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Scientists achieve reliable quantum teleportation for first time (1 Viewer)

F

FlapJacks

Footballguy
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Albert Einstein once told a friend that quantum mechanics doesn't hold water in his scientific world view because "physics should represent a reality in time and space, free from spooky actions at a distance." That spooky action at a distance is entanglement, a quantum phenomenon in which two particles, separated by any amount of distance, can instantaneously affect one another as if part of a unified system.

Now, scientists have successfully hijacked that quantum weirdness -- doing so reliably for the first time -- to produce what many sci-fi fans have long dreamt up: teleportation. No, not beaming humans aboard the USS Enterprise, but the teleportation of data.

Physicists at the Kavli Institute of Nanoscience, part of the Delft University of Technology in the Netherlands, report that they sent quantum data concerning the spin state of an electron to another electron about 10 feet away. The results can be replicated accurately 100 percent of the time, the team said.

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
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Woah. That is really impressive.

I don't like the idea that they are trying to prove Einstein wrong though. He spent his later years trying to make sense of this.

 
jamny said:
Woah. That is really impressive.

I don't like the idea that they are trying to prove Einstein wrong though. He spent his later years trying to make sense of this.
Click to expand...
I was going to give a smartass response but science has always been about the search for the truth. I dont think Albert would want to hold back scientific progress because it might prove him wrong.

 
Whatever, scientists. Maybe now you guys can get to work on producing something useful, like a beer mug that automatically refills itself.

 
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Entanglement, yo. This totally explains why, if you stick one twin with a fork, right? The other twin feels it, like, miles away.

Science, bitches!

 
Insein said:
jamny said:
Woah. That is really impressive.

I don't like the idea that they are trying to prove Einstein wrong though. He spent his later years trying to make sense of this.
Click to expand...
I was going to give a smartass response but science has always been about the search for the truth. I dont think Albert would want to hold back scientific progress because it might prove him wrong.
Click to expand...
I agree. That's not how I meant it. Einstein was trying to prove himself wrong too, that is what science is about. The article just came across as saying that was the primary goal and not to find answers. I guess that's how they look at it.

 
jamny said:
Insein said:
jamny said:
Woah. That is really impressive.

I don't like the idea that they are trying to prove Einstein wrong though. He spent his later years trying to make sense of this.
Click to expand...
I was going to give a smartass response but science has always been about the search for the truth. I dont think Albert would want to hold back scientific progress because it might prove him wrong.
Click to expand...
I agree. That's not how I meant it. Einstein was trying to prove himself wrong too, that is what science is about. The article just came across as saying that was the primary goal and not to find answers. I guess that's how they look at it.
Click to expand...
Ah gotcha.

 
Arsenal of Doom said:
Only a matter of time before this technique is able to provide instantaneous communication over interstellar distances IMO.
Click to expand...
Of all the things in the world that I understand at least a little quantum entanglement is easily the most mind blowing.

 
Maurile Tremblay said:
Whatever, scientists. Maybe now you guys can get to work on producing something useful, like a beer mug that automatically refills itself.
Click to expand...
Or a woman that knows when to shut up.

 
jamny said:
Insein said:
jamny said:
Woah. That is really impressive.

I don't like the idea that they are trying to prove Einstein wrong though. He spent his later years trying to make sense of this.
Click to expand...
I was going to give a smartass response but science has always been about the search for the truth. I dont think Albert would want to hold back scientific progress because it might prove him wrong.
Click to expand...
I agree. That's not how I meant it. Einstein was trying to prove himself wrong too, that is what science is about. The article just came across as saying that was the primary goal and not to find answers. I guess that's how they look at it.
Click to expand...
Actually no Einstein was trying to prove quantum physics wrong. He felt it was too much like playing dice with reality. And this kind of experiment does prove Einstein was wrong about facets of the theory at a minimum.

 
So no this doesn't provide space travel. But as mentioned it could be used for instantaneous communications over extremely long distances. Although at this point the communication would be very simplistic.

 
FlapJacks said:
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Is there any more on this? From what I've understood & read about entanglement, the instant communication part was not really possible due to the observer effect collapsing the waveform. How did they work around that, or are they using a non-classical approach?

 
Sarnoff said:
FlapJacks said:
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Is there any more on this? From what I've understood & read about entanglement, the instant communication part was not really possible due to the observer effect collapsing the waveform. How did they work around that, or are they using a non-classical approach?
Click to expand...
To do this, researchers at Delft first had to create qubits out of classical bits, in this case electrons trapped in diamonds at extremely low temperatures that allow their quantum properties, like spin, to be observed.
Click to expand...
 
The old sci fi movies with people hovered over giant crystal communication devices were made by time travellers imo.

 
NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
FlapJacks said:
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Is there any more on this? From what I've understood & read about entanglement, the instant communication part was not really possible due to the observer effect collapsing the waveform. How did they work around that, or are they using a non-classical approach?
Click to expand...
To do this, researchers at Delft first had to create qubits out of classical bits, in this case electrons trapped in diamonds at extremely low temperatures that allow their quantum properties, like spin, to be observed.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Yeah, I get that. But the details of how they're using it to transmit data are glossed over. There's a qubit, and it's in a superposition, and they they observe it to collapse the position and the other one takes the opposite stance instantly because of the laws of conservation. I get that, and the theories have been around for a while on that part. But I'm asking about the instantaneous data transmission part, which is the part that violates Einstein's causality.

 
Sarnoff said:
There's a qubit, and it's in a superposition, and they they observe it to collapse the position and the other one takes the opposite stance instantly because of the laws of conservation. I get that.
Click to expand...
OH BULL####

 
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Sarnoff said:
NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
FlapJacks said:
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Is there any more on this? From what I've understood & read about entanglement, the instant communication part was not really possible due to the observer effect collapsing the waveform. How did they work around that, or are they using a non-classical approach?
Click to expand...
To do this, researchers at Delft first had to create qubits out of classical bits, in this case electrons trapped in diamonds at extremely low temperatures that allow their quantum properties, like spin, to be observed.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Yeah, I get that. But the details of how they're using it to transmit data are glossed over. There's a qubit, and it's in a superposition, and they they observe it to collapse the position and the other one takes the opposite stance instantly because of the laws of conservation. I get that, and the theories have been around for a while on that part. But I'm asking about the instantaneous data transmission part, which is the part that violates Einstein's causality.
Click to expand...
Sorry misunderstood your question. I haven't read a story that gets into the nitty gritty but that's to be expected. No newspaper is going to that level. They do say in the Guardian:

The Danish researchers stored qubits in diamond “prisons” at a low temperature, according to a report at the Motherboard.com site. Then, the particles, two electrons and a nucleus, were “excited” using lasers. This process made the particles “entangled” with each other. After this, they put a spin upon the electrons in the qubits of data and teleported the data ten feet. The first qubit was destroyed, but the data was reportedly “consumed” at the other end of the ten feet, and the data was successfully teleported in this manner.
Click to expand...
Don't think that is a complete answer either.

 
Reading more I think it's more likely the author of the piece was taking liberty and not fully understanding what he was reporting.

 
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Sarnoff said:
Reading more I think it's more likely the author of the piece was taking liberty and not fully understanding what he was reporting.
Click to expand...
And that is often a problem. Newspapers gutted their hard science reporting and now act like any ninny can handle it.

 
NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
Reading more I think it's more likely the author of the piece was taking liberty and not fully understanding what he was reporting.
Click to expand...
And that is often a problem. Newspapers gutted their hard science reporting and now act like any ninny can handle it.
Click to expand...
Can't wait for the Yahoo news people to get a hold of this. Story might feature a picture of Sheldon Cooper pointing at a chalkboard.

 
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NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
FlapJacks said:
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Is there any more on this? From what I've understood & read about entanglement, the instant communication part was not really possible due to the observer effect collapsing the waveform. How did they work around that, or are they using a non-classical approach?
Click to expand...
To do this, researchers at Delft first had to create qubits out of classical bits, in this case electrons trapped in diamonds at extremely low temperatures that allow their quantum properties, like spin, to be observed.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Yeah, I get that. But the details of how they're using it to transmit data are glossed over. There's a qubit, and it's in a superposition, and they they observe it to collapse the position and the other one takes the opposite stance instantly because of the laws of conservation. I get that, and the theories have been around for a while on that part. But I'm asking about the instantaneous data transmission part, which is the part that violates Einstein's causality.
Click to expand...
Sorry misunderstood your question. I haven't read a story that gets into the nitty gritty but that's to be expected. No newspaper is going to that level. They do say in the Guardian:

The Danish researchers stored qubits in diamond “prisons” at a low temperature, according to a report at the Motherboard.com site. Then, the particles, two electrons and a nucleus, were “excited” using lasers. This process made the particles “entangled” with each other. After this, they put a spin upon the electrons in the qubits of data and teleported the data ten feet. The first qubit was destroyed, but the data was reportedly “consumed” at the other end of the ten feet, and the data was successfully teleported in this manner.
Click to expand...
Don't think that is a complete answer either.
Click to expand...
Right. I mean, when you create this pair, one's going to be spinning one way (call it positive), and one's going to be going in the opposite way (negative), (by the law of conservation of energy) but you don't know which is which yet. Say then they fly away from each other at the speed of light. You keep one trapped on Earth and send the other to Mars, where it's trapped too. Now, a radio transmission from Earth to Mars takes a few minutes because light only goes so fast, so you'd think that's the speed limit of data transmission.

But say you take the one on Earth, which is either positive or negative, and flip it's state from one to the other by some process that does not need to know the starting state. That is, it makes positives negative, and negatives positive, without measuring them first. A pure reversal method of some sort. Then, you observe it, which forces the collapse of the superposition, into definitely either positive or negative. Say, it's positive. Now, you know it's positive now, which means it was negative before. Which means the one on Mars was positive. But, when the observer on Mars looks, it's actually negative, because the reversal method on Earth affected the superposition of both, instantly, faster than light could go from one to the other.

That's the basic entanglement paradox. But that can't be used to convey information faster than light. The theory would be to call positive "1" and negative "0" and keep reversing the qubit on Earth from 1 to 0 and back again to send data to Mars, expecting the one on Mars to flip from 0 to 1 in the opposite sequence and allowing some sort of instantaneous communication. But that breaks down because observing the first time collapses the superposition, breaking the qubit, so you can only use it for one reversal. And since you don't know if it was positive or negative before the observation, there's no way to use it to communicate any useful data. At least, that's the classical thought experiment which leads to the No-Communication Theorem.

I was curious if they were using some novel method which works around the limits of the thought experiment and would prove Einstein's causality and the No-Communication Theorem wrong, which is what the author implied, but, it's more likely to me that the author is intending to report that this is the first time researchers have accomplished the first part of the thought experiment in the real world, which is still useful for sub-light-speed communications on its own.

 
Sarnoff said:
NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
NCCommish said:
Sarnoff said:
FlapJacks said:
http://www.cnet.com/news/scientists-achieve-reliable-quantum-teleportation-for-the-first-time/

Thanks to the strange properties of entanglement, this allows for that data -- only quantum data, not classical information like messages or even simple bits -- to be teleported seemingly faster than the speed of light.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Is there any more on this? From what I've understood & read about entanglement, the instant communication part was not really possible due to the observer effect collapsing the waveform. How did they work around that, or are they using a non-classical approach?
Click to expand...
To do this, researchers at Delft first had to create qubits out of classical bits, in this case electrons trapped in diamonds at extremely low temperatures that allow their quantum properties, like spin, to be observed.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Yeah, I get that. But the details of how they're using it to transmit data are glossed over. There's a qubit, and it's in a superposition, and they they observe it to collapse the position and the other one takes the opposite stance instantly because of the laws of conservation. I get that, and the theories have been around for a while on that part. But I'm asking about the instantaneous data transmission part, which is the part that violates Einstein's causality.
Click to expand...
Sorry misunderstood your question. I haven't read a story that gets into the nitty gritty but that's to be expected. No newspaper is going to that level. They do say in the Guardian:

The Danish researchers stored qubits in diamond “prisons” at a low temperature, according to a report at the Motherboard.com site. Then, the particles, two electrons and a nucleus, were “excited” using lasers. This process made the particles “entangled” with each other. After this, they put a spin upon the electrons in the qubits of data and teleported the data ten feet. The first qubit was destroyed, but the data was reportedly “consumed” at the other end of the ten feet, and the data was successfully teleported in this manner.
Click to expand...
Don't think that is a complete answer either.
Click to expand...
Right. I mean, when you create this pair, one's going to be spinning one way (call it positive), and one's going to be going in the opposite way (negative), (by the law of conservation of energy) but you don't know which is which yet. Say then they fly away from each other at the speed of light. You keep one trapped on Earth and send the other to Mars, where it's trapped too. Now, a radio transmission from Earth to Mars takes a few minutes because light only goes so fast, so you'd think that's the speed limit of data transmission.

But say you take the one on Earth, which is either positive or negative, and flip it's state from one to the other by some process that does not need to know the starting state. That is, it makes positives negative, and negatives positive, without measuring them first. A pure reversal method of some sort. Then, you observe it, which forces the collapse of the superposition, into definitely either positive or negative. Say, it's positive. Now, you know it's positive now, which means it was negative before. Which means the one on Mars was positive. But, when the observer on Mars looks, it's actually negative, because the reversal method on Earth affected the superposition of both, instantly, faster than light could go from one to the other.

That's the basic entanglement paradox. But that can't be used to convey information faster than light. The theory would be to call positive "1" and negative "0" and keep reversing the qubit on Earth from 1 to 0 and back again to send data to Mars, expecting the one on Mars to flip from 0 to 1 in the opposite sequence and allowing some sort of instantaneous communication. But that breaks down because observing the first time collapses the superposition, breaking the qubit, so you can only use it for one reversal. And since you don't know if it was positive or negative before the observation, there's no way to use it to communicate any useful data. At least, that's the classical thought experiment which leads to the No-Communication Theorem.

I was curious if they were using some novel method which works around the limits of the thought experiment and would prove Einstein's causality and the No-Communication Theorem wrong, which is what the author implied, but, it's more likely to me that the author is intending to report that this is the first time researchers have accomplished the first part of the thought experiment in the real world, which is still useful for sub-light-speed communications on its own.
Click to expand...
You may have a point. But I would want to read the actual work to be sure. Haven't even seen an abstract yet.

 
NCCommish said:
jamny said:
Insein said:
jamny said:
Woah. That is really impressive.

I don't like the idea that they are trying to prove Einstein wrong though. He spent his later years trying to make sense of this.
Click to expand...
I was going to give a smartass response but science has always been about the search for the truth. I dont think Albert would want to hold back scientific progress because it might prove him wrong.
Click to expand...
I agree. That's not how I meant it. Einstein was trying to prove himself wrong too, that is what science is about. The article just came across as saying that was the primary goal and not to find answers. I guess that's how they look at it.
Click to expand...
Actually no Einstein was trying to prove quantum physics wrong. He felt it was too much like playing dice with reality. And this kind of experiment does prove Einstein was wrong about facets of the theory at a minimum.
Click to expand...
Not exactly, he was trying to unify the two. He just felt that quantum theory was an emergent theory that held a deeper truth. He may never be truly proven wrong. The God/dice quote is way overplayed. He had a lot more respect for QM than that line implies.

 
joffer said:
"If you think you understand quantum physics, you don't understand quantum physics"
Click to expand...
Of all the subjects in the world, this is the one I am most interested in learning about but am probably least qualified to learn about.

It is both fascinating and frustrating. It would be like me trying to play a song by reading music, which I haven't learned anything about since grade school. I can understand some concepts, but the whole of it is lost on me and very incomplete.

 
Even if the no communication problem were not solvable, there are plenty of possible applications. Think of data security.

Step 1: You and I have two pairs of unknown bits that are either 1 or 0. Right now, unbeknownst to either of us, it looks like:

100101010

011010101

Step 2: I change the spin. I can now observe the state on both sides of the communication, and it looks exactly like before, but backwards:

011010101

100101010

Step 3: I want to securely send you a transmission that includes data - we'll call it 101010101. So I run it through the alogirithm created by the bits:

100101010 <-- these are the bits that only you and i have

0011111111 <-- this is the code

101010101 <-- this is the actual message

The encoding is simple - if it's a 0, then keep the original bit as is. If it's a 1, then change it.

Now when I transmit 001111111, only you and I have the data necessary to translate it. Instead of using very large prime numbers, I have a literally uncrackable code.

 
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I consider myself a pretty decent guy with basic physics knowledge, but this stuff gives my brain a charlie horse.

 
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