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WR Josh Gordon, KC (8 Viewers)

BassNBrew said:
Krispy...I'm from the south.
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True story:

I lived in the land of Dunkin Donuts for the first 21 years of my life.  For the past 33 years I've lived in the land of Krispy Kreme.

In virtually every way, southern food is much better than northern food (some are neither...i.e. Chinese, German, Italian, etc.) imo.

Krispy Kreme donuts are nothing more than warm glazed donuts.

This is a culinary blind spot of the south. 

You have no idea what you are talking about when you try to take the position that warm glazed donuts are "better"...its patently ridiculous.

Edited to add: smoked sausage is also a joke.

 
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bostonfred said:
It's because Dunkin' Donuts isn't a donut shop. It's a coffee shop where they sell donuts and other breakfast items.  The name Dunkin' isn't a person's name (Duncan). It is short for dunking. They used to sell a Q shaped plain donut instead of an O so you could use it as a handle while you dunked your donut in their delicious coffee.  This was obviously decades ago, before food was good and people knew how to fix cars and repair their own homes instead of today's skills like ordering delivery and dealing with our obesity.  People would sit in coffee shops and enjoy a donut with their coffee and dunk it in because there was no internet and nowhere better to  go. They'd buy a dozen donuts on sundays after church and wait in a huge line to do so. They'd bring a dozen donuts to work and be regarded as heroes for the day because they were active people and nobody was dieting to make up for their sedentary computer jobs.  

Then McDonald's popularized the egg mcmuffin and every breakfast place started offering egg sandwiches, and so on. People started getting fatter, especially as office jobs became the norm, and Dunkin offered plausible deniability with things like munchkins (donut holes can't have that many calories right?) And now nobody really buys donuts up here unless they have a promotion of some kind.  But we get coffee every morning, so much that there were Dunkin donuts drive thrus on the "going to work" side of the street and Dunkin walk in locations in every T station or city block or mall long before Starbucks arrived and tried to do the same. 

Krispy Kreme sells coffee, but they're marketed as a donut store first and foremost.  They might have a drive through, but they're competing with the local drive through Dunkin Donuts for coffee business because i don't want to make two stops.  Their donut might be good but that's not something we want up here.  We know we aren't supposed to have donuts.  We get a huge Dunkin coffee with the mandatory six scoops of sugar and six ounces of milk because hey that's just my morning Joe, and we get a bacon egg and cheese sandwich on a bagel instead of a donut because we've been convinced that it's real food instead of empty calories.  But stopping at a donut shop to get donuts is a rare treat,  the kind of thing you can't lie to yourself about because everybody knows donuts are bad for you. And while a fancy glazed donut with warm jizz on it sounds cool once in a while, we're used to the Boston kreme tasting like Boston and the jelly donut tasting like the right brand of jam and we know where to get it.  It was a novelty when they first opened but never something that enough people wanted on a regular basis to keep the popularity they have in other areas. 
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https://www.foodandwine.com/news/krispy-kreme-redesign-doughnut-milkshakes-ice-cream-sandwiches

Krispy Kreme now offers ice creme donut.  Drove by this new store and it put Chickfila to shame.  Line out the door and 30 cars in the drive through.  We were told it's been pretty much a 30 minute wait since they opened.

 
SeniorVBDStudent said:
True story:

I lived in the land of Dunkin Donuts for the first 21 years of my life.  For the past 33 years I've lived in the land of Krispy Kreme.

In virtually every way, southern food is much better than northern food (some are neither...i.e. Chinese, German, Italian, etc.) imo.

Krispy Kreme donuts are nothing more than warm glazed donuts.

This is a culinary blind spot of the south. 

You have no idea what you are talking about when you try to take the position that warm glazed donuts are "better"...its patently ridiculous.

Edited to add: smoked sausage is also a joke.
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You clearly did not live in Chicago or New York then.  

29 in Chicago. 23 in Florida.  

Florida has the best chicken wings on the planet.  Great seafood.  Get to Miami and it is as good for food as anywhere in the world (at 4x the price). 

Chicago easily has the best thick pizza.  ANYTHING meat.  And amazing gourmet.

I love both, but there is no comparison between the hot south and to the places where people are locked inside their houses 9 months of the year. ;)

I still think Josh Gordon is going to have a breakout game.  Minkah Fitzpatrick clearly prefers Dunkin Donuts to Josh Gordon.  

 
Hairy Snowman said:
Chicago easily has the best thick pizza.  ANYTHING meat.  And amazing gourmet.
 
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We are more aligned than you think.  I'm excluding pizza from the comparison under the ethnic food exemption (Italian, German, etc.).

In that regard, the north is way better than the south in terms of access to such (Chicago and Pittsburgh are two of the best).

 
BassNBrew said:
https://www.foodandwine.com/news/krispy-kreme-redesign-doughnut-milkshakes-ice-cream-sandwiches

Krispy Kreme now offers ice creme donut.  Drove by this new store and it put Chickfila to shame.  Line out the door and 30 cars in the drive through.  We were told it's been pretty much a 30 minute wait since they opened.
Click to expand...
We don't really have chick fil a up here either. There's a couple, one in a mall food court which sucks because it's not open in time for breakfast and another that's a proper drive thru about 25 minutes from my house. I love it but I feel like a Republican blasting Dixie Chicks from his Tesla. 

 
Nucker101 said:
Anyone thinking of making an aggressive trade offer for him in redraft? Feel like his value will go up big time if AB ends up getting let go, but at the same time he's going too be hard to trust if AB sticks around. I'm considering doing this in leagues where I've lost Tyreek Hill
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I was offered Lockett for Gordon. Turned it down but thought it was very close. Depends on AB. I'd rather have Gordon if AB is out of the picture, Lockett if AB joins the fray.

 
Lionsfan011 said:
I was offered Lockett for Gordon. Turned it down but thought it was very close. Depends on AB. I'd rather have Gordon if AB is out of the picture, Lockett if AB joins the fray.
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Wow.  Dodds has it 193 Lockett, 144 Gordon rest of year.  

That's like turning down fresh and hot Krispy Kreme for stale Dunkin.

 
bostonfred said:
An analogy that only makes sense because fresh Krispy Kreme isn't clearly better than fresh Dunkin.  The defense rests. 
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How does any of this tie in to Josh Gordon? Was there a chance he was hooked on KK's in Cleveland but now won't be addicted to DD's because their formula is different?

 
Anarchy99 said:
How does any of this tie in to Josh Gordon? Was there a chance he was hooked on KK's in Cleveland but now won't be addicted to DD's because their formula is different?
Click to expand...


Hairy Snowman said:
You clearly did not live in Chicago or New York then.  

29 in Chicago. 23 in Florida.  

Florida has the best chicken wings on the planet.  Great seafood.  Get to Miami and it is as good for food as anywhere in the world (at 4x the price). 

Chicago easily has the best thick pizza.  ANYTHING meat.  And amazing gourmet.

I love both, but there is no comparison between the hot south and to the places where people are locked inside their houses 9 months of the year. ;)

I still think Josh Gordon is going to have a breakout game.  Minkah Fitzpatrick clearly prefers Dunkin Donuts to Josh Gordon.  
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When all is said an done, Gordon is going against a cupcake on the schedule.  And that is not a half-baked opinion. Even if Gordon is a bit of a crepe.  ;)  

 
bostonfred said:
It's because Dunkin' Donuts isn't a donut shop. It's a coffee shop where they sell donuts and other breakfast items.  The name Dunkin' isn't a person's name (Duncan). It is short for dunking. They used to sell a Q shaped plain donut instead of an O so you could use it as a handle while you dunked your donut in their delicious coffee.  This was obviously decades ago, before food was good and people knew how to fix cars and repair their own homes instead of today's skills like ordering delivery and dealing with our obesity.  People would sit in coffee shops and enjoy a donut with their coffee and dunk it in because there was no internet and nowhere better to  go. They'd buy a dozen donuts on sundays after church and wait in a huge line to do so. They'd bring a dozen donuts to work and be regarded as heroes for the day because they were active people and nobody was dieting to make up for their sedentary computer jobs.  

Then McDonald's popularized the egg mcmuffin and every breakfast place started offering egg sandwiches, and so on. People started getting fatter, especially as office jobs became the norm, and Dunkin offered plausible deniability with things like munchkins (donut holes can't have that many calories right?) And now nobody really buys donuts up here unless they have a promotion of some kind.  But we get coffee every morning, so much that there were Dunkin donuts drive thrus on the "going to work" side of the street and Dunkin walk in locations in every T station or city block or mall long before Starbucks arrived and tried to do the same. 

Krispy Kreme sells coffee, but they're marketed as a donut store first and foremost.  They might have a drive through, but they're competing with the local drive through Dunkin Donuts for coffee business because i don't want to make two stops.  Their donut might be good but that's not something we want up here.  We know we aren't supposed to have donuts.  We get a huge Dunkin coffee with the mandatory six scoops of sugar and six ounces of milk because hey that's just my morning Joe, and we get a bacon egg and cheese sandwich on a bagel instead of a donut because we've been convinced that it's real food instead of empty calories.  But stopping at a donut shop to get donuts is a rare treat,  the kind of thing you can't lie to yourself about because everybody knows donuts are bad for you. And while a fancy glazed donut with warm jizz on it sounds cool once in a while, we're used to the Boston kreme tasting like Boston and the jelly donut tasting like the right brand of jam and we know where to get it.  It was a novelty when they first opened but never something that enough people wanted on a regular basis to keep the popularity they have in other areas. 
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Great post...  I long for the days before the internet and the joy of having nowhere better to go.  You brought me back to my youth and made me completely forget about Antonio Brown until... you mentioned "a fancy glazed donut with warm jizz on it" and snapped me back to 2019.

 
The Patriots won't always run it this much, but as long as Brown is active and Edelman is healthy, Gordon is their new, and better, Chris Hogan.  Will make some big plays here and there, but good luck asking for week to week production. 

 
Josh Gordon delivered two catches for 19 yards on five targets Sunday in New England’s Week 2 win over the Dolphins.

Both of his catches came in the second half. Gordon actually drew more targets than he did in the opener, though the Patriots made Antonio Brown (4-56-1 on eight targets) their focal point in Week 2. Though undeniably talented—he scored a thrilling touchdown in last week's opener—Gordon's relatively light target share in a congested Patriots pass-catching corps doesn't make him the most reliable fantasy asset. We'll see what he can conjure against the Jets in Week 3.
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Will he get lost in the shuffle in New England with just too many other options? Is anyone (gasp) dropping him?

ETA: Will he be a fantasy asset if Antonio Brown avoids suspension/punishment?

 
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I'm starting to warm up to AB cutting into Edelman, White and the like but Gordon offers some of that Gronk production and offers a different set of skills.

I think it will take a couple weeks but he will find his rhythm  with AB in this offense. When he hits it will be of the long variety or he will break a tackle with one on one coverage and then he is gone.  Many teams have supported two WRs over the years, not as common even in a passing league but Gordon is still a nice WR3 option most weeks. 12 teams, Top 36 threat?

 
Ministry of Pain said:
I'm starting to warm up to AB cutting into Edelman, White and the like but Gordon offers some of that Gronk production and offers a different set of skills.

I think it will take a couple weeks but he will find his rhythm  with AB in this offense. When he hits it will be of the long variety or he will break a tackle with one on one coverage and then he is gone.  Many teams have supported two WRs over the years, not as common even in a passing league but Gordon is still a nice WR3 option most weeks. 12 teams, Top 36 threat?
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Doubt it. Don’t see one team supporting three fantasy WR in the Top 36. I don’t see Gordon leap frogging the other two. Maybe once in a while based on game plan or opponent. But not usually given the defense.

 
Anarchy99 said:
Doubt it. Don’t see one team supporting three fantasy WR in the Top 36. I don’t see Gordon leap frogging the other two. Maybe once in a while based on game plan or opponent. But not usually given the defense.
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I believe when AB roams vs a better defense than what they just saw in Miami, I think your opinion might change. Josh Gordon can tear a secondary apart and his size and speed, he won't be sitting around on the bench IMO. 

Let's see what the next few weeks bring but I understand the pessimism...long season. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
I believe when AB roams vs a better defense than what they just saw in Miami, I think your opinion might change. Josh Gordon can tear a secondary apart and his size and speed, he won't be sitting around on the bench IMO. 

Let's see what the next few weeks bring but I understand the pessimism...long season. 
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It's an offense designed to go underneath and for great route runners. It's not designed for slow developing plays, like long square ins and the like, really. I think Gordon's use, as Anarchy99 stated, will be sporadic, which is too bad if you roster him. (I do.)

 
And with OL and TE issues, I don’t see NE running many plays that take more than 2 seconds to get the ball out. Stout defense will result in lots of running plays. Sorry MOP, not seeing it for JG unless AB or JE are out (which certainly could happen) and even then it would have to be after the OL gets healthy. 

 
rockaction said:
It's an offense designed to go underneath and for great route runners. It's not designed for slow developing plays, like long square ins and the like, really. I think Gordon's use, as Anarchy99 stated, will be sporadic, which is too bad if you roster him. (I do.)
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Anarchy99 said:
And with OL and TE issues, I don’t see NE running many plays that take more than 2 seconds to get the ball out. Stout defense will result in lots of running plays. Sorry MOP, not seeing it for JG unless AB or JE are out (which certainly could happen) and even then it would have to be after the OL gets healthy. 
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Just because Gordon runs fly patterns as good or better than anyone and granted Brady is not designed to chuck it down the field a lot, that wobbly duck from his own end zone vs Pittsburgh was something to really behold...but he did manage to hit Gordon. 

I think Gordon can take a short pass and turn it into big gains(he did Week 1) and I think sooner or later it will present itself. Nobody breaks tackles from DBs better than Gordon and the Patriots will want to use him. I believe Gordon and AB are different WRs, AB is going to start being bracketed and double covered by defenses, Gordon should be one on one and Brady can still throw it 20-25 yds up the sideline, Gordon doesn't need 50 yards to gain separation vs all DBs he faces, sometimes he just needs a step and a broken tackle and he is gone. 

The 3 of us can have slightly different POV or maybe there's a bigger gap here than I think but I'm not ready to say Gordon won't be effective going forward. He could just as easily go for 100/TD this week as any other WR in his range on the rankings this week. 

 
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Ministry of Pain said:
The 3 of us can have slightly different POV or maybe there's a bigger gap here than I think but I'm not ready to say Gordon won't be effective going forward. He could just as easily go for 100/TD this week as any other WR in his range on the rankings this week. 
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Sure, Gordon could have 100/1 in a game . . . But he’s now the least likely to have that than two receivers on his own team. It’s very unlikely he will see a consistent enough workload or targets to make him a WR3. I felt that BEFORE Brown showed up. He’s seen about half the targets per game compared to his monster season in CLE. The 2019 Patriots are not the 2013 Browns. NE has a great defense, plenty of other receiving options, and a running game. The Browns has none of those. Even Dorsett had a big first week. So sure, there may be a week or two where Gordon has decent totals, but he is much more likely to string together some bland numbers for several games to get to that 100/1 game. His chances of success will go up when NE is challenged. Which probably won’t even happen until November. 

 
rockaction said:
Josh Gordon has seven targets through two games. 

That's pathetic. 

He's a WR5, really. 
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Yeah, I've mentioned previously in this thread, Gordon is dog meat as long as AB is active. Just not enough balls getting thrown around in New England to produce three fantasy WR's.

Also a difficult situation to read as the Pat's have faced zero resistance so far in PIT and MIA and the road won't be any tougher this coming week either.

 
Dizzy said:
Yeah, I've mentioned previously in this thread, Gordon is dog meat as long as AB is active. Just not enough balls getting thrown around in New England to produce three fantasy WR's.

Also a difficult situation to read as the Pat's have faced zero resistance so far in PIT and MIA and the road won't be any tougher this coming week either.
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Yeah, it's frustrating as a fan and from a fantasy perspective to see it, but there it is. His aDOT is below average, his catch rate around seventy percent with no drops, and he averages about seven after the catch, which is more than respectable. He's not blowing his opportunities, he's not getting many, and they're not deep save that one deep ball in the first game. 

 
rockaction said:
Yeah, it's frustrating as a fan and from a fantasy perspective to see it, but there it is. His aDOT is below average, his catch rate around seventy percent with no drops, and he averages about seven after the catch, which is more than respectable. He's not blowing his opportunities, he's not getting many, and they're not deep save that one deep ball in the first game. 
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I love's me some Josh Gordon, but his fantasy value (IMO) hinges entirely on AB's legal issues. If AB suddenly gets suspended, Gordon is back in business. otherwise it feels like he's the odd man out be the $15 million man and TB's "little brother".

 
rockaction said:
Josh Gordon has seven targets through two games. 

That's pathetic. 

He's a WR5, really. 
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He's had 9 targets so far . . . not that is anything more than a consolation prize. He's probably going to see limited targets and will need to survive on big plays and TD's to have real fantasy value.

 
I am benching JG this week in favor or Mark Andrews in my WR/TE PPR spot. I need to see more before he goes back in. I foresee about 3 for 60 yards this week, but I would love for him to prove me wrong and go 7 for 125 and a TD. 

 
As a JG owner not really happy with the AB signing.  I thought Gordon was primed for a solid year, that being said with AB's diva problems and Edelman's injury history I think theres still a good chance Gordon gets his. 

Then again Gordon could go out and buy and oz and say screw the NFL and NE

 
BB changes his game plan and targets different players every week. Gordon is my WR3 but I will seriously consider selling him high after "his" week and his value temporarily goes up.

 
IMO, Josh Gordon has gone from a guy that when started was considered "low risk, low reward" by Pro Football Focus to variance out the ying and earned a "high risk, low reward" moniker.

I personally think that he is now vastly overvalued and is straight up candidate for the chopping block if one can't work a doable trade.

Talk me down.

 
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rockaction said:
IMO, Josh Gordon has gone from a guy that when started is considered "low risk, low reward" by Pro Football Focus to variance out the ying.

I personally think that he is now vastly overvalued and is straight up candidate for the chopping block if one can't work a doable trade.

Talk me down.
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The counter argument will be that his stock will go up once AB is watching from home (for people that subscribe to that narrative). Or Edelman could get hurt. But league mates should be aware that his upside is limited, so not sure if he carries any trade value. He's probably a fantasy JAG as long as he is the WR3 for NE (maybe even WR4 on NE). There may be better options on the waiver wire depending on the league. As others have mentioned, maybe wait for him to have a week where his number is called a lot and puts up big totals and then move him.

 
rockaction said:
IMO, Josh Gordon has gone from a guy that when started was considered "low risk, low reward" by Pro Football Focus to variance out the ying and earned a "high risk, low reward" moniker.

I personally think that he is now vastly overvalued and is straight up candidate for the chopping block if one can't work a doable trade.

Talk me down.
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Talk you down?

Look at the AB fiasco.......He very well could get suspended.

Look at Julian Edelman and his injury history.....guy gets beaten up across the middle on his short routes.

 
Thanks for the feedback, guys. I'm sort of surprised that the predictions (other than FBG) about his performance are as high as they are. That's causing a bit of dissonance, too. Like, am I wrong here? Do not reason and past performance and some obvious tea leaves tell me all I need to know?

They do.

 
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