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WR Josh Gordon, KC (13 Viewers)
- Thread starter Matt Waldman
- Start date
The Man With No Name
Footballguy
Where's Soulfly?
Hairy Snowman
Footballguy
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
He is a primary thought once again! 
JoeSteeler
Footballguy
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
So how bad, how decrepit, how run of the mill is Josh Gordon now?
Thats right Gordon Nation
Lock n Load vs the Jets!!!
A gadget you say? An afterthought? The leftovers at the bottom of a milkshake blender?
Thats right Gordon Nation
Lock n Load vs the Jets!!!
A gadget you say? An afterthought? The leftovers at the bottom of a milkshake blender?
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Let’s talk about how DBs bounce off this guy like he’s made of marble or stone. Let’s go back and look at that short reception in the red zone he plowed into the end zone during Week 1...yeah let’s talk about how limited the Pats are now.
He is clearly with the right organization to utilize his special skills and provide a safe working environment for him to thrive
I expect a career day on Sunday...CAREER!!!
He is clearly with the right organization to utilize his special skills and provide a safe working environment for him to thrive
I expect a career day on Sunday...CAREER!!!
SeniorVBDStudent
Footballguy
Well said. 6'4" 240 lbs. He's WR GRONK. Time to start throwin fools out the club.
SeniorVBDStudent
Footballguy
Mr. Know-It-All
Footballguy
Gordon stock up, Phillip Dorsett stock up....I think Rex Burkhead stock might even take an upswing.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
I expect you may be wrong. Brady's OL is currently a mess. If nothing else, the Jets can bring pressure. I project some offensive struggles for NE and a lot of short underneath passes so Tom can get the ball out quickly. I am not sure that plays to the strength of Gordon. Maybe a couple of shots over the top . . . but those may go to Dorsett. The Pats don't need to be risking much on offense to beat the Jets. Like Miami, ball control, run the clock, let the defense do their thing, maybe dial up the offense if they have to, but otherwise I don't see NE going full throttle in this one.
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Anarchy99
Footballguy
If by short crossing routes you mean pick plays, then sure, I agree with you. But Dorsett and Edelman are good at those too.
Hairy Snowman
Footballguy
I expect a bigger day out of Gordon this week now. Probably 100+ yards and 1 TD.
I expect Gordon to become more integrated with the offense later in the season. The Pats are still in preseason mode.
I expect Gordon to become more integrated with the offense later in the season. The Pats are still in preseason mode.
LawFitz
Footballguy
This right here.
Gordon may be nothing more than a PPG WR3 for the first half of the season. But come fantasy stretch and playoff time, I'm expecting him to be unleashed into the fantasy PPG WR1 that we all know he his.
rockaction
Footballguy
I'm still thinking about dumping Gordon and picking up Dorsett, who is 7-7 or 7-8, has an aDOT of over twenty and a catch rate of about 87%.
He's also faster than Gordon.
What say the thread?
He's also faster than Gordon.
What say the thread?
Soulfly3
Footballguy
TwinTurbo
Footballguy
I agree with you here. Half throttle probably wins this game by 14. This is a smash spot for Edelman, not Gordon.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
I just posted in the Dorsett thread. Dorsett when Edelman around has been limited to 4 or 5 targets a game. He maxed those out Week 1 (almost 100 yards and 2 TD). He also has been known to have to settle for 3 catches and 25 or 30 yards. NE usually has two reliable receiving threats and a 3rd guy that is active. In recent season, those were Edelman and Gronk with White as another option. One year Edelman was out but Cooks slid in instead. IMO, without Gronk, Edelman has been the chess piece to own. Best guess in PPR leagues, Edelman is on the fantasy WR 1/2 bubble, Gordon a WR 3, and Dorsett a WR 4. Given that NE has a cupcake schedule for another month and a half, I doubt we see all three guys having big weeks the same week.
Football Jones
Footballguy
Fire up Flash.
rockaction
Footballguy
Yeah, I should state that it's partly in schtick that I mention Dorsett -- your exact reasoning, actually. He's quite good, though, at the game of football.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Which is it?
He's either really talented in your opinion or he isn't. Some of this is starting to feel like a moral compass about his off field issues in Cleveland.
So he won't do anything until the schedule gets tougher and then when the Pats really really really need him, he might produce?
AB is gone and you don't seem to want to move the needle a little bit here, that's a mistake IMO.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Gordon will easily surpass 1,000 yds and 10 TDs, in his sleep if he can stay off the peace pipe and especially with AB out of the picture.
I'm signing it with my lightsaber
James White owners have to be breathing a sigh of relief with AB gone.
I'm signing it with my lightsaber
James White owners have to be breathing a sigh of relief with AB gone.
Meh - I say this as someone who just dropped him, so some bitterness - but the RB situation is tough to figure out with NE. Its not worth the headache trying to figure out what the game plan might be in any given week. Patriots will be playing with a lead much more often than not this year - so I think Michel and Burkhead have more value even in PPR.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
The way Brady was willing it to White in the middle of a 36-0 blowout at the time late 4th...I'm not so sure I agree with you Sinn and I would like to but I think White owners have a much better chance to see stats with AB gone. Edelman benefits a lot too but they have always had these roles...Gordon allows for the Gronk retirement to not sting as much IMO.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
Let's start over. JG is talented. I just don't think the 2019 version is the 2013 version. Certainly I don't think the 2019 Patriots are the 2013 Browns. I've posted all this already but let's try it again. The Browns had no running game, no other reliable receiving targets, a terrible defense, and fed Gordon the ball as he averaged almost 12 targets a game. He got a lot of production in garbage time when the Browns had to pass, pass, pass to try to stay competitive.
The 2019 Patriots have plenty of receiving options, will have a good running game (provided they don't lose an OL man every game), they have a phenomenal defense, and they won't be losing much and forced to pass the entire game. Edelman goes back to the head of the class. White goes back to being a key cog in the offense.
Even in their 2007 season, NE got great numbers from Moss and Welker. But they didn't use their RBs much at all.The 2007 and 2019 teams both mostly ignore(d) the TE position. And that was Brady in his prime. The current version is still a top QB, but TB at 30 likely had more to offer.
I don't see Gordon getting the target rate he had in Cleveland, Edelman will see a boatload of targets, White will go back to 70 or 80 receptions, Burkhead gets some looks, Dorsett gets 80-90 targets, and Gordon will be inconsistently good for NE. I still think NE becomes more of a running team than a passing team, they take their time and sit on leads, they let their defense do the heavy lifting, and then are happy to leave the stadium with a W. Especially with an easy schedule and a banged up OL at the moment.
Unless you don't think Edelman plays 16 games (which is a reasonable thought) or that he won't reach 1,000 yards if he does (which seems less reasonable), NE has had 2 players go over 1,000 receiving yards in the same season in 2017, 2011, 2009, and 2007. That's about 20-25% of the time with Brady playing QB.
That's me just reading the tea leaves. Other people drink coffee, so what do I know?
Dizzy
Footballguy
Not so sure that's the case anymore. Michel has been pretty steady - when healthy... steadily in that 15-20 carry bracket (maybe a tick under).
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
My crystal ball is Edelman and White become go to underneath lots of targets however after those two guys Gordon becomes a super threat to break a takle and take one to the house on almost any reception and you can't say that about very many WRs. I haven't seen anything to make me believe the 2019 version cannot do what the 2013 version can do physically but I understand Cleveland was a different situation. New England would not have gone to the lengths they have gone to if this kid didn't have a lot of talent, and he's no kid now.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
All that is likely true. As for the last part, remember that NE got him last year on his rookie deal and has him this year for only $2 million. His allure certainly was at least partly motivated by his bargain basement salary cost.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
Just curious. How many seconds does it take for those plays to develop? NE plays the Jets and Bills the next two weeks. Both have solid defenses. I am guessing if they take more then two seconds, Brady may not have time to get the ball out without being hit. The Pats are only short two starting tackles and their starting center.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Soulfly3
Footballguy
JetMaxx
Footballguy
It’s clear a few pics down he has Brady’s full support. It’s go time boys. I’ll gladly take prime Gronk-like #s at WR2.
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Dead on. You disappear and Gordon gets the best news of the year. I was the only one in here predicting a good week. Once again I was right. Now the only question is how much you pollute this thread and cause bad thing to happen to Gordon.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Anarchy99 makes sound arguments. He's just very wedded to his stances, sometimes (often?) too rigidly.
I see it mainly because I can be the same way. Struggled with this mindset my entire life, when the consequences were much greater!
That said, I appreciate his thoughtful, insightful and thorough explanations of his reasoning. Helps me to decide what I should buy and what I should leave.
Not buying Pats will be a running team with an OL that can't block for more than two seconds all season. That may be (somewhat) true now, but Scarneccia is the the OL coach and Bellychick the big dog.
And they have 8 weeks to figure it out before their stretch run when they'll be playing for home field and we will be playing for fantasy gold...
10 BYE
11 Phi
12 Dal
13 @Hou
14 KC
15 @Cin
16 Buf
See ya on the other side, gents.
I see it mainly because I can be the same way. Struggled with this mindset my entire life, when the consequences were much greater!
That said, I appreciate his thoughtful, insightful and thorough explanations of his reasoning. Helps me to decide what I should buy and what I should leave.
Not buying Pats will be a running team with an OL that can't block for more than two seconds all season. That may be (somewhat) true now, but Scarneccia is the the OL coach and Bellychick the big dog.
And they have 8 weeks to figure it out before their stretch run when they'll be playing for home field and we will be playing for fantasy gold...
10 BYE
11 Phi
12 Dal
13 @Hou
14 KC
15 @Cin
16 Buf
See ya on the other side, gents.
