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The Bucs aren't locked in to talking Winston though. The Steelers had no choice.

If the Bucs do end up taking him it's because they see what people outside the organization call "red flags" as being completely overblown by the media. They aren't dismissing them. I'm sure they've done everything in their power to investigate any and all of Winston's indiscretions.

He did some dumb things and made some immature mistakes. If he's learned from them and Tampa is convinced of that then why would they expect any issues in the future?

Professional sports teams are not experts in risk management. In fact, there are many examples of high level failures to properly vet players for injury risk (e.g., Brady Aiken) as well as character risk (e.g., Aaron Hernandez).

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Similar to when I was a teenager, I was "methodical" in my pursuit of Christie Brinkley. 

So that deft, thumbed blind kid sure could throw a football?

Winston has more completions to Saints players than Taysom Hill does in his career. I like the fit a ton. 

The Bucs aren't locked in to talking Winston though. The Steelers had no choice.

If the Bucs do end up taking him it's because they see what people outside the organization call "red flags" as being completely overblown by the media. They aren't dismissing them. I'm sure they've done everything in their power to investigate any and all of Winston's indiscretions.

He did some dumb things and made some immature mistakes. If he's learned from them and Tampa is convinced of that then why would they expect any issues in the future?

Professional sports teams are not experts in risk management. In fact, there are many examples of high level failures to properly vet players for injury risk (e.g., Brady Aiken) as well as character risk (e.g., Aaron Hernandez).

I doubt an NFL team could even fill a 53 man roster if they only took "safe" players.

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I doubt an NFL team could even fill a 53 man roster if they only took "safe" players.

:bs:

Edited by cstu
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Is cstu the woman that is accusing Jameis of raping her?

I know I've set myself up for that but I honestly believe everything I've posted here - and the questions I've asked have yet to be explained in an intellectually honest manner.

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Is cstu the woman that is accusing Jameis of raping her?

I know I've set myself up for that but I honestly believe everything I've posted here - and the questions I've asked have yet to be explained in an intellectually honest manner.

You keep referencing these questions you keep asking... they cannot be answered... for either party.

You have the burden of proof, you prove them. Otherwise, we don't have to.

ETA: BTW, we've already given our answers, you just didn't accept them. Your turn.

Edited by werdnoynek
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I doubt an NFL team could even fill a 53 man roster if they only took "safe" players.

:bs:

I'll rephrase:

I doubt a team could fill a 53 man roster with NFL level talent if they only took "safe" players.

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Is cstu the woman that is accusing Jameis of raping her?

I know I've set myself up for that but I honestly believe everything I've posted here - and the questions I've asked have yet to be explained in an intellectually honest manner.

You keep referencing these questions you keep asking... they cannot be answered... for either party.

You have the burden of proof, you prove them. Otherwise, we don't have to.

ETA: BTW, we've already given our answers, you just didn't accept them. Your turn.

CSTU is convinced the only relevant thing is public perception. Public meaning his perception.

I find him guilty then, in public perception, of killing 2 threads.

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

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Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

TFY Draft Insider Tony Pauline is hearing from NFL sources around the league that they're "unconvinced" FSU QB Jameis Winston "is a slam dunk as the first pick."

It would be an interesting turn of events for mock drafts everywhere, if Florida's own, Jameis Winston, is not the number one overall selection. However, Pauline has been told that Tampa Bay "will work the phones to see if they can deal the first pick, something they admitted not long ago, and Marcus Mariota is still in the mix."

Source: TFY Draft Insider

Apr 30 - 2:18 PM

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

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Is cstu the woman that is accusing Jameis of raping her?

I know I've set myself up for that but I honestly believe everything I've posted here - and the questions I've asked have yet to be explained in an intellectually honest manner.

You keep referencing these questions you keep asking... they cannot be answered... for either party.

You have the burden of proof, you prove them. Otherwise, we don't have to.

ETA: BTW, we've already given our answers, you just didn't accept them. Your turn.

CSTU is convinced the only relevant thing is public perception. Public meaning his perception.

I find him guilty then, in public perception, of killing 2 threads.

Did I kill the Hernandez thread too?

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Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

TFY Draft Insider Tony Pauline is hearing from NFL sources around the league that they're "unconvinced" FSU QB Jameis Winston "is a slam dunk as the first pick."

It would be an interesting turn of events for mock drafts everywhere, if Florida's own, Jameis Winston, is not the number one overall selection. However, Pauline has been told that Tampa Bay "will work the phones to see if they can deal the first pick, something they admitted not long ago, and Marcus Mariota is still in the mix."

Source: TFY Draft Insider

Apr 30 - 2:18 PM

If TB trades out of the pick, what a curveball that would be.

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Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

TFY Draft Insider Tony Pauline is hearing from NFL sources around the league that they're "unconvinced" FSU QB Jameis Winston "is a slam dunk as the first pick."

It would be an interesting turn of events for mock drafts everywhere, if Florida's own, Jameis Winston, is not the number one overall selection. However, Pauline has been told that Tampa Bay "will work the phones to see if they can deal the first pick, something they admitted not long ago, and Marcus Mariota is still in the mix."

Source: TFY Draft Insider

Apr 30 - 2:18 PM

If TB trades out of the pick, what a curveball that would be.

Poetic justice for the thread, IMO.

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

You don't find it odd that she willingly got on his moped?

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

You don't find it odd that she willingly got on his moped?

She would have to hold onto him too... unless she was strapped to the front like a deer, was that in her report?

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

You don't find it odd that she willingly got on his moped?

She would have to hold onto him too... unless she was strapped to the front like a deer, was that in her report?

More troubling, IMO, is the apparent lack of motive for falsely accusing Winston. In fact, all of the potential motives offered by FSU fans are easily refuted. She had no prior relationship with Winston, so there was no jealousy. She didn't know who he was till months later, so she wasn't a fame or fortune seeker. And so on.

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More troubling, IMO, is the apparent lack of motive for falsely accusing Winston. In fact, all of the potential motives offered by FSU fans are easily refuted. She had no prior relationship with Winston, so there was no jealousy. She didn't know who he was till months later, so she wasn't a fame or fortune seeker. And so on.

:goodposting:

Why would he lie?

Why would she lie?

The answer to the first is plainly obvious. The answer to the second is a mystery.

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

You don't find it odd that she willingly got on his moped?

According to her, Winston had to put her clothes back on her.

If true, she wasn't doing much of anything willingly at that point.

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Why would the NFL need to contact Kinsman - an accuser? What is she going to tell them that she hasn't told the police, the reporters, the media?

For the same reason they interview family and friends and others who have had significant interactions with a player.

Friends and family vs someone who accused you of rape and supposedly only had a single encounter with you??

That makes so much sense.

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

You don't find it odd that she willingly got on his moped?

She would have to hold onto him too... unless she was strapped to the front like a deer, was that in her report?

More troubling, IMO, is the apparent lack of motive for falsely accusing Winston. In fact, all of the potential motives offered by FSU fans are easily refuted. She had no prior relationship with Winston, so there was no jealousy. She didn't know who he was till months later, so she wasn't a fame or fortune seeker. And so on.

You forgot a few "supposedly" 's in there.

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bolzano, on 30 Apr 2015 - 1:07 PM, said:

More troubling, IMO, is the apparent lack of motive for falsely accusing Winston. In fact, all of the potential motives offered by FSU fans are easily refuted. She had no prior relationship with Winston, so there was no jealousy. She didn't know who he was till months later, so she wasn't a fame or fortune seeker. And so on.

Preach, brother.

Edited by cstu
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Why would the NFL need to contact Kinsman - an accuser? What is she going to tell them that she hasn't told the police, the reporters, the media?

For the same reason they interview family and friends and others who have had significant interactions with a player.

Friends and family vs someone who accused you of rape and supposedly only had a single encounter with you??

That makes so much sense.

Well it doesn't if all you want to hear is confirmation of what a great person he is to make you feel better about making the pick. This is Due Diligence 101, and i don't care how many family members, friends they interview, they are not doing their due diligence if they fail to ask her to tell her side of the story. Edited by Proust Loves Cake
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Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

TFY Draft Insider Tony Pauline is hearing from NFL sources around the league that they're "unconvinced" FSU QB Jameis Winston "is a slam dunk as the first pick."

It would be an interesting turn of events for mock drafts everywhere, if Florida's own, Jameis Winston, is not the number one overall selection. However, Pauline has been told that Tampa Bay "will work the phones to see if they can deal the first pick, something they admitted not long ago, and Marcus Mariota is still in the mix."

Source: TFY Draft Insider

Apr 30 - 2:18 PM

If TB trades out of the pick, what a curveball that would be.

It would be the smart move so don't expect it. They could trade down, gather picks and still get this future BUST.

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

She was in shock and didn't know where to go. She didn't tell him where she lived, had him drop her off at an intersection, sat on the street crying while she tweeted 'someone help me' until a friend came.

You don't find it odd that she willingly got on his moped?

According to her, Winston had to put her clothes back on her.

If true, she wasn't doing much of anything willingly at that point.

If she's too hammered to get dressed how is she sober enough to go for a ride on a moped?

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I love the false imprisonment part. Didn't he drive her home on his moped?

Yep. And he kissed her goodnight too, so he couldn't have raped her.

I know I shouldn't make light of it. Just thought that was kind of funny. He allegedly drugs her, rapes her, imprisons her falsely, and then she jumps on the back of his moped for a ride home afterward.

Couldn't she have just hopped off and escaped? He's fat and runs a 5.0 forty. No way he could have caught her.

we don't know what happened here, but based on a few years of work in this field I feel comfortable saying that illogical actions by victims of sexual assault are much more common than we'd like to believe.

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Ron Wolf:

"When I was at Green Bay, we didn't take Randy Moss because of a character issue, and he never had one bit of a problem in the NFL, and he just kicked our ### every single time he played against us," Wolf said. "And, of course, I kicked my ### every time for not taking him. The guy we took instead was defensive lineman Vonnie Holliday who played 15 years in the NFL. He's a high-character guy, and he was a wonderful player. Yeah, but Vonnie Holliday wasn't Randy Moss."

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Ron Wolf:

"When I was at Green Bay, we didn't take Randy Moss because of a character issue, and he never had one bit of a problem in the NFL, and he just kicked our ### every single time he played against us," Wolf said. "And, of course, I kicked my ### every time for not taking him. The guy we took instead was defensive lineman Vonnie Holliday who played 15 years in the NFL. He's a high-character guy, and he was a wonderful player. Yeah, but Vonnie Holliday wasn't Randy Moss."

Don't think that applies here for 2 reasons. First is talent level. 2nd is nature of off field issues. If Winston were on Andrew Luck's level as a prospect, then it might be more comparable. Moss was considered a sure thing talent wise, but slid because of off field concerns. Those concerns should have been minimized if teams met with him at Marshall. I think he matured a lot there.

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Rotoworld:

ESPN NFL Insider Jon Gruden said "I'm a little leery" about FSU QB Jameis Winston as the No. 1 pick because he's "an unfinished product ... has made questionable decisions on the field and the off-field history has to be concerning."

"He will stand in the pocket under intense fire and throw strikes, which I really admire," Gruden said. "He can also throw to the wide side of the field against pressure and with tremendous anticipation in a manner you don't often see at any level of football." The commentator went on to describe a day and a half he spent with Winston ("enjoyed every second") and said he would love to coach him. That said, he was concerned by the 28 interceptions and noted "there were 12-13 other passes over the past two years that should have been picked off" and "36 false starts in two years," indicating offensive communication has gone awry. "Winston might be best off sitting for a year and learning," Gruden said. "Because when he does figure things out, he has all the talent you are looking for."
Apr 30 - 6:04 PM
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I'm sure TB didn't do as much background work with their army of investigators, resources and contacts 75 people deep for 3 full months to combat the Internet research of CSTU.

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I'm sure TB didn't do as much background work with their army of investigators, resources and contacts 75 people deep for 3 full months to combat the Internet research of CSTU.

They never talked to the victim who about to haul his ### into court.

You got your wish, now you gotta live with it.

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I'm sure TB didn't do as much background work with their army of investigators, resources and contacts 75 people deep for 3 full months to combat the Internet research of CSTU.

They never talked to the victim who about to haul his ### into court.

You got your wish, now you gotta live with it.

Wish? :lmao:

I could care less if Winston is playing in TB or the California Penal League.

I just got it right that he was going 1st because I didn't let emotion and bias cloud my judgement.

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Rotoworld take:

Buccaneers selected Florida State QB Jameis Winston with the No. 1 overall pick in the 2015 NFL draft.

Winston (6'4/231) was a dominant college quarterback, earning the Heisman as a redshirt freshman in 2013 and leading the 'Noles to back-to-back BCS title game berths. Finishing his career with a 65:28 TD-to-INT ratio and sterling 66.0 completion rate, Winston consistently made the likes of Rashad Greene and Nick O'Leary look far better than they really were. While a sub-par athlete, Winston is an old-school pocket quarterback with a naturally anticipatory and aggressive passing mindset that too often resulted in interceptions in 2014, exacerbated by a poor supporting cast. Purely from a tools standpoint, Winston projects somewhere in between Eli Manning and Ben Roethlisberger. In Tampa Bay, he's set up for early-career success surrounded by Mike Evans, Vincent Jackson, and Austin Seferian-Jenkins in OC Dirk Koetter's vertical-passing attack.
Apr 30 - 8:12 PM
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I'm sure TB didn't do as much background work with their army of investigators, resources and contacts 75 people deep for 3 full months to combat the Internet research of CSTU.

They never talked to the victim who about to haul his ### into court.

You got your wish, now you gotta live with it.

Wish? :lmao:

I could care less if Winston is playing in TB or the California Penal League.

I just got it right that he was going 1st because I didn't let emotion and bias cloud my judgement.

I got it wrong because I applied logic to the Bucs. #neveragain

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