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QB Jameis Winston, NO (7 Viewers)

Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

ESPN's Todd McShay believes, based on film study, that Florida State redshirt sophomore QB Jameis Winston "is the No. 1 QB prospect in this class."

"It's his past behavioral issues that concern me, and that's why I currently have him ranked behind [Marcus] Mariota on our board," the analyst wrote. "The Bucs, or any other team that considers drafting him, are going to have to decide whether they're comfortable with him from a character, personality and psychological standpoint." Of course, very few question Winston's play on the field. "From a talent standpoint, Winston offers a lot for NFL teams to like," McShay wrote. "He excels from inside the pocket and has a very strong, accurate arm. He also has displayed very good on-field leadership and game-management skills. If you limit things to his on-field performance, he should be Tampa Bay's pick at No. 1 overall."

Source: ESPN Insider

Dec 29 - 9:56 PM
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Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.

 
Meh.

He showed a legitimately great and accurate arm a number of times, including some throws that went for incompletions that would have been complete to even terrible NFL receivers.

On the other hand, he made some typically awful decisions, and clearly wasn't prepared to take advantage of the hole left in Oregon's secondary by injury, nor did he look like had any clue what sort of schemes Oregon employed. :shrug:

And of course, he looked worse than he actually played since he was surrounded by a team that was clearly outclassed by the other guy's team.

It's still all going to come down to whether he can land in a spot where he has enough motivation or respect to buckle down and take the game seriously. I wouldn't blow a first round pick on that gamble if I were a GM, but I'm sure at least 20 of the ones actually making the picks would be happy to.

I think it's a pretty typical case of Mariota having the lower ceiling and higher floor, and Winston the opposite. If fans of teams drafting at the top are desperate for either guy, I think they're nuts.

 
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ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.

 
CalBear said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.
Click to expand...
You must not have watched the same game as me.
 
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
Hope he goes to your Skins so you can relive JaMarcus Russell

 
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.
Click to expand...
You must not have watched the same game as me.
Click to expand...
He was the one with the gold helmet, right? I saw him look awkward moving in the pocket more than once (that play being the worst example). I saw Oregon rush three guys most of the night, which says something about their belief in Winston's ability to read secondary and tertiary receivers. And I saw him get beat by almost 40. I certainly didn't see someone I thought could be productive on day 1 in 2015.

 
CalBear said:
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.
Click to expand...
You must not have watched the same game as me.
Click to expand...
He was the one with the gold helmet, right? I saw him look awkward moving in the pocket more than once (that play being the worst example). I saw Oregon rush three guys most of the night, which says something about their belief in Winston's ability to read secondary and tertiary receivers. And I saw him get beat by almost 40. I certainly didn't see someone I thought could be productive on day 1 in 2015.
Click to expand...
Or it could be that they only needed to rush 3, since their D-Line was way better than the makeshift O-line of FSU. The receivers didnt look that much better, fumbling the ball. They looked outclassed IMO. Not much that Winston could've done to get the win.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
CalBear said:
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.
Click to expand...
You must not have watched the same game as me.
Click to expand...
He was the one with the gold helmet, right? I saw him look awkward moving in the pocket more than once (that play being the worst example). I saw Oregon rush three guys most of the night, which says something about their belief in Winston's ability to read secondary and tertiary receivers. And I saw him get beat by almost 40. I certainly didn't see someone I thought could be productive on day 1 in 2015.
Click to expand...
I guess you misses the multiple drops by his receivers and fumbles that that pretty much led to that lose. Winston looked significantly better than Mariota.

My end count of inaccurate throws was 5 for Winston, 12 for Mariota. Difficult/great throws 8 for Winston, none for Mariota.

There is a reason Oregon rushed 3 and 4 all day long. It's because they knew FSU has a weak oline and they need to drop 7 or 8 in coverage to try and contain Winston. They challenged him in his main weak area, over the middle throws beating underneath coverage. He did it. He made throws into several tight windows and displayed great anticipation. Let's get one thing straight here, FSU struggled to get open in this game. Oregon nearly blanketed their WR. Still, Winston put them in position to make plays with regularity. They dropped the ball.

 
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.
Click to expand...
You must not have watched the same game as me.
Click to expand...
He was the one with the gold helmet, right? I saw him look awkward moving in the pocket more than once (that play being the worst example). I saw Oregon rush three guys most of the night, which says something about their belief in Winston's ability to read secondary and tertiary receivers. And I saw him get beat by almost 40. I certainly didn't see someone I thought could be productive on day 1 in 2015.
Click to expand...
I guess you misses the multiple drops by his receivers and fumbles that that pretty much led to that lose. Winston looked significantly better than Mariota.

My end count of inaccurate throws was 5 for Winston, 12 for Mariota. Difficult/great throws 8 for Winston, none for Mariota.

There is a reason Oregon rushed 3 and 4 all day long. It's because they knew FSU has a weak oline and they need to drop 7 or 8 in coverage to try and contain Winston. They challenged him in his main weak area, over the middle throws beating underneath coverage. He did it. He made throws into several tight windows and displayed great anticipation. Let's get one thing straight here, FSU struggled to get open in this game. Oregon nearly blanketed their WR. Still, Winston put them in position to make plays with regularity. They dropped the ball.
Click to expand...
His receivers really let him down but his ghost fumble was the biggest play in turning the tides and allowing the floodgates to open. Very butt fumble like.

 
GoBirds said:
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
jurb26 said:
CalBear said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Winston just makes tons of difficult NFL throws every game. Stands in the pocket, goes through his reads. He will have the occasional boneheaded play, but many of them this year have been intermediate balls jumped by LB's, and he'll learn from that.

He's ready to start and run an NFL offense right now. Nobody else in this draft can you say that about.
Click to expand...
I don't see how you can look at that fourth down fumble and say he's ready to run an NFL offense right now. The single most important situation of the year, and he panics for no reason, puts his head down, goes nowhere, turns around, turns again awkwardly, and drops the ball with no contact. That was a Ryan Leaf play.

The rest of his game wasn't terrible but he didn't look at all like a polished, NFL-ready QB.
Click to expand...
You must not have watched the same game as me.
Click to expand...
He was the one with the gold helmet, right? I saw him look awkward moving in the pocket more than once (that play being the worst example). I saw Oregon rush three guys most of the night, which says something about their belief in Winston's ability to read secondary and tertiary receivers. And I saw him get beat by almost 40. I certainly didn't see someone I thought could be productive on day 1 in 2015.
Click to expand...
I guess you misses the multiple drops by his receivers and fumbles that that pretty much led to that lose. Winston looked significantly better than Mariota.

My end count of inaccurate throws was 5 for Winston, 12 for Mariota. Difficult/great throws 8 for Winston, none for Mariota.

There is a reason Oregon rushed 3 and 4 all day long. It's because they knew FSU has a weak oline and they need to drop 7 or 8 in coverage to try and contain Winston. They challenged him in his main weak area, over the middle throws beating underneath coverage. He did it. He made throws into several tight windows and displayed great anticipation. Let's get one thing straight here, FSU struggled to get open in this game. Oregon nearly blanketed their WR. Still, Winston put them in position to make plays with regularity. They dropped the ball.
Click to expand...
His receivers really let him down but his ghost fumble was the biggest play in turning the tides and allowing the floodgates to open. Very butt fumble like.
Click to expand...
That play was terrible, no doubt. I think the Cook fumble 2nd) was the turning point, though.
 
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.

 
I'll take Winston. Thought he looked far better tonight. I would love to compliment Winston on what I felt was a great pocket presence he had, but it's hard to directly compare when Mariota is throwing the ball in 2 seconds every time and when he does hold onto it longer, he makes plays with his feet.

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?

 
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
This, none of us will ever know the truth behind those things so I stick to what I can see.
 
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
He will never put it all together, enjoy projecting here because he will not be a star at the next level.

 
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
He will never put it all together, enjoy projecting here because he will not be a star at the next level.
Click to expand...
Okay. I'll talk football, you enjoy your People's Magazine subscription.

 
For this one game, one night, in Oregon's system, Mariota was the better QB. But I have seen Winston play much better. And not to make excuses for Windton, but he didn't get much help from his offense or his line. Oregon is just a more complete, better team than FSU and they showed that. Still, I would much rather draft Winston over Mariota if I needed a QB. He reads the defenses pre and post snap, can step up in a muddy pocket and make plays. It's hard to evaluate Mariota when his system is so perfectly choreographed. I'd like to see his throws behind the FSU O-line as a hypothetical case. I'm pretty sure that when the private pro day workouts come, Winston will distinguish himself in the eyes of scouts who were watching him all season.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
jurb26 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
This, none of us will ever know the truth behind those things so I stick to what I can see.
Click to expand...
You can't see the police blotter?

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
He will never put it all together, enjoy projecting here because he will not be a star at the next level.
Click to expand...
Okay. I'll talk football, you enjoy your People's Magazine subscription.
Click to expand...
You must be watching too much Redskins QB play to have a good benchmark.

 
I have come in here and expressed my hate for Winston. The kid is an idiot off the field. Having said that, I think he is the better prospect of the two. I think he is more pro ready than Super Mario. Take Marcus out of Oregon and that gimmicky offense and I have to wonder if he would thrive? Can he read pro defenses? Go through progressions? Did he even go through any progressions against Florida State? Have to be honest. I wouldn't touch this kid unless he somehow ended up in Philly. Then I'd be all over him.

 
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Rotoworld:

Jameis Winston - QB - Seminoles

Florida State redshirt sophomore QB Jameis Winston went 29-for-45 for 348 yards, one touchdown and an interception in Thursday's 59-20 loss in the National Semifinal to Oregon.

In his last college game, Winston finally lost his first game as a college starter. He committed two turnovers, including an unforced fumble when he was flushed from the pocket. Tony Washington returned that ball 58 yards for a score. At one point, FSU HC Jimbo Fisher appeared to threaten to bench Winston. It was a disappointing end to Winston's collegiate career, if this is indeed the end. Winston is a projected top five pick and is expected to declare for the draft in the coming days.

Jan 1 - 10:27 PM
Click to expand...
 
jurb26 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
This, none of us will ever know the truth behind those things so I stick to what I can see.
Click to expand...
How does seeing his coach threaten to bench him in a huge game affect your evaluation?
 
JetMaxx said:
jurb26 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
GoBirds said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
It's easy to tell who knows what they're looking at, and who doesn't reading this page.

The only way you can evaluate a college QB is to ignore surrounding cast, ignore competition, just look at the throws and pocket presence and project him. Ball placement is key, standing in and delivering the ball is also key. Certain throws look great in college, but they aren't difficult NFL throws. Mariota makes very few of those, Winston makes them look easy every game, but needs to be more careful over the middle.
Click to expand...
He also has the common sense of a brick and can't stay away from trouble....how does that project?
Click to expand...
Not relevant to any discussion I'm interested in. I'm talking about skill-set. I'll leave the off-field drama talk to those who are interested in it. If I was an NFL GM I'd care, but I'm not. I'm just talking prospects here, pure skill-sets
Click to expand...
This, none of us will ever know the truth behind those things so I stick to what I can see.
Click to expand...
How does seeing his coach threaten to bench him in a huge game affect your evaluation?
Click to expand...
They prefer to overlook any red flags, they aren't interested is discussing those.

 
SeniorVBDStudent said:
The jamarcus comparisons are unwarranted. Winston looks a lot like vince young by my eye.
Click to expand...
Vince Young averaged over 1000 yards rushing per year in college. In terms of the way they move and play the game, Winston looks a whole lot more like Jamarcus.

But Jamarcus never threw more than 8 INTs in college, so you're right, the comparison with Winston (18 INTs) doesn't quite fit.

 
CalBear said:
SeniorVBDStudent said:
The jamarcus comparisons are unwarranted. Winston looks a lot like vince young by my eye.
Click to expand...
Vince Young averaged over 1000 yards rushing per year in college. In terms of the way they move and play the game, Winston looks a whole lot more like Jamarcus.

But Jamarcus never threw more than 8 INTs in college, so you're right, the comparison with Winston (18 INTs) doesn't quite fit.
Click to expand...
Their last year in college:

Russell - 67.8%, 9.1 YPA, 28 TD, 8 INT, 142 yards rushing

Winston - 65.3%, 8.4 YPA, 25 TD, 18 INT, 67 yards rushing

 
Winston reminds me of Drew Bledsoe in many ways. Size, quick release, bit sidearm. "Apologies" for not being a racist as some of these other comps are.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
cstu said:
CalBear said:
SeniorVBDStudent said:
The jamarcus comparisons are unwarranted. Winston looks a lot like vince young by my eye.
Click to expand...
Vince Young averaged over 1000 yards rushing per year in college. In terms of the way they move and play the game, Winston looks a whole lot more like Jamarcus.

But Jamarcus never threw more than 8 INTs in college, so you're right, the comparison with Winston (18 INTs) doesn't quite fit.
Click to expand...
Their last year in college:

Russell - 67.8%, 9.1 YPA, 28 TD, 8 INT, 142 yards rushing

Winston - 65.3%, 8.4 YPA, 25 TD, 18 INT, 67 yards rushing
Click to expand...
All that matters is Winston won't likely be drafted by the Raiders so he already has that going for him. If he does go to Tampa for instance your also looking at some good weapons to start your career with.

 
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