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QB Jameis Winston, NO (3 Viewers)

Rain was very much a factor in the last meeting between NO and TB. It affected Brees since he didnt throw any TDs either.
This game is in a dome and projects to be a high scoring one?

48-41 vs the Cardinals on the road? Saints ARE going to score and the Buccs will have to keep up.
Thats my guess at least, hindsight will be 20/20, butt thats a good look now.

 
I'm going back and forth with him or Eli.  Manning scares me being it's a Thursday night game.  Also the game log reveals lot of QB's performing well against the Saints.  The only one who hasn't done well was Winston but I think the weather and game flow in that match were the main reasons in the disappointing performance.
If I were in your situation, I don't think I could live with myself if I started Eli in my championship and he had an "Eli game" (you know it's coming at some point). Jameis may not outscore him, but he's definitely the safer play.

 
I'm going back and forth with him or Eli.  Manning scares me being it's a Thursday night game.  Also the game log reveals lot of QB's performing well against the Saints.  The only one who hasn't done well was Winston but I think the weather and game flow in that match were the main reasons in the disappointing performance.
I just fixed my debate by releasing Eli. And this reasoning is why...

If I were in your situation, I don't think I could live with myself if I started Eli in my championship and he had an "Eli game" (you know it's coming at some point). Jameis may not outscore him, but he's definitely the safer play.

 
WheelsUp said:
48-41 vs the Cardinals on the road? Saints ARE going to score and the Buccs will have to keep up.
Thats my guess at least, hindsight will be 20/20, butt thats a good look now.
I am worried about 4 INTs in this scenario since Winston has not been sharp recently

 
I'll be starting Winston this week I think. Various factors contributed to the way the last NO game played out. 

Theres a high chance Brees hangs a decent total on the Buccs at home and Winston has to keep up. That's enough to like his ceiling for this for me. 

 
OK, bringing this thread back to more concrete matters, what do we think of him this week @NO? I'm torn between him and Mariota. Definitely don't think it will be the rock fight that last week's game was, but I also don't think it's the cakewalk everyone was waiting for all fall. 
Keep an eye on whether or not Dotson plays.  If he doesn't Winston is going to continue to get pressured from the right side of the line.  

I watched the NFL Network replay this morning.  It was pretty obvious Sunday night that Gosder Cherilus is no longer an NFL caliber right tackle.  Cherilus was getting demolished on just about every play in the second half.  Winston had no chance and Koetter did not make an adjustment in protection to help him.  He also completely whiffed a block on a perfectly called and executed screen play to Sims that may have scored if he'd blocked his man.  They benched him late in the game, but the other guy didn't fare any better.  Honestly don't even know who it was. 

On the 3rd and 18 play where Winston overthrew Evans they finally gave the tackle some help, but Winston threw it earlier than he needed to, likely because he'd been getting pummeled in under two seconds for most of the second half.  He should have known he'd have a little more time with the extra help on that side, but understandably got a little skittish. 

The interception at the half and the last play of the game?  Come on.  The fumble and the other interception were direct results of constant pressure.  Not making excuses.  Those are facts.  When Winston had time he carved them up, and even when he didn't he made several spectacular plays.  If you can't see that Winston is a special player you're an absolute bozo.

 
And I have no problem admitting the head butt was dumb.  Idiotic, even.  Winston plays with passion.  He often mixes it up with the defense on running plays.  He shouldn't, but I don't think you can coach that fire out of someone.  Would you rather have the guy who cares about his teammates or Jay Cutler? 

 
And I have no problem admitting the head butt was dumb.  Idiotic, even.  Winston plays with passion.  He often mixes it up with the defense on running plays.  He shouldn't, but I don't think you can coach that fire out of someone.  Would you rather have the guy who cares about his teammates or Jay Cutler? 
Neither.  

If "passion" = out-of-control behavior and poor decision making, I'll pass.  I'd prefer "accurate" to "passionate", in my QB.

 
I actually feel better about Winston this week now.  No way that game script bw these 2 teams play out that way again.  NO is going to put up pts and Tb is going to have to open it up to keep up in a super important game with playoff implications. 

Starting Winston with a fair level of confidence.  

 
Probably starting Winston. Thought about picking up Barkley but leaning toward the more known product. I hope NO explodes and TB has to throw to keep up.

 
Same boat Cousins or Winston..

N.o. gives up an avg of over 29 ppg @ home.

Bears have been tough on opposing QBs lately. Passing yards arent there.passing TDs arent there either..

But yet even after wetting the bed v. Carolina at home , the Redskins are -3pt favorites on the road? 46 o/u? What gives? 

And N.O. is -3@home 52.5pt o/u.

Cousins was tough to watch on monday.every snap was a nailbiter thinking the int or fumble was coming..where Winston showed a lot of guts and big play potential.two picks werent his fault. 

And no cold weather rain or snow to worry about in N.O.

Tough call

 
This thread slipped 7 pages deep.

He had the sweetest playoff schedule for a QB (NOs twice and Dallas, who was playing better) and he ended up with what?

4 TDs/6 TOs 708 passing yards and 36 rushing yards.
If that is what you do against NOs when your playoff hopes are on the line
You have a long way to go. He just cant stop turning over the ball with the season on the line.
He should not even be mentioned as a QB1 next year under anyone's breath.
Those of us who did start him in the playoffs should be embarrassed, and I am.

I did a complete 180 these last few week on who is better, I have to say Mariota should have a better career. Turnovers will force Winston out of being a starter in the league in time.

Look, he just threw another interception.

 
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He played well in the first NO game in Tampa.  It was pouring.

Did you watch the game against Dallas?  Cherilus was getting absolutely whipped on play after play.  Jameis had no time.

He didn't play well in the game in New Orleans.  The heave interception was awful. 

The blame can be placed in several areas, but ultimately it always falls on the quarterback.  I'll agree he didn't play well enough to get his team to the postseason.  I'm excited to see what the off-season and another year brings for him.  I think it would be silly to write him off as a high end QB in 2017 because your diabolical 2016 plan didn't work out. 

Mariota is hurt again.  Part of being a great QB is being available to play QB.

 
New Orleans D started playing a lot better too around mid year. Someone else pointed that out after the first NO game in the rain. 

I think Winston is locked into being a mid-QB1 for the next 5 years.  I think what we saw over the past few games is Winston's floor. I'm rolling with him as my starter next year and beyond.

 
From the various different dynasty rankings I've seen him ranked in the 5-8 range. Reading the last couple of pages of this thread you'd think he'd be QB20 or worse....other than from a few posters.

 
From the various different dynasty rankings I've seen him ranked in the 5-8 range. Reading the last couple of pages of this thread you'd think he'd be QB20 or worse....other than from a few posters.


There are some here who have an ego so massive that they just can't let it go when they are on the wrong side of an issue.  It's odd, because the more they post their nonsensical material in a desperate attempt to somehow save face they only make themselves look that much more of a fool. 

 
Why would you say this. I know the kid did a few dumb things in College but I think he has matured a lot and seems like he is going the right way with his life
Lod, the self-proclaimed QB scout said he would be out of the league before next year. 

I got grief from a few people for taking a victory lap and bumping all his stupid ### posts last fall, so you'll have to look them up yourself if so inclined. 

 
I'm also ready for this coming year watching you turnover machine continue handing the ball to the other team. He increased his TO suckage from 18 to 24 in year 2.

I'm ready to watch him commit more headbutts as well. Remember that? They guy is as dumb as a box of rocks. :lmao: He should be out of the league cause he sucks. Your team is stuck with the big smelly turd and they haven't figured out that they should cut him and try and find a real QB.

Victory lap? :lmao:  He sucks.

 
lod001 said:
I'm also ready for this coming year watching you turnover machine continue handing the ball to the other team. He increased his TO suckage from 18 to 24 in year 2.

I'm ready to watch him commit more headbutts as well. Remember that? They guy is as dumb as a box of rocks. :lmao: He should be out of the league cause he sucks. Your team is stuck with the big smelly turd and they haven't figured out that they should cut him and try and find a real QB.

Victory lap? :lmao:  He sucks.


Right on cue.  Thanks for the exclamation point.

 
The best part about all of this is how Jameis' numbers in his first two years compare to "the greatest QB prospect of all time," Andrew Luck.  They're practically identical and Jameis is better in several areas with what I would consider to be a much weaker supporting cast at the skill positions.  Yet, Jameis is somehow holding his team back and he's the only thing "standing in the way?"  You've got to be kidding me. 

From SI prior to Luck's 3rd season:

Indianapolis Colts quarterback Andrew Luck has been touted as a can't-miss prospect since he was the No. 1 overall pick in the 2012 NFL draft out of Stanford. He has since led his team to the playoffs in each of his first two seasons.  The case can be made that Luck, who graces this week’s regional cover of Sports Illustrated, is in the upper echelon of NFL signal callers.  But could Luck be the best quarterback in the NFL this soon?  Luck's numbers in his brief career don't jump out at the casual observer: 81.5 passer rating, 46 touchdowns, 27 interceptions and a 57 percent completion percentage. But what he does have is toughness, as evidenced by the 109 hits (including 32 sacks) he took last season and the flare for the dramatic inherent in his eight fourth-quarter comebacks.
Funny, Luck's numbers "don't jump out," but according to this article in 2014 after his first two years he may be the best QB in the NFL soon and is in the upper echelon of NFL signal callers.  Jameis threw for more TDs in his first two years (50), had a better passer rating (85.2), and had a better completion percentage (59.6), but the articles written about him are smeared with negativity and bias. 

 
Wow. First Desean Jackson and now O.J. Howard? Winston could be huge this year.


Djax and Howard now.  Great offseason for Winston owners.
I don't know how much of a factor OJ is going to be as a receiver, especially early in the season.  I think his biggest impact early is going to be in protection against the better pass rushers they face.  If the tackles stay healthy and show they can win in one on one pass protection then Howard will explode as a receiver.  Until then I think he'll be part of a double team most of the time with Evans, Jackson, Brate, and Humphries being the main targets in the passing game. 

The other huge factor for Winston and the Bucs is the depth they've created at those positions with the additions of Jackson, Howard, and the rookie Godwin.  Last year once the corpse of Vincent Jackson reared his ugly head they had basically nothing on the outside at WR after Evans.  Enter Jackson and Godwin.  When Brate went down late in the year the passing game was abysmal, and even with Brate when he was in the game the defense could stay in nickel as he isn't as adept as a run blocker.  When Stocker or Myers were in the game and Brate was out the defense could anticipate run and just double Evans.  Enter Howard. 

Tampa is going to run a ton of 2 TE sets this season, and I don't know how defenses are going to stop them. 

 
Looks like I blatantly plagiarized that Vincent Jackson corpse line.  Go figure.  Anyway, it was true.  He was pathetic.

 
Star or System Guy?

Whenever a quarterback starts his career with back-to-back 4,000-yard seasons, coaches and scout zero in on his game tape heading into Year 3. Evaluators want to dig into the film to see if the gunslinger has inflated numbers because he was "chasing points" or was the product of playing in a quarterback-friendly scheme that allowed him to generate production on layups and simple throws from the pocket. Having studied the All-22 Coaches Film on Winston myself, I can tell you that it's pretty obvious he is a transcendent talent with a set of skills that will make him one of the top passers in the game for the next decade.

Now, this certainly won't surprise evaluators who've seen the young quarterback carve up defenses since his days as a freshman starter at Florida State. He has always exhibited outstanding arm talent and impeccable timing as an anticipation thrower. But we all wondered if he would be able to avoid the turnovers that plagued his game as a collegian.

While he still throws too many picks (33 through his first two seasons), Winston has shown that he is a fearless anticipatory thrower capable of delivering darts into tight windows. He routinely connected with Mike Evans, Adam Humphries and Cameron Brate on hotly contested throws tossed at intermediate range. Without a deep threat to stretch the coverage last season or a legitimate running game to create one-on-one chances in the passing game, Winston was rarely able to string together completions on a handful of "gimme" throws outside of the numbers. Thus, he should earn a gold star for racking up spectacular production on challenging throws.

In 2017, that gold star could turn into another Pro Bowl honor, with DeSean Jackson and O.J. Howard coming on board to create more big-play opportunities. Winston will have a legitimate home run threat outside the numbers to target on go and post routes, as well as a dynamic "MOF" (middle of the field) threat to attack the voids between the hashes. With Evans, Humphries and Brate poised to shine in their assigned roles, Winston has a supporting cast in place that should allow him to reach his potential as an elite passer in this league.

 
Heard this the CBS podcast and thought it was interesting. This is a comp of Winston's 2nd year and Blake Bortles 2nd year

Winston  YPA: 7.2  TD% 4.9  Int% 3.2   QB Rating:86.1 Completion% 60.8 

Bortles   YPA: 7.3  TD% 5.8  Int% 3.0   QB Rating:88.2 Completion% 58.6 

Now these aren't perfect comparisons since Bortles was likely throwing into softer defensive coverage in garbage time where I think Winston was in more close games. However, there were similarities in having struggling run games, one big time WR and some questionable supporting targets (I know Hurns had a good year, but are we really sure he's actually all that good?). 

 
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Heard this the CBS podcast and thought it was interesting. This is a comp of Winston's 2nd year and Blake Bortles 2nd year

Winston  YPA: 7.2  TD% 4.9  Int% 3.2   QB Rating:86.1 Completion% 60.8 

Bortles   YPA: 7.3  TD% 5.8  Int% 3.0   QB Rating:88.2 Completion% 58.6 

Now these are the best comparisons since Bortles was likely throwing into softer defensive coverage in garbage time where I think Winston was in more close games. However, there were similarities in having struggling run games, one big time WR and some questionable supporting targets (I know Hurns had a good year, but are we really sure he's actually all that good?). 


This ought to get lod absolutely stoked.

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