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DE J.J. Watt - Retired (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
ffmail4me
Footballguy
Why do you say that? They have one of the best young QBs in the league and a great offense. Yes, they need to get better on defense, but Watt and the draft will both help.
Deamon
Footballguy
I think he probably just means that the Cardinals are not in the top 5 ... heck not even in the top 10 for teams likely to win a championship.
They are currently 18th in Super Bowl odds.
Jury is still very much out on that statement.
He played for an awful Houston Texans for his career and yet picked a team that hasn’t made the playoffs in 5 years and has made the playoffs fewer times in the last two decades than the Texans have. Even if you believe in Kyler turning things around for the franchise, it’s an odd choice given the supposed many other suitors that are much better shots at winning. Maybe Hopkins smooth talked him into coming there?
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Balco
Footballguy
There are many other teams that offer a better chance to win a championship than Arizona. I don’t blame him at all but I think he took the most money he could get.
Murray needs to greatly improve his decision making.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Right.
Rams are more likely to win the division. If he wanted the best chance to win a ring, Green Bay or Buffalo were better choices.
AZ has a decent shot, just not the best from the teams rumored to have been interested.
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
He was obviously sold on their plans going forward and he isn't playing on last years team, he's playing on next years team.
Those future plans, and the expectation that their raw potential develops further must have been pretty convincing.
Those future plans, and the expectation that their raw potential develops further must have been pretty convincing.
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Balco
Footballguy
And the guaranteed money appears to have a lot to do with it.
I think Cardinals can surprise like the Browns did but they are not a championship contender as constructed. Their division is also very talented from top to bottom.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Decided to take a bigger payday and recoup per season close to what he was making in Houston, apparently his market value which was projected around $10M, Arizona way overpaid and Watt stands no chance in the desert of reaching the Super Bowl with Coach KK vs Shanahan, McVay and Carroll, glad JJ wanted to collect some more money before he donates that last season before he retires and maybe he can find his way on to a winning team.
This doesn't put Arizona in the driver seat or anywhere close to the team to beat, they thirsted for leadership and got it but don't expect Arizona to suddenly become Super Bowl favs.
This doesn't put Arizona in the driver seat or anywhere close to the team to beat, they thirsted for leadership and got it but don't expect Arizona to suddenly become Super Bowl favs.
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
-OZ-
Footballguy
I did not expect to think this, but I'm actually somewhat glad the Titans didn't cough up this money for Watt.
Future HOF without a doubt. Possibly even a really good mentor for younger players, all around great guy, one of the truly good guys in the game, probably will be good for the local area for the charity work he does. But I don't think he was worth this contract for his on field impact.
Future HOF without a doubt. Possibly even a really good mentor for younger players, all around great guy, one of the truly good guys in the game, probably will be good for the local area for the charity work he does. But I don't think he was worth this contract for his on field impact.
massraider
Footballguy
It's one thing to take less money to try and win a ring. It's another thing to take less money to try and win a ring with Cleveland, or Buffalo, Indy. I mean, are you joking?
The oddsmakers say they have a better chance to win than AZ. OK, great? Take millions less to hitch your final years with Wentz in Indy?
His chances are SO much better with those teams, that have been also-rans for years, that he should take less?
Ha, no.
The oddsmakers say they have a better chance to win than AZ. OK, great? Take millions less to hitch your final years with Wentz in Indy?
His chances are SO much better with those teams, that have been also-rans for years, that he should take less?
Ha, no.
Just read a report that the Browns and Colts offered more money than the Cardinals, and the Titans offered similar money. If that’s the case, it kind of debunks a lot of what you guys are saying about he just wanted the money, no? I do think the Cardinals are being underestimated here. We’re talking about a team that two years ago was literally the worst in football and just came within the final game of the season or making the playoffs.
Capella
Footballguy
They can go 10-6 next year, sure. They absolutely are not winning the super bowl. In the nfc alone the Bucs, Packers, Rams are all significantly better and the Niners, Seahawks, Saints and even the Vikings are all probably still better.
Who said he should have? People are just pointing out, rightly so IMO, that he didn't go to a team that would have given him the best chance at winning. so it certainly doesn't seem like that was at the top of his list.
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rzrback77
Footballguy
One of the things that I like best about in the NFL is the ability for teams to make huge jumps from year to year. After all, NFL has been equated to not for long.
I realize that the NFC West is a very tough division right now, but Arizona has made huge strides over the pass three season:
Don't you just love the NFL and their "off-season"?
I realize that the NFC West is a very tough division right now, but Arizona has made huge strides over the pass three season:
- 2018 - record of 3-13 and they scored 200 points less than their opponents
- 2019 - record of 5-10-1 and they scored 81 points less than their opponents
- 2020 - record of 8-8 and they scored 43 points more than their opponents
Don't you just love the NFL and their "off-season"?
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
@CharlesRobinson
Unless the #Colts, #Browns and #Titans are straight up lying, this is not what I’ve been told. I’ve been told by multiple Watt suitors that the $23 million guaranteed in Watt’s Arizona deal was near ceiling for their total $. Teams were trying to get Watt for roughly $12 mil per.
John Gambadoro@Gambo987
The deal JJ Watt signed with the Cardinals was NOT the most he was offered. The Cleveland Browns and Indianapolis Colts each offered more money. Tennessee's offer was very similar.
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Chris Cannon@IUCannon
I'm willing to bet it's a situation where it's being skewed about the total max. Sounds like Arizona guaranteed significantly more but there may have been higher max amounts from others when including incentives & bonuses
You don’t know any of that, no more than I do. The Vikings and Niners just had losing seasons. Did you have the Bucs in the Super Bowl, much less winning it, after they got walloped by the Saints by 35 points in Week 9 last year? Probably not. Things change extremely fast in this league. Look at Miami. I’m just saying I’ll trust the judgment of a future HOF player more times than not over a random Joe like myself on a forum.
Balco
Footballguy
He has been injury prone but when he plays it is still at an elite level both as a pass rusher and against the run. If they somehow re-sign reddick it will be tough to double team either of Watt, Reddick, or Chandler Jones, they will have an excellent pass rush.
Capella
Footballguy
How are they going to remake their entire offensive line that fast? Things don’t change fast in the league because fans want them to, it takes time. That is not a super bowl caliber team despite their shiny parts. You don’t have to believe me, you can believe JJ, I truly don’t care at all. Check back next year and we’ll see.
Balco
Footballguy
And I am sure other teams might have offered more money but I highly doubt any team offered more guaranteed money.
And again, Watt doesn’t need to feel bad because he took the most money. I don’t think he ever said he wanted to only go to the team that offers him best shot at a championship either. I think that was assumed.
And again, Watt doesn’t need to feel bad because he took the most money. I don’t think he ever said he wanted to only go to the team that offers him best shot at a championship either. I think that was assumed.
True, we can't "know" that, but your examples aren't good comparisons at all IMO. The Bucs replaced a terrible QB with the GOAT, and Miami replaced a horrid coaching staff and added 3 1st round picks (and still didn't even make the playoffs). The Cards won't be doing either of those, and signing Watt may mean they can't sign Reddick and/or Peterson, so even their pass rush/defense may not be an improvement over last year. They also have the most roster spots to fill in the NFL and not a lot of money to do it with.
It would be shocking IMO if they were serious contenders for a championship in the next two years.
I guess their 23 year-old number 1 overall pick QB that was in the MVP discussion for a duration of the season last year can’t make another leap? Oh okay.
Capella
Footballguy
Sure. Winning 10 games and making the playoffs in the next 2 years with an uneven roster is the leap. Winning 12-13 and a Super Bowl isn’t even remotely realistic.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I remember when Reggie White, one of the first ever big FA's in the history of NFL free agency, signed with the Packers in 1993 at 31 years of age. White famously said God told him to go to Green Bay, but the Packers were coincidentally also the team that offered the best financial package. There was a ton of speculation as to where he would go and why (there was a famous SI cover with White surrounded by the helmets of various teams that were chasing him.) The Packers did not make the playoffs in '92, had a new coaching staff and were unsettled at quarterback with a new kid out of Kiln Mississippi having just joined the team. White was widely mocked for moving to the northern tundra "for the money" but there he was, a few years later, hoisting a Lombardi. I'll never criticize a player's career decisions. We don't know what drives their decisions, but salary is certainly a legitimate reason to accept a job.
Capella
Footballguy
100% it is. I think the most money should be the only consideration. These guys have a limited shelf life to play and should cash in when they can.
Okay buddy. You absolutely missed the point I was making bringing up the Bucs, but I digress.
Yes, obviously that's what I said. Just refuting your terrible comparison.
Balco
Footballguy
Was he really an MVP candidate though? Maybe for fantasy football. He made some atrocious decisions with the football that cost that team games.
Not saying that he cannot make a giant leap, we just saw Josh Allen do it.
Balco
Footballguy
100% agree on that. Take as much guaranteed money as you can, when you can. Don’t fault JJ Watt for that at all.
I already pointed out why that's irrelevant- yes, things can change quickly if you go from one of the worst to one of the best QBs in the NFL in the offseason. That's not even a possibility for Arizona so it's moot. Yes, Murray can play better next year (or not), but it's simply not possible for him to go from 2019 Winston levels to 2020 Brady levels.
You also mentioned that you'd trust Watt's opinion, but has he even come out and said that he thinks the Cardinals give him the best chance to win? Even if he does it has to be taken with a huge grain of salt considering what else is he going to say, I took the most guaranteed money lol? I'm not criticizing his decision at all by the way, he's free to make his own choice, but there's no good argument that Arizona gives him as good of a chance at winning as some of the rumored options. "You never know, anything can happen" isn't a very compelling argument IMO.
Balco
Footballguy
I loved that defensive line- Sean Jones and Reggie White at end, Santana Dotson and Gilbert Brown at D Tackle. Dominant.
Deamon
Footballguy
And with the JJ Watt move, the Cardinals' Super Bowl Odds have SKYROCKETED all the way up to the 17th most likely team to win it.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Faust said:
- I really appreciate this from a professional player, just honor the legacy and the team did as well by reaching out to the family. I'll be pulling for Watt this year, a first class great.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Goldberg played for the last Cards team to win an NFL championship, and the only other player to wear 99 was Bob "The Bomber" Nussbaumer who had 12 picks (!) plus 2 fumble recoveries in 12 games in 1950 (and then never played again).
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rockaction
Footballguy
https://www.nfl.com/news/j-j-watt-on-signing-with-cardinals-signs-kept-pointing-back-down-here It’s wild...it’s almost like he had other reasons for choosing Arizona aside from the money.
it's wild...it's almost like he didn't even mention the easiest, most canned response of "winning a championship" as one of his reasons for choosing Arizona.
Balco
Footballguy
I think JJ Watt is an awesome player and it’s impossible not to root for him - he has done so much for the community.
But there is zero doubt he went to the place that offered the most guaranteed money. And that’s okay, most would do the same thing. Football is a brutal sport and you never know when your career will end. And it’s not like baseball and basketball where the entire contract is guaranteed.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Major loss
Watt is a walking injury report, at this point he should think about retirement.
42 games missed over last 5-6 seasons, he can only make it half a season.
Watt is a walking injury report, at this point he should think about retirement.
42 games missed over last 5-6 seasons, he can only make it half a season.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Ministry's Hall of Fame
1st Ballot
What a tremendous effort to work himself back into shape for the Playoffs. Huge boost and whoever they might be playing in the opening round just #### themselves. Arizona is likely the 5-Seed, what an awful draw whoever settles into the 4-seed, could be 1 and done.
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