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Some, who have been posting about tyranny and policing in this very thread neither know what tyranny really is nor why society has an institution focusing on order and what function it might serve. They're in this very thread. Actually, they're who you're involved in this discussion with.
Did I say that? Are they only bailing out the peaceful ones?
That's troubling, but par for the course. I learned how to read a police report from Reason magazine, no friends to LEO-loving sorts. It's hard to say that with all the law enforcement lies we've seen in the past that this information would be anything new. That's probably why there are protests. But what sets this incident apart for nationwide violence specifically is a question nobody can really answer right now.
Please inform me of what tyranny is then. I'm willing to learn, so please inform all of us. Continue with why society has an institution focusing on order as well. TIA
Not with that smart-### condescending tone, brother. I'm not in your gulag.
I think people had a problem with him using a football game to protest the police but I don't think anyone had a problem with the message he was trying to send. People also said that he was making it about himself with the football and losing his message (and they were right he failed with his message). The biggest problem people had was the entitlement he wanted to play football and ignore his employer's request to not protest on the job. He has the right to protest and they have the right not to employ him. I think that's most of the 400 pages.
"Smart-### tone"? I'm asking you to inform me about what you said. How is asking for information misconstrued here?
Sure...but the people that makes piles of money...are typically the ones with the bigger stage and pulpit to reach more people.
So they are against some violence but quietly okay with other violence? Not sure I understand what you're saying
Its like you skipped the "legal" part on purpose, but obviously was just an accident.
and everyone agree's with that
You asked where they all were speaking out against violence and I'd like to point out that many of them were very vocal about the violence that ended the lives of black people. LeBron James comes to mind. Why do you think we are here?
A lot of people I know didn't like it. They weren't mad that it was a protest. They were mad they turned on a football game and got what they viewed as politics. The NFL is entertainment. Some people just want a reason to be mad and will be mad no matter what. But a lot of the NFL frustration was--people were turning in for football and getting other stuff.
I know why we are all upset and protesting (peacefully). You didn't answer my question.
"ANTIFA" just means "antifascist" Andy. There is no centralized authority, no organization. You're being more than a bit ridiculous here.Well this is cool. MN AG Keith Ellison's son, and Minneapolis City Council member Jeremiah Ellison declares his support for ANTIFA.
"I hereby declare, officially, my support for ANTIFA
Unless someone can prove to me ANTIFA is behind the burning of black and immigrant owned businesses in my ward, I’ll keep focusing on stopping the white power terrorist THE ARE ACTUALLY ATTACKING US!"
So it's not enough to say "I don't think it's ANTIFA." Instead, you have to support them because you're sure it's white supremacists - even though there isn't any more proof it's them than Antifa.
I'm calling a real estate agent and getting out of here.
Well, a protest has to be public or else no one cares. If he went out and protested on the weekends on his front lawn, it is not like a news crew would be sent out to televise it. There is discussion on this very football forum about changes to policing, so obviously protesting has to grab our attention or else it is easy to just change the channel and ignore it. I mentioned this earlier in this thread, so just quoting myself from some amount of pages back:
There is nothing that could be done that people would not complain about. People saying that if they only protested peacefully they would be supportive are only saying that because it is a false choice, and if they were peacefully protesting there would still be complaints and comments about how they are against the protest, but if they did it some other way they would be all for it. Eventually you follow that logic to the end of the line and it turns out that for some, no protest or disruption is acceptable.
It did not feel like there was that much offense about the kneeling when it first started until they were told to be offended by Fox News and Rush Limbaugh and President Trump. It was manufactured outrage, just people waiting to be told what to think.
Its very organized in many cities like Portland and Austin. I've seen it first hand, when my daughter's friend was mis-identified and got harrassed at work and at home and had to move away from Austin,
I have posted this a few times before. In Michigan it is "legal' to open carry any type of weapon in the Capital building. Hard to believe but true. That is why the State Police could do nothing about it. Pretty sure that a new law will be in place soon but as of now it is legal.
I talked to a lot of people who said they didn't watch football for that. I think a lot of Americans follow politics loosely and don't care what Trump tells them. They just don't want politics with their sports.
James, Jordan, Watt, Kaep, Trevor Lawrence, Dwane Casey, Doc Rivers, Shaq, Harbaugh....this list is infinite. We can basically google just about ANY athlete, coach, organization and see them speaking against violence.
Sure, as long as we realize that since one begets the other, the police need to make sweeping changes first.
These guys are speaking out against the looters and rioters? Not just the police brutality?
No, it isn't. Show me the roving packs of "ANTIFA" that are around MN. I'll wait, and keep waiting, because they don't exist. There were 3 "ANTIFA" on Unicorn Riot last night at George Floyd's memorial who he talked to. They were three pasty, overweight white people chilling in a car at the Speedway gas station on the corner. They had a German Antifa flag and were happy to talk to anyone that came around. I highly doubt those three had the cardiovascular health to burn some calories, much less a good chunk of the city.
Oh man, this is wrong.
And that it doesn't matter that it may be a small percentage that are bad cops...when the structure ends up defending them...again, look at the post from the beginning of this, the quote on the last page where I linked to mcintyre's post...the explanation from the city was to claim the cops noticed him having a medical issue and called the ambulance...that he was loaded into the ambulance and died a short time later. Just a complete fabrication...and this happens quite often. Its the departments doing this consistently that have created as much of the outrage as the bad cops...a complete and total mistrust (for good reason).
So beating, killing, stealing, and burning stores of people is the way to make those changes? Why don't they go burn a police station or a courthouse or beat a cop first? The owner of Starbucks, the shoe store, or the phone store isn't killing innocent black people.
If you think that, then the right wing media machine has already won and we're already lost. No way we're having an election this November at this rate.
That's not even the debate. Whether or not Antifa is actually in Minneapolis is not relevant (to this argument).
An official at last night's 11pm press conference confirmed the presence of white supremacist organizations and posters/literature that they had collected around the city. When asked about Antifa being behind the fires, he replied "I have heard those reports, but I have no confirmation on them."
It's not gaslighting, but ANTIFA is real. They're not just "Good citizens against Fascism" as they'd have you believe.
Im not even sure its partisanship....they may be more left aligned or right aligned...but I don't think its partisanship that drives much of it...its a want for chaos and division. I share in that same disappointment.
I've actually been thinking quit a bit about this post over the past hour or so since I read it. It caused me to seriously ask myself, am I totally fine with the protests? Sure, it's easy to say I'm fine with them when they're somewhere else and I'm not the least bit inconvenienced. But I have to admit, I've found myself annoyed when there is a protest in my area that complicates my commute to work (for many years I worked downtown near City Hall). Yes, adding a measly 10 minutes to my commute caused annoyance rather than introspection about the purpose of the protest. And what if I was a business owner open to the public in the area of the protest? No doubt my business would likely be impacted. Are my regular customers going to want to cross a picket line in order to buy coffee or do a print job or fill their prescription? Would I be "totally fine" with them then? I know that you have already commented that the situations are "different" but your response to Colin Kaepernick's peaceful protest was to state "I do not need a lecture on the subject when I sit down to watch a football game. Not going to apologize for that." Frankly, I can't imagine a less inconveniencing protest - it doesn't delay or interfere with the game, it lasts mere seconds and you don't even have to watch it - and yet you complain. And I don't mean this to be a personal slight on you at all - indeed, it's caused me to reflect on my own behaviors. I have to admit that I'm guilty of virtue signaling and proclaiming support for these protests, but how would I feel if I was affected or inconvenienced by them? Would I say "I do not need a lecture when I'm on my evening commute?" I have before. Perhaps these protests we are now experiencing wouldn't be as combative or involve as many criminal acts if the prior peaceful protests were actually effective in getting people to stop what they are doing and reflect on the message. I think we all can play a part in that. I know for sure that I can do better.
I'm also against Fascism. But if I started causing explosions and attacking people in the name of stopping Fascism, I'd be a criminal. That's ANTIFA. Just because they chose the name doesn't mean they're good people or that that's how they should be judged.
We're not even debating the same thing here.
