***Detroit Tigers thread: 1st pick yet again, this is not fun***

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

Tigers not bringing Hunter back. They might have brought him back on a one year deal but Hunters agent says that Hunter thinks he can play 3-4 more years and wants to play full time. Good-Bye....

Heard DD talking after the Hanrahan singing and he says they will be looking at Rondon and Hanrahan as closers. Makes me think they might be cutting bait on Nathan.

You sure he said that?

Dombrowski said Hanrahan had interest from other clubs, but only negotiated with the Tigers, because he felt loyal to them for taking a chance this past season.

Still, Dombrowski acknowledged the signing is a risk. He's been cleared medically, but with such a long layoff, plus the complications over the summer, there's no telling what kind of impact Hanrahan will have. In fact, when asked if Dombrowski was more confident in Bruce Rondon, who had Tommy John surgery in March, or Hanrahan making an impact, Dombrowski didn't hesitate. He said Rondon.

I was reading some other quotes on twitter where he said with Rondon and Hanrahan hew was confident the "back-end" would be in order. I'm not sure they are sure Hanrahan will be effective at all but it was worth a shot.

Obviously I am sweet on Rondon who I still think would have been the difference in getting to the World Series in 2013.

Theoretically if everyone is healthy a back-end of Rondon, Hanrahan, Soria and Nathan would be pretty damn good. I think Nathan will bounce back some, although probably not back to his elite status. I also think Krol will be pretty good if he's used properly. He was allowed to pitch to too many right-handers in a row, where he should be used as a LOOGY or as a three out guy if there are two left-handers in the mix.

[Da Guru 6,293]

Tigers not bringing Hunter back. They might have brought him back on a one year deal but Hunters agent says that Hunter thinks he can play 3-4 more years and wants to play full time. Good-Bye....

Heard DD talking after the Hanrahan singing and he says they will be looking at Rondon and Hanrahan as closers. Makes me think they might be cutting bait on Nathan.

You sure he said that?

Dombrowski said Hanrahan had interest from other clubs, but only negotiated with the Tigers, because he felt loyal to them for taking a chance this past season.

Still, Dombrowski acknowledged the signing is a risk. He's been cleared medically, but with such a long layoff, plus the complications over the summer, there's no telling what kind of impact Hanrahan will have. In fact, when asked if Dombrowski was more confident in Bruce Rondon, who had Tommy John surgery in March, or Hanrahan making an impact, Dombrowski didn't hesitate. He said Rondon.

I was reading some other quotes on twitter where he said with Rondon and Hanrahan hew was confident the "back-end" would be in order. I'm not sure they are sure Hanrahan will be effective at all but it was worth a shot.

Obviously I am sweet on Rondon who I still think would have been the difference in getting to the World Series in 2013.

Theoretically if everyone is healthy a back-end of Rondon, Hanrahan, Soria and Nathan would be pretty damn good. I think Nathan will bounce back some, although probably not back to his elite status. I also think Krol will be pretty good if he's used properly. He was allowed to pitch to too many right-handers in a row, where he should be used as a LOOGY or as a three out guy if there are two left-handers in the mix.

Reread the article and DD said Rondon "could" not would close.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

Still think they need to bring in another lefty just so we can close the books on Coke.

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/detroit-tigers/

Edited November 17, 2014 by Leroy Hoard

[whoknew 8,756]

Tigers picked up Avila's option.

[Da Guru 6,293]

Still think they need to bring in another lefty just so we can close the books on Coke.

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/detroit-tigers/

Did not know the MLB minimum salary was 500K. Not a bad gig to hang around for 4-5 years.

[skillz 252]

Picking up Avila's $5 million option >>>>>>> signing Russell Martin for 5 years/$82 million

[Bojang0301 2,246]

Still think they need to bring in another lefty just so we can close the books on Coke.

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/detroit-tigers/

Did not know the MLB minimum salary was 500K. Not a bad gig to hang around for 4-5 years.

Most shoot for the retirement minimum (I think 8 or 9 years), then I think you get like 50K/year for life.

Edit:

Major League Baseball has the best pension program in all of sports. A big league player needs just 43 days of service to qualify for a pension benefit. Forty-three days of service can guarantee an MLB player a $34,000 per year pension benefit. One day on an active roster qualifies a player for full comprehensive medical benefits.

Major league baseball players become fully vested in their pensions after 10 years of service. It is not uncommon for retired baseball players with over 10 years of service to receive over $100,000 annually upon reaching the age of 62. Baseball has the most well-funded pension program with estimates valuing the plan at over half a billion dollars.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Bojang0301

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

Well that explains why we can't get rid of some of these guys.

[Bojang0301 2,246]

Is the market really this cold on Max? Maybe we can get him on a shorter deal with higher up front money.

[Bojang0301 2,246]

Well that explains why we can't get rid of some of these guys.

Matt Stairs and Jason Giambi are going to have some nice golden years.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

You know how much I like my lefties, here is an interesting prospect:

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2014/11/19/overlooked-lefty-mantiply-might-reach-tigers/19301047/

[Da Guru 6,293]

You know how much I like my lefties, here is an interesting prospect:

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2014/11/19/overlooked-lefty-mantiply-might-reach-tigers/19301047/

Don`t count out Coke and Kelly on the opening day roster.

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

You know how much I like my lefties, here is an interesting prospect:

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2014/11/19/overlooked-lefty-mantiply-might-reach-tigers/19301047/

Don`t count out Coke and Kelly on the opening day roster.

#### Coke, but I love Dandy Don.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

I should have phrased it as "good lefties".

[skillz 252]

Is the market really this cold on Max? Maybe we can get him on a shorter deal with higher up front money.

Boras will wait until the GM meetings to really get the bidding going. That's his MO.

[Da Guru 6,293]

Is the market really this cold on Max? Maybe we can get him on a shorter deal with higher up front money.

Boras will wait until the GM meetings to really get the bidding going. That's his MO.

Max is going to get a good contract. If the Dodgers, Yankees and RedSox are not bidding the contract will not be what Boros projected. Boros was looking for 200 million area..think it will end up closer to what the Tigers offered.

Thinking about it now,,Max made 16 million last year and the Tigers offered 6 more at 144 before the season. That would have been a total of 7-161 million had he signed. Seems insane to turn that offer down.

[Bojang0301 2,246]

Ya I mean that's about as good as it gets. It really does look bad on Max's part. Maybe there was some catch in options or trade clause that wasn't known. I don't think he'll get Kershaw money and even if he gets to 180 seems sort of petty. Who am I to sneeze at $20 mil though, I'll never see that in my life.

[jon_mx 8,750]

Is the market really this cold on Max? Maybe we can get him on a shorter deal with higher up front money.

Boras will wait until the GM meetings to really get the bidding going. That's his MO.

Max is going to get a good contract. If the Dodgers, Yankees and RedSox are not bidding the contract will not be what Boros projected. Boros was looking for 200 million area..think it will end up closer to what the Tigers offered.

Thinking about it now,,Max made 16 million last year and the Tigers offered 6 more at 144 before the season. That would have been a total of 7-161 million had he signed. Seems insane to turn that offer down.

No doubt. 161 million in the bag is worth more than 200 million in the bush.

ETA: Depending on the bush, of course

Edited November 29, 2014 by jon_mx

[Bojang0301 2,246]

If the rumored deal with the Yankees is true Max deserves to be booed every time he steps in Comerica. 7/$185, $14 mil, barely a qualifying offer was worth a whole year of injury risk and alienating a fan base?

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

If the rumored deal with the Yankees is true Max deserves to be booed every time he steps in Comerica. 7/$185, $14 mil, barely a qualifying offer was worth a whole year of injury risk and alienating a fan base?

Can't get mad about stuff like that, it's a business. Tigers don't seem to be legitimately interested in bringing him back, he's gonna take the best offer out there. I'm not gonna root for him if he's in New York, but I won't hate him either. He deserves whatever he gets.

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

Would be a big fan of Masterson being the 5th starter.

[MAC_32 12,077]

Would be a big fan of Masterson being the 5th starter.

odd numbered year.

[Da Guru 6,293]

If the rumored deal with the Yankees is true Max deserves to be booed every time he steps in Comerica. 7/$185, $14 mil, barely a qualifying offer was worth a whole year of injury risk and alienating a fan base?

Can't get mad about stuff like that, it's a business. Tigers don't seem to be legitimately interested in bringing him back, he's gonna take the best offer out there. I'm not gonna root for him if he's in New York, but I won't hate him either. He deserves whatever he gets.

If the Yankees are going to give a 7 year deal for a 31 year old pitcher they can have him. Thought they learned their lesson with Sabathia.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

If the rumored deal with the Yankees is true Max deserves to be booed every time he steps in Comerica. 7/$185, $14 mil, barely a qualifying offer was worth a whole year of injury risk and alienating a fan base?

Can't get mad about stuff like that, it's a business. Tigers don't seem to be legitimately interested in bringing him back, he's gonna take the best offer out there. I'm not gonna root for him if he's in New York, but I won't hate him either. He deserves whatever he gets.

If the Yankees are going to give a 7 year deal for a 31 year old pitcher they can have him. Thought they learned their lesson with Sabathia.

Almost all of the long term starter contracts have ended up as a bad deal for the new team, of course that doesn't mean he won't make that team better in the now.

[Bojang0301 2,246]

Today's model mostly means you'll lose your homegrown talent. Even the Yankees themselves lost Cano last year.

[Da Guru 6,293]

Was hoping Markakis might slip through the cracks, doesn't seem like it.

He might be slipping..heard on the MLB Network that the Os do not want to do more than 3 years. 4-48 and he is a Tiger.

Edited December 1, 2014 by Da Guru

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

Was hoping Markakis might slip through the cracks, doesn't seem like it.

He might be slipping..heard on the MLB Network that the Os do not want to do more than 3 years. 4-48 and he is a Tiger.

He would be an upgrade in the outfield corner on defense & maybe his doubles would return in the bigger ballpark?

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

Is Dombrowski gonna deal Porcello for a hitter and then bring Max back?

[bicycle_seat_sniffer 5,109]

Is Dombrowski gonna deal Porcello for a hitter and then bring Max back?

i like that move

[Da Guru 6,293]

Was hoping Markakis might slip through the cracks, doesn't seem like it.

He might be slipping..heard on the MLB Network that the Os do not want to do more than 3 years. 4-48 and he is a Tiger.

He would be an upgrade in the outfield corner on defense & maybe his doubles would return in the bigger ballpark?

The Braves signed Markakis. 4-44 Andy Dirks was released by the Blue Jays so we can bring Dirksie back for pennies on the dollar.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Da Guru

[whoknew 8,756]

Is Dombrowski gonna deal Porcello for a hitter and then bring Max back?

i like that move

I read this morning that the rumor is Porcello for Cespedes.

Maybe I'm being a homer, but that seems like a terrible trade for the Tigers.

[MAC_32 12,077]

Is Dombrowski gonna deal Porcello for a hitter and then bring Max back?

i like that move

I read this morning that the rumor is Porcello for Cespedes.

Maybe I'm being a homer, but that seems like a terrible trade for the Tigers.

It is. Yeah, Cespedes can mash, and it's become a more and more raw skill, but that's all he can do. His obp is putrid, avg is not good, defense isn't anything special, he has issues staying on the field, given that this would be his third team in 6 months from the outside I'm questioning what he's like in the clubhouse, and he's a free agent after the season.

If Porcello is involved then we should be getting a prospect like Brian Johnson and a depth piece like Nava as well.

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

This team is win now and they need an outfielder badly.

Cespedes and Porcello are both in contract years so there is motivation for both. Cespedes is an above average fielder, has power, and would be a perfect #5 hitter. Porcello is a solid middle of the rotation pitcher who finally busted out last year. I don't see their value being a lot different, and neither is going to be easy to re-sign (Porcello and Boras and Cespedes thinking he's Bo Jackson).

If the Tigers had a plan with replacing Porcello, I'd be fine with this deal. However Dombrowski has always operated in the shadows and it seems like a deal that makes too much sense to actually happen.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

I would trade Porcello if Max was still here. Not sure about going into 2015 with just Price/JV/Sanchez as proven starters.

[MAC_32 12,077]

I would trade Porcello if Max was still here. Not sure about going into 2015 with just Price/JV/Sanchez as proven starters.

If Porcello goes then someone else is coming in.

[Da Guru 6,293]

This team is win now and they need an outfielder badly.

Cespedes and Porcello are both in contract years so there is motivation for both. Cespedes is an above average fielder, has power, and would be a perfect #5 hitter. Porcello is a solid middle of the rotation pitcher who finally busted out last year. I don't see their value being a lot different, and neither is going to be easy to re-sign (Porcello and Boras and Cespedes thinking he's Bo Jackson).

If the Tigers had a plan with replacing Porcello, I'd be fine with this deal. However Dombrowski has always operated in the shadows and it seems like a deal that makes too much sense to actually happen.

Don`t know why but Porcello has never excited me. I would get pumped if Max, JV even when he was struggling, Price and even Sanchez were starting. When Porcello starts it was just ho-hum. I don`t have the numbers but the last 6 weeks or so of last season it looked like Porcello was pitching BP. I see him as a 3 or 4 starter at best. Is he going to command top FA type of money? I guess it would be a Sanchez type of contract.

[whoknew 8,756]

Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal

Sources tell me and @jonmorosi that #Yankees, #Tigers and #DBacks are indeed in serious trade discussions, as @YankeesWFAN said.

[Payne 546]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

[MAC_32 12,077]

Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal

Sources tell me and @jonmorosi that #Yankees, #Tigers and #DBacks are indeed in serious trade discussions, as @YankeesWFAN said.

I like what happened the last time this threesome happened.

[whoknew 8,756]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

So the Fister trade really did suck.

[MAC_32 12,077]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

So the Fister trade really did suck.

Yes, but I don't think judging Greene/Ray + minor leaguer in the context of the Fister trade is right. Dom bombed the Fister trade and most of us thought as much at that time. He's getting out of a bad hand now and trying to make the most of his mistake.

I like this move. Ray has shown nothing to indicate he'll be any good in the majors whereas Greene has experienced some modest success and he is still a ways away from free agency. If we are successful trading Porcello then he fits the mold of a #4/#5 pretty well imho. I think we'll still add someone else and I'd rather have Greene as the #5, but he's displayed signs of being an effective #4. Lots of GB's and a good k rate/swgstrk rate/out pitch so it looks sustainable. If he develops a second pitch then the HR rate should come down and he could be a middle of the rotation option.

He may have an innings cap this year, but I don't think it'd be one he hits until September. This is also why I'd prefer him as the #5 though. If he proves himself then he can slide up in the rotation after Price walks after 2015 then we have more options about where to spend the $ allocated to price in the budget instead of likely needing to spend it on starting pitching.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

OPS over a hundred points lower on the road, going to a bigger park might help this guy.

Like Mac said, got out of a bad hand with Ray, not the worst move to make.

Edited December 5, 2014 by Leroy Hoard

[Bojang0301 2,246]

I've been pretty stubborn about the ramifications of the Fister trade. Hindsight is 20/20 but this is pretty much an admittance that it was a bad trade and now I don't like the outcome it lead to with Jackson and Smyly. If we get Price to sign long term or field a decent haul from him or Porcello I may change my mind. Still no address of the bullpen other than a poo throw with Hanrahan and a reup of Soria.

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

So the Fister trade really did suck.

Not sure how you got that out of this trade. We just got a #4 starter (what Fister is) who is controllable through 2018 for Ray and a mifer who was deep on the franchise depth chart.

So now the Tigers have Green and Krol for Fister and Lebya. The loss of Fister made no difference to the team last year (1.3 WAR), and he is a free agent after this season. So we now have 9 years of two controllable pitchers over one year if Fister. Plus Ray had value to the Diamondbacks.

As I said before, judging trades at the time they were made is fruitless because so many things can happen later. I thought we would have had to give up more to get Green than that.

[Leroy Hoard 13,423]

OPS over a hundred points lower on the road, going to a bigger park might help this guy.

Just to follow up, check out his splits:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.cgi?id=greensh02&year=&t=p

4-0 away from Yankee Bandbox with a 2.70 ERA & 10.8 strikeouts per 9 innings pitched. Small sample size (7 games) but still not bad.

[Bojang0301 2,246]

I really wish I knew more about him but like someone else said I like the outcome the last time these 3 teams got together.

[The Flying Elvis 24]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

So the Fister trade really did suck.

Not sure how you got that out of this trade. We just got a #4 starter (what Fister is) who is controllable through 2018 for Ray and a mifer who was deep on the franchise depth chart.

So now the Tigers have Green and Krol for Fister and Lebya. The loss of Fister made no difference to the team last year (1.3 WAR), and he is a free agent after this season. So we now have 9 years of two controllable pitchers over one year if Fister. Plus Ray had value to the Diamondbacks.

As I said before, judging trades at the time they were made is fruitless because so many things can happen later. I thought we would have had to give up more to get Green than that.

Doug Fister is not a #4 starter.

[Da Guru 6,293]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

So the Fister trade really did suck.

Not sure how you got that out of this trade. We just got a #4 starter (what Fister is) who is controllable through 2018 for Ray and a mifer who was deep on the franchise depth chart.

So now the Tigers have Green and Krol for Fister and Lebya. The loss of Fister made no difference to the team last year (1.3 WAR), and he is a free agent after this season. So we now have 9 years of two controllable pitchers over one year if Fister. Plus Ray had value to the Diamondbacks.

As I said before, judging trades at the time they were made is fruitless because so many things can happen later. I thought we would have had to give up more to get Green than that.

Doug Fister is not a #4 starter.

On the Tigers he was,

1. Max

2. Verlander

3. Sanchez

4. Fister

5. Porcello

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

DETROIT -

The Detroit Tigers have acquired Yankee starting pitcher Shane Greene in a three-way trade involving New York and the Arizona Diamondbacks, according to Ken Rosenthal.

In the deal, the Tigers sent 23-year-old starting pitcher Robbie Ray to the Diamondbacks. Ray was 1-4 with an 8.16 ERA in limited action for the Tigers after being acquired from Washington for Doug Fister. Reports say the Tigers will also send another minor league player to the Diamondbacks in the deal.

The Diamondbacks sent shortstop Didi Gregorius to the Yankees in the deal, according to reports.

So the Fister trade really did suck.

Not sure how you got that out of this trade. We just got a #4 starter (what Fister is) who is controllable through 2018 for Ray and a mifer who was deep on the franchise depth chart.

So now the Tigers have Green and Krol for Fister and Lebya. The loss of Fister made no difference to the team last year (1.3 WAR), and he is a free agent after this season. So we now have 9 years of two controllable pitchers over one year if Fister. Plus Ray had value to the Diamondbacks.

As I said before, judging trades at the time they were made is fruitless because so many things can happen later. I thought we would have had to give up more to get Green than that.

Doug Fister is not a #4 starter.

On the Tigers he was,

1. Max

2. Verlander

3. Sanchez

4. Fister

5. Porcello

He is on the Nats also.

[jon_mx 8,750]

Name the two teams in baseball Fister would be the #4 guy.

Edited December 8, 2014 by jon_mx