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WR Brandin Cooks, DAL (1 Viewer)

FreeBaGeL said:
He literally had to run back out of the endzone to catch the ball after being 10 yards behind any defender.  Should have been the easiest gimme TD of the game if not for a terrible throw.

But other than that I thought he was struggling to get separation in the game even before seeing the stats here.  He looked fine week 1.  Did not look good week 2.  I worry a bit if he's not getting open.  A lot of the raving about him in camp was him making great catches in traffic but Brady isn't really the type of QB to throw into coverage or throw a guy open.  The thing that has always made him one of the all-time greats is that he reads the field better than anyone in NFL history and it's not even close.  Why throw into coverage and let your receiver try and make a play when you're as good at finding someone wide open as he is?
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He had peaks and valleys with Brees too. Given how Brees (like Brady) is one of the game's premier QBs, I think we may just have to accept that Cooks is always going to have them. That may be who he is as a WR.

I thought he was fine Week 1. The Chiefs mugged the hell out of him and he still put up 11 points in PPR. Obviously, the expectations were great last week due to the matchup (Diggs and Thielen had just destroyed the same D and were running wide-### open the entire game) and he failed. Though as I pointed out and you agreed he should've had a TD which would've made his fantasy day far more palatable. He also had a crazy 7-yard loss on what I thought was a needless rushing attempt late in the game. 

Bottom line - bad games happen to the best of players. I don't believe Cooks to be among the game's elite WRs but even if he was those players come up small sometimes too. I still think the upside is there because he is, and has already shown this season, one of the best downfield threats at the position. The Patriots will take advantage of that as the season goes on just like Brees did. They didn't give up what they did not to make every effort possible to cash in on the investment.

So ultimately, I would still give Cooks high-end WR2 value with low-end WR1 upside possible if the TDs end up being there. Last week sucked but I haven't lost my belief in what I think he can do in this offense with this quarterback.

 
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Fact: Cooks 2 games with the Pats are among his 3 worst for receptions (3 or fewer). He had 9 games of 3 or fewer with the Saints in 3 years. The Saints game was the 2nd worst ever in terms of catches & yards, better only than the Saints/Rams game that drove him to get a trade. He's a great WR, it's not his fault he's not being exploited.

 
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SaintsInDome2006 said:
Fact: Cooks 3 games with the Pats are among his 3 worst for receptions (3 or fewer). He had 9 games of 3 or fewer with the Saints in 3 years. The Saints game was the 2nd worst ever in terms of catches & yards, better only than the Saints/Rams game that drove him to get a trade. He's a great WR, it's not his fault he's not being exploited.
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He's only played two unless you can see in the future and if so are you saying Cooks should be benched this week? :)

I think it's just a matter of time before we see it all happen for Cooks in this offense. It definitely could come tomorrow against a Houston D that has rather serious issues in the secondary. 

 
packersfan said:
SaintsInDome2006 said:
Fact: Cooks 3 games with the Pats are among his 3 worst for receptions (3 or fewer). He had 9 games of 3 or fewer with the Saints in 3 years. The Saints game was the 2nd worst ever in terms of catches & yards, better only than the Saints/Rams game that drove him to get a trade. He's a great WR, it's not his fault he's not being exploited.
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He's only played two unless you can see in the future and if so are you saying Cooks should be benched this week? :)

I think it's just a matter of time before we see it all happen for Cooks in this offense. It definitely could come tomorrow against a Houston D that has rather serious issues in the secondary. 
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Interesting take. I read SiD’s post & immediately thought “yeah he’s too good for this to become a trend.”

 
packersfan said:
He's only played two unless you can see in the future and if so are you saying Cooks should be benched this week? :)

I think it's just a matter of time before we see it all happen for Cooks in this offense. It definitely could come tomorrow against a Houston D that has rather serious issues in the secondary. 
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I'm going with this version. The mean says he should be trending way up.

 
 Charchian came out on his show and said Cooks was going to be matched with a backup corner. (I have not verified this though)

 Everyone on his show is high on him, and all the guys I know and fully respect their opinions, they pretty much all rate him higher than where he has been so far this season.

It doesn't really matter, I am one of those, and I am rolling him out as my WR2 in a start 3WR league. I am pretty high on him, as I said above thread.

We are going to see in less than 24 hours.

I get the feeling the supreme blow up is coming, but I just don't know if its this week. (something along the lines of a 2-TD 140 yard game)

I think if its not this week, then it may well be week 6 @ the NY Jets.

For that matter, I am betting on a big night from him (if healthy) @ home vs ATL  in the Sunday night prime time game in week 7.

 TZM

 
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I think the Saints realized Cooks is a little more speedster than he is wide receiver, which is why they would trade him for a pick at the start of the 2nd round (where players chosen have at least a 1/3 chance of being a complete bust) and the chance to move up the few steps from a mid 4th round pick to last in the third. If he were who many of you are hoping, I don't think anyone would trade him so cheaply. If he can be a perfect fit for the extremely complex Patriots system, maybe "it's time." If not, he may just be another slightly misfit Patriot piece, which Belicheck and McDaniels can make good use of, but who will become another of their which-week-can-you-rely-on-him offensive options.

 
I've never been the biggest fan of Cooks, but even I'm going to reserve judgment of him as a Pat until we see more.  It's very common for WRs going to a new team to need time to adjust and to build a rapport with their new QB, even if that QB is Tom Brady.  

I did say months ago that I thought this trade was a downgrade for Cooks from a fantasy perspective though, and I still feel that way today even after all the injuries NE has sustained.  Even with the emergence of Thomas in NO, Cooks was locked in as one of the top 2 receiving options on a weekly basis (i know he had bad weeks in NO too,  all WRs do). In the NE offense they are much better at exploiting mismatches on a game to game basis, which in turn makes most of the offensive players much more susceptible to blowing up for a game then disappearing for stretch of games.

 
SameSongNDance said:
Cooks is going to be squaring off against Marcus Burley this week, a dude who was cut by CLE during the preseason. This will be his most exploitable match-up to date and if he doesn't put up top 15 numbers you can officially hit the panic button.
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Finger has officially stopped hovering over the panic button.

 
Matt BowenESPN Staff Writer 

Breakout game for Brandin Cooks fantasy owners...The Patriots WR caught five passes for 131 yards and two touchdowns. Vertical routes down the field, play action concepts to clear out space and one-on-one matchups.

 
Eh, I wouldn't call it breakout. He had some nice catches (the 2nd TD catch was very nice with a toe tap just inside the line), but Houston sold out to concentrate on him most of the game. Hogan & Gronk feasted underneath with Cooks drawing double coverage up top. 

I'm happy at the stat Iine though, i own Cooks in multiple dynastys.

 
Bracie Smathers said:
Matt BowenESPN Staff Writer 

Breakout game for Brandin Cooks fantasy owners...The Patriots WR caught five passes for 131 yards and two touchdowns. Vertical routes down the field, play action concepts to clear out space and one-on-one matchups.
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Completely disagree with this. This is who Cooks is and why he has finished as a top 10 receiver before. 11.8, 6.3, then 30.8 in PPR scoring. Averages out to 16.3 a game. Then next week he will go off again and everyone will think all is right in the world then he will throw up a couple of duds, or he will throw up a couple of duds then pull out another 30 point performance. He is the most maddening top 10 receiver to own, he is great if your league has large starting lineups, because a strong team can cover up his dud and his big weeks are game winners. Still trying to trade him in one league, hopefully I get a decent offer now.

 
msudaisy26 said:
Completely disagree with this. This is who Cooks is and why he has finished as a top 10 receiver before. 11.8, 6.3, then 30.8 in PPR scoring. Averages out to 16.3 a game. Then next week he will go off again and everyone will think all is right in the world then he will throw up a couple of duds, or he will throw up a couple of duds then pull out another 30 point performance. He is the most maddening top 10 receiver to own, he is great if your league has large starting lineups, because a strong team can cover up his dud and his big weeks are game winners. Still trying to trade him in one league, hopefully I get a decent offer now.
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The targets aren't there......not sure he will finish as a top 10 WR this year. 18 targets in 3 games is not going to do it long term.......

 
I think I would be selling in redraft and buying in dynasty.  

Selling in redraft because people are right, the targets aren't there for any kind of consistency.

Buying in dynasty because I am immensely impressed with his ability.  His natural talent is well known (quickness, speed), but it's his skills as a receiver that really impress me.  He just brings the ball in.  Sucks it up, even when it looks like a low percentage play.  Great balance and body control.

He's an elite talent with elite skills so I am buying long-term.  Short-term I agree things will be frustrating.  The one hope on that front is that Brady was impressed enough by what he did in traffic today that he starts looking his way more.

 
I mean he could easily have 5 TDs this season and another 100-150 yards.......Brady under threw Cooks last week for a TD and the PI in the first week.......

 
TZMarkie said:
It doesn't really matter, I am one of those, and I am rolling him out as my WR2 in a start 3WR league. I am pretty high on him, as I said above thread.

We are going to see in less than 24 hours.

I get the feeling the supreme blow up is coming, but I just don't know if its this week. (something along the lines of a 2-TD 140 yard game)

I think if its not this week, then it may well be week 6 @ the NY Jets.

For that matter, I am betting on a big night from him (if healthy) @ home vs ATL  in the Sunday night prime time game in week 7.

 TZM
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 Hmm.  I had no idea how close my "guess" was going to be.

I thought the 2TD 140 game was coming, but I did say "I don't know if its this week".

 He posted 5 catches for 131 and 2 TDs. PLUS a 2 pt. conversion .

 Maybe I need to come in here every week and try and "guess" a blow up game like this for us owners.    :excited:

  Typically when  I am high on a guy he posts a 4 for 45 yd. line, and no TDs.  (the old Crabtree line from SF)   :wall:

Lets hope this is Cooks firing up and getting started for a nice rest-of-season.

 TZM

 
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shadyridr said:
can't wait until next week's 3-40-0
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I think Cooks will eat vs. Daryl Worley this week. If those splits I talked about have any merit, Worley and his 4.64 wheels will have his hands full. Worley will see Cooks for most of the game.

Previously he contributed to Garcon's 6/81/0 and Michael Thomas's 7/87/1 stat lines. Zay Jones didn't do much week 2 but he drew the most targets of all BUF receivers that week.

 
I thought it was good that in a close game Brady was looking for cooks but he's such a good QB he hardly ever force feeds anyone.  You get open you get the ball.  

 
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need2know said:
He already has..... :cry:
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Well first game he easily could have had 2 TD's and 100 more yards if not for the PI calls. The 2nd game Brady criminally under threw him in the endzone and Cooks had to come back for the ball to make a great catch but was tackled on the 2 yard line. He could easily have 3 more TD's and 100+ more yards which would make him the #1 WR in FF right now. I'd still be saying he needs more targets though......I thought they would put him in the slot more than they are but it's not happening. He'll have a hard time staying in the top 12 if he doesn't increase his targets.

 
As a Cooks owner, it is the 2 point conversion that makes me more excited than anything. It was a classic Welker/Edelman route.

Couple that with all the deep stuff, the targets are going to come. It takes time for new WRs with Brady.

 
COOKS REST OF SEASON ANALYSIS: Let's project Start/Sit games 

Basis of Study: Cooks excels vs slower (4.45+ 40time) corners, and struggles vs faster (4.44- 40time).

Week 3: Barrett has pointed out that "130 of Cooks' 150 yards and both touchdowns came against Corey Moore (4.62) and Johnthan Banks (4.61) in coverage. Bill knows what's up." link 
Week 4 : Scott Barrett with PFF has already pointed out the numbers look favorable. 

So we know that Belichick, unsurprisingly, is hip to this trend.... getting Cooks matched up vs a team's slower assets (absent a shadow corner). 

GOAL: The goal of this exercise is to look at the remaining weeks in an attempt to isolate a sit/start schedule for Cooks going foward. 

Week 4 CAR: Worley 4.64 / Bradberry 4.50
Week 5 @TB:  Grimes 4.57 / Hargreaves 4.50
Week 6 @NYJ: Claiborne 4.44  / Skrine 4.37 (4.50 Combine)
Week 7 ATL: Trufant 4.38 / Alford 4.34
Week 8 SD: Haywarrd 4.47 / Williams 4.44 
Week 9 BYE
Week 10 @DEN: Talib 4.42 / Harris Jr 4.48
Week 11 @OAK: Amerson 4.35 / Carrie 4.43
Week 12 MIA: Maxwell 4.43 / X Howard 4.41
Week 13 @BUF: T White 4.47 / E Gaines 4.51
Week 14 @MIA: Maxwell 4.43 / X Howard 4.41
Week 15 @PIT: J Haden 4.43 / A Burns 4.42
Week 16 BUF: T White 4.47 / E Gaines 4.51

40 Times: Grabbed the times at NFLDraftScount. They seem to use some factor of Combine/ProDay/Other? I'm open to other sources. 
Depth Charts:  I'm going off NFL depth charts on ESPN.com. 

Going off these charts, Looks like He's got: 
• 4 "Feast" weeks vs slower CBs (including week 4)
• 6 "Decent" weeks vs CBs with speed around the threshold he starts to struggle with. 
• 2 "Avoid" Weeks where he likely will be covered by fast CBs. 

Curious for thoughts.. obviously other factors come into play. Defenses with exceptional pass rush may inhibit Brady's ability to throw a long ball... etc. 

CREDIT: SameSongNDance has been mentioning this trend in here already so im just building on what he's been saying. 

 
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IF the above is true... it's very likely the Cooks owner will be Frustrated after week 11, and Cooks may be a great trade target for leagues who's deadlines haven't passed. 

 
Just Win Baby said:
Verrett is out for the season. Trevor Williams is starting in his place.
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Good deal thanks! I'll make the adjustment. I am NOT an authority on this so welcome any input on who we think cooks will see, corrections on 40 times, and other factors. Will update that post with all corrected variables. :thumbup:  

 
More importantly to me is to see if Cooks starts running more short or intermediate routes and gets looks from Brady.  NE prefers the quick passing game.  Cooks is not built to go over the middle but he does not have to always be the long route guy. 

 
DocHolliday said:
More importantly to me is to see if Cooks starts running more short or intermediate routes and gets looks from Brady.  NE prefers the quick passing game.  Cooks is not built to go over the middle but he does not have to always be the long route guy. 
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They may be using Cooks long to start the season, setting up the possibility for him to cut some routes shorter when they think it will work.  Also, KC dropped into an eight-man zone, rushing only three on opening Thursday.  They had success with it.  I anticipate other teams will attempt this as well.  I doubt the 40 times of the corners really matter that much against this type of coverage.  It then becomes Cooks ability to find the seams and for Brady to find him.  I am guessing that at this point Brady has more confidence in more familiar receivers and running backs and knows where they will go to beat the zone. This may or may not continue through the year. I think the data above may have some validity, but I doubt it is the deciding factor in Cooks' success.  There are always adjustments being made by both teams.

 
DocHolliday said:
More importantly to me is to see if Cooks starts running more short or intermediate routes and gets looks from Brady.  NE prefers the quick passing game.  Cooks is not built to go over the middle but he does not have to always be the long route guy. 
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I always thought they would use him on some of these routes and when Edelman went down it seemed like more of a certainty but it hasn't happened yet......if it does than Cooks has #1 WR in FF upside.

 
Milkman said:
I always thought they would use him on some of these routes and when Edelman went down it seemed like more of a certainty but it hasn't happened yet......if it does than Cooks has #1 WR in FF upside.
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Cooks has WR1 upside regardless. He's currently WR11 and Brady is playing out of his mind. 

Edit: I misread your post.

 
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creepythinman said:
As a Cooks owner, it is the 2 point conversion that makes me more excited than anything. It was a classic Welker/Edelman route.

Couple that with all the deep stuff, the targets are going to come. It takes time for new WRs with Brady.
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No it doesn't. Moss, Welker both came right in and dominated.  Amendola came in and looked like Edelman, until he got hurt, which was only like 2 weeks. 

 
Catbird said:
I think the Saints realized Cooks is a little more speedster than he is wide receiver, which is why they would trade him for a pick at the start of the 2nd round (where players chosen have at least a 1/3 chance of being a complete bust) and the chance to move up the few steps from a mid 4th round pick to last in the third. If he were who many of you are hoping, I don't think anyone would trade him so cheaply. If he can be a perfect fit for the extremely complex Patriots system, maybe "it's time." If not, he may just be another slightly misfit Patriot piece, which Belicheck and McDaniels can make good use of, but who will become another of their which-week-can-you-rely-on-him offensive options.
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If the Saints actually think this I think they are wrong. Cooks is more than just a fast WR.

The Saints traded away Kenny Stills who many may see as just a speedster too, but when other Saints receivers were injured, he proved that he can be more than that. Then they traded him away.

Honestly I think the Saints believe that with Brees they can make any WR a star, so they do not really value these good receivers as much as other teams might. They have higher priorities and trading these WR away is a way for them to try to improve other parts of their team.

The Patriots gave up their 1st round pick for Cooks, that is not a cheap price for Cooks at all considering he only had one year left on his contract. That is likely the other reason they traded him, because of their belief that they can turn any WR into a star and they didn't want to pay Cooks top dollar he is going to get on his second contract.

 
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[icon] said:
COOKS REST OF SEASON ANALYSIS: Let's project Start/Sit games 

Basis of Study: Cooks excels vs slower (4.45+ 40time) corners, and struggles vs faster (4.44- 40time).

Week 3: Barrett has pointed out that "130 of Cooks' 150 yards and both touchdowns came against Corey Moore (4.62) and Johnthan Banks (4.61) in coverage. Bill knows what's up." link 
Week 4 : Scott Barrett with PFF has already pointed out the numbers look favorable. 

So we know that Belichick, unsurprisingly, is hip to this trend.... getting Cooks matched up vs a team's slower assets (absent a shadow corner). 

GOAL: The goal of this exercise is to look at the remaining weeks in an attempt to isolate a sit/start schedule for Cooks going foward. 

Week 4 CAR: Worley 4.64 / Bradberry 4.50
Week 5 @TB:  Grimes 4.57 / Hargreaves 4.50
Week 6 @NYJ: Claiborne 4.44  / Skrine 4.37 (4.50 Combine)
Week 7 ATL: Trufant 4.38 / Alford 4.34
Week 8 SD: Haywarrd 4.47 / Williams 4.44 
Week 9 BYE
Week 10 @DEN: Talib 4.42 / Harris Jr 4.48
Week 11 @OAK: Amerson 4.35 / Carrie 4.43
Week 12 MIA: Maxwell 4.43 / X Howard 4.41
Week 13 @BUF: T White 4.47 / E Gaines 4.51
Week 14 @MIA: Maxwell 4.43 / X Howard 4.41
Week 15 @PIT: J Haden 4.43 / A Burns 4.42
Week 16 BUF: T White 4.47 / E Gaines 4.51

40 Times: Grabbed the times at NFLDraftScount. They seem to use some factor of Combine/ProDay/Other? I'm open to other sources. 
Depth Charts:  I'm going off NFL depth charts on ESPN.com. 

Going off these charts, Looks like He's got: 
• 4 "Feast" weeks vs slower CBs (including week 4)
• 6 "Decent" weeks vs CBs with speed around the threshold he starts to struggle with. 
• 2 "Avoid" Weeks where he likely will be covered by fast CBs. 

Curious for thoughts.. obviously other factors come into play. Defenses with exceptional pass rush may inhibit Brady's ability to throw a long ball... etc. 

CREDIT: SameSongNDance has been mentioning this trend in here already so im just building on what he's been saying. 
Click to expand...
So now Bill is following this trend eh?

Talk about using someone else for your own self promotion.

I think this is nonsense honestly.

 
Biabreakable said:
If the Saints actually think this I think they are wrong. Cooks is more than just a fast WR.

The Saints traded away Kenny Stills who many may see as just a speedster too, but when other Saints receivers were injured, he proved that he can be more than that. Then they traded him away.

Honestly I think the Saints believe that with Brees they can make any WR a star, so they do not really value these good receivers as much as other teams might. They have higher priorities and trading these WR away is a way for them to try to improve other parts of their team.

The Patriots gave up their 1st round pick for Cooks, that is not a cheap price for Cooks at all considering he only had one year left on his contract. That is likely the other reason they traded him, because of their belief that they can turn any WR into a star and they didn't want to pay Cooks top dollar he is going to get on his second contract.
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If the Saints weren't going to resign him then they should have traded him, that's a no-brainer. That also means the Saints thought less of him than the rest of the league, specifically the Patriots.

 
msudaisy26 said:
No it doesn't. Moss, Welker both came right in and dominated.  Amendola came in and looked like Edelman, until he got hurt, which was only like 2 weeks. 
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You name 2 WRs a decade ago and one game of Danny Amendola to make your point? What about the countless others where the timing/chemistry didn't click right away?

In each of the 3 games so far, Brady has badly underthrown Cooks, costing much yardage and a easy touchdown against the Saints. I'm guessing that'll be fixed the more games they play. But maybe not.

 
creepythinman said:
You name 2 WRs a decade ago and one game of Danny Amendola to make your point? What about the countless others where the timing/chemistry didn't click right away?
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Who are the countless others who had a pedigree equal to Cooks'? Joey Galloway, but he was 38 when he came to NE, so he is a bad example. Ocho Cinco is the only guy who comes to mind. Sample size of one.

 
creepythinman said:
You name 2 WRs a decade ago and one game of Danny Amendola to make your point? What about the countless others where the timing/chemistry didn't click right away?

In each of the 3 games so far, Brady has badly underthrown Cooks, costing much yardage and a easy touchdown against the Saints. I'm guessing that'll be fixed the more games they play. But maybe not.
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They are off the top of my head. I am sure I can look and find more. You are pointing out 1 play, deep pass plays don't hit that often, a lot of times they end in incomplete passes or flags.

 
Biabreakable said:
So now Bill is following this trend eh?

Talk about using someone else for your own self promotion.

I think this is nonsense honestly.
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Pretty much.  He's staying in my lineup.  I don't need to get that deep into it

 
Biabreakable said:
So now Bill is following this trend eh?

Talk about using someone else for your own self promotion.

I think this is nonsense honestly.
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1) Did you even read Barrett's article. There is hard data that continues to prove out. How do YOU explain his league-largest gap in points per route against fast/slow CBs? 

2) Who is trying to promote what? I took someone else's proven system and applied it to existing CB's going forward as a basis for discussion. Nobody's promoting anything, but given this thread has devolved into a bunch of people locked into their own opinions, it's nice to discuss some actual data. 

Bottom line: Despite your flat-earther mentality, this is a very real phenomena. The only question is if it will continue to play out in the Patriots game-plan heavy system. Per analysis by someone far sharper than you or I, Early evidence of Bill's utilization of Cooks seems to indicate knowledge of this strength/weakness. 

If you're going to attempt to take a position of authority on his topic, I'll politely encourage you to strengthen your position beyond simply saying "I think this is nonsense". TIA 

 
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msudaisy26 said:
They are off the top of my head. I am sure I can look and find more. You are pointing out 1 play, deep pass plays don't hit that often, a lot of times they end in incomplete passes or flags.
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Cooks has some of the best hands / catch rate on deep balls in the NFL... and there is nothing wrong with a DPI flag on a deep route... 

 
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