That's a damn good point. I hadn't thought about the escalation of his salary from year 2 to year 3.
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RB Ezekiel Elliott, NE (2 Viewers)
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socrates
Footballguy
I suspect this was in response to the NFL's request that the matter be dismissed as not yet being ripe. I read that to say the Judge is suggesting that, at least on the issue of alleged procedural errors (denying Elliott the right to face his accuser, examine the Commissioner, etc.), the issue before the Court was already ripe, and Henderson's pending ruling would have no effect upon that issue.
This is not a quote from the Judge, but rather the argument by attorney Jeffrey Kessler on behalf of the NFLPA and Ezekiel Elliott.
The issue before the Court is not one of credibility of the witness. Instead, the issue before the Court is one of fundamental fairness. The Court is not conducting a de novo review of the facts of the case.
Mavis
Footballguy
I will amend that we can talk about what some of the quotes from the judge be shared above means, however...Another damn good post, especially the bolded.
Like it doesnt mean he will, but responding to the NFL lawyers the way he does and the NFL leaving and immediatley filing in NY does not look good for the NFL in my opinion as it sits now regarding the TRO.
Now, thats not to say Zeke will win the case and get 6 games back, but it does look like he will be able to play this season if we are guaging the can he play or will he play stock market if you will.
Ask you this, if you are a betting man and you have to put your house on a side based off how this judge rules (not the enitre case outcome)...
where u betting, does Zeke play this year?
Mavis
Footballguy
Yes, thank you. This is what some of us have been saying.
This is about procedure.
Here is something for those who say the Brady case matters here, the Judge says you are not correct in any way.
Daniel Wallach @WALLACHLEGAL 15m15 minutes ago
Judge Mazzant: "None of the other cases have the facts we have here. Here there is a series of events I can't ignore"
Frank Cawley @Frank_Cawley
The more differences Mazzant sees b/t this case and Brady, the less controlling or persuasive Brady becomes.
I'll say it now after that last tweet with a judge quote, Zeke is getting the TRO. I see why lawyers in the room agreed with that premise.
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http://www.espn.com/nfl/team/_/name/dal/dallas-cowboys
Take a listen to Will Cain here on Dallas ESPN page. Specifically the link titled, "Will Cain offers insight..."
Take a listen to Will Cain here on Dallas ESPN page. Specifically the link titled, "Will Cain offers insight..."
mnmplayer
Footballguy
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
mnmplayer
Footballguy
Based on Cain's polling of attorneys he thinks the TRO will be granted and it's more likely than not that things then drag out for most if not all season.
Mavis
Footballguy
These notes are great and full of Judge quotes. I think a TRO is a given at this point. Judge said the "standard for the TRO is not that high."
Daniel Wallach @WALLACHLEGAL 52m52 minutes ago
Here are @Frank_Cawley's hearing notes from Tuesday's TRO hearing before Judge Mazzant: http://bit.ly/2xdVSpe Transcript expected shortly.
Frank Cawley @Frank_Cawley 57m57 minutes ago
This statement explains why NFL is focusing on jurisdiction. They want out of Mazzant's court b/c he sees this case as different than Brady
the lack of debate in this thread now tells me exactly what everyone thinks will happen and those who are
Daniel Wallach @WALLACHLEGAL 52m52 minutes ago
Here are @Frank_Cawley's hearing notes from Tuesday's TRO hearing before Judge Mazzant: http://bit.ly/2xdVSpe Transcript expected shortly.
Frank Cawley @Frank_Cawley 57m57 minutes ago
This statement explains why NFL is focusing on jurisdiction. They want out of Mazzant's court b/c he sees this case as different than Brady
the lack of debate in this thread now tells me exactly what everyone thinks will happen and those who are
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Short Corner
Footballguy
Team Smokin'
Footballguy
This pretty much sums it up in layman's terms. Now, I am beginning to understand ALL of this.Mavis said:
Not a betting man, and if I were, this isn't something I'd bet on; it's too unclear.Mavis said:
The law is on the NFL's side; article 46 established that Goodell has pretty-much unquestioned authority to discipline players. It's been challenged twice the last few years, and the players lost in each situation.
The judge, however, could decide to ignore the law & past precedents & grant an injunction while the case is pending. In that case, Zeke would still have to get the court proceedings to drag into 2019 to avoid missing time (regular season/playoffs) this year. As matttyl pointed out, that will cost Zeke almost twice as much in salary. You'd have to wonder if at some point his lawyers point out that it's likely that he will lose this case at some point & it'd be best (financially-speaking) for him to serve the games this year, rather than next.
Friday is a key day. If Zeke is granted the injunction (barring something unforeseen happening), I think his FF owners are safe for at least 2 months. After that time, it's very possible that his case could get resolved. At that time, he could be lost for the FF playoff run/playoffs.
If I owned him in Fantasy, I'd hope for the injunction, hope for a good couple games, then I'd see if I could trade him to someone who was optimistic he'd play out the year. It might cost me if he's available in the playoffs (& my thoughts might change by then), but that's an option I could see myself looking into.
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
I drafted him at 30 last night 3.6 and I'm not sure what I'm rooting for. I think even if a TRO happens I'd want him suspended Weeks 8-13. Back for FF playoffs and you get him to start your season. I guess it doesn't matter but that would at least allow me a few weeks to aid the RB depth.
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
If a judge rules a TRO couldn't Roger just put him on the Commish exempt list and still pay him?
beerbuff
Footballguy
I don't think it is about the money for Zeke. If it were he wouldn't be paying a boatload of money to high priced attorneys to fight this. He'd take the punishment and move on and only miss one divisional game between weeks 2-8. I think it is more about trying to fight what he perceives as the unfairness of it all.matttyl said:
unckeyherb
Footballguy
I was under the impression that he could not do that, or if he did, Elliot's people would just file for another TRO
Feel like the TRO being granted could open up a can of worms and this thing takes until the offseason to get settled.
Would the NFL really want to upset the competitive balance by removing Zeke in the middle of the season? Just deal with it in the offseason.
matttyl
Footballguy
Honest question - is he paying for the lawyers or is the NFLPA doing so on his behalf?
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
And let the luck of the schedule draw fix it in the off-season?
NFL can look good by putting Zeke on the exempt list, he's getting paid while this all gets worked out.
beerbuff
Footballguy
Mavis
Footballguy
Exempt list is not happening, I cant find the link... but someone of the good follows above said any judge in the world would be furious and may grant an injunction on that without filings even needed. Goodell doing so would not likely happen based off the judge embarrassing him more. Also, suspension has been handed down i think the writer might have misjudged that one. Not sure.
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Gottabesweet
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
Today we find out if our fantasy football0 lotto ticket hits.
socrates
Footballguy
Not necessarily. The Judge may issue a Temporary Restraining Order today and set a hearing for the next couple of weeks to consider a Preliminary Injunction. We may not get much clarity today on how the rest of the season plays out.
cloppbeast
Footballguy
I for one drafted Zeke for the fantasy playoffs. It wouldn't be such a bad thing for this whole thing to get put to rest and his suspension start week 2. At least it wouldn't drag on to start week 10 or 12 which would be pretty ####ty.
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Gottabesweet
Footballguy
That would be neat.
I'll hang out here all day and think I'm a lawyer. Hoping this ticket cashes as I wasn't able to back Zeke up with anything decent.
socrates
Footballguy
cloppbeast
Footballguy
Depending on what sources you think are most credible, the odds of that happening are looking pretty solid.
cloppbeast
Footballguy
I drafted Zeke on the swell of positivity thinking that his suspension would get overturned. Always knew that I'd have to be prepared to deal with 6 weeks without a top draft pick, but never thought it would come to reality. Here's hoping there's some better news in the wake of a disappointing Thursday night if you're invested in Pats/Brady/Gronk in any way.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
socrates
Footballguy
It would mean that (1) Judge Mazzant issues an injunction (not just a TRO); (2) the NFL does not have that injunction overturned this season on appeal; (3) the Commissioner does not (or cannot) put Elliott on the Exempt List. and (4) the Court does not make a ruling against Elliott on the underlying case this season.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
Yeah seems like he has to go 4/4 - A suspension is happening this year, When?
Can they still just agree to a reduction of 3 and drop it? Or is that out of the water at this point?
If you have been following this closely, you know that (2), (3) and (4) are an uphill battle for the NFL. Yes, getting the TRO is just step one and we need the injunction. But getting the TRO is very likely right now. So if the odds of an injunction are even at 30%, that's an optimistic enough situation for me to be pulling for that to get Zeke for 16 games, rather than just throwing in the towel and hoping for an immediate suspension.
Don't get me wrong, Zeke will serve this suspension sooner or later. But if we get the TRO, the odds of Zeke playing 16 games swing to our favor.
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Short Corner
Footballguy
Just my personal opinion, but I think the lawyers that we're in the courtroom for the last hearing in Texas are the best sources that have currently given any incite.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Of course it is an option. It's just not an option the egos involved will ever consider.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Just odd that you'd say what you said... given reliable sources it looks likely to happen... but then it's your opinion...
Of course Zeke's attorneys are going to paint a rosy picture. I don't know of any attorneys that have zero skin in the game, know all of the information in this case, and have offered incite.
My exact words we're "Depending on what sources you think are most credible". Which of course means that it's my opinion who I find most credible. So it's not at all odd that I would say what I said.
Nothing I'm speaking of refers to Zeke's attorneys.
socrates
Footballguy
True, Elliott must go 4/4, but if Judge Mazzant issues a Preliminary Injunction (some say this is a distinct possibility based on the Judge's remarks at Tuesday's hearing), you could frame the other points as follows: For the NFL to successfully impose its suspension against Elliott this season, they would have to either (1) appeal (almost certain the NFL would appeal) and have the appeal heard this season (likely) and have the Court of Appeals stay the injunction; or (2) have the case heard by the Court this season (that could take several months, so not very likely) and the Court rule against Elliott.
The third point is the Commissioner's Exempt List: If Judge Mazzant issues a Preliminary Injunction, and the Commissioner exercises this power, Elliott could (and would) go back to Judge Mazzant and ask the Judge to rule on that as well. I cannot imagine a judge looking too favorably upon any action which tries to bypass the judge's earlier ruling. Judge Mazzant may try to address this preemptively if he grants an injunction.
To your final point, I don't believe there is anything which would restrict the parties from reaching an accord and dismissing their cases (remember, the NFL also filed). Judges typically favor the parties reaching an agreement. Both sides have dug their heels in now, so that seems unlikely.
At the same time, (1) is an even bigger uphill battle for Zeke. And, IF (1) happens, it means that the judge likely ignored salient aspects of labor law, which then makes (2) less of an uphill battle for the NFL.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
right, so you formed your opinion on who you find most credible, and I asked what sources those were in hopes of a link or something for me to educate myself on those "credible sources" to form my own opinion, but all you said was it's your opinion and referenced some mysterious attorneys that offered some good incite. still waiting if you have some information to pass along.
I suppose I could say, I have some pretty great information that says Zekes suspension is actually going to be lengthened. Based on credible information from those who know details. It's very likely to happen.
