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Ned

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The Iguana

The Iguana 3,125

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Just now, FUBAR said:

Yeah, I think it makes sense. You're giving up privacy already with the GPS but it's a little better without the flyby.

you can still do it if you turn it on. I turned mine back on. Doing a little research, they turned it off after a minor stink on twitter a while back but it was for a different part of the site. But they didn't really give much info on it disappearing apparently or how to turn it on. It's easy to do but you have to go find it in your privacy settings.

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SFBayDuck

Just read through the last few days of posts here, and I don't even know what to say other than that I'm humbled. Tri had given me some updates on @BassNBrew's color commentary and analysis, but all o

gruecd

Hey guys, I'll write more later, but I'm happy to announce that our baby girl, Lenka Ruby, was born at 5:16pm. She was 6 lbs. 11 oz. and 21 inches. Mom and baby are both doing great. Such an amazing C

tri-man 47

Western States "Crew B" and Pacer #1 Report What an outstanding experience!  I flew into Sacramento on Thursday and drove up into the mountains and headed to my hotel in Reno, which is quite a pi

Zasada

Zasada 3,352

Posted
Posted
Just now, Juxtatarot said:

How much value do your place on Garmin watch features like Training Status, Load, and Recovery hours?  

Very little.  Not that I'm an expert, but I see these numbers/statuses bounce around so much that I can't really rely on them for anything.  Other than just trivial observations.

The estimated race times being so incredibly wrong (for me) also doesn't give me much more faith in anything else Garmin does in terms of training recommendations.

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gruecd

gruecd 7,108

Posted
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9 minutes ago, Juxtatarot said:

How much value do your place on Garmin watch features like Training Status, Load, and Recovery hours?  

About as much value as I place on Strava's estimation of fitness level....

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Juxtatarot

Juxtatarot 11,205

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13 minutes ago, Zasada said:

Very little.  Not that I'm an expert, but I see these numbers/statuses bounce around so much that I can't really rely on them for anything.  Other than just trivial observations.

The estimated race times being so incredibly wrong (for me) also doesn't give me much more faith in anything else Garmin does in terms of training recommendations.

Yes, my new watch may not have enough data yet but race predictor has me a lot slower than I think I am.  I even purposely ran a hard tempo this morning to get the times down but that didn't work.  

"Body battery" is nice although mainly as a reminder to get enough sleep.

My initial thought is Recovery Time is interesting although somewhat common sense.

 

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Zasada

Zasada 3,352

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1 minute ago, Juxtatarot said:

Yes, my new watch may not have enough data yet but race predictor has me a lot slower than I think I am.  I even purposely ran a hard tempo this morning to get the times down but that didn't work.  

"Body battery" is nice although mainly as a reminder to get enough sleep.

My initial thought is Recovery Time is interesting although somewhat common sense.

 

Another issue is that sometimes my watch will read my HR wrong for a stretch (pegged to my max for a number of miles), and that will throw off all the metrics.  

At least with Strava, I can tell it to ignore HR and use perceived effort for those runs.  There's no way I know of to tell Garmin to ignore HR or (in a perfect world) edit said HR.

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pbm107

pbm107 2,926

Posted
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10 minutes ago, Juxtatarot said:

I think I'm ready to start training for a race but, alas, there aren't races around here in winter and I'm too nervous about covid cancellations to plan a trip.

Your workout this morning shows that you're not far from being in race shape. I feel the same way about races and am just taking things week by week.  This week I just want to get in 60 and run at least 3 maybe 4 miles at my current tempo pace.

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Juxtatarot

Juxtatarot 11,205

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Just now, pbm107 said:

Your workout this morning shows that you're not far from being in race shape. I feel the same way about races and am just taking things week by week.  This week I just want to get in 60 and run at least 3 maybe 4 miles at my current tempo pace.

Yes, I've been thinking that you've done so much base training recently that you should be more than ready for those type workouts.

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gruecd

gruecd 7,108

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1 minute ago, Juxtatarot said:

I think I'm ready to start training for a race but, alas, there aren't races around here in winter and I'm too nervous about covid cancellations to plan a trip.

I'm going to run Milwaukee on April 10.  Starting training on December 7.  It's only $69 to register, and it's only a 90-minute drive for you, so pretty much zero planning required.  Just a thought...

Also, is "Breasted Ave" as amazing as it sounds?

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Juxtatarot

Juxtatarot 11,205

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Just now, gruecd said:

I'm going to run Milwaukee on April 10.  Starting training on December 7.  It's only $69 to register, and it's only a 90-minute drive for you, so pretty much zero planning required.  Just a thought...

Also, is "Breasted Ave" as amazing as it sounds?

No, it's pretty flat.

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Juxtatarot

Juxtatarot 11,205

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, gruecd said:

I'm going to run Milwaukee on April 10.  Starting training on December 7.  It's only $69 to register, and it's only a 90-minute drive for you, so pretty much zero planning required.  Just a thought...

Also, is "Breasted Ave" as amazing as it sounds?

I'll keep Milwaukee in mind.  I'll find something this spring.

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gruecd

gruecd 7,108

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1 minute ago, Juxtatarot said:

I'll keep Milwaukee in mind.  I'd find something this spring.

I deferred Carmel from this year, so I'm registered for that, too, on April 3.  Gives me a possible pivot if Milwaukee would get canceled (in which case there's the option for a full refund, btw).

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FUBAR

FUBAR 3,203

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1 hour ago, gruecd said:

Somebody tell me why I ever even leave the peace and tranquility of own little thread....

 

1 hour ago, gianmarco said:

Secret desire to get suspended?

:yes:

Avoid the PSF. maybe venture into the shark pool or stock thread occasionally.

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El Floppo

El Floppo 27,934

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53 minutes ago, FUBAR said:
2 hours ago, gruecd said:

Somebody tell me why I ever even leave the peace and tranquility of own little thread....

 

2 hours ago, gianmarco said:

Secret desire to get suspended?

:yes:

Avoid the PSF. maybe venture into the shark pool or stock thread occasionally.

Psf is a no fly zone for me.

I stick to my handful of threads where people are decent, respectful towards each other. And here.

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gruecd

gruecd 7,108

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1 hour ago, FUBAR said:

Avoid the PSF. maybe venture into the shark pool or stock thread occasionally.

I rarely ever visit the PSF anymore.  And I never post.

I posted in a couple of threads in the Shark Pool this past weekend, but nobody wanted to listen when I told them not to drink the Kool-Aid on A.J. Dillon yesterday because it was going to be the Jamaal Williams show.  :shrug:

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tri-man 47

tri-man 47 8,740

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4 hours ago, Juxtatarot said:

 

My initial thought is Recovery Time is interesting although somewhat common sense.

 

Pretty much this.  When I started gearing up my mileage again earlier in the calendar year, it was telling me to take 3-4 days of recovery.  Now, it's often more like 15-30 hours.  I have noticed that when I overextend, the recovery time that shows is longer.  But as you say, that's all common sense.

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Zasada

Zasada 3,352

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17 hours ago, tri-man 47 said:

Pretty much this.  When I started gearing up my mileage again earlier in the calendar year, it was telling me to take 3-4 days of recovery.  Now, it's often more like 15-30 hours.  I have noticed that when I overextend, the recovery time that shows is longer.  But as you say, that's all common sense.

And even the VO2MAX calculation feels error-prone.  Went out this morning, nice cool temps (could have lived without the rain and wind, though).  Ran a good pace, HR was in a good spot, and of course Garmin bumps-up my VO2MAX to 59.  Had I run that in 70F temps, there's no way that would have happened.  There really needs to be a temperature adjustment to these calculations.  I can't just have a high VO2MAX in winter, and lower in summer.

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Zasada

Zasada 3,352

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2 minutes ago, Cowboy Dan said:

He's not very smart.

A new runner to the thread!  Welcome.  Don't run too fast when you start.  There's a ton of science about cadence out there.  Be sure to read up.

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Juxtatarot

Juxtatarot 11,205

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, gruecd said:

Cowboy Dan? :lmao::lmao:

:tumbleweed:

@Cowboy Dan's a major player in the cowboy scene. He goes to the reservation drinks and gets mean.  He's gonna start a war. He hops in his pickup, puts the pedal to the floor and says "I got mine but I want more".

Edited by Juxtatarot
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JShare87

JShare87 4,093

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2 hours ago, Zasada said:

And even the VO2MAX calculation feels error-prone.  Went out this morning, nice cool temps (could have lived without the rain and wind, though).  Ran a good pace, HR was in a good spot, and of course Garmin bumps-up my VO2MAX to 59.  Had I run that in 70F temps, there's no way that would have happened.  There really needs to be a temperature adjustment to these calculations.  I can't just have a high VO2MAX in winter, and lower in summer.

Look at me, my VO2MAX is 59!

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Cowboy Dan

Cowboy Dan 28

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36 minutes ago, Zasada said:

A new runner to the thread!  Welcome.  Don't run too fast when you start.  There's a ton of science about cadence out there.  Be sure to read up.

Thanks!

As I'm just getting back to running, I have a question for the esteemed group:

I'm way out of shape.  Just got out and did 3 miles, felt decent.  I'm going to use at least the next couple of weeks to get back into it and try to get out pretty much every day but keep mileage at 3-4 miles to start.  Right now, my HR is easily 20 bpm higher than where I was.

Am I better off pushing the pace to where I used to be with the higher HR and let it come down or am I better off slowing down significantly to keep the HR where it should be and slowly speed up over the next couple weeks?

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MAC_32

MAC_32 12,082

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2 minutes ago, Cowboy Dan said:

Thanks!

As I'm just getting back to running, I have a question for the esteemed group:

I'm way out of shape.  Just got out and did 3 miles, felt decent.  I'm going to use at least the next couple of weeks to get back into it and try to get out pretty much every day but keep mileage at 3-4 miles to start.  Right now, my HR is easily 20 bpm higher than where I was.

Am I better off pushing the pace to where I used to be with the higher HR and let it come down or am I better off slowing down significantly to keep the HR where it should be and slowly speed up over the next couple weeks?

The harder you press right now the quicker you'll get back to where you were, but the harder you press right now the more likely you are to sustain an injury. Risk <> reward.

Anecdotally speaking, I started training for a November half at the beginning of August 19 after a relatively inactive summer. That was pre-HR monitor days, but I know my effort those first 6-8 weeks were significantly above optimal levels. But after a stepback week to race at the beginning of October I had the best 6 week stretch of training I think I've ever had. That doesn't happen if I took a more risk averse approach in August and September.

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Juxtatarot

Juxtatarot 11,205

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1 minute ago, Cowboy Dan said:

 

Am I better off pushing the pace to where I used to be with the higher HR and let it come down or am I better off slowing down significantly to keep the HR where it should be and slowly speed up over the next couple weeks?

I usually go the middle route.  Run a little slower with a higher heart rate and then, as fitness comes back, speed up while having a lower heart rate.

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Cowboy Dan

Cowboy Dan 28

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1 minute ago, MAC_32 said:

The harder you press right now the quicker you'll get back to where you were, but the harder you press right now the more likely you are to sustain an injury. Risk <> reward.

Anecdotally speaking, I started training for a November half at the beginning of August 19 after a relatively inactive summer. That was pre-HR monitor days, but I know my effort those first 6-8 weeks were significantly above optimal levels. But after a stepback week to race at the beginning of October I had the best 6 week stretch of training I think I've ever had. That doesn't happen if I took a more risk averse approach in August and September.

Thanks.

That's partly why I'm keeping the runs shorter to start.  My right IT band still wasn't happy the last couple runs and it started right around mile 3.  I figure if I keep runs at 3-4 miles and rebuild some leg strength, I'll be good.  I'll work on pushing the paces and getting the HR up, kind of like I did today. 

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Cowboy Dan

Cowboy Dan 28

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Posted

Speaking of which, Mrs. Cowboy finally got a running coach.  I think it's a good idea and will be interesting to see how things go.  He does believe she's capable of a BQ.  Eventual goal will be 3:40.  She just received her first plan covering the next 6 weeks.  It's not all that different than our normal training.  However, there is one part I noticed that really raised my eyebrows.  Curious your thoughts. 

Her GMP right now is 8:20-8:30 pacing.  He wants her to adjust her previous easy run paces.  He now wants her "easy" runs to be between 8:45-9:15 pacing (we've been in the 10-10:30 range).  Thoughts?

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MAC_32

MAC_32 12,082

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8 minutes ago, Cowboy Dan said:

Speaking of which, Mrs. Cowboy finally got a running coach.  I think it's a good idea and will be interesting to see how things go.  He does believe she's capable of a BQ.  Eventual goal will be 3:40.  She just received her first plan covering the next 6 weeks.  It's not all that different than our normal training.  However, there is one part I noticed that really raised my eyebrows.  Curious your thoughts. 

Her GMP right now is 8:20-8:30 pacing.  He wants her to adjust her previous easy run paces.  He now wants her "easy" runs to be between 8:45-9:15 pacing (we've been in the 10-10:30 range).  Thoughts?

I don't adhere to hard rules when it comes to easy running - it depends on factors unique to that day. There are days my easy run is around 8 minute pace and there are days it's near 10. Hell there were long run days when I was nearing peak shape last winter my HR barely elevated over 140 at paces near 7:30. 

For your cowgirl, with improved fitness and more optimal training conditions comes faster easy runs. She is in a completely different place fitness wise right now than she was beginning marathon training last time. And fall/winter training in St Louis is substantially different than spring/summer.

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Zasada

Zasada 3,352

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5 minutes ago, MAC_32 said:

I don't adhere to hard rules when it comes to easy running - it depends on factors unique to that day. There are days my easy run is around 8 minute pace and there are days it's near 10. Hell there were long run days when I was nearing peak shape last winter my HR barely elevated over 140 at paces near 7:30. 

Yeah my ERs are more about feel/effort than pace.  Very weather-dependent. 

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gruecd

gruecd 7,108

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Cowboy Dan said:

Speaking of which, Mrs. Cowboy finally got a running coach.  I think it's a good idea and will be interesting to see how things go.  He does believe she's capable of a BQ.  Eventual goal will be 3:40.  She just received her first plan covering the next 6 weeks.  It's not all that different than our normal training.  However, there is one part I noticed that really raised my eyebrows.  Curious your thoughts. 

Her GMP right now is 8:20-8:30 pacing.  He wants her to adjust her previous easy run paces.  He now wants her "easy" runs to be between 8:45-9:15 pacing (we've been in the 10-10:30 range).  Thoughts?

By "easy" does he mean "recovery" or "general aerobic?"  That's way too fast for GA runs (what my coach calls "glue" runs).  When I'm training to race at sub-6:50 pace, my GA pace tends to be in the 7:30-8:00 range.  If he meant recovery, that's REALLY too fast.

9-minute pace is about 7% slower than 8:25 pace, whereas 7:45 pace is 13% slower than 6:50 pace.  

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