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Dynasty & Redraft: WR Breshad Perriman, Lions


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No way I could put OBJ in my championship line up after the turd he’s been all year. I actually cut him two weeks ago to avoid this decision. I hope he works out for you if you start him, but Perriman

Where the heck was all this for the past 5 years when I drafted you in the 1st round of my rookie draft.  Do nothing for 4 and 3/4 years and then explode.

Yeesh. Who do you like in this draft at WR? 

I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

What do you expect this time of year?
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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

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Rotoworld:

Breshad Perriman - WR - Knights

UCF WR Breshad Perriman clocked a sensational forty between 4.19 and 4.27, depending on the watch, at the school's pro day, according to NFL Media senior analyst Gil Brandt.

That is huffing it for a 6-foot-1 3/4, 212-pounder. Officially, the time is being reported as between 4.24 and 4.27. New England Patriots coach Bill Belichick and Pittsburgh Steelers general manager Kevin Colbert were amongst those taking in the workout. Perriman added a 36 1/2-inch vertical jump, 10-foot-7 broad jump and 18 reps on the bench press. Perriman (32-inch arms and 9 5/8-inch hands) "caught the ball better than expected during his positional workout," Brandt reported. "Some people thought that he didn't have very good hands, but you didn't see that today in his workout. He also showed very good change-of-direction skills. The knock on Perriman is that he is not the hardest-working player, but he helped himself a lot at UCF's pro day and should be a low first-round to high second-round draft choice."

Source: NFL.com

Mar 25 - 9:18 PM

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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

For example Milkman suggesting Perriman should be a 6th overall pick in rookie drafts or Xue stating that he is a better route runner than Parker, White and Strong.

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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

For example Milkman suggesting Perriman should be a 6th overall pick in rookie drafts or Xue stating that he is a better route runner than Parker, White and Strong.

Those are the only 2 examples and Xue has been saying that since before the pro day, so not really an example. In other words, one post reacting to today's events so far = serious overreaction here?

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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

For example Milkman suggesting Perriman should be a 6th overall pick in rookie drafts or Xue stating that he is a better route runner than Parker, White and Strong.

Those are the only 2 examples and Xue has been saying that since before the pro day, so not really an example. In other words, one post reacting to today's events so far = serious overreaction here?

I guess not to you.

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If he goes in the 1st round of the actual draft how is he not picked in the 1st of dynasty rookie drafts? Explain the 5 guys people are going to take consistently ahead of him that went after him in the actual draft? Some in the third round.

Edited by Milkman
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If he goes in the 1st round of the actual draft how is he not picked in the 1st of dynasty rookie drafts? Explain the 5 guys people are going to take consistently ahead of him that went after him in the actual draft? Some in the third round.

Obviously, it depends completely on who ELSE also goes in the first round.

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LOL at overreacting to his 40 time. He was already a late 1st early second rounder before he ran Bo Jackson fast. Moving him up 3-4 spots is hardly an overreaction.

Exactly. And it's not like a possible sub-4.2 is just some "fast pro day". That's historically fast by a WR already being talked about possibly going in the 1st round who hadn't already shown what he can run at the combine. At his size, even more freakish.

ETA -- 2 people already had him at 1.6 well before his Pro Day

Edited by gianmarco
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If he goes in the 1st round of the actual draft how is he not picked in the 1st of dynasty rookie drafts? Explain the 5 guys people are going to take consistently ahead of him that went after him in the actual draft? Some in the third round.

Obviously, it depends completely on who ELSE also goes in the first round.

Gurley

Cooper

White

Parker

DGB

Strong

Gordon

??????

He was already in that 1.09-2.03 range really. Running a 4.2 gives him at the very least a small boost and if he goes top 20 he could crack the top 6.

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If he goes in the 1st round of the actual draft how is he not picked in the 1st of dynasty rookie drafts? Explain the 5 guys people are going to take consistently ahead of him that went after him in the actual draft? Some in the third round.

Obviously, it depends completely on who ELSE also goes in the first round.

Gurley

Cooper

White

Parker

DGB

Strong

Gordon

??????

He was already in that 1.09-2.03 range really. Running a 4.2 gives him at the very least a small boost and if he goes top 20 he could crack the top 6.

Actually, he's the 2.02 in PPR. Not yet selected in standard.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/725846-2015-rookie-204-pre-nfl-draft-for-dynasty/

A jump to the top 6 based on this would be a sever reaction. Very sever. We'll see what happens in the NFL draft. That could shake it up a great deal. Still, top 6 seems very knee-jerk.

Edited by jurb26
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LOL at overreacting to his 40 time. He was already a late 1st early second rounder before he ran Bo Jackson fast. Moving him up 3-4 spots is hardly an overreaction.

Exactly. And it's not like a possible sub-4.2 is just some "fast pro day". That's historically fast by a WR already being talked about possibly going in the 1st round who hadn't already shown what he can run at the combine. At his size, even more freakish.

ETA -- 2 people already had him at 1.6 well before his Pro Day

Ok Gian now that is 3 examples that you can feel free to dismiss as over reactions. Carry on. ;)

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If he goes in the 1st round of the actual draft how is he not picked in the 1st of dynasty rookie drafts? Explain the 5 guys people are going to take consistently ahead of him that went after him in the actual draft? Some in the third round.

Obviously, it depends completely on who ELSE also goes in the first round.

Gurley

Cooper

White

Parker

DGB

Strong

Gordon

??????

He was already in that 1.09-2.03 range really. Running a 4.2 gives him at the very least a small boost and if he goes top 20 he could crack the top 6.

Actually, he's the 2.02 in PPR. Not yet selected in standard.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/725846-2015-rookie-204-pre-nfl-draft-for-dynasty/

A jump to the top 6 based on this would be a sever reaction. Very sever. We'll see what happens in the NFL draft. That could shake it up a great deal. Still, top 6 seems very knee-jerk.

Jurb he just ran. If he ran a 4.3 at the combine would he still be taken in the second round of rookie drafts?

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If he goes in the 1st round of the actual draft how is he not picked in the 1st of dynasty rookie drafts? Explain the 5 guys people are going to take consistently ahead of him that went after him in the actual draft? Some in the third round.

Obviously, it depends completely on who ELSE also goes in the first round.

Gurley

Cooper

White

Parker

DGB

Strong

Gordon

??????

He was already in that 1.09-2.03 range really. Running a 4.2 gives him at the very least a small boost and if he goes top 20 he could crack the top 6.

Actually, he's the 2.02 in PPR. Not yet selected in standard.https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/725846-2015-rookie-204-pre-nfl-draft-for-dynasty/

A jump to the top 6 based on this would be a sever reaction. Very sever. We'll see what happens in the NFL draft. That could shake it up a great deal. Still, top 6 seems very knee-jerk.

Jurb he just ran. If he ran a 4.3 at the combine would he still be taken in the second round of rookie drafts?

I don't know where he would be taken. I was referring to the top 6 talk, though. Not just first round. Yeah, he probably gets a bump based on his time. I find that somewhat silly in and of itself, but it's the reality. Top 6? I'm pretty certain, no.

What happens if he gets drafted in the NFL in round 3?

The NFL draft will clear things up much more than anything going on now.

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LOL at overreacting to his 40 time. He was already a late 1st early second rounder before he ran Bo Jackson fast. Moving him up 3-4 spots is hardly an overreaction.

Exactly. And it's not like a possible sub-4.2 is just some "fast pro day". That's historically fast by a WR already being talked about possibly going in the 1st round who hadn't already shown what he can run at the combine. At his size, even more freakish.

ETA -- 2 people already had him at 1.6 well before his Pro Day

Ok Gian now that is 3 examples that you can feel free to dismiss as over reactions. Carry on. ;)

Over reactions to what? Those 2 votes took place before today.

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Agree with that jurb. I just see him firmly in the 1st round now. I don't see him jumping any of the top 3 WR but he could jump DGB or Strong pretty easily if he's drafted in front of them. Not saying he's a lock to be drafted in front of those guys but it's possible now.

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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

For example Milkman suggesting Perriman should be a 6th overall pick in rookie drafts or Xue stating that he is a better route runner than Parker, White and Strong.

I've been high on Perriman since October.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/702717-dynasty-2015-draft-prospects/?p=17387992

I had him ranked #6 and 4 spots above Strong BEFORE today. (Not posted on this forum) I actually moved Strong down after the Combine. Was really high on Strong, but watched more tape, and just not impressed with his movements. Strong is a lesser prospect than Donte Moncrief was to me right now.

I never said Perriman is "a better route runner". Read my post again. Besides, what does being a better route runner have to do with a fast 40 time?

Edited by Xue
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Roto is reporting he ran a 4.19. lololololololol He's a monster too. I'm not sure if that speed shows up on the field though. He doesn't look that fast to me on tape but now I'm going to have to go back and look again.

Did he run any drills?

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He ran drills from what I read, but I didn't see times. He reportedly caught the ball better than expected. I'm not sure what better than expected is. That leaves a lot to the imagination.

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Well he's a 1st round pick now and maybe a top 20 pick. That puts him in the discussion at the 1.06 in rookie dynasty drafts. He could jump Parker and Beckham depending where he gets drafted.

This was Milkman's 1st post referencing pick 1.06. I read this to say that if Perriman gets taken in the top 20 that that would put him in the discussion for 1.06. I don't see Milkman anointing Perriman the no brainer 1.06 right now.

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Well he's a 1st round pick now and maybe a top 20 pick. That puts him in the discussion at the 1.06 in rookie dynasty drafts. He could jump Parker and Beckham depending where he gets drafted.

This was Milkman's 1st post referencing pick 1.06. I read this to say that if Perriman gets taken in the top 20 that that would put him in the discussion for 1.06. I don't see Milkman anointing Perriman the no brainer 1.06 right now.

Thank you. Reading comprehension ftw!

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Perriman was known as a burner. It was faster than expected, but still I really question that you can change too much on him with a fast pro-day 40. He is who we thought he is, IMO.

His routes are spotty at best and his hands are very questionable. Honestly, I think Xue is the only person on the world wide web who seems to think that Perriman is a better route runner than White. While I'll agree Perriman appears a bit more sudden and smooth on the field, I'd still take White all day over Perriman even if there's a premium to be paid.

I can't get over his hands and his route running. Speed will only get you so far without route running and hands - ask Stephen Hill. If I were a betting man, I'd say Perriman's hands are going to keep him out of the first round in the NFL draft, and should keep him out of the first round of fantasy drafts too.

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LOL at overreacting to his 40 time. He was already a late 1st early second rounder before he ran Bo Jackson fast. Moving him up 3-4 spots is hardly an overreaction.

Exactly. And it's not like a possible sub-4.2 is just some "fast pro day". That's historically fast by a WR already being talked about possibly going in the 1st round who hadn't already shown what he can run at the combine. At his size, even more freakish.

ETA -- 2 people already had him at 1.6 well before his Pro Day

Ok Gian now that is 3 examples that you can feel free to dismiss as over reactions. Carry on. ;)

I don't think it's an overreaction, it's people waking up to what has been happening the last 3 months. He has been talked about as a first rounder by people like Cosell for a while.

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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

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Perriman was known as a burner. It was faster than expected, but still I really question that you can change too much on him with a fast pro-day 40. He is who we thought he is, IMO.

His routes are spotty at best and his hands are very questionable. Honestly, I think Xue is the only person on the world wide web who seems to think that Perriman is a better route runner than White. While I'll agree Perriman appears a bit more sudden and smooth on the field, I'd still take White all day over Perriman even if there's a premium to be paid.

I can't get over his hands and his route running. Speed will only get you so far without route running and hands - ask Stephen Hill. If I were a betting man, I'd say Perriman's hands are going to keep him out of the first round in the NFL draft, and should keep him out of the first round of fantasy drafts too.

White is a worse route runner because he can't transition his speed into his cuts. Perriman is much smoother in doing that. They both need work and are far from being "great route runners". I just don't like White's change of direction in his routes, because he's so much more athletic with the ball with his hands. How can you not wonder why it doesn't show up in his routes? Watch this in slow motion and look at his left foot: http://gfycat.com/UnselfishJointAurochs#?speed=0.5

He doesn't show this kind of feet in his routes.

Edited by Xue
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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

Sounds like Kevin White. Perriman is actually quite fluid in the hips: http://gfycat.com/TerribleFilthyAtlanticspadefish

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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

Sounds like Kevin White. Perriman is actually quite fluid in the hips: http://gfycat.com/TerribleFilthyAtlanticspadefish

He rounded that route like the start of a circle.... Not exactly a good endorsement. Again lazy, or he just can't do it properly. As for comparing him to White, I see more natural athleticism on the field and the quickness for him is hands down much better than Perriman's. White is what you hope Perriman can become.

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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

Sounds like Kevin White. Perriman is actually quite fluid in the hips: http://gfycat.com/TerribleFilthyAtlanticspadefish

He rounded that route like the start of a circle.... Not exactly a good endorsement. Again lazy, or he just can't do it properly. As for comparing him to White, I see more natural athleticism on the field and the quickness for him is hands down much better than Perriman's. White is what you hope Perriman can become.

You said he has "stiff hips". He clearly does not. But nice strawman. Does Alshon Jeffery run "lazy" routes? Or does he simply move in a certain way? It's frustrating when people don't understand human movement. You want him to be fluid and he is, now he's "lazy"? So you want him to be "stiffer" and less smooth so he can be sharper? It's the same, or opposite with Sammie Coates. People say he's 'stiff', but he actually makes sharp cuts. Then people say he's not smooth. Then if he's smooth, he's just lazy.

Edited by Xue
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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

Sounds like Kevin White. Perriman is actually quite fluid in the hips: http://gfycat.com/TerribleFilthyAtlanticspadefish

He rounded that route like the start of a circle.... Not exactly a good endorsement. Again lazy, or he just can't do it properly. As for comparing him to White, I see more natural athleticism on the field and the quickness for him is hands down much better than Perriman's. White is what you hope Perriman can become.

You said he has "stiff hips". He clearly does not. But nice strawman. Does Alshon Jeffery run "lazy" routes? Or does he simply move in a certain way? It's frustrating when people don't understand human movement. You want him to be fluid and he is, now he's "lazy"? So you want him to be "stiffer" and less smooth so he can be sharper? It's the same, or opposite with Sammie Coates. People say he's 'stiff', but he actually makes sharp cuts. Then people say he's not smooth. Then if he's smooth, he's just lazy.

He rounds because he gets a high center of gravity before and through breaks. Is that lazy? I don't know. Maybe he just doesn't have a strong enough core.
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Is anyone worried about the fact Perriman is lacking in catching consistency and route running despite having a former NFL WR as his dad? You would think that he should be a technician in those two areas.

I think that maybe he just isn't going to get better at these aspects. Maybe slightly but not much. Of course there's a lot that goes into a family dynamic but still it seems odd that he isn't better at these parts of his game.

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Is anyone worried about the fact Perriman is lacking in catching consistency and route running despite having a former NFL WR as his dad? You would think that he should be a technician in those two areas.

I think that maybe he just isn't going to get better at these aspects. Maybe slightly but not much. Of course there's a lot that goes into a family dynamic but still it seems odd that he isn't better at these parts of his game.

with wheels like that its, hey breshad go deep.

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Is anyone worried about the fact Perriman is lacking in catching consistency and route running despite having a former NFL WR as his dad? You would think that he should be a technician in those two areas.

I think that maybe he just isn't going to get better at these aspects. Maybe slightly but not much. Of course there's a lot that goes into a family dynamic but still it seems odd that he isn't better at these parts of his game.

with wheels like that its, hey breshad go deep.

And... drop the ball?

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I'm feeling a bit out of touch on this but is it just me or does it seem like this is either A) the greatest collective WR class ever OR B)A LOT of people are going to be burned in fantasy dyno this year because it seems as if there are 1-=12 WRs that EVERYONE is loving.

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I'm feeling a bit out of touch on this but is it just me or does it seem like this is either A) the greatest collective WR class ever OR B)A LOT of people are going to be burned in fantasy dyno this year because it seems as if there are 1-=12 WRs that EVERYONE is loving.

It's people overreacting to last year's rookie WR class, which isn't going to be as good long term as everyone is now just expecting as fact.

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I'm feeling a bit out of touch on this but is it just me or does it seem like this is either A) the greatest collective WR class ever OR B)A LOT of people are going to be burned in fantasy dyno this year because it seems as if there are 1-=12 WRs that EVERYONE is loving.

I agree somewhat but we could have up to 6 or 7 first round WR picks. Cooper, White, Parker are locks and Strong, DGB, Perriman, Agholor, Devin Smith have all been mocked to be 1st rounders. Maybe that's more indicative of a weak overall top of the draft but 1st round wrs are generally really solid prospects. The NFL draft will be interesting. It's possible that the NFL is suffering from the same recency bias as us FFers

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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

Sounds like Kevin White. Perriman is actually quite fluid in the hips: http://gfycat.com/TerribleFilthyAtlanticspadefish

He rounded that route like the start of a circle.... Not exactly a good endorsement. Again lazy, or he just can't do it properly. As for comparing him to White, I see more natural athleticism on the field and the quickness for him is hands down much better than Perriman's. White is what you hope Perriman can become.

You said he has "stiff hips". He clearly does not. But nice strawman. Does Alshon Jeffery run "lazy" routes? Or does he simply move in a certain way? It's frustrating when people don't understand human movement. You want him to be fluid and he is, now he's "lazy"? So you want him to be "stiffer" and less smooth so he can be sharper? It's the same, or opposite with Sammie Coates. People say he's 'stiff', but he actually makes sharp cuts. Then people say he's not smooth. Then if he's smooth, he's just lazy.

I never said he was lazy. For a guy who constantly nitpicks, yet calls people out for not reading their posts it's quite contradictory. I said the way he runs routes is lazy, or he can't do it the right way. The way he runs the shorter routes doesn't make me believe he's doing it with full effort. The longer ones, yes because he likely knows he can get past any DB. Maybe he just hasn't had good enough coaching to do it the way I would expect, that could be the case. Or like Jurb said, his high center of gravity doesn't physically let him, in which case I'd say he'd be very limited in the NFL to what he can do. We don't know the root of the issue. To add some more clarification to what I meant the 1st time, The way he cuts is stiff in his hips. Especially when he already has the ball.

When I say stiff I mean it in regards to the way a player cuts. If the routes are rounded, that's either 1. They haven't learned the best technique to run that route. 2. They physically can't get to the top, sink, and move (ie. stiff)

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WRs need natural hands. I know there was speculation this time last year about K Benjamin's hands but they were attributed to concentration drops, which Ricky Proehl remedied. (turning upfield too quickly) That is not really the case here with Perriman. And as pointed out earlier, if his father can't help him learn how to consistently catch, who will be able to do it?

I don't know if this has been addressed here or not or if anyone has done a study regarding "hand size" of WRs, but it seems like more times than not, WRs who are considered to have GOOD hands generally have hands 9 5/8" and larger. 9 1/2" and smaller tend to be unreliable, especially if they enter the NFL having had issues catching in the NCAA.

Snapshot of the last 3 years, rds 1-2 of NFL draft:

'12

Blackmon - 9 1/4" (outside of one BIG game, was pretty mediocre prior to screwup)

Floyd - 9 3/8"

K Wright 8 5/8"

AJ Jenkins - 9 1/2"

Quick - 9 3/4" (outlier, but had issues @ APP St)

S Hill - 9 3/8"

Jefferey - 10 1/4"

Randle - 9 1/2"

Broyles - 9"

Gordon (honorable mention/supp draft) - 10"

TY Hilton - 8 1/2" (3rd rd honorable mention) (outlier)

'13

Patterson - 9"

Hopkins - 10"

Austin - 9 1/3"

K Allen (3rd rd) - 10"

Hunter - 9 3/8"

Woods - 9 1/4"

Dobson - 9"

'14

Watkins - 9 5/8"

Evans - 9 5/8"

ODB - 10"

Cooks - 9 5/8"

Mathews - 10 3/8"

Benjamin - 10 1/4"

Lee - 9 1/2"

Robinson - 9 1/2"

Adams - 9"

Latimer - 9 5/8"

Richardson - 8 7/8"

Landry - 10 1/4"

Is there a trend here? Even if someone is drafted early and is big and/or fast, fantasy relevance is not a guarantee. A guy has to be able to consistently catch the ball under all conditions or he will end up in the coaches' doghouse or on the bench. Obviously the situation/team, route running, ability to separate, character, practice habits, etc all play a part here as well, but hand size seems to play into the equation and Perriman at 9 1/4" hands will be bucking that trend, especially taking his history into account. There are others who have somewhat bucked the trend, but not at his size and the position that he will be expected to play. Randal Cobb (9 3/8"), AJ Green (9 1/4"), and TY Hilton are notable/recent exceptions but they had a history of being able to easily and naturally catch prior to entering the NFL. And there is always a Jon Baldwin (10 1/8") out there to keep you on your toes, but again, he had serious issues all around @ Pitt.

Just my $ .02

Edited by Rookie_Whisperer
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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

For example Milkman suggesting Perriman should be a 6th overall pick in rookie drafts or Xue stating that he is a better route runner than Parker, White and Strong.

I've been high on Perriman since October.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/702717-dynasty-2015-draft-prospects/?p=17387992

I had him ranked #6 and 4 spots above Strong BEFORE today. (Not posted on this forum) I actually moved Strong down after the Combine. Was really high on Strong, but watched more tape, and just not impressed with his movements. Strong is a lesser prospect than Donte Moncrief was to me right now.

I never said Perriman is "a better route runner". Read my post again. Besides, what does being a better route runner have to do with a fast 40 time?

Post 37 of this thread you said:

"Disagree. Perriman is a good route runner. He's just inconsistent like every other WR. He uses a variety of releases and fakes. Guys like White, Strong, and Parker don't."

So the context is in reference to route running. You also say that Perriman uses a variety of releases and fakes but that White, Strong and Parker do not.

I think you went overboard including Parker in the example of WR who do not use a variety of releases and fakes, which I consider to be aspects of route running.

We seem to agree that a 40 time doesn't have much to do with a players route running ability. Yet after Perrimans pro day you chose to include Parker in the players who do not run as good of releases and fakes as Perriman. That to me seems like an over reaction to the pro day, which isn't really related to players abilities to run routes. I wouldn't have considered it as such if you left Parker out of the comparison. I have read several statements from you recently being skeptical of White and Strong. Including Parker in that now seemed over the top to me.

I did not know you have been so high on Perriman (or Strong) prior to this threads creation. The slagging of Strong recently is something I see in a completely different light now that I know how high you were on him back in October.

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As far as my opinion about Perriman. I have him ranked as the 17th best player for FF and I have had him there for the past month or so. I still haven't seen much more than two games of his on draft breakdown, so I consider that an incomplete evaluation. If anyone could add links to other games of his we could watch, that would be helpful.

I think the high 40 time he put up at his pro day warrants taking a longer look at him. Based on what I have read, I already expected him to be fast. So confirmation of that does not really move the needle for me as far as how I have him ranked right now.

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He's stiff in the hips, runs poor routes (or at the very least lazy ones) which makes it look really sloppy when he's running the route or after the catch. Apparently fast from his pro day numbers, wouldn't think he was that fast. Very little movement skills in terms of agility and quickness. Sure he is a big body and has strength but there's plenty of those guys. I'm not saying he's going to bust but all of this 1st round talk, in rookie drafts and the NFL, is a reach, at least in my mind. He's pretty much a 1 trick pony right now and that trick is run deep while he uses his body to shield defenders. I've seen it around a couple times on the old interweb that he isn't a dedicated worker on his craft, although I have no idea if it's true. If it is I wouldn't be surprised because to me it comes off that way from what I have seen of the guy.

Sounds like Kevin White. Perriman is actually quite fluid in the hips: http://gfycat.com/TerribleFilthyAtlanticspadefish

He rounded that route like the start of a circle.... Not exactly a good endorsement. Again lazy, or he just can't do it properly. As for comparing him to White, I see more natural athleticism on the field and the quickness for him is hands down much better than Perriman's. White is what you hope Perriman can become.

You said he has "stiff hips". He clearly does not. But nice strawman. Does Alshon Jeffery run "lazy" routes? Or does he simply move in a certain way? It's frustrating when people don't understand human movement. You want him to be fluid and he is, now he's "lazy"? So you want him to be "stiffer" and less smooth so he can be sharper? It's the same, or opposite with Sammie Coates. People say he's 'stiff', but he actually makes sharp cuts. Then people say he's not smooth. Then if he's smooth, he's just lazy.

I never said he was lazy. For a guy who constantly nitpicks, yet calls people out for not reading their posts it's quite contradictory. I said the way he runs routes is lazy, or he can't do it the right way. The way he runs the shorter routes doesn't make me believe he's doing it with full effort. The longer ones, yes because he likely knows he can get past any DB. Maybe he just hasn't had good enough coaching to do it the way I would expect, that could be the case. Or like Jurb said, his high center of gravity doesn't physically let him, in which case I'd say he'd be very limited in the NFL to what he can do. We don't know the root of the issue. To add some more clarification to what I meant the 1st time, The way he cuts is stiff in his hips. Especially when he already has the ball.

When I say stiff I mean it in regards to the way a player cuts. If the routes are rounded, that's either 1. They haven't learned the best technique to run that route. 2. They physically can't get to the top, sink, and move (ie. stiff)

What you're describing isn't called "stiff". It's just lack of suddenness.

White has a lower center of gravity, yet he doesn't cut that well in his routes either. So what is he? Stiff, too? White doesn't show the kind of hip/torso fluidity as Perriman, but Perriman is considered "stiff"? What does that make White? Sammie Coates cuts sharper than Perriman. Does that make Coates "not stiff"? Yet people refer to Coates as "stiff".

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I have only seen two games of this guy playing. Maybe if I saw more than that I would find more to like.

But there seems to be a serious over reaction to a fast time on a pro day here to me.

Where's the serious over reaction?

For example Milkman suggesting Perriman should be a 6th overall pick in rookie drafts or Xue stating that he is a better route runner than Parker, White and Strong.

I've been high on Perriman since October.

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?/topic/702717-dynasty-2015-draft-prospects/?p=17387992

I had him ranked #6 and 4 spots above Strong BEFORE today. (Not posted on this forum) I actually moved Strong down after the Combine. Was really high on Strong, but watched more tape, and just not impressed with his movements. Strong is a lesser prospect than Donte Moncrief was to me right now.

I never said Perriman is "a better route runner". Read my post again. Besides, what does being a better route runner have to do with a fast 40 time?

Post 37 of this thread you said:

"Disagree. Perriman is a good route runner. He's just inconsistent like every other WR. He uses a variety of releases and fakes. Guys like White, Strong, and Parker don't."

So the context is in reference to route running. You also say that Perriman uses a variety of releases and fakes but that White, Strong and Parker do not.

I think you went overboard including Parker in the example of WR who do not use a variety of releases and fakes, which I consider to be aspects of route running.

We seem to agree that a 40 time doesn't have much to do with a players route running ability. Yet after Perrimans pro day you chose to include Parker in the players who do not run as good of releases and fakes as Perriman. That to me seems like an over reaction to the pro day, which isn't really related to players abilities to run routes. I wouldn't have considered it as such if you left Parker out of the comparison. I have read several statements from you recently being skeptical of White and Strong. Including Parker in that now seemed over the top to me.

I did not know you have been so high on Perriman (or Strong) prior to this threads creation. The slagging of Strong recently is something I see in a completely different light now that I know how high you were on him back in October.

How can it be an overreaction to include Parker? You sound like you're offended. I'm a big Parker fan and made numerous posts on his releases already. When did I say I was "skeptical" of Parker as well? All I stated was an observation. I still have Parker ahead of Perriman and White. Perriman and White are closely ranked to me, but not in the same tier as Parker.

I'm sorry that you try to read into my posts too much. What I think about prospects isn't always documented in this forum.

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Who thinks Coates is stiff? I don't. I think Coates and Perriman are similar prospects. Both raw but extremely athletic. Both sudden off the line and able to destroy a cushion. Both unreliable hands, but for different reasons. Both sloppy routes. Boom/bust guys IMO.

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As far as my opinion about Perriman. I have him ranked as the 17th best player for FF and I have had him there for the past month or so. I still haven't seen much more than two games of his on draft breakdown, so I consider that an incomplete evaluation. If anyone could add links to other games of his we could watch, that would be helpful.

I think the high 40 time he put up at his pro day warrants taking a longer look at him. Based on what I have read, I already expected him to be fast. So confirmation of that does not really move the needle for me as far as how I have him ranked right now.

I have him 1.08 to 1.10 before this news. Let me know in three months who "overreacted" to his 40 time.

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  • Faust changed the title to Dynasty & Redraft: WR Breshad Perriman, Lions

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