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RB Damien Wiliams, CHI - 10/3/21 - Quad Issue


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5 hours ago, BigSteelThrill said:

I looked at those last two playoff runs... he was at 3.9 a carry.  He does have 10 TDs.

He has been good and usable, but the Helaire talent is huge and will push Williams to an afterthought by the end of the year.

Looks like 4.4 yard per carry over the last 2 playoffs with KC. 

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Obviously he has the trust of the coaching staff and will still be used.  However, he is not the talent of CEH and gains a lot of his stats because of the position he is put in and the other weapons on the team.  This is why CEH has skyrocketed up draft boards because people see a more talented player getting the benefit of the system around him.  That is not to say that the Chiefs will just through Williams to the curb (yet). 

 

Williams will have value and is a bargain in drafts right now.  He will still be used until he gets injured which may be when CEH begins to take over.  For redrafts, I would much rather get Williams at his price than CEH at his and that is the value here.  The Chiefs like Williams and trust him and that will go a long way at the beginning of the season to seeing the field. 

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1 hour ago, Gally said:

Obviously he has the trust of the coaching staff and will still be used.  However, he is not the talent of CEH and gains a lot of his stats because of the position he is put in and the other weapons on the team.  This is why CEH has skyrocketed up draft boards because people see a more talented player getting the benefit of the system around him.  That is not to say that the Chiefs will just through Williams to the curb (yet). 

Are we 100% certain that CEH isn't also a product of a system? In 2018, he had less carries and receptions than Nick Brosette and wasn't anything remotely close to a star player. The 2019 LSU offense breaks nearly every college record possible and CEH shined but so did everyone. Burrow had 65 TDs, Jefferson had 1500/18, Chase had 1700/20, Marshall had 600/13 and Moss had 500/4. These are video game numbers and I don't think it's easy to parse out who/what was driving this production and who was along for the ride. I think it's a very bold stance to assume Damien is the inferior talent to CEH. 

1 hour ago, Gally said:

 

Williams will have value and is a bargain in drafts right now.  He will still be used until he gets injured which may be when CEH begins to take over.  For redrafts, I would much rather get Williams at his price than CEH at his and that is the value here.  The Chiefs like Williams and trust him and that will go a long way at the beginning of the season to seeing the field. 

Agree here 100%

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3 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Are we 100% certain that CEH isn't also a product of a system? In 2018, he had less carries and receptions than Nick Brosette and wasn't anything remotely close to a star player. The 2019 LSU offense breaks nearly every college record possible and CEH shined but so did everyone. Burrow had 65 TDs, Jefferson had 1500/18, Chase had 1700/20, Marshall had 600/13 and Moss had 500/4. These are video game numbers and I don't think it's easy to parse out who/what was driving this production and who was along for the ride. I think it's a very bold stance to assume Damien is the inferior talent to CEH. 

My comments were in regard to Williams and that he isn't going to be tossed aside.  I was also stating that many people see CEH has much more talented (I am one of those guys) which is why he moved up on draft boards.  CEH could be a product of a system but if so he has shown he can succeed in that type of system.  He has the tools and should be put in a position to maximize his ability to succeed.  It is yet to be seen if he will actually take advantage of that opportunity. 

 

I think Williams is the better redraft value but I also have CEH at the top of my dynasty board.  I was a believer in his talent before the landing spot.  The landing spot has just made it virtually impossible for me to get him now since I am at the back end of the first in my drafts. 

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4 minutes ago, Gally said:

My comments were in regard to Williams and that he isn't going to be tossed aside.  I was also stating that many people see CEH has much more talented (I am one of those guys) which is why he moved up on draft boards.  CEH could be a product of a system but if so he has shown he can succeed in that type of system.  He has the tools and should be put in a position to maximize his ability to succeed.  It is yet to be seen if he will actually take advantage of that opportunity. 

 

I think Williams is the better redraft value but I also have CEH at the top of my dynasty board.  I was a believer in his talent before the landing spot.  The landing spot has just made it virtually impossible for me to get him now since I am at the back end of the first in my drafts. 

Yeah, I agree with what you said about value and early usage this year. I am just challenging the assumed notion everyone is making that CEH is for sure more talented than Williams. 

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27 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Yeah, I agree with what you said about value and early usage this year. I am just challenging the assumed notion everyone is making that CEH is for sure more talented than Williams. 

I believe so but I thought that before his landing spot. 

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1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

Yeah, I agree with what you said about value and early usage this year. I am just challenging the assumed notion everyone is making that CEH is for sure more talented than Williams. 

I don't even care if he's more talented.  I'll just concede the point that he is.

Doesn't matter.  Williams has thrived in this offense (he just can't stay healthy for 16 games).  He knows the offense.  He breaks big plays.  He moves the chains.  He pass protects well.  He catches the ball out of the backfield well.  They won a superbowl with him as their starter.  He does everything you want.  It makes zero sense to toss an asset like that on the bench for the entire game. 

 

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

 

Quote

Chiefs RB Damien Williams opted out of the 2020 NFL season.

Chiefs GM Brett Veach supports Williams' decision, one that was difficult to make but is in the best interest of himself and his family. Williams will be set to rejoin the NFL in 2021. For fantasy football purposes, it's the biggest player to opt of the season. Williams was a reasonable mid-round selection and hedge to rookie Clyde Edwards-Helaire, who now should be a first-round pick in fantasy drafts. Edwards-Helaire was previously being selected in the late second round.

RELATED: 

Clyde Edwards-Helaire

SOURCE: Chiefs on Twitter

Jul 29, 2020, 4:47 PM ET

 

 

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2 minutes ago, JoeSteeler said:

Does he have an underlying medical condition?

 

There was no specific reason cited on his decision to opt-out as far as I can tell:

Quote

Kansas City Chiefs @Chiefs

"As an organization, we certainly understand and respect Damien’s choice, knowing it was made in the best interest of his family. He means a lot to our football team as a player and a person, and we’re going to miss having him around this season.”

 

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1 hour ago, Dr. Octopus said:

Wasn't he a healthy scratch by year's end and now even a year older?

Yes and even in pressure packed playoff games they went with a late round rookie over him in Darwin.

Put me down as a no on KC bringing anyone in of relevance at RB. They did not when Spencer Ware went down and don't see them doing it now either.

As for who is the backup I don't know but my guess would be if any one RB can seize that role it would be Darwin, but its more likely to me that it's a RBBC if CEH went down.

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2 hours ago, menobrown said:

Yes and even in pressure packed playoff games they went with a late round rookie over him in Darwin.

Put me down as a no on KC bringing anyone in of relevance at RB. They did not when Spencer Ware went down and don't see them doing it now either.

As for who is the backup I don't know but my guess would be if any one RB can seize that role it would be Darwin, but its more likely to me that it's a RBBC if CEH went down.

I really think this is the spot for D. Freeman.  Yes, he is on my dynasty team so yes I am biased/hopeful.  But, it just makes too much sense.  This is the defending champs and favorites to win it this year.  There is no preseason to get CEH up to speed, and a totally jacked up offseason in general.  Freeman can catch the ball, and bang it between the tackles but most of all is a proven veteran presence who has played in big games and wont need time to adjust to the NFL game.  I loved Darwin in the preseason last year but he showed pretty much nothign in the regular season.  He may prove to be an NFL RB, but he hasnt yet.  If this was not a contending team, I could see them rolling with what they have - but this is a team that can repeat, and having a veteran in the backfield seems wise on many levels.

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6 minutes ago, ChuckLiddell said:

I really think this is the spot for D. Freeman.  Yes, he is on my dynasty team so yes I am biased/hopeful.  But, it just makes too much sense.  This is the defending champs and favorites to win it this year.  There is no preseason to get CEH up to speed, and a totally jacked up offseason in general.  Freeman can catch the ball, and bang it between the tackles but most of all is a proven veteran presence who has played in big games and wont need time to adjust to the NFL game.  I loved Darwin in the preseason last year but he showed pretty much nothign in the regular season.  He may prove to be an NFL RB, but he hasnt yet.  If this was not a contending team, I could see them rolling with what they have - but this is a team that can repeat, and having a veteran in the backfield seems wise on many levels.

it makes so much sense that it probably won't happen.

Also not sure they can afford him.

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2 hours ago, menobrown said:

Yes and even in pressure packed playoff games they went with a late round rookie over him in Darwin.

Put me down as a no on KC bringing anyone in of relevance at RB. They did not when Spencer Ware went down and don't see them doing it now either.

As for who is the backup I don't know but my guess would be if any one RB can seize that role it would be Darwin, but its more likely to me that it's a RBBC if CEH went down.

PFN speculating that the handcuff might be DeAndre Washington:

 

Quote

Beyond Edwards-Helaire, I think the other running back I would want might be DeAndre Washington. We have already seen how volatile the offseason can be, so taking a late-round flier makes sense. He already has chemistry with the NFL’s $500 million man as they played together at Texas Tech. 

While the three-game sample size is small, Washington did an excellent job when starting in place of Josh Jacobs when he was in Oakland. He averaged 20.5 fantasy points per game and was an RB1 in each of those weeks. 

Source: How Damien Williams’ choice to opt-out affects fantasy football

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2 hours ago, menobrown said:

Yes and even in pressure packed playoff games they went with a late round rookie over him in Darwin.

Put me down as a no on KC bringing anyone in of relevance at RB. They did not when Spencer Ware went down and don't see them doing it now either.

As for who is the backup I don't know but my guess would be if any one RB can seize that role it would be Darwin, but its more likely to me that it's a RBBC if CEH went down.

Fantasy Football Impact: Damien Williams Opts Out Due to COVID-19

Excerpt:

Quote

2) Who are you targeting behind CEH as the backup to own in Kansas City?

I can’t imagine they’ll proceed without signing someone to fill that role, be it Miller, Freeman, or bringing back in LeSean McCoy. Depending on who it is, they may be the best handcuff, but more likely than not, there is no direct replacement were CEH to suffer an injury. This would probably end up being a heavily split backfield as we’ve seen Reid use before when his starter goes down. Darwin Thompson is the best bet who is currently on the roster, though.
– Bobby Sylvester (@bobbyfantasypro)

I’m not targeting anyone as of now because, frankly, we just don’t know who the primary backup will be. But if I’m drafting today, the first Chiefs running back not named Clyde Edwards-Helaire that I’d be drafting is DeAndre Washington. The concerns about the lack of preseason games apply to Washington, too, but the bottom line is that the Chiefs went out and signed Washington, the exact type of veteran back that Andy Reid likes to have in his system, despite having Darwin Thompson and Darrel Williams on the roster. So, if I absolutely had to choose a backup, it would be him. But, because we don’t know how this shakes out, including whether the Chiefs sign someone new, I wouldn’t even bother worrying about it much if you’re drafting today.
– Dan Harris (@danharris80)

I fully expect the Chiefs to sign someone that’s currently a free agent like Devonta Freeman or Lamar Miller, but if you’re in a deep Dynasty league right now and you have an open spot at the end of your bench, DeAndre Washington is worth adding to your roster just in case.
– Kyle Yates (@KyleYNFL)

 

Edited by Faust
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52 minutes ago, ChuckLiddell said:

I really think this is the spot for D. Freeman.  Yes, he is on my dynasty team so yes I am biased/hopeful.  But, it just makes too much sense.  This is the defending champs and favorites to win it this year.  There is no preseason to get CEH up to speed, and a totally jacked up offseason in general.  Freeman can catch the ball, and bang it between the tackles but most of all is a proven veteran presence who has played in big games and wont need time to adjust to the NFL game.  I loved Darwin in the preseason last year but he showed pretty much nothign in the regular season.  He may prove to be an NFL RB, but he hasnt yet.  If this was not a contending team, I could see them rolling with what they have - but this is a team that can repeat, and having a veteran in the backfield seems wise on many levels.

Sight unseen and all but I think CEH can do everything Freeman can at this point but do it better.

Darwin showed nothing because he did not get a chance.

37/128 rushing and  9/43 receiving.

46/193 rushing and 9/86 receiving.

One of those numbers above is Darwins  rookie year and the other is Westbrooks. No not saying he's Westbrook, and if KC thought that they'd not have drafted CEH, just pointing out that I don't think his usage or production his rookie year should be held against him, but I would say being active for the playoffs and SB over McCoy was kind of telling.

I think the lack of preseason games as it relates to RB's is seriously overblown.  RB's barely play in preseason games. He's got a good 40 days of camp to mentally prepare and a few weeks of tackling. I think that's good enough especially since it's my belief they start the season using multiple RB's because this is a team that should feel good about prospects of playing deep into playoffs and having CEH not worn down would seem to be something they will be cognizant about.

If the Chiefs end up adding a RB I think it will be someone struggling to or not making another teams roster. For example the Steelers just signed Smallwood and some beat writers feel it's between him and Samuels for that last spot. The loser of that battle is the kind of RB I think the Chiefs might poke around on.

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Quote

I’m not targeting anyone as of now because, frankly, we just don’t know who the primary backup will be. But if I’m drafting today, the first Chiefs running back not named Clyde Edwards-Helaire that I’d be drafting is DeAndre Washington. The concerns about the lack of preseason games apply to Washington, too, but the bottom line is that the Chiefs went out and signed Washington, the exact type of veteran back that Andy Reid likes to have in his system, despite having Darwin Thompson and Darrel Williams on the roster. So, if I absolutely had to choose a backup, it would be him. But, because we don’t know how this shakes out, including whether the Chiefs sign someone new, I wouldn’t even bother worrying about it much if you’re drafting today.
– Dan Harris (@danharris80)

This is terribly flawed logic.  They didn't go and sign Thompson or Williams over Washington because they already had them under contract.    Signing him doesn't mean they like him better, it just means they need another body. 

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  • 6 months later...
Quote

DAMIEN WILLIAMSRB, KANSAS CITY CHIEFS

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Chiefs RB Damien Williams and RG Laurent Duvernay-Tardif are expected to opt-in to the 2021 season.

Both players opted out of the 2020 season but appear ready to return for the team next year. It's difficult to say what the risks of playing will be next season but the 2020 season went well and things should continue to improve in the NFL's second year while operating under COVID-19 protocols. Duvernay-Tardif started 14 games for the Chiefs in 2019 and 60 games dating back to 2015. Damien Williams broke out in 2019 with 711 yards and seven scores before performing extremely well in the playoffs. His return will ensure that the Chiefs don't bring back Le'Veon Bell and could murky the water of their backfield. Clyde Edwards-Helaire cost the Chiefs a first-round pick but hasn't been meaningfully better than UDFA back Darrel Williams. 

The last time Damien played with the Chiefs, they won the Super Bowl  :whistle:

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7 hours ago, djjosee said:

The last time Damien played with the Chiefs, they won the Super Bowl  :whistle:

And in my opinion was the obvious SB MVP 

Mahomes 286 py, 2 TDs, 2 INTs 4 sacks, 63.5 QBR

Williams 133 tot yards, 2 tds, scored the go ahead TD on a catch and sealed it with a 38 yard rushing TD. Shredded that 9ers D. 

 

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1 hour ago, kewin316 said:

And in my opinion was the obvious SB MVP 

Mahomes 286 py, 2 TDs, 2 INTs 4 sacks, 63.5 QBR

Williams 133 tot yards, 2 tds, scored the go ahead TD on a catch and sealed it with a 38 yard rushing TD. Shredded that 9ers D. 

 

I agree.  Same as Dominic Rhodes should have been the MVP when the Colts won the Super Bowl but you knew it was going to Manning

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3 hours ago, JoeJoe88 said:

I wouldn’t at all be surprised if Damien wasn’t a huge thorn in the side of CEH owners next year. 

Yup. As much as CEH drafted crushed Williams value,  Williams' return will crush (what's left of) CEH's value. 

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14 hours ago, Gally said:

I agree.  Same as Dominic Rhodes should have been the MVP when the Colts won the Super Bowl but you knew it was going to Manning

While we're at it, James White in SB 51.

What's a RB gotta do to get some respect around here?

Edited by jtd13
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  • 1 month later...
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Chiefs released RB Damien Williams. 

The move clears $2.2 million in cap space, and comes after Williams sat out the 2020 season due to the COVID-19 pandemic. The Chiefs used a first-round pick on Clyde Edwards-Helaire and reached another Super Bowl without Williams, so they were comfortable moving on. The move also comes the same day the Chiefs re-signed Darrel Williams. Damien turns 29 in 18 days. A solid pass catcher and role-playing runner, Williams can still be an effective part of a committee. Wherever he winds up, he will not have standalone fantasy value. 

RELATED: 

Kansas City Chiefs

SOURCE: Herbie Teope on Twitter 

Mar 16, 2021, 4:13 PM ET

 

 

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1 hour ago, zed2283 said:

Horrible decision to sit out the season.

His mother had cancer. As a football decision, it didn't work well. As a life decision, who on earth is going to begrudge him that?

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1 hour ago, rockaction said:

His mother had cancer. As a football decision, it didn't work well. As a life decision, who on earth is going to begrudge him that?

The Chiefs, apparently.

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3 hours ago, rockaction said:

His mother had cancer. As a football decision, it didn't work well. As a life decision, who on earth is going to begrudge him that?

Well, you're right about that.

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17 minutes ago, Capella said:

Y’all realize a ton of players got cut recently who played the 2020 season right? Tying him getting cut to sitting out is A+ dumb. 

That's quite overstated. Maybe B- but A+? No way.

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Quote

Bears signed RB Damien Williams, formerly of the Chiefs, to a one-year contract. 

Williams, released by KC this month after opting out of the 2020 season, has plenty of familiarity with Chicago's coaching staff. He worked with offensive coordinator Bill Lazor in Miami and knows head coach Matt Nagy's offensive scheme from their days together in Kansas City. Williams' addition to the Bears backfield very much complicates David Montgomery's path to the massive volume he saw in 2020. A mere four running backs last season had more total opportunity (rushing attempts plus targets) than Montgomery, who thrived in a series of great late-season matchups. J.D. McKissic, amazingly, was the only back to run more pass routes than Monty in 2020. That's not happening again. Pass-catching specialist Tarik Cohen coming back from injury and the Williams signing are major hits to Montgomery's usage and upside in the Bears offense. Williams will be a frequent target of Zero RB drafters in 2021 seasonal leagues. 

RELATED: 

David Montgomery

, Tarik Cohen

, Kansas City Chiefs

SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter

Mar 24, 2021, 12:59 PM ET

 

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I was not impressed with the Rookie. But with that said, he was a Rookie and he will get better. Not sure what to make of the situation. Williams runs the offense like a pro.

 

Possibly a good buy low and if doesn't pan out, unless the guy who owns his is unreasonable, it won't have cost you much.

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10 hours ago, CFB Sicko said:

I was not impressed with the Rookie. But with that said, he was a Rookie and he will get better. Not sure what to make of the situation. Williams runs the offense like a pro.

 

Possibly a good buy low and if doesn't pan out, unless the guy who owns his is unreasonable, it won't have cost you much.

Not many people were impressed with the rookie. But Damien Williams just signed with Chicago. No rookies there. A diversion about Edwards-Helaire is fine, but I think you got this all confused. 

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4 hours ago, rockaction said:

Not many people were impressed with the rookie. But Damien Williams just signed with Chicago. No rookies there. A diversion about Edwards-Helaire is fine, but I think you got this all confused. 

I was under the impression he was still under contract with KC.

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I was really liking the possibility that KC might want to get him back into the mix.  Not so much for a healthy share of touches in the #2 role, but for the potential goldmine of a CEH injury, or even a slim possibility that KC would come to the conclusion that their offense works better with DW on the field.

I'm really not sure that he's worth holding in dynasty now.   In my case, he's worth holding if Tarik Cohen is not expected to make a full recovery or if there's any possibility that he outperforms Montgomery to the point that he earns an even split or better.

Otherwise, he was really more of a lotto ticket on either team with some potential to be serviceable even without an injury ahead of him.   It's not a terrible landing, but I'm not sure that the potential payout on the Bears makes him a lotto ticket worth keeping.  For context, I was definitely keeping him ahead of Kerryon with a return to the Chiefs.   With the Bears, I like him better in redraft than KJ or any mid-round RB prospect, but it's a tougher call for dynasty. 

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  • Joe Bryant changed the title to RB Damien Wiliams, CHI - 10/3/21 - Quad Issue

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