BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Matthew Stafford is the first Lions QB since Bill Munson to win twice at Lambeau Field (1968 and 1970).
Wow
that’s insane.
Wow
that’s insane.Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
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2024 Detroit Lions: Getting ready for the draft in Motown. (60 Viewers)
- Thread starter Da Guru
- Start date
Deamon
Footballguy
That punting stat you mentioned in the game thread is crazy Bobby. For those that missed it, the last time the Lions went an entire game without punting was November 1971.
Think you guys are gonna go 5-3 or 6-2 over your final 8. 6-2 should get you into the playoffs. What a week 1 matchup vs Minny that would be. 5-3 and it's going to be close... Dallas and Seattle could both win 10 games pretty easily.
Think you guys are gonna go 5-3 or 6-2 over your final 8. 6-2 should get you into the playoffs. What a week 1 matchup vs Minny that would be. 5-3 and it's going to be close... Dallas and Seattle could both win 10 games pretty easily.
TartanLion
Footballguy
6-2 isn't outwith the realms of possibility if we can get hot. It might be asking a lot though with the condition of our running game, and lack of ability in short yardage situations. I'd activate Zenner to be honest. He fights for yards well and has some decent size/ability to move the pile. Decker back soon, who knows, maybe we can get it functional.
Woukd be very frustrating to not win the division this year. We are the team that has been consistently closest to Rodgers/Packers across the last five years, it would be very galling to have the Vikings win it as I think we are a better team.
What I would give to just have one of those Falcons, Panthers, Steelers games to have gone our way
Woukd be very frustrating to not win the division this year. We are the team that has been consistently closest to Rodgers/Packers across the last five years, it would be very galling to have the Vikings win it as I think we are a better team.
What I would give to just have one of those Falcons, Panthers, Steelers games to have gone our way
dmac37
Footballguy
I have been on the Zenner bandwagon since last year. When he was the guy last year it was the first time it looked like we had a complete NFL RB and were able to move the ball and score in the red zone, don't understand what they are doing making him inactive. He is like a poor mans K. Hunt, just gets positive yardage and can catch the ball also. AA can make the crowd cheering dazzling move at times but never equals consistent production.
Futz
Footballguy
It truly is what this offense lacks. Just get me 3-4 yards on EACH carry. Not -2, -1, +4 +2, -1. Abdullah's negative plays are very similar to Barry Sanders except without the numerous chunk plays to make up for it. He just doesn't have the ability to break the initial tackles or explode into the secondary like the man did.
Zenner could certainly set up some third and shorts and when this offense is set up like that, they can be indefensible when the whole play book is sitting there.
I also heard some chatter about FA DeAngelo Williams which might make a lot of sense too. He had a list of teams in the beginning of the year he said he'd play for but the Lions weren't on it. I wonder if he'd reconsider now that he has no offers and the Lions have a legit playoff chance.
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Futz
Footballguy
Finally got a chance to watch the game. It was a methodical and yet a thorough beat down for a divisional roadie in all places Lambeau. The usual warts showed (RBs, OL vs rush, RZ/Goalline) but Stafford played his best game in awhile, JBC added a couple of nice wrinkles to the play calling and the defense did exactly what I expected. What happened to GB running the ball with Aaron Jones? Completely abandoned it for some odd reason.
The rest of the season sets up nicely and it started here.
The rest of the season sets up nicely and it started here.
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
@Da Guru - thread title update? 
Snap count analysis from MNF at Lambeau:
A week ago, Quandre Diggs was on the wrong end of the worst of big plays. It was the kind that came after his offense was stopped near the goal-line, with that goal of getting the ball back quickly in a one-score game. His chasing and failing to catch JuJu Smith-Schuster for a 97-yard touchdown pass against the Pittsburgh Steelers was a highlight played over and over and over again.
But the Detroit Lions have shown continued faith in what the third-year nickel cornerback can do ever since he won the position battle in training camp this year, and that was never more evident than Monday night in Green Bay. The Lions not only kept Diggs in his normal position but they also made him one of the foundational parts of their defensive game plan. He played a career-high 85 percent of the snaps, almost every single play when the defense went to a nickel alignment.
Diggs certainly made that pay off in Detroit's 30-17 romping of the Packers. He brought the wood against the run, including a tackle for loss. And a week after giving up 97 yards on a single play, Diggs only surrendered 10 receiving yards on one catch against the Packers. In 50 total snaps, he was targeted one time, according to Pro Football Focus.
It's to be kept in perspective against a quarterback like Brett Hundley, who spent several downs throwing to nobody despite receivers that were breaking open. All cornerback stats are going to look better against him than even the average quarterback. But Diggs' ability to stay active and fend off any competition from DJ Hayden for work showcases what the Lions continue to really like about him: He's a force against the run and can be effective in coverage when he isn't stuck in it all day.
Here were other observations from how the snap counts shook out:
-- The Lions have found a new member of the pass rush. Jacquies Smith was playing in just his second game of 2017 and first with the Lions after signing, departing and signing again over the past couple weeks. The sixth-year defensive end was not only active over rookie Jeremiah Valoaga but played 49 percent of the snaps, even more than Cornelius Washington's 41 percent. He was in the game early and often, and he finished with a game-high two quarterback hits. Defensive coordinator Teryl Austin said last week that he was going to have to try some new avenues to generate a pass rush after Detroit failed to find a single sack against Drew Brees or Ben Roethlisberger. In addition to dialing up some blitzes, this was the new approach, and it worked some in a game where Hundley made pressures a little easier. At 6 feet 2 inches and 260 pounds, Smith is the oddball in the defensive end room as a lankier, faster player. He had 13.5 sacks combined in 2014 and 2015 before his 2016 ACL tear, and he can provide a little different form of a pass rush for the Lions if he can stay healthy and the rest of the defense can defend the run well enough to give him a legitimate number of snaps.
-- The blowout helped give a little bit of rest for Golden Tate, who is still recovering a bit from his shoulder injury, even if it's difficult to tell. He played 51 percent of the snaps, which was even less than what he had against New Orleans, when he got hurt. To lead the game with seven catches and 113 yards in half the game says plenty about the kind of zone he's in in this offense.
-- Darren Fells outsnapped Eric Ebron again, 43 plays to 35. This isn't anything new, especially since the Lions are going to go with Fells' blocking at the goal line (and those plays add up with their continued inability to convert in that area). Fells is also a better help for Brian Mihalik at left tackle given that blocking prowess. It'll be interesting to see how this approach changes, if it changes, when first-round left tackle Taylor Decker is back, which could potentially happen this Sunday against the Cleveland Browns.
-- Second-round rookie Teez Tabor snagged 11 plays at cornerback, which are eight more than he's had in the other seven games combined. He traded off with DJ Hayden, who played 30 snaps, to provide some relief for Nevin Lawson. Tabor is making a little progress at the position, but this also showed a desire to match up to the size Green Bay presented out wide with 6-foot-3-inch Jordy Nelson and 6-foot-1-inch Davante Adams. Those body types just make it difficult against 5-foot-9-inch Lawson, and the less Hundley could rely on just tossing it up and asking them to make a play in coverage, the more the Lions could force him to create. That obviously didn't go that well for the Packers.
Here's the full breakdown of snaps:
OFFENSE
G TJ Lang 68 (100 percent)
G Graham Glasgow 68 (100 percent)
C Travis Swanson 68 (100 percent)
OT Rick Wagner 68 (100 percent)
QB Matthew Stafford 68 (100 percent)
WR Marvin Jones 65 (96 percent)
OT Brian Mihalik 62 (91 percent)
WR TJ Jones 50 (74 percent)
TE Darren Fells 43 (63 percent)
TE Eric Ebron 35 (51 percent)
WR Golden Tate 35 (51 percent)
RB Ameer Abdullah 33 (49 percent)
RB Theo Riddick 25 (37 percent)
TE Michael Roberts 21 (31 percent)
WR Jared Abbrederis 18 (26 percent)
RB Dwayne Washington 11 (16 percent)
OT Emmett Cleary 6 (9 percent)
WR Jamal Agnew 3 (4 percent)
DEFENSE
FS Glover Quin 59 (100 percent)
LB Jarrad Davis 59 (100 percent)
CB Darius Slay 56 (95 percent)
CB Quandre Diggs 50 (85 percent)
SS Tavon Wilson 47 (80 percent)
DE Anthony Zettel 38 (64 percent)
DE Ezekiel Ansah 38 (64 percent)
DT A'Shawn Robinson 35 (59 percent)
LB Tahir Whitehead 35 (59 percent)
DT Akeem Spence 33 (56 percent)
CB Nevin Lawson 32 (54 percent)
CB DJ Hayden 30 (51 percent)
DE Jacquies Smith 29 (49 percent)
DE Cornelius Washington 24 (41 percent)
DT Jeremiah Ledbetter 21 (36 percent)
SS Miles Killebrew 18 (31 percent)
DT Khyri Thornton 18 (31 percent)
CB Teez Tabor 11 (19 percent)
LB Jalen Reeves-Maybin 9 (15 percent)
FS Charles Washington 7 (12 percent)
SPECIAL TEAMS
SS Miles Killebrew 16 (70 percent)
LB Nick Bellore 15 (65 percent)
P Sam Martin 14 (61 percent)
RB Dwayne Washington 13 (57 percent)
CB Jamal Agnew 13 (57 percent)
LB Jalen Reeves-Maybin 12 (52 percent)
FS Charles Washington 12 (52 percent)
LB Paul Worrilow 12 52 percent)
CB Nevin Lawson 11 (48 percent)
TE Darren Fells 9 (39 percent)
OT Emmett Cleary 8 (35 percent)
CB Teez Tabor 8 (35 percent)
WR Jace Billingsley 7 30 percent)
G TJ Lang 7 (30 percent)
C Travis Swanson 7 (30 percent)
G Graham Glasgow 7 (30 percent)
OT Rick Wagner 7 (30 percent)
OT Brian Mihalik 7 (30 percent)
LS Don Muhlbach 7 30 percent)
K Matt Prater 7 (30 percent)
TE Michael Roberts 7 (30 percent)
CB DJ Hayden 6 (26 percent)
WR Jared Abbrederis 5 (22 percent)
DT Jeremiah Ledbetter 5 (22 percent)
LB Jarrad Davis 4 (17 percent)
FS Glover Quin 4 (17 percent)
CB Quandre Diggs 4 (17 percent)
DT A'Shawn Robinson 4 (17 percent)
LB Tahir Whitehead 3 (13 percent)
CB Darius Slay 3 (13 percent)
DE Cornelius Washington 3 (13 percent)
DT Khyri Thornton 3 (13 percent)
WR TJ Jones 1 (4 percent)
SS Tavon Wilson 1 (4 percent)
DE Anthony Zettel 1 (4 percent)
DE Ezekiel Ansah 1 (4 percent)
DT Akeem Spence 1 (4 percent)
Snap count analysis from MNF at Lambeau:
A week ago, Quandre Diggs was on the wrong end of the worst of big plays. It was the kind that came after his offense was stopped near the goal-line, with that goal of getting the ball back quickly in a one-score game. His chasing and failing to catch JuJu Smith-Schuster for a 97-yard touchdown pass against the Pittsburgh Steelers was a highlight played over and over and over again.
But the Detroit Lions have shown continued faith in what the third-year nickel cornerback can do ever since he won the position battle in training camp this year, and that was never more evident than Monday night in Green Bay. The Lions not only kept Diggs in his normal position but they also made him one of the foundational parts of their defensive game plan. He played a career-high 85 percent of the snaps, almost every single play when the defense went to a nickel alignment.
Diggs certainly made that pay off in Detroit's 30-17 romping of the Packers. He brought the wood against the run, including a tackle for loss. And a week after giving up 97 yards on a single play, Diggs only surrendered 10 receiving yards on one catch against the Packers. In 50 total snaps, he was targeted one time, according to Pro Football Focus.
It's to be kept in perspective against a quarterback like Brett Hundley, who spent several downs throwing to nobody despite receivers that were breaking open. All cornerback stats are going to look better against him than even the average quarterback. But Diggs' ability to stay active and fend off any competition from DJ Hayden for work showcases what the Lions continue to really like about him: He's a force against the run and can be effective in coverage when he isn't stuck in it all day.
Here were other observations from how the snap counts shook out:
-- The Lions have found a new member of the pass rush. Jacquies Smith was playing in just his second game of 2017 and first with the Lions after signing, departing and signing again over the past couple weeks. The sixth-year defensive end was not only active over rookie Jeremiah Valoaga but played 49 percent of the snaps, even more than Cornelius Washington's 41 percent. He was in the game early and often, and he finished with a game-high two quarterback hits. Defensive coordinator Teryl Austin said last week that he was going to have to try some new avenues to generate a pass rush after Detroit failed to find a single sack against Drew Brees or Ben Roethlisberger. In addition to dialing up some blitzes, this was the new approach, and it worked some in a game where Hundley made pressures a little easier. At 6 feet 2 inches and 260 pounds, Smith is the oddball in the defensive end room as a lankier, faster player. He had 13.5 sacks combined in 2014 and 2015 before his 2016 ACL tear, and he can provide a little different form of a pass rush for the Lions if he can stay healthy and the rest of the defense can defend the run well enough to give him a legitimate number of snaps.
-- The blowout helped give a little bit of rest for Golden Tate, who is still recovering a bit from his shoulder injury, even if it's difficult to tell. He played 51 percent of the snaps, which was even less than what he had against New Orleans, when he got hurt. To lead the game with seven catches and 113 yards in half the game says plenty about the kind of zone he's in in this offense.
-- Darren Fells outsnapped Eric Ebron again, 43 plays to 35. This isn't anything new, especially since the Lions are going to go with Fells' blocking at the goal line (and those plays add up with their continued inability to convert in that area). Fells is also a better help for Brian Mihalik at left tackle given that blocking prowess. It'll be interesting to see how this approach changes, if it changes, when first-round left tackle Taylor Decker is back, which could potentially happen this Sunday against the Cleveland Browns.
-- Second-round rookie Teez Tabor snagged 11 plays at cornerback, which are eight more than he's had in the other seven games combined. He traded off with DJ Hayden, who played 30 snaps, to provide some relief for Nevin Lawson. Tabor is making a little progress at the position, but this also showed a desire to match up to the size Green Bay presented out wide with 6-foot-3-inch Jordy Nelson and 6-foot-1-inch Davante Adams. Those body types just make it difficult against 5-foot-9-inch Lawson, and the less Hundley could rely on just tossing it up and asking them to make a play in coverage, the more the Lions could force him to create. That obviously didn't go that well for the Packers.
Here's the full breakdown of snaps:
OFFENSE
G TJ Lang 68 (100 percent)
G Graham Glasgow 68 (100 percent)
C Travis Swanson 68 (100 percent)
OT Rick Wagner 68 (100 percent)
QB Matthew Stafford 68 (100 percent)
WR Marvin Jones 65 (96 percent)
OT Brian Mihalik 62 (91 percent)
WR TJ Jones 50 (74 percent)
TE Darren Fells 43 (63 percent)
TE Eric Ebron 35 (51 percent)
WR Golden Tate 35 (51 percent)
RB Ameer Abdullah 33 (49 percent)
RB Theo Riddick 25 (37 percent)
TE Michael Roberts 21 (31 percent)
WR Jared Abbrederis 18 (26 percent)
RB Dwayne Washington 11 (16 percent)
OT Emmett Cleary 6 (9 percent)
WR Jamal Agnew 3 (4 percent)
DEFENSE
FS Glover Quin 59 (100 percent)
LB Jarrad Davis 59 (100 percent)
CB Darius Slay 56 (95 percent)
CB Quandre Diggs 50 (85 percent)
SS Tavon Wilson 47 (80 percent)
DE Anthony Zettel 38 (64 percent)
DE Ezekiel Ansah 38 (64 percent)
DT A'Shawn Robinson 35 (59 percent)
LB Tahir Whitehead 35 (59 percent)
DT Akeem Spence 33 (56 percent)
CB Nevin Lawson 32 (54 percent)
CB DJ Hayden 30 (51 percent)
DE Jacquies Smith 29 (49 percent)
DE Cornelius Washington 24 (41 percent)
DT Jeremiah Ledbetter 21 (36 percent)
SS Miles Killebrew 18 (31 percent)
DT Khyri Thornton 18 (31 percent)
CB Teez Tabor 11 (19 percent)
LB Jalen Reeves-Maybin 9 (15 percent)
FS Charles Washington 7 (12 percent)
SPECIAL TEAMS
SS Miles Killebrew 16 (70 percent)
LB Nick Bellore 15 (65 percent)
P Sam Martin 14 (61 percent)
RB Dwayne Washington 13 (57 percent)
CB Jamal Agnew 13 (57 percent)
LB Jalen Reeves-Maybin 12 (52 percent)
FS Charles Washington 12 (52 percent)
LB Paul Worrilow 12 52 percent)
CB Nevin Lawson 11 (48 percent)
TE Darren Fells 9 (39 percent)
OT Emmett Cleary 8 (35 percent)
CB Teez Tabor 8 (35 percent)
WR Jace Billingsley 7 30 percent)
G TJ Lang 7 (30 percent)
C Travis Swanson 7 (30 percent)
G Graham Glasgow 7 (30 percent)
OT Rick Wagner 7 (30 percent)
OT Brian Mihalik 7 (30 percent)
LS Don Muhlbach 7 30 percent)
K Matt Prater 7 (30 percent)
TE Michael Roberts 7 (30 percent)
CB DJ Hayden 6 (26 percent)
WR Jared Abbrederis 5 (22 percent)
DT Jeremiah Ledbetter 5 (22 percent)
LB Jarrad Davis 4 (17 percent)
FS Glover Quin 4 (17 percent)
CB Quandre Diggs 4 (17 percent)
DT A'Shawn Robinson 4 (17 percent)
LB Tahir Whitehead 3 (13 percent)
CB Darius Slay 3 (13 percent)
DE Cornelius Washington 3 (13 percent)
DT Khyri Thornton 3 (13 percent)
WR TJ Jones 1 (4 percent)
SS Tavon Wilson 1 (4 percent)
DE Anthony Zettel 1 (4 percent)
DE Ezekiel Ansah 1 (4 percent)
DT Akeem Spence 1 (4 percent)
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
- Jim Caldwell at his weekly presser.
Actually, that's from any weekly PC over the last 3-1/2 seasons.
ALLEN PARK -- The Detroit Lions got back Kenny Golladay and Greg Robinson at practice Wednesday, but lost Jalen Reeves-Maybin and Ezekiel Ansah in return.
Ansah has been slowed by a knee injury for months now, which sidelined him for the entirety of training camp and has limited him in every practice he's attended. Whether it's the injury itself or all the limitations that go along with it, Ansah sure doesn't seem like himself because of the ordeal. He has a piece of a sack in just two games this season, and four overall.
Reeves-Maybin had been trending up in recent weeks, including making a team-high five tackles in the loss against Pittsburgh, but had his workload reduced Monday night against Green Bay and now he's banged up.
On the bright side, Golladay participated in a second straight practice for the first time in a long time. He's missed five games with a hamstring injury despite repeated attempts at a comeback, so the back-to-back days is a good sign in his bid to return against Cleveland.
Robinson has missed two games with an ankle injury, although his future is uncertain even when healthy. Brian Mihalik has held up well in his place at left tackle, and Taylor Decker is due for a return to Sundays any day now.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Dude tj sounded fine on his tuesday radio program
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Yep. He’ll be changing diapers all week.
Yeah, it’s crazy. Didn’t get sick until Wednesday. Sucks, but gotta protect these guys. CTE is no joke.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M8zyJuriHN9ZBRlUIkiRG6z-jot_rX6e0dzyzXVl360/edit#gid=183142882
@SameSongNDance doesn't allow copy / paste from his spreadsheet, but Fells has started the last 4 and outsnaps Ebron every week, because he's a better blocker. Ebron has higher utilization (percentage of plays he sees targets) and it's possible he hits on something. Had a really good catch and run against the Steelers for 44 yards. But the offense goes through Tate, Marvin Jones, Abdullah, and Riddick, in that order.
Targets/touches over the last 3 games:
- MJJ 12.0 (331 yards, 3 TDs)
- Tate 8.0 (295, 1)
- Abdullah 2.0 / 17.3 (149, 1)
- Riddick 4.3 / 8.0 (171, 0)
- TJJ 6.3 (150, 0)
- Ebron 4.3 (102, 0)
- Fells 2.7 (48, 1)
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Greg Robinson cut (presumably he’ll be looking for a job in public administration.) No corresponding move, the Lions have until 4pm Saturday to decide on the 53rd man. It’s widely reported Taylor Decker will be activated & play against the Browns.
Ezekiel Ansah is out Week 10, but it’s not the chronic knee this week - he’s dealing with a back issue. Probably time to move on after this season. Too bad, he was phenomenal in 2015 and he’s only been playing the game since 2010, if he ever gets healthy I think he’ll get back to Pro Bowl level. But it’s been two years of nagging injuries.
T.J. Lang is out Week 10. Bummer, hope he’s out of the protocol by Week 11.
Kenny Golladay had a week of full participation & is expected to be active Sunday.
Ezekiel Ansah is out Week 10, but it’s not the chronic knee this week - he’s dealing with a back issue. Probably time to move on after this season. Too bad, he was phenomenal in 2015 and he’s only been playing the game since 2010, if he ever gets healthy I think he’ll get back to Pro Bowl level. But it’s been two years of nagging injuries.
T.J. Lang is out Week 10. Bummer, hope he’s out of the protocol by Week 11.
Kenny Golladay had a week of full participation & is expected to be active Sunday.
TartanLion
Footballguy
Would be nice if we can get our entire first choice O line playing together at some point.
Shame sbout Ansah, but I really don't see how we can be investing any money in him. He's not been clear or injury for like two years now and we can't have another Levy situation on our hands.
Shame sbout Ansah, but I really don't see how we can be investing any money in him. He's not been clear or injury for like two years now and we can't have another Levy situation on our hands.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
hopefully they can take care of biz until the injuries hopefully clear up for the home stretch. Every game remains a must win for now.
Futz
Footballguy
Thanks Greg for being a big warm bodied corpse that people had to at least run around for a stretch until they got to the QB.BobbyLayne said:
Silver lining there is that we were forced into playing a guy who proved worthy in Mihallik.Ansah is disappointing but the silver lining here is that if we choose to keep him, we may be getting a Pro Bowl talent at a deep injury plagued discount. My gut tells me though that we let him test FA and someone over pays. Hopefully Quinn does the right thing and I think he will.
If ever there was a week to rest Lang even if he could play, it's Cleveland at home and same could be said for easing Golladay back in. Use him in the red zone only so he doesn't blow up that hammie.
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Next year's 6th and $5.3M. That close to TC they had to try something. Mihalik has been solid, his story is very similar to Villanueva, he's a very good backup for them now, so not a complete waste.Thanks Greg for being a big warm bodied corpse that people had to at least run around for a stretch until they got to the QB.
I was looking at Football Outsiders offensive line rankings for the first half earlier today. We're not good at run blocking, but the pass blocking is getting better, Stafford is pretty amazing when he has a clean pocket. He hits that hole shot in the Cover 2 better than anyone.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Decker moved to 53 man roster
The Lions also activated OT Corey Robinson to give them more depth on the OL; Jace Billingsley waived.
The Lions also activated OT Corey Robinson to give them more depth on the OL; Jace Billingsley waived.
Futz
Footballguy
Gracchi Bros
Footballguy
The Vikings have a tough game vs. the Rams, the Lions are at Chicago. Its always bad to look ahead with the Lions but they could be 6-4 vs. a 7-3 Vikings team on Thanksgiving for the North lead.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
It's basically in their own hands despite being out right now. Maybe just once Lucy won't pull the ball away from Charlie Lion.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Not really the same because the progression has taken longer, but the Lions (or more correctly, Stafford - everything from here on out is about legacy) are somewhat reminiscent of the late 80s Pistons. Couldn't get past the Celtics for years. Once we finally did, lost a heartbreaking Game 7 (why did Rodman take that shot...and please, no way Laimbeer fouled KAJ...don't get me started.) The next year they were muddling along and then the Dantley trade freed things up, they went on a tear for 2 years. Anyway, there was a progression, and lots of disappointment with crazy events & hard losses along the way. Well, the Lions have the latter part perfected.
Feels different than 2013, when they were leading with Cutler & Rodgers both hurt but choked away the opportunity. For one thing, Stafford is now 4-4 versus GB since then. Yeah, they're not the main thing this year but that's important, beating your nemesis regardless of who is hurt. For another, the defense can make some big plays, force turnovers. The offense doesn't have to outgun other teams, and the Special Teams is great in every aspect. There is reason to hope the run game is improving and will get better as we come down the stretch. Marvin Jones Jr may not be all that, but coupled with Tate - who is freaking putting up crazy numbers for a guy who is hurt & on a pitch count - plus a healthy Golladay, I like our WR corps. Heck, even Ebron makes a play here and there.
Stafford is 7-1 versus the Bears since 2013 (1-5 in the early years.) People always love to jump on Detroit's SoS but dang, you gotta give Caldwell some credit here. They've only lost to a team with less than 7 wins twice in the last four years. They generally take care of business against bad teams. That's what you're supposed to do, but don't act like it's a given. Mediocre teams steamroll good teams on the regular in the NFL.
We've swept the Vikings in 2011, 2014 and 2016; they swept us in 2009, 2012 and 2015. Means nothing of course, but I find it interesting that 2013 was the only year in the Stafford era there was a split (he's 7-7 against them overall.) Every week is big, they cannot afford to let down - especially this week - just because the schedule is easier in the second half, but that Thanksgiving Day game is gaining in importance. Two games is a big deficit with 7 left, but it's really only one game if they do their job.
Caldwell has the highest winning percentage in November in the NFL since he came to Detroit. Not a typo.
I think when most people think of the Detroit Lions, they figure "Oh, OK, we've seen this scenario before. They got another year with a weak schedule, and whether it's sneaking in with 9/10/11 wins, they'll be the 5/6 seed and get blown out in the first round." It's not an unfair assessment; that's their history. Not just the Stafford era, they are 0-9 in the WC round. In my lifetime, they are 1-1 at home in the playoffs, 0-11 on the road - 7 of those were double digit losses.
Let's face it, there's no rational reason to get behind this team and invest yourself emotionally. There is no valid argument they are poised for a deep run into late January.
But here's my weltanschauung, and it goes to the core of why I have remained a fan for 51 seasons (well except that one year): Your past does not equal your future. I wake up everyday believing the best is yet to come. I was never all that impressed with big volume Stafford, but smart efficient Stafford is a guy who could succeed. When you extrapolate the last few seasons out to 2021, he'll be climbing up leaderboards into the top 12 all-time by the time he is 33. None of which will matter because he'll just be Archie Manning or Fran Tarkenton if he doesn't win division titles or playoff games. But I don't think he's a same ole Lions guy. I believe he is the kind of leader who will create a legacy he can be proud about. I know i keep banging the same drum, but the big arm and insane throws don't mean anything until you start beating the best.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
OFF TOPIC
In the long time redraft I Commish, we have had 100% renewal 5 of the last 6 years. We've only lost one member 4 times in the last 9 seasons. But we're not getting any younger; I have two grandparents who are leaving at year end. Another guy wrote to me today to let me know he's gonna hang 'em up after 2017. So, I have to recruit new owners for the first time in forever. I have one guy who has been in the queue since 2014, but I might have two other spots if anyone needs a league. 12 x 16, full PPR, some quirky scoring (lots of DST categories, bonus plays & milestone yardage, low level KR, et al.)
It's a free league, but kind of an odd duck, because everyone keeps working the wire right through to the end regardless of where they are at in the Standings. So we're looking for people who understand commitment. There's no money so, yeah, it's weird. The other strange thing is we are all history enthusiasts, mostly American Civil War. Like, 100% of the league. So we need managers, but we're also hoping to find someone who is a good fit. Mostly Yinzers and mid-Atlantic guys, with one guy living in the U.K.
Anyway, if you are interested for 2018 and beyond, shoot me a PM.
ETA - oh, forgot we do have one Lions fan, he was our last new guy (2014.) He's the only other FBG in the league but mostly hangs in the FFA. Anyway, you wouldn't be out of place being a Michigander. TIA
In the long time redraft I Commish, we have had 100% renewal 5 of the last 6 years. We've only lost one member 4 times in the last 9 seasons. But we're not getting any younger; I have two grandparents who are leaving at year end. Another guy wrote to me today to let me know he's gonna hang 'em up after 2017. So, I have to recruit new owners for the first time in forever. I have one guy who has been in the queue since 2014, but I might have two other spots if anyone needs a league. 12 x 16, full PPR, some quirky scoring (lots of DST categories, bonus plays & milestone yardage, low level KR, et al.)
It's a free league, but kind of an odd duck, because everyone keeps working the wire right through to the end regardless of where they are at in the Standings. So we're looking for people who understand commitment. There's no money so, yeah, it's weird.
The other strange thing is we are all history enthusiasts, mostly American Civil War. Like, 100% of the league. So we need managers, but we're also hoping to find someone who is a good fit. Mostly Yinzers and mid-Atlantic guys, with one guy living in the U.K. Anyway, if you are interested for 2018 and beyond, shoot me a PM.
ETA - oh, forgot we do have one Lions fan, he was our last new guy (2014.) He's the only other FBG in the league but mostly hangs in the FFA. Anyway, you wouldn't be out of place being a Michigander. TIA
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Lang & Reeves-Maybin returned to practice today; worked outdoors in 40 degrees & rain since they’ll be in Chicago Sunday.
Ansah DNP.
Starting to feel like Dre Levy, D Washington also out, otherwise the team is healthy going into Week 11. Seasons
Ansah DNP.
Starting to feel like Dre Levy, D Washington also out, otherwise the team is healthy going into Week 11. Seasons
TartanLion
Footballguy
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Thank you for your service. ??
Nah, seriously brah, it’s great having the continuity. Most of us in here regularly have gone through decades of AYFKM kind of losses and seasons.
I genuinely believe this team could be different. We’ll see.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
3-0 in divisional road games - first time that’s happened since...
Check that - first time that’s happened in the Super Bowl era (52 seasons.) Wow.
Overall, the Lions are 4-1 away from home this season. That matches New Orleans, Carolina and the Rams for the most road wins in the NFC, and trails just Pittsburgh league wide. It also matches the most road wins by a Caldwell-coached team for a full season, with trips to losing teams like Cincinnati, Tampa Bay and Baltimore still on deck.
Only team the NFL that has 3 Road division wins in 2017.
Minnesita plays 4 of their next 5 on the road, versus 3 winning teams and the .500 Packers (plus home v. Cinci.) After Thanksgiving, the Lions wont face a team that currently has a winning record.
Check that - first time that’s happened in the Super Bowl era (52 seasons.) Wow.
Overall, the Lions are 4-1 away from home this season. That matches New Orleans, Carolina and the Rams for the most road wins in the NFC, and trails just Pittsburgh league wide. It also matches the most road wins by a Caldwell-coached team for a full season, with trips to losing teams like Cincinnati, Tampa Bay and Baltimore still on deck.
Only team the NFL that has 3 Road division wins in 2017.
Minnesita plays 4 of their next 5 on the road, versus 3 winning teams and the .500 Packers (plus home v. Cinci.) After Thanksgiving, the Lions wont face a team that currently has a winning record.
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playin4beer
Footballguy
You're all welcome... I had tickets in row 1 of the end zone just off to the side of the goal post that Barth missed the game tying kick..
I was the guy in the Slay jersey "waving" the kick to the right... It worked..
I was the guy in the Slay jersey "waving" the kick to the right... It worked..
Nice work. If only you had been there to wave at the end of the Atlanta game. It probably would have only taken an extra puff of air to nudge Tate across the goal line.You're all welcome... I had tickets in row 1 of the end zone just off to the side of the goal post that Barth missed the game tying kick..
I was the guy in the Slay jersey "waving" the kick to the right... It worked..
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Beat Minnesota on Thursday and I really like their chances to make playoffs
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Deeply flawed team - once again, woeful start that makes you question their preparation, two weeks giving up 200+ rushing, O-line outside of Decker looked like dog crap in their first game together all year. Lang was awful yesterday - he’s been super solid before this. Big Play Slay let an ice the game interception go through his hands. CB Teez Tabor (played like 11 or 13 snaps) led the team in pressures with 2.
Doesn’t matter. Division road games are tough outs. Forward down the field...
Good stuff: Stafford, MJJ, Golladay, Ebron, the DBs, Agnew, Prater. Quinn is the MVP and it’s really not close.
Deep in January? Unlikely, they’d have to run the table & get a lot of help to get the 2 seed. Have a decent shot at hosting a WC game. 0-9 in WC playoff games and 0-11 on the road in the Super Bowl era.
Still, I believe one of these years with Stafford at QB they will do one or more of those things. Why not 2017? Are there any super teams out there? Philly is very good obviously, New Orleans has an out of the box team, but I don’t think there is a team on the NFC who can’t be be beaten.
Doesn’t matter. Division road games are tough outs. Forward down the field...
Good stuff: Stafford, MJJ, Golladay, Ebron, the DBs, Agnew, Prater. Quinn is the MVP and it’s really not close.
Deep in January? Unlikely, they’d have to run the table & get a lot of help to get the 2 seed. Have a decent shot at hosting a WC game. 0-9 in WC playoff games and 0-11 on the road in the Super Bowl era.
Still, I believe one of these years with Stafford at QB they will do one or more of those things. Why not 2017? Are there any super teams out there? Philly is very good obviously, New Orleans has an out of the box team, but I don’t think there is a team on the NFC who can’t be be beaten.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Seattle & Pack have real injury problems going forward, but that could still leave Detroit in the first spot out of the WC. Whether its division or wild card, Thanksgiving Day is ironicly a pretty much a do or die day for our favorite turkeys.
http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/258411/why-the-lions-should-pull-for-new-orleans-tampa-bay-this-weekend
http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/258411/why-the-lions-should-pull-for-new-orleans-tampa-bay-this-weekend
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
If we’re a road WC team in January I’ll probably spend the weekend skiing. Seriously, this is the best chance in the Stafford era to win the division. Bears are a joke, the Pack isn’t that good even with Rodgers, and the Vikings are not a super team.
Detroit has a ton of issues. Both lines are subpar, the young LBs don’t understand gap responsibility and outside of Whitehead none of them have been good in coverage, the OC consistently sets up his tailbacks for failure by telegraphing his 1st down/short yardage runs. But they do a lot of things really well:
- good QB play - His deep passer rating (throws over 20 yards) is tops in the league, which is amazing considering he doesn’t have speedsters. He’s great at that hole shot sideline throw between the seams v. the cover 2. He just keeps getting it done when they are down & need a drive. Pocket prescense regressed a bit this year but he doesn’t make those WTHWT throws anymore. Great leadership - I’m really impressed at how he handles it effortlessly. Dude has a lot on his shoulders & it’s just NBD.
- improving receiving corps - Tate struggled to stay on the field v. the Bears but his production through his injury has been phenomenal. Golladay is good for a big play every week, Marvin has upped his game, even Ebron has made big plays lately.
- defensive backfield - the two weak links platooning opposite Darius each have a scoop n score the last two games. Quinn is at an All Pro level. Big Play Slay is just that and pretty solid agaibsts WR1s - dude is ballin’ this year. Killibrew & Wilson chip in contribution, Slow Poke Tabor is seeing more snaps. Best group on the team and it’s not close.
- Special teams are A+ - Agnew is gonna be in the Pro Bowl (but won’t play on Thanksgiving), Prater is clutch - literally never misses in the last 5 minutes & kills it from over 50 - Martin is back to excellent form, they’re good in coverage.
- Turnovers have been a point of emphasis. 19 in 10 games is no accident. “5 TDs from the D and 2 PR TDs isn’t sustainable.” Oh, OK. Except what you’re seeing is a team that plays like they practice. It’s simply execution.
The doom and gloom beat writers and sports talk radio guys around Detroit are convinced the Vikings will roll over the Lions in two days. So glad I don’t live around there anymore. If you’re sick of same ole Lions why don’t you start by looking in the mirror.
ETA CORRECTION - misread the practice report, Agnew sat out today but may play
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NeverEnough
Footballguy
Vikings shut down the Rams. Anyone expecting a repeat or close?
If they win the rest of their games this year I really like their chances to be Super Bowl champs.
Seriously though, this has all the trappings of a "same ol' Lions" game": high-profile show-down against a strong opponent who's playing well (think Green Bay Week 17 last year, or Green Bay Week 17 2014). So yeah, if they can pull out a win it will really say something about this team, and how things may be different this year.
But if they can't ... same ol' Lions.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
They didn't really shut them down, but that Kupp fumble at the 1 inside two minutes of the first half really killed the momentum. Slugfest third quarter but the game got away from them in the 4th.
The Lions offense is averaging 389 yards per game since Week 5, with a low of 345, high of 482. They've had very slow starts the last two weeks against inferior competition. They've given up 379 or more in four of those five games, but timely turnovers have mitigated their flaws somewhat.
I don't expect Detroit to run the ball well on Thanksgiving. I like our positional advantage at QB - though Keenum has played very well this year - and they do a good job of spreading the targets.
I'm very concerned about being able to stop the run. The linebackers are not good at being disciplined in gap responsibility, they miss Ngata inside and Ansah (declared out) sets the best edge. I like our chances at creating turnovers, as the Vikings QB is streaky.
ETA: CORRECTION Ansah has not been declared out & practiced today
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Though unlikely, they do have a very favorable schedule. None of their last five opponents is above .500 (21-29 overall.)If they win the rest of their games this year I really like their chances to be Super Bowl champs.
The problem is even given that slim chance, the Saints beat them H2H and have almost as easy of a schedule. If the Falcons or Panthers beat them in the Superdome, that opens up possibilities. Probsble best case I think is first division crown since 1993 and a home WC.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Agnew is out
Abdullah will take KR
TJ Jones or Tate PR
Abdullah will take KR
TJ Jones or Tate PR
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Lions have to ditch the run and become a pass first offense like GB with Rodgers. Use the pass to set up the run not vice versa. Stafford is playing at a high level and when the Lions are down or in a fast paced passing offense they seem to move the ball at will. Stop trying to be something you are not.
Futz
Footballguy
I think that works when you have teams with elite passing game components and that includes an offensive line that keeps the QB upright.
GB: Rodgers, Jordy, Adams, Cobb
NE: Brady, Gronk, Cooks, Edelman (when healthy), Hogan, Amendola, and pass catching RBs out the ying yang
I would argue that Tate & Jones would be WR3s at best on these types of pass happy teams. I also don't think Stafford or the OL is elite enough to get it done against good teams. That's the problem with this team. We have to run to a certain degree to lower the degree of difficulty on third downs or we are just not very good.
We are one more draft away. We need a true RB1, DE, DT and LB still.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
I think you are really selling Tate short. He would be a total beast in New England. Edleman - injuries + Dion Lewis like open field moves
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Every time I watch Jordan Howard play I keep think he was the RB that got away. 5th rd pick and he is a bell cow!
