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Game of Thrones, tv only, books don't exist, no backstory...NERDS already ruining a series that hasn't started (5 Viewers)

Ilov80s said:
Her entire arc and life was devoted to not being terrible and being the savior for the poor, powerless, etc. Her then burning thousands of women and children alive seemed like a stretch to me. 
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I would say you're describing some of the meaning she found along the way when she was floundering in achieving her main goal...but it could be argued her main goal/destiny was to take revenge on the usurpers and those who supported them by taking back the throne of her birthright regardless of the bloodshed. That's what she originally wanted. 

 
Amazing episode ...

Jon Vs Dany for the throne. Perfect. 

I still think the “king of the north” will be just that.

Sansa sits on the iron throne.

 
Ghost Rider said:
How was it out of character? 

She burned that witch alive in Season 1. 

She put Xaro in a sealed vault to slowly suffocate to death in Season 2.

She burned Kraznys alive in Season 3. 

etc. 

This side of her personality has always been on full display.  This is not new. 
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So go right for the red keep after the surrender and burn cersei and all her people in there with her. What was the point of intentional strafing of peasants?

 
El Floppo said:
@chet the explosions/percussion was the wildfire green stuff, if that's what you were asking earlier.

Loved the mad queen. Sure she could've just flown to the red keep and ended it, but she crazy.

Didn't like the cersei/Jamie end, just from revenge standpoint for the shows biggast villain.

Sorry...found the scorpions flailing this week ridiculous. Ok...yeah- she used the sun to her advantage...once...when everybodywas waiting for her.

I like the direction this went more than what I was imagining. And now I'm kinda hoping Danny gets to he queen of the ashes, with the wheel firmly in place under yet another tyrant.
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The green wildfire came on toward the end. When Drogon started his rampage, his fire breath was setting things on fire and destroying them.  That's what I found strange.  Admittedly, I don't often watch/read media that features dragons so I don't know if their fire breath normally has the ability to knock down walls as well as light things on fire.  

You and I are on the same page on many other issues with this episode though.

 
chet said:
The green wildfire came on toward the end. When Drogon started his rampage, his fire breath was setting things on fire and destroying them.  That's what I found strange.  Admittedly, I don't often watch/read media that features dragons so I don't know if their fire breath normally has the ability to knock down walls as well as light things on fire.  

You and I are on the same page on many other issues with this episode though.
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They melted the walls at harrenhall but they were like 15 feet thick.

The barrels of wildfire blew up the balon building. 

I think drogon being the biggest dragon could probably blow things up without us getting into a debate about dragon chemistry and structural engineering in Westeros 

 
Capella said:
Would think the Dany heel turn was 100% outlined by him. 
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Agreed.  But recall reading somewhere recently that GRRM was disappointed that the show wasn't going to run more seasons.  I took that to mean that he thought they were speeding to the finish line and if so I think that's what others are feeling when they say the heel turn was too sudden.  FWIW, I think that is a valid criticism as are Jamie's arc and the whimper with which Cersei went out.  Seems like D&D were trying too hard to please too many different people:

Give Jamie and Brienne their moment, but then have Jamie turn back to Cersei immediately

Give the prophecy folks a 'lil sumptin with Jamie's hands on Cersei's neck but don't really make the prophecy come true - but hope those book nerds can read enough into it

Choose spectacle over consistency time and time again...'cuz it's the most popular TV show and #areyounotentetained 

As always, just my 2 cents

 
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Ilov80s said:
Her entire arc and life was devoted to not being terrible and being the savior for the poor, powerless, etc. Her then burning thousands of women and children alive seemed like a stretch to me. 
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It’s ridiculous.  And, more than anything, took a big dump on the character.  

Burn the red keep?  Sure. 

Burn innocent citizens for no reason after they surrendered?  Character assassination.  

 
I hate all the internet attacks since " we left the books." Having said that, I would have loved 4 or 5 episodes specifically showing Dany losing it. 

But that's really just because I love the characters.  And yes, this does put her whole arc in a different light for me. The burning of the masters has been my favorite scene in this show since it happened. Now...I'm not so sure. Still sexy as hell, but foundation wise....

I was hoping she would pull back at some point, but this was an all in moment. 

Next week is going to suck. 

 
chet said:
The green wildfire came on toward the end. When Drogon started his rampage, his fire breath was setting things on fire and destroying them.  That's what I found strange.  Admittedly, I don't often watch/read media that features dragons so I don't know if their fire breath normally has the ability to knock down walls as well as light things on fire.  

You and I are on the same page on many other issues with this episode though.
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I had subtitles on...."explosions" we're noted iapproaching the gate..while golden co leader was standing there. wife and I were wondering what could be explodimg- as soon as we saw the green later, it made sense.

Btw... The yuron/Jamie fight was silly to me...as was Jamie getting stabbed twice almsot dying...and then climbing all the way up to upper bits of the red keep and back down (it's just a fleshwound). Some of that stuff genuinely cheapened a solid episode for me.

 
zoonation said:
It’s ridiculous.  And, more than anything, took a big dump on the character.  

Burn the red keep?  Sure. 

Burn innocent citizens for no reason after they surrendered?  Character assassination.  
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It's frustrating ..and it bugged me while watching...but I like the direction for the show, and I'm does fit with some of the extreme things she's done when left to her own devices 

 
Yankee23Fan said:
I hate all the internet attacks since " we left the books." Having said that, I would have loved 4 or 5 episodes specifically showing Dany losing it. 

But that's really just because I love the characters.  And yes, this does put her whole arc in a different light for me. The burning of the masters has been my favorite scene in this show since it happened. Now...I'm not so sure. Still sexy as hell, but foundation wise....

I was hoping she would pull back at some point, but this was an all in moment. 

Next week is going to suck. 
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There would need to be seasons of development for me to believe she would have killed innocents after they surrendered.  

Terrible.  

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
Dany only ever solves problems by killing whoever is in her way. Seriously, think about it. She can't do that to Sansa or the North now so she's struggling. There is no one else being oppressed to free here either, which is her other move. Now she's in the position of being the potential oppressor of free people who chose their own leaders. She's been put in a situation where she has to negotiate on even footing with someone like Sansa and she's way out of her depth. 
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Welp...this point is a bit more salient now. 

 
El Floppo said:
It's frustrating ..and it bugged me while watching...but I like the direction for the show, and I'm does fit with some of the extreme things she's done when left to her own devices 
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That’s just it though.  It really doesn’t fit.  She was tough and even ruthless when she needed/wanted to be.  

Varys?  Get it.  

Dickon and pops?  Harsh but understandable.  

Genocide?  Not the character we knew.  

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Dany only ever solves problems by killing whoever is in her way. Seriously, think about it. She can't do that to Sansa or the North now so she's struggling. There is no one else being oppressed to free here either, which is her other move. Now she's in the position of being the potential oppressor of free people who chose their own leaders. She's been put in a situation where she has to negotiate on even footing with someone like Sansa and she's way out of her depth. 
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Welp...this point is a bit more salient now. 
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Yeah - I remember that. 

You see a lot of things similar to me. 

Please - don't take offense.. 

😁

 
El Floppo said:
I had subtitles on...."explosions" we're noted iapproaching the gate..while golden co leader was standing there. wife and I were wondering what could be explodimg- as soon as we saw the green later, it made sense.

Btw... The yuron/Jamie fight was silly to me...as was Jamie getting stabbed twice almsot dying...and then climbing all the way up to upper bits of the red keep and back down (it's just a fleshwound). Some of that stuff genuinely cheapened a solid episode for me.
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Drogon's first attack was against Euron's ships.  Dany dodged the scorpion's spear and then closed in on the fleet.  Drogon's fire breath completely destroyed the first few ships it touched.  To me, that was silly--fire breath will set a wooden ship on fire but it won't cause it to explode.  IMO, Drogon was completely overpowered this episode after being neutered last episode--the writers can't flip flop from episode to episode.

 
zoonation said:
There would need to be seasons of development for me to believe she would have killed innocents after they surrendered.  

Terrible.  
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She went mad like her father. It's not supposed to be rational. The question shouldn't be "have they built up enough to Dany dispassionately making this choice for it to work?" The question is "have we seen enough of her madness leaking out over the years to see how all the #### recently made her finally lose it?" 

For me...I'm still deciding. But she had no more advisors she trusted, who in the past had held back some of her worst instincts. You think she does this if Jorah is alive? Missande? Hwr other dragons? Without Jon's parentage making her question the destiny she's never wavered from? Nah. And lots more on top of that.

She ####### cracked man. It's not supposed to be rational or reasonable. As long as we saw her cracking. I'd argue they could have spent more time on that.

 
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culdeus said:
Ehhhh.  This has been foreshadowed quite a bit.  

I don't think she would have had the manpower or charisma to hold KL.  Even in winterfell she saves their ### and nobody cared for her.  
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Who was left to challenge the Throne? Burning the keep and sparing the civilians may have been well received.  

Have a couple Betoesque rallies on top of wagons around the city to drum up support. It’s not like they had any love for Cercei.  

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
She went mad. It's not supposed to be rational. The question shouldn't be "have they built up enough to Dany dispassionately making this choice for it to work?" The question is "have we seen enough of hwr madness leaking out over the years to see how all the #### recently made her finally lose it?" 

For me...I'm still deciding. But she had no more advisors she trusted, who in the past had held back some of her worst instincts. You think she does this if Jorah is alive? Missande? Hwr other dragons? Without Jon's parentage making her question the destiny she's never wavered from? Nah. And lots more on top of that.

She ####### cracked man. It's not supposed to be rational or reasonable. As long as we saw her cracking. I'd argue they could have spent more time on that.
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Agree that we have to accept she went mad.  I just feel the extent to which she took the madness wasn’t earned.  

 
chet said:
Drogon's first attack was against Euron's ships.  Dany dodged the scorpion's spear and then closed in on the fleet.  Drogon's fire breath completely destroyed the first few ships it touched.  To me, that was silly--fire breath will set a wooden ship on fire but it won't cause it to explode.  IMO, Drogon was completely overpowered this episode after being neutered last episode--the writers can't flip flop from episode to episode.
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So youre saying the fire breathing dragon needed to be more realistic? 

 
I know they started showing the street view and stopped showing closeups of the dragon later on, probably for budget reasons...but we could have used a couple more closeups of Emilia Clarke wide and wild-eyed, maybe tears streaming down an otherwise crazy and furious face, to really sell it. This was her character's ultimate destiny being played out on the streets below and we never saw her face again after the bell tower sequence. 

Maybe this comes next week and this week was all about being immersed in the helplessness of the bystanders and the utter destruction she was raining down. Kind of a Saving Private Ryan storming the beaches of Normandy POV. 

 
So Dany is obviously dying next episode. And it seems as though the only one left to do it is John.  Arya ####ed off, everyone else is dead and she clearly can’t rule now.  

She broke the wheel alright.  

 
zoonation said:
Agree that we have to accept she went mad.  I just feel the extent to which she took the madness wasn’t earned.  
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No madness is ever earned, nor is it predictable - or even controlled. 

Targaryens are a messy lot. Things lurk deep & shallow. Always have. 

Again - as bookie, I understand the tv criticism - I won't argue that. 

However, my itch is scratched & satisfied with the portrayal. 

 
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