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It's not so much that I somehow don't like winning but really the guy wasn't a bad guy. He just wasn't my client.

I like helping my clients who need help. I hate many times the manners and methods I employ to extend that help.

That's all I was trying to say earlier. It's a tough job sometimes. But from what I know of you, I don't think you take clients who don't "deserve" yo be zealously advocated for. You seem like a really good guy.

I have no doubt that his tears are at least part of his own making. And either way, it isn't something you need to feel like a jerk about in my opinion. Not from the stories you share about what you do.

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I don't know if there's a real pinnacle to this profession. Some times it really seems like there isn't one. But I do now know that when you're standing there waiting and hoping for two words instead

Made partner today. 

Big news for The_Son - just found out he got the Rubenstein Scholarship from Chicago! Full tuition + a $20,000 per year stipend. Last week he was fortunate enough to be offered a full-tuition scholars

I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

I don't do criminal and I don't do family law

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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

I don't do criminal and I don't do family law

Yeah not sure what I would have chosen if I had gone that way. I was always interested in patent law and coupled with my interest in science that seemed like it might be a good fit. But it wasn't to be. I did have University of Pennsylvania interested in giving me some sholarship help at one point but yeah who needs that right? Kids are dumb.

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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

I don't do criminal and I don't do family law

Yeah not sure what I would have chosen if I had gone that way. I was always interested in patent law and coupled with my interest in science that seemed like it might be a good fit. But it wasn't to be. I did have University of Pennsylvania interested in giving me some sholarship help at one point but yeah who needs that right? Kids are dumb.

Do you have a science degree?
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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

I don't do criminal and I don't do family law

Yeah not sure what I would have chosen if I had gone that way. I was always interested in patent law and coupled with my interest in science that seemed like it might be a good fit. But it wasn't to be. I did have University of Pennsylvania interested in giving me some sholarship help at one point but yeah who needs that right? Kids are dumb.

Do you have a science degree?

No I have a technology degree.

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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

I don't do criminal and I don't do family law

Yeah not sure what I would have chosen if I had gone that way. I was always interested in patent law and coupled with my interest in science that seemed like it might be a good fit. But it wasn't to be. I did have University of Pennsylvania interested in giving me some sholarship help at one point but yeah who needs that right? Kids are dumb.

Do you have a science degree?

No I have a technology degree.

Even better. Have you considered getting your law degree late in life? Most of the happy lawyers I know did that.
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I'm pretty sure I would have been like Mr.Ford. I wanted to be a lawyer and I love winning arguments. To be honest I would have enjoyed reducing the occasional witness to tears. Hell I did it to instructors in college.

I never did it when I was a defense guy

Didn't have the heart. Now I only take cases I really believe in, because I work primarily on contingency. As a result, I generally believe someone is severely in the wrong when I make him cry.

Yeah I have a certain lines I won't cross. Sometimes I don't know where the line is until my toes are on it though. Not sure I could do sex crime defense for example. I just can't see myself destroying a rape victim on the stand or maybe I could if the evidence was there, I don't suffer liars very well, that's one of those hazy lines I was talking about. But I can't see myself doing the she's a slut defense in any case. Which seems to be pretty popular in that line of work.

I don't do criminal and I don't do family law

Yeah not sure what I would have chosen if I had gone that way. I was always interested in patent law and coupled with my interest in science that seemed like it might be a good fit. But it wasn't to be. I did have University of Pennsylvania interested in giving me some sholarship help at one point but yeah who needs that right? Kids are dumb.

Do you have a science degree?

No I have a technology degree.

Even better. Have you considered getting your law degree late in life? Most of the happy lawyers I know did that.

I would love to. But I have an issue with a wife who has been under medical care for over a decade and a ton of medical debt because of it. But for better or worse right? So it probably isn't in the cards for me.

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

If a guy starts crying on the stand, shouldn't the opposing attorney object or something?
To what?

"Objection, your honor, my client feels so awful about himself and what he's done that the jury can't help but agree with him that he's responsible"

:shrug: That's why you're the lawyer and I'm asking questions.

What about "badgering the witness?"

People will cry without being harassed on the stand.

That's true. I had a client break down on me 2 weeks ago when I was questioning her in a divorce prove-up her husband refused to attend.

Edited by Christo
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Well, if you ever decide to, I will write you the most glittering recommendation you've ever seen. Subject to certain conditions, of course.

Thanj you and it goes without saying.

really just one - that you never share my actual identity with these freaks on this board.

You'd make a good lawyer. And a fair one. There aren't enough.

I have my own financial crisis regarding family illness, and I'm extremely impressed with your handling of your own.

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I lurked on this board for years before posting with regularity, and you are one of the most impressive posters on here, NCC. For purely selfish reasons, I'd love to share a profession.

One of the members of my law school class was 60 when he graduated. And that was years ago. Keep it in mind.

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.
Jesus.
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There's a guy whose firm is in New Orleans whose nickname with plaintiffs is "The Third Reich.". He does #### like that constantly. Always wondered if it bothered him.

Edited by Henry Ford
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Well, if you ever decide to, I will write you the most glittering recommendation you've ever seen. Subject to certain conditions, of course.

Thanj you and it goes without saying.

really just one - that you never share my actual identity with these freaks on this board.

You'd make a good lawyer. And a fair one. There aren't enough.

I have my own financial crisis regarding family illness, and I'm extremely impressed with your handling of your own.

You might be surprised how many secret identities I already know. I have met 2 to 3 dozen of our fellow posters. I definitely never reveal that info. Anonymity is what makes it work.

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I think you'd be a great lawyer, NCC, and I don't mean that as an insult.

Thanks I really appreciate it.

More of a curse than an insult

I have actually been told that many times and usually not with good intent invovled.

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I lurked on this board for years before posting with regularity, and you are one of the most impressive posters on here, NCC. For purely selfish reasons, I'd love to share a profession.

One of the members of my law school class was 60 when he graduated. And that was years ago. Keep it in mind.

That's pretty impressive. I will defintely keep it in mind. And I like your work here as well.

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.

That has to suck.

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Any of your private equity firms looking to invest a few million in multifamily, let me know.

Is this a polygamy thing? I know it's an investment, but I feel like a second wife would be a bigger status symbol way better than a Ferrari.

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.
And if your opponent knew about this beforehand, it's his fault you had to do this - not yours.
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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.
And if your opponent knew about this beforehand, it's his fault you had to do this - not yours.

He knew. He was just a dooshbag.

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.
And if your opponent knew about this beforehand, it's his fault you had to do this - not yours.
He knew. He was just a dooshbag.
Then it's completely his fault. Sorry you had to do that.
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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.
And if your opponent knew about this beforehand, it's his fault you had to do this - not yours.
He knew. He was just a dooshbag.
Then it's completely his fault. Sorry you had to do that.

He didn't file an in limine trying to protect her. He didn't even object

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I don't think I've ever had a day like Yankee's today - where destroying someone on the stand didn't give me personal pleasure.

I had to cross a woman in a case where she believed her unborn child had been lost in a car accident. Not only was there substantial evidence that the fetus had died earlier, I also had to bring out the previous abortions she'd had when she was younger. Even with a soft cross, she cried the whole time and I felt like a heel. I got a defense verdict, but felt like crap.
And if your opponent knew about this beforehand, it's his fault you had to do this - not yours.
He knew. He was just a dooshbag.
Then it's completely his fault. Sorry you had to do that.
He didn't file an in limine trying to protect her. He didn't even object
Jesus. That's so much worse than you bringing it up. He should be sanctioned.
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Today I've done almost 10 hours of CLE, 10 hours of "work", had a nice hike, and have posted in the FFA all day. :multitasking:

Edited by krista4
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Today I've done almost 10 hours of CLE, 10 hours of "work", had a nice hike, and have posted in the FFA all day. :multitasking:

So the Washington bar has a different concept of double billing, then?

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Question from the peanut gallery. What is the relevance of the previous abortions? The difference in miscarriage rates is really small between women who had abortions and those who haven't. Something like one percent according to a huge Danish study.

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Today I've done almost 10 hours of CLE, 10 hours of "work", had a nice hike, and have posted in the FFA all day. :multitasking:

So the Washington bar has a different concept of double billing, then?

Hint: I don't bill.

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Today I've done almost 10 hours of CLE, 10 hours of "work", had a nice hike, and have posted in the FFA all day. :multitasking:

So the Washington bar has a different concept of double billing, then?

Hint: I don't bill.

Hey! I thought it was just me! Twins!

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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

12 a year. We actually report every other year so it's really 24 every 2. Because everything had to be stupid in New Jersey.
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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

30 in Illinois with at least 6 professional responsibility. Biggest racket out there.

2 year reporting period.

Edited by Christo
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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

12 a year. We actually report every other year so it's really 24 every 2. Because everything had to be stupid in New Jersey.

I got 6.5 today. Could have had 7.5 but I just couldn't take it any more.

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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

30 in Illinois with at least 6 professional responsibility. Biggest racket out there.
Holy ####.

My 12.5 includes 1 of ethics and 1 of professional responsibility.

Edited by Henry Ford
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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

IL is 30 hours every two years; all can be done online.

TN is 15 hours every year, but at least seven must be in person. :loco:

GA is 12 hours every year; haven't been admitted long enough to know details.

WA is 45 hours every three years.

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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

30 in Illinois with at least 6 professional responsibility. Biggest racket out there.
Holy ####.

:no: That's every two years.

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By the way - what are the CLE requirements in various jurisdictions? Really low for us - 12.5 hours a year.

30 in Illinois with at least 6 professional responsibility. Biggest racket out there.
Holy ####.

:no: That's every two years.

Oh. Much easier.

I'm considering starting my slow crawl across jurisdictions this year. I figure what the heck - I'm allowed automatically into Texas and can start moving across the country from there.

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Question from the peanut gallery. What is the relevance of the previous abortions? The difference in miscarriage rates is really small between women who had abortions and those who haven't. Something like one percent according to a huge Danish study.

If it had been properly objected to, I bet it would have been excluded. Because of what you cited. But it wasn't.

I think the only real argument is "you didn't really want to be a mother anyway, right?" And that wouldn't fly with any judge I know.

Edited by Henry Ford
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Question from the peanut gallery. What is the relevance of the previous abortions? The difference in miscarriage rates is really small between women who had abortions and those who haven't. Something like one percent according to a huge Danish study.

If it had been properly objected to, I bet it would have been excluded. Because of what you cited. But it wasn't.

Not to mention that if she was in her second trimester the correlation breaks down completely. Not to take anything away from Fish but that guy must have sucked.

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damages. she was suing for emotional distress associated with losing a fetus. the jury got to hear that she had voluntarily aborted a fetus twice before. the implication is that she didn't suffer all that much distress the first time if she did it again.

the evidence was pretty conclusive that the fetus had died before the accident. that's when she started crying. I don't think the rest mattered much to her at that point.

Edited by -fish-
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I recently heard the only happy lawyers no longer practice law. Si o no?

Depends on the day. Kind of like owning a boat.

You always seem to me to enjoy your job, more than most lawyers I know.

It's the thing in this world I'm most suited to do. And it just so happens that my professional goals (winning) generally align with my personal goals (helping people who deserve it.)
Henry Ford, like Charlie Sheen... WINNING!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v==em

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