meier, both Price and Barnes have 3rd or 4th round draft potential though whereas Meier is 5th round at the earliest.
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Todd Reesing, I see way too many Tony Romo similarities to ignoreKerry Meier, talented enough to play now and is still new to the position

I like both of these guys but don't see them getting drafted high. Reesing could be great but won't go high and owners would have to be patient, Meier is similar to Davone Bess.
Reesing bombed at the Sr. Bowl, he needs to pull a 180 to even get drafted. His flaws are much, much worse than I thought they were.My opinion is unchanged about Meier, I think he's a draft day afterthought because his speed won't time out but will be starting in a year or two as a #2 or #3.Taylor Price is a guy I forgot about before my previous post, he was hurt all year and was still the only positive in Ohio's otherwise lethargic offense. Healthy, he has starting potential. I liken him to Barnes and Meier, both Price and Barnes have 3rd or 4th round draft potential though whereas Meier is 5th round at the earliest.
I'm a Jayhawk and have watched quite a bit of Kerry Meier, love the guy, he's been a big part of the success they had (until the 2nd half of this year), but I agree that he's unlikely to be drafted but could easily be a #3 with 50-75 receptions a year - Like Bess.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage. One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever. I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.
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Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.

He's no Josh Morgan, that's for sure.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage. One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever. I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.
You contradict yourself here. First you say that Crabtree was way overrated (and conveniently ignoring all of the hate that was posted on this board), then you say that you need to be supremely talented to deserve the elite comparisons. He did everything on the field and more than the other receivers you mention that were deserving of the comparisons. It is a natural reaction to compare players playing styles to that of an elite talent without expecting them to actually reach the same level of production.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage. One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever. I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.
You contradict yourself here. First you say that Crabtree was way overrated (and conveniently ignoring all of the hate that was posted on this board), then you say that you need to be supremely talented to deserve the elite comparisons. He did everything on the field and more than the other receivers you mention that were deserving of the comparisons. It is a natural reaction to compare players playing styles to that of an elite talent without expecting them to actually reach the same level of production.
:thumbup: I'm not sure why kremenull put himself out like that. I've seen others on this board do the same. Not really sure how anyone who have been paying attention can criticize Crabtree's performance after considering the amount of time he missed. I'm simply amazed! :mellow:
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Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here.

No, not really.Most people didn't put him on that level and he wasn't drafted that high (Fitz, Calvin, and Andre were all top 3 picks).Crabtree is basically what everyone said he was: a big, athletic possession WR with limited speed and home run skills. Still a nice player and cornerstone for the franchise. I know me and my fellow 49er fans were encouraged by his play this season.

And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage.

I don't see any real similarity to Braylon. They aren't built alike and they don't run alike.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs.

People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly.

Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.

There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.

And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage.

One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever.

I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.

You contradict yourself here. First you say that Crabtree was way overrated (and conveniently ignoring all of the hate that was posted on this board), then you say that you need to be supremely talented to deserve the elite comparisons. He did everything on the field and more than the other receivers you mention that were deserving of the comparisons. It is a natural reaction to compare players playing styles to that of an elite talent without expecting them to actually reach the same level of production.
:goodposting:

I'm not sure why kremenull put himself out like that. I've seen others on this board do the same. Not really sure how anyone who have been paying attention can criticize Crabtree's performance after considering the amount of time he missed. I'm simply amazed! :mellow:

This is a great point and one that is much overlooked IMO. He missed the whole offseason and didn't start playing until week 7 were he caught five passes. Most rookies (regardless of position) who miss the entire offseason are a lock to be a none factor. He missed the offseason and practice time/conditioning through week 6 and came into week 7 and looked like an NFL football player. Truly incredible. Give this kid an offseason and then judge. I do not know if this kid can be an elite receiver in this league, however he had an amazing rookie year based on the circumstances.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage. One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever. I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.
You contradict yourself here. First you say that Crabtree was way overrated (and conveniently ignoring all of the hate that was posted on this board), then you say that you need to be supremely talented to deserve the elite comparisons. He did everything on the field and more than the other receivers you mention that were deserving of the comparisons. It is a natural reaction to compare players playing styles to that of an elite talent without expecting them to actually reach the same level of production.
There is no contradiction by me here whatsoever. I don't confuse production on the field, in a spread offense no less, with talent. If that were the case then Troy Davis and Ron Dayne would be All-World. And it is certainly not natural, or advised, to compare guys to elite players, especially when they do not have elite physical talent. This leads to overblown expectations, which is not a good thing to have in this endeavor. Guys with elite measurables, as well as elite football skills, are much more likely to end up as an elite player than guys with average to good physical skills and very good to elite football skills. This is even moreso with skill positions such as RB and WR and TE, even throw in CB, DE, and LB. The difference in athletic ability at the highest levels of professional sports separates the dominators from the good players. It's called ceiling.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage. One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever. I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.
You contradict yourself here. First you say that Crabtree was way overrated (and conveniently ignoring all of the hate that was posted on this board), then you say that you need to be supremely talented to deserve the elite comparisons. He did everything on the field and more than the other receivers you mention that were deserving of the comparisons. It is a natural reaction to compare players playing styles to that of an elite talent without expecting them to actually reach the same level of production.
There is no contradiction by me here whatsoever. I don't confuse production on the field, in a spread offense no less, with talent. If that were the case then Troy Davis and Ron Dayne would be All-World. And it is certainly not natural, or advised, to compare guys to elite players, especially when they do not have elite physical talent. This leads to overblown expectations, which is not a good thing to have in this endeavor. Guys with elite measurables, as well as elite football skills, are much more likely to end up as an elite player than guys with average to good physical skills and very good to elite football skills. This is even moreso with skill positions such as RB and WR and TE, even throw in CB, DE, and LB. The difference in athletic ability at the highest levels of professional sports separates the dominators from the good players. It's called ceiling.
Yet you still include Charles Rogers as an example. Apparently you cannot separate production on the field with talent.
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Please tell me it's not Golden Tate. That would be too funny since he's barely in my top 10 WRs. People always try to nitpick the top prospects even when it's pretty obvious that those players have a lot of talent. Lots of people were looking for every excuse to downgrade Crabtree last season. What did he do? Step onto the field after two weeks of NFL practice and perform at a higher level than the vast majority of veterans in the league. Sure, he might not be Calvin or Andre, but I don't think most reasonable people expected that. He was touted as a quality WR1 prospect and that's what he appears to be. Citing him as an example of an overrated player seems silly. Same with Dez. There's not much to nitpick about his game. He might not become a Hall of Famer, but I find it highly unlikely that he'll be a bust. The Braylon comparison doesn't hold much weight with me. Dez is stronger, more compact, and a more fluid runner. The only similarity is that they'll both occasionally leave a catchable pass on the field.There's less of a consensus about Thomas, but my personal opinion is that he's easily one of the two most athletically gifted receivers in this class. I think he's the second best WR prospect regardless of what happens on draft day. His game projects well to the next level. I'll have more on that next week when I release the new list.

Crabtree is certainly overrated in comparison to the hype in here before entering the league. He has to be Fitz-Jerry Rice-Andre-Calvin type to live up to the hype that was in here. I'm not saying that he isn't good, he certainly is, but he's not on those guys' level yet, and I seriously doubt he ever gets there.And I beg to differ with your assessment that Bryant is stronger or more compact than Braylon. They have as close to the same body type as two WRs can get, and I believe they are almost twins physically and athletically (leaping ability, body control, explosiveness, top-end speed - although Braylon may be a bit faster)......right down to the dropsies. Dez is probably a more fluid runner, I will agree there, but he's still not all that much better after the catch than Braylon even with that advantage. One thing that people should beware of is comparing prospects to such elite players, like comparing Crabtree or Bryant to Fitz/Rice, Moreno to Walter Payton, yikes!......to meet these types of expectations is simply unfair to the propsects. Elite comparisons should not be handed out unless a guy is unquestionably, undeniably, and supremely gifted (physically and as a football player). Recent vintage guys like Peterson, Calvin, Andre1500, Peyton Manning, LT, and even Reggie Bush, yes that's right, entering the league he graded out supremely high, have deserved such lofty comparisons. Again, I start from a historical perspective in rating prospects, and if a player is not in the Bo Jackson, Dickerson, Payton, O.J. Simpson, Sayers, Barry realm for RBs, or the Moss, Calvin, Andre1500, Fitz, Charles Rogers (great prospect, not good NFL career) realm for WRs then he's not worthy of an elite tag. He simply has to earn it ala Jerry Rice, not considered amongst the most elite prospects but turned into one of the greatest ever. I recently compared Ryan Mathews to Thomas Jones (in one of these rookie threads).....and in my estimation, that is a very nice compliment. If he can produce something along the lines of what Thomas Jones has done over the past few season, then any Mathews owners should be jumping for joy.
You contradict yourself here. First you say that Crabtree was way overrated (and conveniently ignoring all of the hate that was posted on this board), then you say that you need to be supremely talented to deserve the elite comparisons. He did everything on the field and more than the other receivers you mention that were deserving of the comparisons. It is a natural reaction to compare players playing styles to that of an elite talent without expecting them to actually reach the same level of production.
:lmao: I'm not sure why kremenull put himself out like that. I've seen others on this board do the same. Not really sure how anyone who have been paying attention can criticize Crabtree's performance after considering the amount of time he missed. I'm simply amazed! :unsure:
I watched Crabtree quite a bit living in the Bay Area. And I didn't say that he didn't impress, what I am saying, and let me make this very clear, is that he is not 'special'. During the 49ers-Lions telecast, one of the announcers even made mention of his observation that Calvin, although not even enjoying a monster game or anything, just looked so fast, explosive, and dominant, that he demanded (and received) a tremendous amount of defensive attention (which we all know by now how he gets double- and triple-teamed constantly) on almost every play. Whereas he made it a point to compare Crabtree to Calvin in stating that he is "certainly not in his (Calvin's) class", as he lacks the explosion and "presence", with presence definitely being one of the other words he used. For all of the Crabtree supporters, and really, I give the kid credit for what he did accomplish in limited preparation, just note that others (football insiders) see and say what I'm saying as well. The kid is good, just not elite. Why do you all believe that is a knock on him? Another thing is that I don't even concern myself with fantasy numbers when I make such statements, hell, Wes Welker would be elite if we were only talking about fantasy numbers and number of receptions. If Crabtree goes on to have a Cris Carter-like HOF career, then that would be fantastic. And actually, probably a best case scenario for him. And BTW, Cris Carter is not elite, either. A great player, yes, but not amongst the elite. I suppose I'm of the group that has a very strict reservation for elite status, which I'll accept and continue.... :D
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Yet you still include Charles Rogers as an example. Apparently you cannot separate production on the field with talent.

And this was mentioned in regards to elite prospects entering the NFL, not how his NFL career turned out. PROSPECT! The time of which we are in now, evaluating players in the NFL draft as PROSPECTS.In this draft class, there are '0' elite NFL prospects at the skill positions. Except maybe one.......Gresham! If he runs sub 4.6 or very low 4.6s and his athleticism has returned post knee injury, BOOK IT!
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Tentative list of offensive prospects who could "light it up" at the combine....i.e., greatly impress with speed and athleticism

QBs who could display great skill and good athleticism

Jarrett Brown

Jimmy Clausen

RBs

C.J. Spiller

Ryan Mathews

Jahvid Best

Jonathan Dwyer

Joe McKnight

WRs

Golden Tate

Dez Bryant

Arrelious Benn

Taylor Price

Jacoby Ford

Carlton Mitchell

Demaryius Thomas

Mike Williams

Danario Alexander

TEs

Aaron Hernandez

Jimmy Graham

Jermaine Gresham

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Tentative list of offensive prospects who could "light it up" at the combine....i.e., greatly impress with speed and athleticism

WRs

Golden Tate

:kicksrock:
I'd pretty much be willing to make a gentlemen's bet that he runs faster and jumps higher than Dez Bryant...... :boxing:
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Tentative list of offensive prospects who could "light it up" at the combine....i.e., greatly impress with speed and athleticism

WRs

Golden Tate

:lmao:
I'd pretty much be willing to make a gentlemen's bet that he runs faster and jumps higher than Dez Bryant...... :boxing:
He'd better. That's the only way he'll succeed in the NFL at 5'10".

Speed and explosiveness are not Tate's strengths. They are the biggest question marks about his game (in addition to size). He needs a good 40 time as much as any WR in the draft. Very curious to see how he tests in a few weeks.

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Tentative list of offensive prospects who could "light it up" at the combine....i.e., greatly impress with speed and athleticism

WRs

Golden Tate

:boxing:
I'd pretty much be willing to make a gentlemen's bet that he runs faster and jumps higher than Dez Bryant...... :boxing:
:lmao:
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Interesting little tidbit from Matt McGuire of Walterfootball.com

Summary: I want to like Dwyer, but when you combine that he looks out of shape with bad tape, I have a hard time getting behind him. Since early in the season, I have felt he is an overrated prospect. The option scheme limits the evaluation because he is in the three-point stance four yards behind the line of scrimmage (LOS) as opposed to a two-point stance seven yards behind the LOS. I don't see an impressive athlete on tape, but if a team can get him in good condition, he might look like a completely different back in a north-south running scheme. He's the only back in this class that I think has the upside to be a No. 1 in the NFL, but he would certainly be a gamble in the second round.

Player Comparison: Tim Hightower. Hightower is a better pass catcher, but from an athleticism and size standpoint, these players match up.

link

http://www.walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2010jdwyer.php

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