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Apple (AAPL) : Tim Cook announces iForum. Dodds and Bryant prepare shut down operations


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18mo or so until we see a car, IMO. Then the stock loses its ####

What exactly do you think is the development cycle for a car?

We aren't seeing a viable mass production car in 18 months.

Did I say we were going to see a mass production car on the lot in 18 months? :)

I think we are going to see a prototype/leaks or possibly a teaser reveal at a car show by late 2017 / early 2018. This is a bit earlier than many estimates of 2018-2019, but given the action (establishment of Faraday Future, Project Titan staff tripling in size recently, setting up a uber-secure testing facility w/ armed guards, etc... I think this project is accelerating quickly.

I could be totally wrong, but I think Apple begins teasing/revealing parts of this sooner than many think.

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18mo or so until we see a car, IMO. Then the stock loses its ####

What exactly do you think is the development cycle for a car?
We aren't seeing a viable mass production car in 18 months.

Did I say we were going to see a mass production car on the lot in 18 months? :)

I think we are going to see a prototype/leaks or possibly a teaser reveal at a car show by late 2017 / early 2018. This is a bit earlier than many estimates of 2018-2019, but given the action (establishment of Faraday Future, Project Titan staff tripling in size recently, setting up a uber-secure testing facility w/ armed guards, etc... I think this project is accelerating quickly.

I could be totally wrong, but I think Apple begins teasing/revealing parts of this sooner than many think.

Or they just buy Tesla.

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Or they just buy Tesla.

Certainly something they could easily do with 200BB in cash lying around... but their aggressive poaching of Tesla talent ($250k bonus + 60% pay increase), and battery maker A123 systems (resulting in a lawsuit) seems to indicate they want to do things their own way.

We do know Apple has also purchased a massive tract of land significantly larger than that on which their new HQ sits, and has reportedly been in talks with the largest secure road-testing facility in the world (GeoMentum in SF).

Of course... there are also rumors of a hiring freeze due to displeasure by Ive regarding project's direction.

It should be interesting...

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18mo or so until we see a car, IMO. Then the stock loses its ####

What exactly do you think is the development cycle for a car?
We aren't seeing a viable mass production car in 18 months.

Did I say we were going to see a mass production car on the lot in 18 months? :)

I think we are going to see a prototype/leaks or possibly a teaser reveal at a car show by late 2017 / early 2018. This is a bit earlier than many estimates of 2018-2019, but given the action (establishment of Faraday Future, Project Titan staff tripling in size recently, setting up a uber-secure testing facility w/ armed guards, etc... I think this project is accelerating quickly.

I could be totally wrong, but I think Apple begins teasing/revealing parts of this sooner than many think.

And I didn't say "on the lot". I'm not talking about actually being in a position to mass produce a car. They aren't going to have a prototype capable of being mass produced in 18 months.

I don't think a prototype would do much for their stock. That's not the hard part of being in the car business.

Edited by jonessed
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Or they just buy Tesla.

Certainly something they could easily do with 200BB in cash lying around... but their aggressive poaching of Tesla talent ($250k bonus + 60% pay increase), and battery maker A123 systems (resulting in a lawsuit) seems to indicate they want to do things their own way.

We do know Apple has also purchased a massive tract of land significantly larger than that on which their new HQ sits, and has reportedly been in talks with the largest secure road-testing facility in the world (GeoMentum in SF).

Of course... there are also rumors of a hiring freeze due to displeasure by Ive regarding project's direction.

It should be interesting...

Or maybe they have a dozen teslas and are breaking down to steal as much IP as possible, you know sort of like how they've done everything, ever.

If they did intend on launching a prototype they simply can't keep it quiet. There is no way to truly hide this from the public. Too much regulatory hurdles to clear and too many AEC audits to pass, all of those being people under NDA, but they will talk.

I'm just not sure it makes a ton of sense. A car is such a departure. Moving into medical would be the more natural field, but it's not as sexy.

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The car thing seems so dumb. I always assumed they weren't actually making an actual car but we're making the interface / interior displays for companies that make cars.

This Tim Cook guy is not creating anything. Maybe the Steve Jobs "genius" was hype but there is no arguing his run starting with the iPod.

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The car thing seems so dumb. I always assumed they weren't actually making an actual car but we're making the interface / interior displays for companies that make cars.

This Tim Cook guy is not creating anything. Maybe the Steve Jobs "genius" was hype but there is no arguing his run starting with the iPod.

I agree. I can't say I'm interested in an Apple Car. Now having a "smart car" system that would integrate everything from my phone into my car? That sounds interesting.

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The car thing seems so dumb. I always assumed they weren't actually making an actual car but we're making the interface / interior displays for companies that make cars.

This Tim Cook guy is not creating anything. Maybe the Steve Jobs "genius" was hype but there is no arguing his run starting with the iPod.

I agree. I can't say I'm interested in an Apple Car. Now having a "smart car" system that would integrate everything from my phone into my car? That sounds interesting.

Google and Apple are not going to manufacture cars. They want to control everything we do and since we spend so much time in our cars this is the next step.

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The car thing seems so dumb. I always assumed they weren't actually making an actual car but we're making the interface / interior displays for companies that make cars.

This Tim Cook guy is not creating anything. Maybe the Steve Jobs "genius" was hype but there is no arguing his run starting with the iPod.

I agree. I can't say I'm interested in an Apple Car. Now having a "smart car" system that would integrate everything from my phone into my car? That sounds interesting.

Google and Apple are not going to manufacture cars. They want to control everything we do and since we spend so much time in our cars this is the next step.

They might. The driverless car is a big enough jump that they could enter the market. Either that or they partner with someone. I actually think it's more likely that they buy in somewhere. We'll see.

Edited by jonessed
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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

This is what I was hoping for. They are getting smoked by Amazon here.

The worse iTunes gets the less faith I have that they could do something amazing with TV.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

Edited by The Commish
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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

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You guys seem to be thinking about a traditional car with some neat interface and a computer system that connects us to the car. It seems more like Apple and Google would be making a car that effectively is a computer on wheels. Why would Chrysler be better at this than Apple or Google? I'd have more confidence in IBM creating the next generation of world-changing cars than I would Ford or GM.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

Again...they can. To get to the bold, they'll need to do a significant amount more than integrate the current Apple TV though. One of the issues current Apple TV users have faced (as recently as within the last 12 months) is data usage. If they own their own network, they don't have to worry about that. Otherwise, they have to play nicely (with in the rules of the network agreements between consumer and content provider). There's lots out there about their data usage and problems people see.

Apple has a lot of them convinced they should be mad at their network provider, but in reality it's on the end user (and what they use on the network).

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

Again...they can. To get to the bold, they'll need to do a significant amount more than integrate the current Apple TV though. One of the issues current Apple TV users have faced (as recently as within the last 12 months) is data usage. If they own their own network, they don't have to worry about that. Otherwise, they have to play nicely (with in the rules of the network agreements between consumer and content provider). There's lots out there about their data usage and problems people see.

Apple has a lot of them convinced they should be mad at their network provider, but in reality it's on the end user (and what they use on the network).

I think we're talking in circles here.

Sure, it would be nice for Apple to get their own network content and all that stuff.

But I think just jumping into the TV market could be a good play for them. All the other Smart TVs have horrible interfaces, are slow, terrible apps, etc. Apple could make their own TV and essentially run a version of iOS on it, similar to the current gen Apple TV.

People would eat that up.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

How would that be any different then an Apple TV connected via HDMI. Smart TV is useless much rather be able to connect the equipment I want when I want.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

How would that be any different then an Apple TV connected via HDMI. Smart TV is useless much rather be able to connect the equipment I want when I want.

Because the whole thing would be designed by Apple. How is Apple Watch different from any other smart watch? People love Apple and will buy just about anything they make.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

How would that be any different then an Apple TV connected via HDMI. Smart TV is useless much rather be able to connect the equipment I want when I want.

Because the whole thing would be designed by Apple. How is Apple Watch different from any other smart watch? People love Apple and will buy just about anything they make.

I guess. When I turn on my ATV. I'm only interacting with my ATV not Samsung anymore.

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Whatever it is Apple is doing they are a lot slower than they used to be. Maybe it's more in fighting, politics in the office, power vacuum, etc but what they have been coming up with lately has been slower to market and not as good.

This last iPhone was/is great but the rest of it has been pretty meh. This coming from a pretty big fanboy and have made a ton of the stock.

The TV is where I thought they could really do something amazing and all we get is Apple TV :yawn: pretty run of the mill compared with Amazon and Google there.

iTunes gets worse and worse the more muddled and "feature" laden it gets.

It's not like they are going anywhere and it's unrealistic to expect amazing innovation in every product but wish they could drop another big idea or huge improvement on something already out there.

I really thought they would dive into the TV market. With more and more people cutting the cord, having a TV made by Apple that ran iOS and could access everything through apps seems pretty intriguing. And honestly, the TV market seems ripe for the picking right now.

In the TV world, you still have to have a network. So since they do their own thing, they either buy a satellite TV company or buy a broadband company, otherwise they are left having to play with others, which isn't really their MO. That's always been the problem with the TV world.

Why couldn't they manufacture TVs?

They can...but those TVs need content. That means they have to play nice with their providers. That means a device that runs well on really low end networks as well as those that have fiber running right to the house. That also means playing nice with the companies their users have "cut the cord" on

But why couldn't they make their own TV with Apple TV essentially integrated into it? It would blow all the other current "smart TVs" out of the water.

How would that be any different then an Apple TV connected via HDMI. Smart TV is useless much rather be able to connect the equipment I want when I want.

Because the whole thing would be designed by Apple. How is Apple Watch different from any other smart watch? People love Apple and will buy just about anything they make.

I guess. When I turn on my ATV. I'm only interacting with my ATV not Samsung anymore.

True. I just always thought they would make their own TV set. Retina screen and all. I think there's a market for that. But, you're right though, that Apple TV pretty much becomes the default Smart TV OS when it's plugged into a TV.

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You guys seem to be thinking about a traditional car with some neat interface and a computer system that connects us to the car. It seems more like Apple and Google would be making a car that effectively is a computer on wheels. Why would Chrysler be better at this than Apple or Google? I'd have more confidence in IBM creating the next generation of world-changing cars than I would Ford or GM.

how do you expect apple or google to sell these cars?

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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

Edited by heropretend
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You guys seem to be thinking about a traditional car with some neat interface and a computer system that connects us to the car. It seems more like Apple and Google would be making a car that effectively is a computer on wheels. Why would Chrysler be better at this than Apple or Google? I'd have more confidence in IBM creating the next generation of world-changing cars than I would Ford or GM.

how do you expect apple or google to sell these cars?

ivrooms

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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

You must be hanging around some serious fans. I only have a handful of friends with the watch and they love Apple. Most people that buy iPhones do so because they are a good, easy-to-use product that they are familiar with, not because they are running a status ladder against other Apple users. If the watch does well it's going to be for the same reasons.

Watches can already be luxury status symbols. If that's important to you, you aren't buying an Apple Watch.

Edited by jonessed
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To those suggesting they partner with a current maker, that's one angle they appear to be exploring. They have been talking with BMW and seem to be impressed with their i3 platform. Given BMW's upscale reputation, as well as ability to create excellent DRIVING autos, they would be a natural fit with Apple's drive for quality while being excellent at providing the guts of the car.

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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

You must be hanging around some serious fans. I only have a handful of friends with the watch and they love Apple. Most people that buy iPhones do so because they are a good, easy-to-use product that they are familiar with, not because they are running a status ladder against other Apple users. If the watch does well it's going to be for the same reasons.

Watches can already be luxury status symbols. If that's important to you, you aren't buying an Apple Watch.

This. I don't think I know anyone with an Apple Watch. I use an iPhone 6 because it works great, not because I think people are impressed by it. Hell, most everyone I know has an iPhone. It's a useful tool, not a status symbol, IMO. Maybe in some groups/communities I suppose.

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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

You must be hanging around some serious fans. I only have a handful of friends with the watch and they love Apple. Most people that buy iPhones do so because they are a good, easy-to-use product that they are familiar with, not because they are running a status ladder against other Apple users. If the watch does well it's going to be for the same reasons.

Watches can already be luxury status symbols. If that's important to you, you aren't buying an Apple Watch.

iPhones are priced around $650 and a great upper end budget Moto G 3rd gen is $220. I don't want to talk contracts or anything and upgrade cycles. Merely pointing out, there is a huge difference in price without a huge difference in useability.

The Apple Watch is just starting to gain traction and you do have a handful of friends who bought it. I do too. I don't see them flashing it as a status symbol, but at the same time I haven't heard a great reason to buy one from people using it. That leads me to believe they are buying it only to differentiate their IPhone/iSTATUS from their parents' or colleagues' iPhoniness. The Apple Watch is useless to me and you and yet quarterly sales of "other" jumped $1.6 billion. Those aren't apple tv and headphone sales.

Edited by heropretend
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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

You must be hanging around some serious fans. I only have a handful of friends with the watch and they love Apple. Most people that buy iPhones do so because they are a good, easy-to-use product that they are familiar with, not because they are running a status ladder against other Apple users. If the watch does well it's going to be for the same reasons.

Watches can already be luxury status symbols. If that's important to you, you aren't buying an Apple Watch.

iPhones are priced around $650 and a great upper end budget Moto G 3rd gen is $220. I don't want to talk contracts or anything and upgrade cycles. Merely pointing out, there is a huge difference in price without a huge difference in useability.

The Apple Watch is just starting to gain traction and you do have a handful of friends who bought it. I do too. I don't see them flashing it as a status symbol, but at the same time I haven't heard a great reason to buy one from people using it. That leads me to believe they are buying it only to differentiate their IPhone/iSTATUS from their parents' or colleagues' iPhoniness. The Apple Watch is useless to me and you and yet quarterly sales of "other" jumped $1.6 billion. Those aren't apple tv and headphone sales.

The Galaxy S5 was priced about the same as the 6 as I recall. Apple phones carry a premium, but it's not $400.

The "other" category exists so they can mask sales of individual products. That doesn't mean that sales were bad, but if they were good, we would have heard about it elsewhere I suspect.

If you have the disposable income and like Apple products I don't see why you wouldn't try it out. They are kind of fun even if not overly useful. They will improve it I'm sure, but I think it really needs to differentiate itself beyond an extension of the phone to get much traction.

Edited by jonessed
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The car thing seems so dumb. I always assumed they weren't actually making an actual car but we're making the interface / interior displays for companies that make cars.

This Tim Cook guy is not creating anything. Maybe the Steve Jobs "genius" was hype but there is no arguing his run starting with the iPod.

Umm, Steve Jobs was most certainly a genius.

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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

You must be hanging around some serious fans. I only have a handful of friends with the watch and they love Apple. Most people that buy iPhones do so because they are a good, easy-to-use product that they are familiar with, not because they are running a status ladder against other Apple users. If the watch does well it's going to be for the same reasons.

Watches can already be luxury status symbols. If that's important to you, you aren't buying an Apple Watch.

This. I don't think I know anyone with an Apple Watch. I use an iPhone 6 because it works great, not because I think people are impressed by it. Hell, most everyone I know has an iPhone. It's a useful tool, not a status symbol, IMO. Maybe in some groups/communities I suppose.

It took the Ipod several years to catch on too. I don't have an Apple watch yet, but I can see myself getting one as they work the form down a bit. I didn't get an ipod until gen 3.

I don't even really view the Apple watch as a watch or a status symbol, it's a wearable interface to the iphone that you can keep in your pocket or purse. It also makes fitbit and other sports bands obsolete. The biggest mistake Apple made, IMO, was calling it a watch.

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Apple pay might be their biggest mistake. Last stats I saw was only 5% of people with an apple pay enabled phone AT an apple pay enabled checkout terminal have used the service.

I think they really missed the timing on this not getting in when all the POS terminals were swapping to Chip and pin transaction cards. Now they don't want to add this other new tech.

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Apple pay might be their biggest mistake. Last stats I saw was only 5% of people with an apple pay enabled phone AT an apple pay enabled checkout terminal have used the service.

I think they really missed the timing on this not getting in when all the POS terminals were swapping to Chip and pin transaction cards. Now they don't want to add this other new tech.

It goes through the Apple network too....I don't need my financial transaction (any part of it) running through their infrastructure.

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I'm starting to see the Apple Watch as a means of iPhone users signaling their status over other iPhone users. Wherever we go with wearables or VR or cars, with Apple's perception as a luxury brand and best in class design, Apple is going to dominate the market. If everyone owns an iPhone then its no longer an iPhone cycle, but an Apple Watch or Apple glasses or Apple Car cycle that then upgrades into perpetuity. If everything is an extension of the iPhone then Apple's long term potential market to takeover is every luxury/status symbol.

You must be hanging around some serious fans. I only have a handful of friends with the watch and they love Apple. Most people that buy iPhones do so because they are a good, easy-to-use product that they are familiar with, not because they are running a status ladder against other Apple users. If the watch does well it's going to be for the same reasons.

Watches can already be luxury status symbols. If that's important to you, you aren't buying an Apple Watch.

iPhones are priced around $650 and a great upper end budget Moto G 3rd gen is $220. I don't want to talk contracts or anything and upgrade cycles. Merely pointing out, there is a huge difference in price without a huge difference in useability.

The Apple Watch is just starting to gain traction and you do have a handful of friends who bought it. I do too. I don't see them flashing it as a status symbol, but at the same time I haven't heard a great reason to buy one from people using it. That leads me to believe they are buying it only to differentiate their IPhone/iSTATUS from their parents' or colleagues' iPhoniness. The Apple Watch is useless to me and you and yet quarterly sales of "other" jumped $1.6 billion. Those aren't apple tv and headphone sales.

The Galaxy S5 was priced about the same as the 6 as I recall. Apple phones carry a premium, but it's not $400.

The "other" category exists so they can mask sales of individual products. That doesn't mean that sales were bad, but if they were good, we would have heard about it elsewhere I suspect.

If you have the disposable income and like Apple products I don't see why you wouldn't try it out. They are kind of fun even if not overly useful. They will improve it I'm sure, but I think it really needs to differentiate itself beyond an extension of the phone to get much traction.

The Moto G 3rd gen is really $220 unlocked and new. The Nexus 5x is at $300 new right now. These phones work on all carriers and the price difference is $470 and $390 while the average iphone price last quarter was $690. Those are good but not great phones that work well for the majority of people at a fraction of the cost. People don't buy those phones because it's not an iPhone.

It's like a cast iron pot, people buy a le creuset over a lodge logic or kirkland. These are status symbols. The iPhone is unique is because it's a status symbol that everyone thinks is better AND everyone owns.

The other category grew $1.6 billion with no other significant product rebooted. It's pretty safe to assume the headphone, iPod and apple tv markets aren't responsible for the $1.6 billion growth. How can you really explain $1.6 billion increase in "other" if you're not tying it to the watch?

Edited by heropretend
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Apple pay might be their biggest mistake. Last stats I saw was only 5% of people with an apple pay enabled phone AT an apple pay enabled checkout terminal have used the service.

I think they really missed the timing on this not getting in when all the POS terminals were swapping to Chip and pin transaction cards. Now they don't want to add this other new tech.

That's surprising. I still have a 5, which isn't enabled, and Apple Pay (and the better camera chip) is the only reason I wanted to upgrade to 6. Most people I know with 6 use it and love it. Whether Apple Pay succeeds or not, the days of physical credit cards are numbered.

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Apple pay might be their biggest mistake. Last stats I saw was only 5% of people with an apple pay enabled phone AT an apple pay enabled checkout terminal have used the service.

I think they really missed the timing on this not getting in when all the POS terminals were swapping to Chip and pin transaction cards. Now they don't want to add this other new tech.

It goes through the Apple network too....I don't need my financial transaction (any part of it) running through their infrastructure.

Not sure you understand how ApplePay works...

Apple Pay, which has a tokenised backend infrastructure, makes card payments secure by creating a number or token that replaces your card details. More specifically, it creates a Device Account Number for each one of your cards.

​According to Apple, the Device Account Number is assigned, encrypted, and securely stored in the Secure Element, a dedicated chip in iPhone and Apple Watch, and when a payment is initiated, the token is passed to the retailer or merchant. The retailer or merchant therefore never has direct access to your card details.

I love ApplePay and use it wherever I can. Super easy/quick... as are most contactless payments.

Chip+Pin scanners are slow as hell. At least the ones I have used are. I try to avoid at all costs.

Edited by [icon]
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Apple pay might be their biggest mistake. Last stats I saw was only 5% of people with an apple pay enabled phone AT an apple pay enabled checkout terminal have used the service.

I think they really missed the timing on this not getting in when all the POS terminals were swapping to Chip and pin transaction cards. Now they don't want to add this other new tech.

That's surprising. I still have a 5, which isn't enabled, and Apple Pay (and the better camera chip) is the only reason I wanted to upgrade to 6. Most people I know with 6 use it and love it. Whether Apple Pay succeeds or not, the days of physical credit cards are numbered.

Probably, but when? I don't see wallets and purses going away anytime soon and it's not that hard to pull a CC out of a wallet.

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