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I remember people being upset about all the murdering of Robert's bastards, although admittedly not to this level. The Red Wedding events took place in an enormous scene that was key to the plot, and everyone could see that. Having to listen to a girl being mock raped is viewed differently...I'm not sure what is so hard to understand about that. Especially when people can see how unnecessary it was in the context of the story. If we never saw Ramsey before, but he was portrayed as some sort of hero or noble man who would lead his people to great things, and then he turned and raped his wife on their wedding night, so the scene actually had a purpose, I think the reaction would be much different.
I guess I read different articles and listen to different podcasts. The Red Wedding was upsetting to a lot of people, especially the choice they made to have Rob's wife there and get stabbed in the stomach. The scene last year with Jamie/Cersei upset a lot of people. The Kingsguard killing babies too. This is another one.
Would Reek not being forced to watch or knowing Ramsey's history and what he's capable of change your opinion at all?
I understand this. I really do. I just still don't agree.
I guess that is also one of my problems - how do we know it isn't furthering a storyline or plot yet? It was the final scene of the 6th episode in a 10 episode arc. For all we know she kills him the next episode. For all we know Sansa and Theon join up and torture him the way he did to Theon and everyone will cheer (I will too because that would be pretty damn satisfying.)
Not to this level. The red wedding stuff was also fully expected because of the books. I'm not saying that people don't complain after every episode. But this one has politicians and media people in an uproar like something in real life happened.
Small point of order - really really small. Did he forcibly bend her over? I didn't get that sense. He definately ripped her dress and made it clear what he was going to do, but I thought she kinda laid down on her own? Again, small thing.
The irony here is overwhelming. You are far more outraged at the "outrage" than anyone is at the show. Every article or review I've seen that takes issue with the incident is more criticism than outrage. You want to talk about people loving outrage because it gives them a sense of purpose? Read the last couple pages of this thread. Who seems more outraged- the people who didn't like the scene or the people pushing back against that sentiment?
I"m just waiting for my coffee to kick in before I get to work today and doing mindless TV talk. I think your attempt to be hollier than thou is truly wasted on someone like me.
Nah. People are people. The fact that this shows creates so much passion is a testament to the show and the writers and the world they've created. And the horror that Sansa is suffering is a testament to her story arc and the fact that people love her character and actually are feeling her pain now - or in the alternative are feeling pain for her and getting worked up in real life. That is usually one of the better ways to measure the success of television drama.
You make good points, and I know I am coming off as being so upset about this that I am not going to watch anymore, but that is not the case. I am just saying that I get why people are upset and I thing they good reason to be.
It's not an attempt to be holier than thou, and it's not just you. The irony is everywhere. 95% of the outrage on this subject is coming from people who are outraged about people criticizing a TV show and are making silly straw man arguments in response to that criticism. One guy even said "you can't show rape on TV or movies now?" even though nobody has ever said anything even close to that. Honestly it's pretty hilarious.
Is there anyone in here that said they can't show it or believe that the actress actually got raped?
Very true. And again - I have no real life lesson or care for this show. It's entertainment. True, what we call entertainment these days is pretty sick sometimes, but alas... I would have preferred she killed him or Theon killed him. Would have been much more pleasing. There better be a pretty solid 10 minute torture and kill scene for that guy at least this season.
I just read a blog that laid out why they weren't going to cover the show anymore because of this scene that is pretty much a direct refutation of your opinion. But I get it. Outrage breeds reciprocal outrage and the argument takes off. I really have no skin in this game at all. I enjoy the argument more than the substance.
Here, no. But that is an argument making the rounds. I may have said it in here at some point, but the gratuitous sex just for the sake of it is pretty useless to me at this point. I get it. I don't need the brothel scenes anymore really. I know I have to suspend my man card for 30 days with this at this point, but if show cut back on all the sex scenes a great deal and only used them sparringly when absolutely necessary to the scene itself (like Greyworm seeing that hot chick in the river) then I'd be fine. They set the background. I got it.
My wife watched the first episode with me when I binged the first 4 seasons and kicked me out of the bedroom. She refuses to even allow it on the TV when she is in the same room. She is very much a person who requires her book tv and movie entertainment to have a clear and obvious happy ending to the story or she hates it, so this show is pretty much the connection of everything she hates in entertainment.
Something like The Mary Sue tv blog? It was the top thing in google when I typed in game of thrones thinking I was on this site already.
Sure, but I think after 5 seasons a lot of people are tiring of it if it doesn't have a purpose other than they can show it because they are HBO and that is what they do.
last week's endless "discussion" of... thank god I've forgotten what it was... was much worse.
Now that is ridiculous.
it doesn't have to happen next week- is the timing important to you?- but I still believe that the scene will lead to further developments before the end of the season.
I think it did have a purpose in a couple of regards. 1) it reinforced what Ramsey is (I can agree that people could see that as redundant as we all know what he is) and 2) I imagine it serves, if not as the final straw on the back of the camel, at least a wake up call to Theon/Sansa that things aren't going to get any better and they should take things into their own hands....A cynic might even think that Sansa's a willing participant and she's playing a long con (in itself a bit weird as I'd assume that people would see her allowing herself to be raped to further herself in the game(if one can do that?) as the ultimate female empowerment moment)
The timing is important for me because I don't think it changed the way the audience sees the characters or their relationships to one another at all. If Sansa and/or Theon plotted to murder Ramsay 2-3 episodes down the road it's not like we'd be confused about their motivation or conflicted as to how we feel about it. The other thing I thought about was maybe she gets pregnant, but everyone assumes a married couple would screw on their wedding night anyway- remember how they had to go out of their way to explain to us why Tyrion wasn't gonna consummate the marriage to Sansa.
at this Sansa/Ramsey thing being a thing.
I am arguing, as are others that: 1. We know what Ramsey is, so we didn't need that. 2. they didn't need to use that specifically as a plot device yet again to achieve that end result.
