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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread***


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2 minutes ago, Dinsy Ejotuz said:
5 minutes ago, CletiusMaximus said:

The EPL was never going to kick its top 6 teams out

Leave Leicester and West Ham out of this please.

 

I should say, the EPL was never going to kick its top 6 brands out

 

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While this is powerful and true, it does sting when you think of how little has been done against racism and the Qatar cluster ####.

===============================

Brian Sciaretta

@BrianSciaretta

Remarkable.. utterly remarkable. People have taken down the combined richest forces in all of sports - in less than 48 hours.

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12 minutes ago, Dinsy Ejotuz said:

 

If I were really, really cynical I'd swear all this was just to let UEFA announce the expanded CL format starting in 2023 with as little blowback as possible.

Whether planned or not, that news certainly flew under the radar yesterday.  I'm old enough to remember the outrage when the so-called "Champions League" decided to admit 2nd, 3rd and even 4th place teams.  The horror! The greed! Nothing but a cash-grab!

 

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3 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:

ok now that this looks to be dying the fastest death in history, lets change the parameters of the Super League.  It is clear that the players, coaches and fans were unusually unified against the Super League.

If the Super League was presented this way instead, would more have been in favor iof it?  I know UEFA would have to fight this tooth and nail but I am more thinking about players/coaches/fans buy in.

* Super League to start in 2027

* At the end of the 2026 season, the top 20 ranked UEFA teams will make up the first season of the Super League.  If any don't wish to join, the next highest ranked team will be invited

* All 20 teams will not play in the UCL

* 4 teams will be relegated each year from the Super League

* the 4 teams that make UCL semi finals will be promoted

* All teams in the Super League stay in their domestic leagues as well

I think something similar to this would've had a better chance of going over with football fans, but it's exactly what the Kroenke's, Glazers', and Perez's of the deal didn't want.  They want guaranteed fortune.  They don't want any chance that some other entity could come in and take their golden goose.  I don't see anyway that this league develops with pro/reg involved.  And without it, I don't think footy fans will ever be on board.

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Just now, encaitar said:

I think something similar to this would've had a better chance of going over with football fans, but it's exactly what the Kroenke's, Glazers', and Perez's of the deal didn't want.  They want guaranteed fortune.  They don't want any chance that some other entity could come in and take their golden goose.  I don't see anyway that this league develops with pro/reg involved.  And without it, I don't think footy fans will ever be on board.

IMO, the Super League idea is never going to go away, but now it feels like the parameters have been set when this bubbles up again around 2030.

I also am unsure what this fall out may mean for the expected MLS/Liga MX merger.  

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7 minutes ago, encaitar said:

United is out from latest reports.  Apparently the players weren't keen on the idea and senior members went to management to make ultimatums/threats?

Wow, I did not expect that.  Woodward and Joel Glazer were the main force behind this.  Suprised they would pull out so quickly.

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Just now, B Maverick said:

Wow, I did not expect that.  Woodward and Joel Glazer were the main force behind this.  Suprised they would pull out so quickly.

Even the most clueless individuals had to see where this was headed the last 24 hours.   I have been following the game my entire life and I have never seen such a unified force against one issue.

Even the absolute cluster #### of Qatar was met with many just shaking their heads regarding the corruption.

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7 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:

ok now that this looks to be dying the fastest death in history, lets change the parameters of the Super League.  It is clear that the players, coaches and fans were unusually unified against the Super League.

If the Super League was presented this way instead, would more have been in favor iof it?  I know UEFA would have to fight this tooth and nail but I am more thinking about players/coaches/fans buy in.

* Super League to start in 2027

* At the end of the 2026 season, the top 20 ranked UEFA teams will make up the first season of the Super League.  If any don't wish to join, the next highest ranked team will be invited

* All 20 teams will not play in the UCL

* 4 teams will be relegated each year from the Super League

* the 4 teams that make UCL semi finals will be promoted

* All teams in the Super League stay in their domestic leagues as well

 

A minor point perhaps, but there's no way I want to use UEFA's coefficients to decide participation in a non-UEFA tournament.  More importantly, I think the main point for the owners and funding source (JP Morgan) is that the world's top 15 football brands would be in this thing year in and year out.  I like the idea of having 5 new invitees every new season.

 

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1 minute ago, NewlyRetired said:

Even the most clueless individuals had to see where this was headed the last 24 hours.   I have been following the game my entire life and I have never seen such a unified force against one issue.

Even the absolute cluster #### of Qatar was met with many just shaking their heads regarding the corruption.

Wooward and the Glazers are beyond the most clueless.

Seeing a lot of reports coming out.

Arsenal out

Majority of the teams are out

Nothing about United so I still believe they are holding out hope and will go down with the ship

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1 minute ago, CletiusMaximus said:

 

A minor point perhaps, but there's no way I want to use UEFA's coefficients to decide participation in a non-UEFA tournament.  More importantly, I think the main point for the owners and funding source (JP Morgan) is that the world's top 15 football brands would be in this thing year in and year out.  I like the idea of having 5 new invitees every new season.

 

well my idea was that it would be a UEFA tournament, which is why I tied using the Champions League as the promotion platform.

I understand the closed model and what the reasoning was for it.  I was trying to explore avenues in which the fans/coaches/players would accept it.

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So.... I hope everyone who was looking for a new team to follow yesterday had enough time to find one - because your old one does not want you back. 

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I read many people predicting both Chelsea and City would be the first two to bail.  Looks like those predictions were correct

================

Ryan O'Hanlon

@rwohan

City and Chelsea are owned by impossibly rich people who are in it for the prestige/reputation-laundering/both. They don't need the extra 200 million or so from the Super League, and joining a league that everyone hates isn't gonna help with prestige/reputation-laundering.

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Talk sport is reporting that Ed Woodward has resigned as chairman of Manchester United due to the backlash over the ESL.

I am at a loss for words now.  I wanted him out of the football side but not the marketing side.  But if he's gone, maybe the director of football will actual be allowed to do things good for the football club

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Just now, NewlyRetired said:

I read many people predicting both Chelsea and City would be the first two to bail.  Looks like those predictions were correct

================

Ryan O'Hanlon

@rwohan

City and Chelsea are owned by impossibly rich people who are in it for the prestige/reputation-laundering/both. They don't need the extra 200 million or so from the Super League, and joining a league that everyone hates isn't gonna help with prestige/reputation-laundering.

I saw a stat earlier today that showed that Chelsea was the only team among the 12 in the Super League that reported no debt last year.  Man City was second lowest with only like $30M in debt.  The rest, especially Tottenham, Real Madrid, and Barca had run up huge amounts of debt.

It was clear that Man City and Chelsea didn't need the money and I don't doubt that the reports that they were practically strong-armed into joining to begin with were accurate.  Once they saw their fans negative reaction it's not surprising that their decisions were quickly reversed.  It'll be interesting to see if this does anything to change the majority of English fans' opinions on those two ownership groups.... hell, maybe Roman can use this to get his UK visa back.  :)

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2 minutes ago, B Maverick said:

Talk sport is reporting that Ed Woodward has resigned as chairman of Manchester United due to the backlash over the ESL.

I am at a loss for words now.  I wanted him out of the football side but not the marketing side.  But if he's gone, maybe the director of football will actual be allowed to do things good for the football club

The guys on Peacock also just reported this during the Chelsea/Brighton pre-game.  This is absolutely incredible.  Honestly, I'm enjoying it, but WTF?!?

 

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15 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:

So lets review:

* PSG is being viewed as being good

* People were actually rooting for UEFA and FIFA

* Chelsea comes out of this looking like the heroes

 

The forces and variables need to create this are beyond contemplation...

 

reminds me of when we all took the side of US Soccer against the USWNT

 

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6 minutes ago, B Maverick said:

Talk sport is reporting that Ed Woodward has resigned as chairman of Manchester United due to the backlash over the ESL.

I am at a loss for words now.  I wanted him out of the football side but not the marketing side.  But if he's gone, maybe the director of football will actual be allowed to do things good for the football club

I wonder if all the people lecturing us about how well the powers that be knew what they were getting into when they announced this have started to change their minds.....

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14 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:

well my idea was that it would be a UEFA tournament, which is why I tied using the Champions League as the promotion platform.

I understand the closed model and what the reasoning was for it.  I was trying to explore avenues in which the fans/coaches/players would accept it.

If its a UEFA tournament, I think the main change has to be UEFA paying more money to the clubs, which was the main point of the ESL.  Seems unlikely, but maybe the clubs have some leverage now.

 

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1 hour ago, CletiusMaximus said:

reminds me of when we all took the side of US Soccer against the USWNT

 

That is an excellent analogy.   Sadly it continues with the near lunacy of the USWNT suit.   It has gone beyond embarrassing at this point.

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10 minutes ago, McBokonon said:

$MANU down 6% on heavy volume.

Sweet, time to buy more!

9 minutes ago, CletiusMaximus said:

The guys on Peacock also just reported this during the Chelsea/Brighton pre-game.  This is absolutely incredible.  Honestly, I'm enjoying it, but WTF?!?

 

:goodposting:

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3 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:

Sounds like Woodward was intending to quit this summer any way according to reports so this just accelerated things.

Interesting.  Would guess he expected to be the Vice Chairman of the Super League and wouldn't need United any more.  And since they now have a DoF in place......

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2 minutes ago, Dinsy Ejotuz said:

wth... Woodward (United) and Agnelli (Juve) are OUT.

and to think I chuckled a bit when I read this yesterday

===================

UEFA president Alexander Ceferin has hit out at Manchester United and Juventus supremos Ed Woodward and Andrea Agnelli, branding them "snakes" after leading proposals for a breakaway Super League.

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Just now, Desert_Power said:

I did not see this coming 

The speed has taken me by surprise. I had assumed part of the tactic was to let people vent and move forward later when things quiet down and people moved on to other concerns.

But now it appears clear there was absolutely no plan other than "the leagues can't survive with out us so we can do what ever we want"

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New reports saying Woodward is out, but will stay on through the end of the year.

Guessing thats end of this season and not 2021.

 

ETA, nope they mean until the end of 2021

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1 hour ago, CletiusMaximus said:

reminds me of when we all took the side of US Soccer against the USWNT

now that I think about this a little more, this was different, mostly because of timing.

In the beginning, almost everyone was on the USWNT side since we did not have all the information, but that changed as soon as we became educated.

Sure there were a few uneducated people who still clung to "girls rule boyz drool" but for the most part people understood the finer points.

This ESL thing has been only one direction since it was announced.

As others have said, hopefully we can get back to hating the organizations like FIFA/UEFA/US Soccer as the gods intended :)

Edited by NewlyRetired
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25 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:
26 minutes ago, Desert_Power said:

I did not see this coming 

The speed has taken me by surprise. I had assumed part of the tactic was to let people vent and move forward later when things quiet down and people moved on to other concerns.

But now it appears clear there was absolutely no plan other than "the leagues can't survive with out us so we can do what ever we want"

Oh, I made that post for @Sinn Fein

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7 minutes ago, CletiusMaximus said:

Between the ESL circus, a Chelsea game on, and now the Chauvin verdict is coming in - really no idea why I came into work today.

Don't forget Bayern v Leverkusen

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3 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

I don't even think that is true.  There is backlash every time a super league idea is floated.

From what I am reading - this has been 2 years in the making, and that the owners are prepared to move forward.  They already got a favorable court ruling in Spain, effectively barring UEFA and/or FIFA from imposing any sanctions on the teams until there has been a full hearing.

I think the owners are prepared to ride out the storm, and will be prepared to start play in the fall.

I'll take Posts That Did Not Age Well, for $200.

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8 minutes ago, Dinsy Ejotuz said:

Richard Jolly @RichJolly

There is a growing possibility that Jose Mourinho may be the only European Super League manager ever to be sacked. The Special One.

Every cloud has a silver lining.

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