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I wonder if he's just really trying to motivate his men?

It really doesn't mean much. He could flat out be talking about all the camp bodies, trying to get one of them to step up. He's just including 'everyone' so that Crowell doesn't read it as 'it's my job'. You never want to tell a guy he's untouchable. THAT is when he starts coasting.

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The Ravens that had a murderer for his entire tenure? 

totally coulda got him at 5.01, noob

God, I forgot how much of a ####-measuring contest the Shark Pool can be.  Thanks for reminding me, guys.  See you in another year.

Totally.

Any negative stuff we read about Crowell is clearly a ploy by the savvy Browns coaching staff to motivate the only RB that matters to the team.

Meantime, all negative stuff we read about Terrence West was totally, completely true.

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don't own anyone in this situation but watching it closely as a gem could emerge. I liked what Crowell brought last year and think he's better than West but I don't see how a RB coach having to motivate a player or saying that he came in out of shape isn't something to be concerned about. He's right that you want to have a guy come into camp in great shape, practice strong and do the things they expect.

This isn't new though..much of this was said last year which led to the merry go round rotation of these backs. They (West/Crowell) were rookies but they should know the drill and know what the expectations are...the fact that they again need to be reminded publicly of what they need to do is a red flag to me and will make me look at Duke a little harder because while he's not currently healthy he's new and may "get it" while West/Crowell clearly don't.

Edited by Banger
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Just to review:

Crow showed nothing in last years camp until it was time to gas up the slam sedan(final preseason game) where he showed up.

There's a bumper sticker on the Slam Sedan, it says "there'll be no wine before its time"

In case you forgot what the wine tastes like...

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-miss-plays/0ap3000000432749/Wk-12-Can-t-Miss-Play-Can-t-touch-Crowell

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The out of shape comments were no doubt directed at Johnson & West, who've been injured virtually all of camp. There was a report out earlier that said they were growing frustrated with Johnson not getting back on the field sooner. Montgomery directly alluded to RBs needing to come to training camp in shape & be able to heal from minor injuries quickly. The comments regarding Crowell were about him showing the coach he wants the job, doing the little things, etc. The only negative I've heard on his play in camp is having trouble with a couple handoffs from McCown on the first day of camp.

I think Johnson could be their 3rd down back if he can pass protect & shows well, but he's not a feature back type. West is just a guy at this point. The starter's job seems to be Crowell's to lose. With his talent & that OL, there's enormous upside.

Edited by Football Jones
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Crowell: "I feel like I have what it takes to be the starting back." Says he's going to keep working hard.

Waldman's "best RB talent of 2014 rookie class" is gonna make some people who sleep on him very, very upset.

Edited by Soulfly3
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The out of shape comments were no doubt directed at Johnson & West, who've been injured virtually all of camp. There was a report out earlier that said they were growing frustrated with Johnson not getting back on the field sooner. Montgomery directly alluded to RBs needing to come to training camp in shape & be able to heal from minor injuries quickly. The comments regarding Crowell were about him showing the coach he wants the job, doing the little things, etc. The only negative I've heard on his play in camp is having trouble with a couple handoffs from McCown on the first day of camp.

I think Johnson could be their 3rd down back if he can pass protect & shows well, but he's not a feature back type. West is just a guy at this point. The starter's job seems to be Crowell's to lose. With his talent & that OL, there's enormous upside.

I don't know what you're talking about here with Duke. All the reports I've read and heard are that they love him, have big plans for him and feel no need to rush him back. They want to make sure he's really to go.
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The out of shape comments were no doubt directed at Johnson & West, who've been injured virtually all of camp. There was a report out earlier that said they were growing frustrated with Johnson not getting back on the field sooner. Montgomery directly alluded to RBs needing to come to training camp in shape & be able to heal from minor injuries quickly. The comments regarding Crowell were about him showing the coach he wants the job, doing the little things, etc. The only negative I've heard on his play in camp is having trouble with a couple handoffs from McCown on the first day of camp.

I think Johnson could be their 3rd down back if he can pass protect & shows well, but he's not a feature back type. West is just a guy at this point. The starter's job seems to be Crowell's to lose. With his talent & that OL, there's enormous upside.

I don't know what you're talking about here with Duke. All the reports I've read and heard are that they love him, have big plans for him and feel no need to rush him back. They want to make sure he's really to go.

Maybe so but he's a rookie missing out on incredibly valuable practice reps. He may be a better runner (maybe) and a more natural receiver but being behind the 8-ball on pass protection is a good way to prevent him seeing the field early.

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The out of shape comments were no doubt directed at Johnson & West, who've been injured virtually all of camp. There was a report out earlier that said they were growing frustrated with Johnson not getting back on the field sooner. Montgomery directly alluded to RBs needing to come to training camp in shape & be able to heal from minor injuries quickly. The comments regarding Crowell were about him showing the coach he wants the job, doing the little things, etc. The only negative I've heard on his play in camp is having trouble with a couple handoffs from McCown on the first day of camp.

I think Johnson could be their 3rd down back if he can pass protect & shows well, but he's not a feature back type. West is just a guy at this point. The starter's job seems to be Crowell's to lose. With his talent & that OL, there's enormous upside.

I don't know what you're talking about here with Duke. All the reports I've read and heard are that they love him, have big plans for him and feel no need to rush him back. They want to make sure he's really to go.

Maybe so but he's a rookie missing out on incredibly valuable practice reps. He may be a better runner (maybe) and a more natural receiver but being behind the 8-ball on pass protection is a good way to prevent him seeing the field early.
Of course it would be better if he was there and not injured. I don't know how that can be twisted into them being disappointed in him and that he is out of shape, though. I've heard nothing of the sort.
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The out of shape comments were no doubt directed at Johnson & West, who've been injured virtually all of camp. There was a report out earlier that said they were growing frustrated with Johnson not getting back on the field sooner. Montgomery directly alluded to RBs needing to come to training camp in shape & be able to heal from minor injuries quickly. The comments regarding Crowell were about him showing the coach he wants the job, doing the little things, etc. The only negative I've heard on his play in camp is having trouble with a couple handoffs from McCown on the first day of camp.

I think Johnson could be their 3rd down back if he can pass protect & shows well, but he's not a feature back type. West is just a guy at this point. The starter's job seems to be Crowell's to lose. With his talent & that OL, there's enormous upside.

I don't know what you're talking about here with Duke. All the reports I've read and heard are that they love him, have big plans for him and feel no need to rush him back. They want to make sure he's really to go.

mmm, no

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The out of shape comments were no doubt directed at Johnson & West, who've been injured virtually all of camp. There was a report out earlier that said they were growing frustrated with Johnson not getting back on the field sooner. Montgomery directly alluded to RBs needing to come to training camp in shape & be able to heal from minor injuries quickly. The comments regarding Crowell were about him showing the coach he wants the job, doing the little things, etc. The only negative I've heard on his play in camp is having trouble with a couple handoffs from McCown on the first day of camp.

I think Johnson could be their 3rd down back if he can pass protect & shows well, but he's not a feature back type. West is just a guy at this point. The starter's job seems to be Crowell's to lose. With his talent & that OL, there's enormous upside.

I don't know what you're talking about here with Duke. All the reports I've read and heard are that they love him, have big plans for him and feel no need to rush him back. They want to make sure he's really to go.

mmm, no

Yup.

Rotoworld:

ESPN's Adam Caplan says the Browns are just "being very conservative" with Duke Johnson (hamstring).

"I wouldn't overreact if you have a fantasy draft coming up," wrote Caplan. Johnson has been sidelined for about 10 days now and won't play in the preseason opener, but the Browns still have big plans for him. Isaiah Crowell and Terrance West have been called out publicly for poor play through the first couple weeks of camp.

Source: Adam Caplan on Twitter

Aug 10 - 12:39 PM

I was watching coverage on the Browns on the NFL network and Albert Breer reported that the Browns are quite excited about Duke Johnson, and they have big plans for him in their offense for 2015. They are likely to give him another week off to rest his hamstring as they don't want to rush him back.

Rotoworld:

Speaking Tuesday, Browns coach Mike Pettine called third-round RB Duke Johnson's (hamstring) continued absence "disappointing."

"It’s just disappointing that a guy we’re counting on being a big part of what we do, to lose him at this formative time," Pettine said. "He’ll have a lot of catch-up work to do. There’s no substitute for getting live reps." Pettine doesn't appear to be criticizing his rookie, but simply stating the obvious. It's unclear how long Johnson, who is ticketed for third-down duties, might be sidelined. He got injured on Sunday. NFL Network's Albert Breer did suggest Tuesday that Johnson could miss a "couple more weeks."

Source: ESPN Cleveland

Aug 4 - 2:37 PM

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"...ticketed for third down duties..." + not getting reps = bad.

So you chose to focus on the writers speculation portion of the post rather than the direct quote for the coach? Interesting but not surprising I suppose.

"Its just disappointing that a guy were counting on being a big part of what we do, to lose him at this formative time,"

Edited by jurb26
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"...ticketed for third down duties..." + not getting reps = bad.

So you chose to focus on the writers speculation portion of the post rather than the direct quote for the coach? Interesting but not surprising I suppose.

"Its just disappointing that a guy were counting on being a big part of what we do, to lose him at this formative time,"

I think you are reading a lot into "...a big part of what we do..."

And him being absent for 10 days is not speculation.

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"...ticketed for third down duties..." + not getting reps = bad.

So you chose to focus on the writers speculation portion of the post rather than the direct quote for the coach? Interesting but not surprising I suppose.

"Its just disappointing that a guy were counting on being a big part of what we do, to lose him at this formative time,"

I think you are reading a lot into "...a big part of what we do..."

And him being absent for 10 days is not speculation.

:lmao: right, because that's the portion I was referring too.
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Does anyone know how this plays out??? Crowell looked pretty good last year. I was surprised they drafted Duke so high. Cleveland must not be convinced right? How do we accurately value these guys right now?

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Does anyone know how this plays out??? Crowell looked pretty good last year. I was surprised they drafted Duke so high. Cleveland must not be convinced right? How do we accurately value these guys right now?

Take a hat and on little slips of paper write the names Crowell, West, Johnson, Rice, Earnest Byner, etc. Put the slips of paper in the hat and randomly draw out the names. Repeat every week of the season.

This is the same process the Browns use...

Edited by Godsbrother
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Does anyone know how this plays out??? Crowell looked pretty good last year. I was surprised they drafted Duke so high. Cleveland must not be convinced right? How do we accurately value these guys right now?

Take a hat and on little slips of paper write the names Crowell, West, Johnson, Rice, Earnest Byner, etc. Put the slips of paper in the hat and randomly draw out the names. Repeat every week of the season.

This is the same process the Browns use...

If that's true, then you can only draft anyone of these guys as a flier/FLEX play, in my opinion.

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West = In the coaches doghouse all last year, showed up this year a little chubby and back in the doghouse again.

Crowell = Runs like a beast on fire, but tends to put the ball on the ground once in a while.

Duke = They have specific plays in the playbook with him in mind as a pass catcher. Tweaking his hammy has them a bit ticked. He was penciled in a 3rd down role at least when he was drafted and now they have to rethink that. If he can't prove he can pass block his playing time might be severely limited. He can't prove that riding a stationary bike.

I give Crowell the edge but I'm betting someone shares the load. That could be West if Duke takes longer to heal or West could be cut altogether if he keeps ticking off the coach. West has skill but his work ethic isn't the best.

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Does anyone know how this plays out??? Crowell looked pretty good last year. I was surprised they drafted Duke so high. Cleveland must not be convinced right? How do we accurately value these guys right now?

Take a hat and on little slips of paper write the names Crowell, West, Johnson, Rice, Earnest Byner, etc. Put the slips of paper in the hat and randomly draw out the names. Repeat every week of the season.

This is the same process the Browns use...

Hey, I just drew Jim Brown. He's probably good for a few more yards.

Edited by purestrength
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Does anyone know how this plays out??? Crowell looked pretty good last year. I was surprised they drafted Duke so high. Cleveland must not be convinced right? How do we accurately value these guys right now?

Take a hat and on little slips of paper write the names Crowell, West, Johnson, Rice, Earnest Byner, etc. Put the slips of paper in the hat and randomly draw out the names. Repeat every week of the season.

This is the same process the Browns use...

Hey, I just drew Jim Brown. He's probably good for a few more yards.

I got Tommy Vardell :kicksrock:

On a serious note. I was reading this report from last night's game:

3) Jury still out on the running game

Johnny Manzielicon-article-link.gif finished as the Browns’ leading rusher with 14 yards. Isaiah Crowellicon-article-link.giffinished with four carries for 6 yards and a 6-yard reception. Terrance Westicon-article-link.gif had four carries for 10 yards and two receptions for 6 yards.

Some variables to consider: Members of the first-team offensive line didn’t play all that much after the first series. The Browns were also without both of their fullbacks because of injuries.

“It is a long preseason,” Pettine said. “Obviously, Terrance coming off the injury and Crow probably having too heavy a load at practice, I am not going to hit the panic button after the first preseason game about our run game. We will be fine.”

Doesn't sound like much clarity from the first preseason game...

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Rotoworld:

Isaiah Crowell managed 14 yards on five carries in the Browns' second preseason game Thursday night.

Crowell played behind Terrance West in this one. Duke Johnson (hamstring) will be back for Cleveland's regular season dress rehearsal. Crowell busted a stiff-arming 13-yard run late in the second quarter, showing burst and power. Unfortunately, he managed one combined yard on his other four rushing attempts. Through two preseason contests, Crowell has just 20 yards on nine carries. With neither Crowell nor West running away with the job, the door is open for Johnson to take control of Cleveland's backfield once he gets up to speed physically.

Aug 20 - 10:12 PM

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I have my draft in the morning and am going to target and get Duke Johnson. West and Crowell have done nothing. And the team isn't happy with them. The writing is screaming on the wall. They will give Dule every opportunity and they have a good line. Could be home run late. Really like the potential upside for the risk.

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I have my draft in the morning and am going to target and get Duke Johnson. West and Crowell have done nothing. And the team isn't happy with them. The writing is screaming on the wall. They will give Dule every opportunity and they have a good line. Could be home run late. Really like the potential upside for the risk.

All depends where you have to take him. I have a funny feeling all these backs are going to be good enough to roster but bad enough to never start.

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I have my draft in the morning and am going to target and get Duke Johnson. West and Crowell have done nothing. And the team isn't happy with them. The writing is screaming on the wall. They will give Dule every opportunity and they have a good line. Could be home run late. Really like the potential upside for the risk.

All depends where you have to take him. I have a funny feeling all these backs are going to be good enough to roster but bad enough to never start.

This situation is going to be a complete PIA! I got Crowell in the 6th in some earlier drafts and now in regretting it. In a ten team league howpfully I can avoid the whole mess...

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Sadly this is looking more and more like an avoid situation across the board.

This Crowell owner agrees.

Duke Johnson doesn't have the size/power to sustain a fulltime gig on this team. Period. As bad as the passing game is going to be, D's are going to be able to stack the box. He will meet the same fate.

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Sadly this is looking more and more like an avoid situation across the board.

This Crowell owner agrees.

Duke Johnson doesn't have the size/power to sustain a fulltime gig on this team. Period. As bad as the passing game is going to be, D's are going to be able to stack the box. He will meet the same fate.

Disagree. Duke can catch. Dump offs galore.

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On Browns Daily radio they said so-far in the preseason Isaiah Crowell has more yards after contact 2.0 yards AFTER CONTACT than any other RB in the league and the host said the next person wasn't close.

So he has been running hard but the line hasn't blown open holes. Add rookie RB Duke Johnson's hamstring is healthy so he might cloud the picture but Crow is running hard and the line should start playing better.

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On Browns Daily radio they said so-far in the preseason Isaiah Crowell has more yards after contact 2.0 yards AFTER CONTACT than any other RB in the league and the host said the next person wasn't close.

So he has been running hard but the line hasn't blown open holes. Add rookie RB Duke Johnson's hamstring is healthy so he might cloud the picture but Crow is running hard and the line should start playing better.

Thanks for this.

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Took him in the 7th of my 12 team keeper league as my RB3. Danny Woodhead, Tevin Coleman and Devanta Freeman went in the same round.

I think Duke's durability concerns are real after as he exited their 3rd preseason game with a concussion. I'm assuming he'll be a go for the start of the regular season but you really have to wonder if he'll be able to stay on the field this season.

I largely feel the same about Crow as I did going into the preseason; he's a talented back running behind a top tier OL. All the factors lowering his floor are still there but I still see RB2 upside if he can get out ahead early. Honestly, he's their best bet to actually score TDs this season. It still boggles my mind how they went into the season with Bowe/Hartline are their top two receiving threats.

I'd really like to see Crow get somewhere between 225-250 touches this year. Something like 220/900/10 seems feasible which would have made him a low-end RB2 last year.

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Crow is great value where he's going. A year of experience and the type of presence that could run away with it. If Duke emerges, so be it, but for a 9th/10th round guy hes the kind of shot I like to take

I gambled on him a bit earlier at 8.10, but then my draft strategy had me swinging for fences on rb prospects since I went wr rounds 1-3 in my 12 team ppr redraft.

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Crow seems to be a decent value now from what I've seen in drafts. Duke went ahead of him in both of the drafts I did this weekend, by about 3 rounds IIRC. Duke is now on the mend... Again.

Edited by jurb26
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Crow seems to be a decent value now from what I've seen in drafts. Duke went ahead of him in both of the drafts I did this weekend, by about 3 rounds IIRC. Duke is now on the mend... Again.

Mine too. My 12 team PPR draft this past Sat Duke went at 5.09. Crow 8.10.

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Rotoworld:

Browns coach Mike Pettine said Isaiah Crowell has the edge over Terrance West for the starting running back job.

Neither player has had a particularly exciting preseason, but Crowell is the more talented runner with the higher ceiling. Both players should get carries against the Jets Week 1, and Duke Johnson (concussion) will be in the mix as well once he returns. This backfield will once again be difficult to project week to week.

Source: Mary Kay Cabot on Twitter

Sep 3 - 11:01 PM

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