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Another killing at the hands of the Police


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So, if Bryant had not died, is there any chance its a stand your ground case?

https://www.foxnews.com/us/ohios-new-stand-your-ground-gun-law-takes-effect-tuesday

https://www.wlwt.com/article/ohio-s-new-stand-your-ground-law-everything-you-need-to-know/36196538

I ask because if it truly was bryant that called the police and the others were the initial aggressors, then could it not potentially be considered stand your ground?  For the record im not a fan of stand your ground personally, but it does complicate this case a bit.  Just curious everyone's thoughts on it. 

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In January, Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine, a Republican, signed a so-called "stand your ground" bill that eliminates an individual's duty to retreat before using force. The final version of the legislation -- Senate Bill 175 -- passed in December, Fox 8 reported.

The new legislation expands the locations at which a person has no duty to retreat before using force under both civil and criminal law, eliminating the home and vehicular parameters. It could potentially allow an individual to use deadly force in public areas so long as the person is not the aggressor and reasonably and honestly believes it was necessary to prevent serious bodily harm or death.

 

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The controversial new law, signed by Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine in January, eliminates Ohioans' duty to retreat before using force.

The measure expands the so-called “stand your ground” right from an individual’s house and car to any place, “if that person is in a place in which the person lawfully has a right to be.”

The new law can be explained like this: In the past, if someone shot in self-defense, the burden was on the shooter to prove that's why they did it. With a "stand your ground" law, the burden shifts to the prosecutor to prove the shooting was not justified.

In addition to making prosecutors prove a claim of self-defense may not be justified, the measure would also eliminate the call for gun owners with concealed carry permits to try to retreat from a threat before opening fire.

 

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I don’t know what Stand Your Ground involves .  The basic premise of defending yourself I agree with.  The sticky part is cases like in Columbus.  The cop was a trained marksman, we are not.  Let’s say one of those people at that scene shot and hit someone else, now what?

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1 minute ago, FairWarning said:

I don’t know what Stand Your Ground involves .  The basic premise of defending yourself I agree with.  The sticky part is cases like in Columbus.  The cop was a trained marksman, we are not.  Let’s say one of those people at that scene shot and hit someone else, now what?

Yea.  And im not a fan of stand your ground because it can get very tricky.  It seems as long as you aren't the aggressor then you can use lethal force.  Id have to look at the case law to see how that is interpreted.  Does it mean the initial aggressor? It could complicate this case for sure. 

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3 minutes ago, PinkydaPimp said:

Yea.  And im not a fan of stand your ground because it can get very tricky.  It seems as long as you aren't the aggressor then you can use lethal force.  Id have to look at the case law to see how that is interpreted.  Does it mean the initial aggressor? It could complicate this case for sure. 

How many of these domestic cases involve booze or drugs also?  Stand your ground at a crowded bar after a night of drinking and someone hitting on your wife?  Eh...

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23 hours ago, PinkydaPimp said:

Yea.  And im not a fan of stand your ground because it can get very tricky.  It seems as long as you aren't the aggressor then you can use lethal force.  Id have to look at the case law to see how that is interpreted.  Does it mean the initial aggressor? It could complicate this case for sure. 

Not a lawyer, but pretty sure "Stand Your Ground" means you can defend yourself if you're being attacked.  Though, if you have the avenue to escape, you're supposed to.  This girl CLEARLY did not escape even though she could have.  She was the clear aggressor even if the other girls started it (which, I'm not even sure is true at this point).

Edited by BladeRunner
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1 minute ago, BladeRunner said:

Not a lawyer, but pretty sure "Stand Your Ground" means you can defend yourself if you're being attacked.  Though, if you have the avenue to escape, you're supposed to.  This girl CLEARLY did not escape even thought she could have.  She was the clear aggressor even if the other girls started it (which, I'm not even sure is true at this point).

True.  And im no lawyer either but the article above seems to state they may have changed the law so that you may not have to retreat.  They mention a gun below but not sure how that goes for knives. 

Quote

the measure would also eliminate the call for gun owners with concealed carry permits to try to retreat from a threat before opening fire.

 

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11 hours ago, lazyike said:

I have a cousin , not too bright,  that thinks it was the fentanyl that killed Floyd and not to fall for the “commie left’s video.” Chavin’s defenders are out there.

It’s not an unreasonable viewpoint from an evidentiary standpoint.  He had a large dose of fentanyl in his system and was having trouble breathing well before he got pinned by Chauvin.

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17 minutes ago, ekbeats said:

It’s not an unreasonable viewpoint from an evidentiary standpoint.  He had a large dose of fentanyl in his system and was having trouble breathing well before he got pinned by Chauvin.

What hurts Chauvin’s argument here is him not letting up.  Would a average person without fentanyl be able to survive nine minutes without breathing?  Probably not.  

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3 minutes ago, FairWarning said:

What hurts Chauvin’s argument here is him not letting up.  Would a average person without fentanyl be able to survive nine minutes without breathing?  Probably not.  

I agree 1000%.  I personally feel that Chauvin killed a man who was having an overdose.

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2 minutes ago, ekbeats said:

I agree 1000%.  I personally feel that Chauvin killed a man who was having an overdose.

I watched the video this week of the security camera, he was feeling no pain in the store.  

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3 minutes ago, FairWarning said:

I watched the video this week of the security camera, he was feeling no pain in the store.  

Also my understanding was he had a very strong tolerance so I’m not sure he was overdosing.  Maybe he had high levels though.  I don’t recall what they were and if that was considered an overdose or not however. 

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1 minute ago, PinkydaPimp said:

Also my understanding was he had a very strong tolerance so I’m not sure he was overdosing.  Maybe he had high levels though.  I don’t recall what they were and if that was considered an overdose or not however. 

Even if he was overdosing - the last thing you want to do to a guy who is having trouble breathing is sit on his neck.

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Wild stuff. 

Baltimore Cops Carried Toy Guns to Plant on People They Shot, Trial Reveals

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Detective Maurice Ward, who's already pleaded guilty to corruption charges, testified that he and his partners were told to carry the replicas and BB guns "in case we accidentally hit somebody or got into a shootout, so we could plant them." The directive allegedly came from the team's sergeant, Wayne Jenkins, the Washington Post reports. Though Ward didn't say whether or not the tactic was ever used, Detective Marcus Taylor—another cop swept up in the scandal—was carrying a fake gun almost identical to his service weapon when he was arrested last year, according to the Sun.

Notable testimony from the Baltimore Police Gun Trace Task Force corruption trial

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Ward said the officers kept BB guns in their vehicles “in case we accidentally hit somebody or got into a shootout, so we could plant them.” He did not say whether the officers ever planted a BB gun on anyone.

Baltimore Police officer charged in BB gun-planting incident

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In the spring of that year, Jenkins struck a man with his vehicle in Northeast Baltimore and placed a panicked call to Gladstone, a former mentor, seeking help. Gladstone has admitted that he retrieved a BB gun and visited the scene, dropping it underneath a vehicle to help justify Jenkins’s actions.

 

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12 hours ago, PinkydaPimp said:

So, if Bryant had not died, is there any chance its a stand your ground case?

https://www.foxnews.com/us/ohios-new-stand-your-ground-gun-law-takes-effect-tuesday

https://www.wlwt.com/article/ohio-s-new-stand-your-ground-law-everything-you-need-to-know/36196538

I ask because if it truly was bryant that called the police and the others were the initial aggressors, then could it not potentially be considered stand your ground?  For the record im not a fan of stand your ground personally, but it does complicate this case a bit.  Just curious everyone's thoughts on it. 

 

 

I think her "stand your ground" excuse would have ended when she chased the one girl out of the house and then tried to stab another girl standing outside. 

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The Most Powerful Weapon for Police Reform Is Back

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Reform agreements have long-term staying power, according to Walker, and there’s no better example of that than the past four years. “What Jeff Sessions did early in 2017, was to suspend the program. There were no new investigations. No new consent decrees,” he said. “There was a lot of worry that the local U.S. attorneys who participated in this process would undermine existing consent decrees.” But Walker hasn’t seen any evidence that the Trump administration’s halt on new investigations or agreements undermined the agreements that were already in place. He points to Newark, New Jersey where the police department has been under consent decree since 2016. In 2020, no Newark police officer fired his or her weapon, a feat that would have been unthinkable a few short years ago.

 

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Played in a softball event yesterday against a team of 20 somethings.  They hit 3 HRs and after each HR they would all yell  "Say his name...Joe Smith..say his name Joe Smith about the guy who hit the HR.  Then the next HR was "Say his name John Doe..say his name John Doe" 

Strange how sayings pop up in other places.

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Newark Police officers did not fire a single shot during the calendar year 2020, and the city didn’t pay a single dime to settle police brutality cases. That’s never happened, at least in the city’s modern history.

At the same time, crime is dropping, and police recovered almost 500 illegal guns from the street during the year.

https://www.nj.com/news/2021/01/newark-cops-with-reform-didnt-fire-a-single-shot-in-2020-moran.html

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32 minutes ago, PinkydaPimp said:

What? That's crazy. A US police force literally dropped a bomb from the air on domestic soil?

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On 4/24/2021 at 10:52 AM, PinkydaPimp said:

Also my understanding was he had a very strong tolerance so I’m not sure he was overdosing.  Maybe he had high levels though.  I don’t recall what they were and if that was considered an overdose or not however. 

Tolerance has a great impact on the inability to get high than the fatality. This is why there are so many ODs. People need to keep taking more to get high but the fatality tolerance doesn't keep up. It does increase, but only slightly.

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On 4/23/2021 at 6:11 PM, BladeRunner said:

Thanks.  I just wanted to know because we have so many white-guilt liberals in here ashamed of their own skin that speak on your behalf that having an actual person of color in here to talk to for the some real truth is enlightening. :thumbup:

I'm going to bypass them and come to you directly from now on.  Prepare yourself.  :)

 

I tried that with him. He has no interest in having a conversation. In fact he admitted to being suspicious of me from the outset, then he lied and told everybody that Joe didn’t want to let our conversation happen. All because we have differences of opinion. 
 

Just be warned, he doesn’t like statistics. 

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45 minutes ago, STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:

I tried that with him. He has no interest in having a conversation. In fact he admitted to being suspicious of me from the outset, then he lied and told everybody that Joe didn’t want to let our conversation happen. All because we have differences of opinion. 
 

Just be warned, he doesn’t like statistics. 

ive been talking to blade for like a year.  no problem with talking to him.  You seem bothered by this.  Let it go bud. 

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31 minutes ago, PinkydaPimp said:

ive been talking to blade for like a year.  no problem with talking to him.  You seem bothered by this.  Let it go bud. 


I know this might seem hard for you to believe, but I don’t get upset by words, stats or discussions. I admit I’m not a big fan of liars. You’ve already said you’re done taking to me so I suggest if you don’t like the truth, you put me on ignore. 

You don't want this smoke.
 

 

Edited by STEADYMOBBIN 22
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2 hours ago, dgreen said:

What? That's crazy. A US police force literally dropped a bomb from the air on domestic soil?

Yes, indeed. It's amazing the kinds of things that didn't get national media coverage back then.

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40 minutes ago, STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:


I know this might seem hard for you to believe, but I don’t get upset by words, stats or discussions. I admit I’m not a big fan of liars. You’ve already said you’re done taking to me so I suggest if you don’t like the truth, you put me on ignore. 

You don't want this smoke.
 

 

👍

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1 hour ago, NorvilleBarnes said:

Tolerance has a great impact on the inability to get high than the fatality. This is why there are so many ODs. People need to keep taking more to get high but the fatality tolerance doesn't keep up. It does increase, but only slightly.

did not know this.  Thanks!

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Just now, PinkydaPimp said:

did not know this.  Thanks!

Same here.

Made me think if the media bias/sourcing thread.

on one hand...look at the great things I learn from sources other than msm

On the other hand...wtf knows if norvillebarnes is talking out his ### and I’m too lazy to look it up so now I may be running around with fake facts

 btw love u norville, not about u

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On 4/23/2021 at 12:04 PM, John123 said:

Every cop should have to wear a camera, with a goal of every public interaction being recorded.  If an interaction isn't recorded, unless it can be proven there was a technical malfunction, it should result in automatic discipline up to and including possible termination.  It protects the public AND the police officer. 

I think even more important is that it should be an automatic termination for signing a false report.  If they want to try and cover for each other, make them aware that if evidence comes out that they signed a false report then they lose their job. 

It will also give 'cover' to good cops, in that they won't be perceived as a rat if they just tell the truth. 

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On 4/23/2021 at 3:11 PM, BladeRunner said:

Thanks.  I just wanted to know because we have so many white-guilt liberals in here ashamed of their own skin that speak on your behalf that having an actual person of color in here to talk to for the some real truth is enlightening. :thumbup:

I'm going to bypass them and come to you directly from now on.  Prepare yourself.  :)

 

Yikes.  Do you view white people that believe that there has been systematic racism of minorities as being ashamed of their own skin?

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On 4/23/2021 at 4:54 PM, PinkydaPimp said:

https://www.denverpost.com/2021/04/26/karen-garner-booking-video-loveland-police/
 

Quote

The officers fractured Garner’s arm and dislocated her shoulder during the arrest, her family said.

“Ready for the pop?” an officer identified by Garner’s lawyer as Hopp said to other officers while re-watching the footage together.

“What popped?” another officer asked.

“I think it was her shoulder,” Hopp responded.

In the video from the booking area, Hopp also can be heard saying, “I can’t believe I threw a 73-year-old on the ground.” After watching the footage of the arrest for several minutes, Jalali starts repeating “I hate this,” to which Hopp responds, “This is great” and “I love this.”

 

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9 hours ago, PinkydaPimp said:

Have you ever seen what MOVE did or who they were? I watched a two hour documentary on the commune. I wouldn't be hanging my hat on this one.

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16 hours ago, rockaction said:

Have you ever seen what MOVE did or who they were? I watched a two hour documentary on the commune. I wouldn't be hanging my hat on this one.

Yeah, but you can't raze two city blocks to catch people like that. I understand that burning down 60 homes was not the intention of the bombing, but still.

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On 4/12/2021 at 8:11 AM, Sinn Fein said:

This reminds me a lot of Ahmaud Arbery - when the police did not make arrests when they saw the video, they made arrests when the public saw the video.

Arbery Defendants indicted on three charges in Federal Court

 

Attempted Kidnapping

Interference with Rights

Use of Gun During Crime of Violence

 

 

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Burning of Police Station After George Floyd’s Death Draws 4-Year Sentence

A 23-year-old Brainerd, Minn., man was also ordered to pay $12 million for his role in the fire in Minneapolis, U.S. prosecutors said.

Huh. I was told these guys get away with everything.

Edited by Dinsy Ejotuz
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1 hour ago, gianmarco said:

Here we go again

Another man dies after being restrained.

So awful.

An sad example of police not being properly trained or equipped to deal with mental health issues. Did the cop need to put pressure on Mario's back once he was cuffed? He was inebriated and wasn't in a mental state to comply. I didn't hear the police ask for ID - maybe family could've been called?

Here's the full video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NN7sJex_uas

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3 hours ago, Dinsy Ejotuz said:

Huh. I was told these guys get away with everything.

I'm not someone that would state that.  

 

But this guy was just ordered to pay 12 million dollars.   I'm guess he'll get away with not meeting that figure.  

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7 hours ago, SoBeDad said:

An sad example of police not being properly trained or equipped to deal with mental health issues. Did the cop need to put pressure on Mario's back once he was cuffed? He was inebriated and wasn't in a mental state to comply. I didn't hear the police ask for ID - maybe family could've been called?

Here's the full video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NN7sJex_uas

ugh.  This is just terrible.  And yes it makes me wonder if he was paired there with a trained mental health professional if this could have been avoided.  Now i don't know that i saw them use excessive force.  They seemed to be cognizant of the knee and tried to get him out of the prone position.  Could that prone position have been avoided?  They probably handled it as best they knew how.  But man just a terrible situation and another person dead while being restrained.  :sadbanana:

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