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****OFFICIAL 2021 IN- SEASON DYNASTY TRADES****


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2 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

So I've eluded to this trade in a few threads and largely avoided posting it because the commish frequents this forum and I didnt want it to turn into a problem on the forum. However I really want the opinions of this group. 

After making this trade the commish said we either had to pay 2020 dues (not anywhere in the rules) or be immediately kicked out and trade vetoed. He said I was "trading away 3 studs and receiving two 2nds and a bunch of castaways"

I had every intention of coming back in 2020, however I'm not a fan of making up rules on the fly because an inner circle of the commish and 1st and 2nd place had an issue with the trade. My trade partner and I traded back, and needless to say decided to not come back.

Got: Lockett, Daniel Jones, Westbrook, Tate, two 2020 2nds

Gave: Godwin, Adams, Wentz

My reasoning: I like Godwin, but he was a must for my trade partner. Prior to this trade he had 2 pretty big stinkers and.hia stock seemed to be falling. I wanted to move him. Godwin and Lockett arent too far off and I like Locketts long term situation way better than Godwin (what if TB drafts the next Mariota?? Or signs him!?!?). I feel Lockett will finish ranked higher than Godwin. I explained this to the league and the commish

Adams' toe gets me nervous, and his season has been largely disappointing. Sure, he could go for more in some leagues but nobody in this league gave me anything for him. The best offer I got from someone else was a single late 1st. His situation long term isnt that great either with Rodgers and himself getting older. In the end, his toe has me extremely nervous

Wentz is a bum. Jones isnt much lower, and I think he will finish higher than Wentz as well. Why the commish called him a stud is beyond me. 

Westbrook was doing quite well before getting hurt. I think hes a really good target ROS. He was averaging 11.1 fp/g prior to getting hurt. We have a lot of flex players and he was better than who I was flexing at the time (corey davis)

Tate has been averaging 15.7 points per game this year. Again, he would have been a flex play for me, better than Hockenson, J. Samuels, Frank Gore- which were my flex options with Preston Williams out for the year. 

I firmly believed this made my team better. The commish and his inner circle felt it was collusive. 

Full disclosures: the commish knows all of the people in this league through another forum or other leagues. My trade partner and I only know each other. I had played in 1 league last year with the commish. 

Three things stand out to me. One, the commish shouldn't have made up the rules on the fly regarding expecting 2020 payment, though it is somewhat standard for deposits to be paid when a trade is questionable or involves future picks. I don't think this is *that* bad, but I get your criticism of it.

Second, I wouldn't scream collusion when an imbalanced trade goes through. People use that word too loosely and the commish probably did, too. Imbalanced is worth talking about, but collusion is a whole other can of worms.

Third, this trade is garbage and it sucks. I absolutely understand we all evaluate players and situations differently, and I also acknowledge that sometimes we overthink things. I think you got a little over your skis with this one. No offense, you know I defend your position on here quite a bit and value your perspective. But I wouldn't come close to taking that entire Lockett side for *either* Godwin by himself or Adams by himself, and if I were a league member I'd be very vocal about it, short of saying "collusion". The QB debate doesn't move the needle either way for me. In a bubble I'd rather have Jones than Wentz but they are throw ins in this deal.

The value imbalance here is what makes this so bad. Dynastytradecalculator.com has this as 99.6 to 48.8, with both Godwin or Adams basically equalling the entire other side. This isn't even the 4 quarters vs 1 dollar debate. This is 4 quarters for 2 dollars and a quarter. Sorry.

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12 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

Got: Lockett, Daniel Jones, Westbrook, Tate, two 2020 2nds

Gave: Godwin, Adams, Wentz

In my assessment, Godwin and Adams are both potential top-10 WRs for a LONG time.  Lockett and Dede conceivably could be viewed similarly by some owner somewhere,  but their consensus value is a tier or two lower.  

Let’s call Wentz and Jones a wash.  Both are servicable starters, either could be great, both could flop.  Tate has been around long enough to be basically a solid bye week filler/bench depth, but doesn’t swing the needle much.

Do two 2nds make up the difference between two top-tier players and two lesser ones?  Not in my book.  I’d say you got fleeced and badly.

Rules should be written in advance and enforced uniformly, but that’s a separate topic.  In a ruleset where the Commissioner has veto authority over trades for reasons of “imbalance” I think reversing this is justifiable,  In a ruleset where collusion is the only ground then obviously not,

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On a side note I wish the trade deadline hadn't come yet as it appears I might be able to buy Adams low. I absolutely think he is still a potential league winning difference maker. The toe injury hasn't helped. As for TD production, I think it is fair to say last year was a positive outlier and this year is a negative one. The FF playoffs are yet to come and Rodgers has been playing pretty good ball. I'm a little amazed people are talking about Adams like he is some scrub. Especially in dynasty. I get the redraft hesitation but I'm still starting him with confidence. Blown away I am even typing that.

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11 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

 

The value imbalance here is what makes this so bad. Dynastytradecalculator.com has this as 99.6 to 48.8, with both Godwin or Adams basically equalling the entire other side. This isn't even the 4 quarters vs 1 dollar debate. This is 4 quarters for 2 dollars and a quarter. Sorry.

https://dynasty101.com/trade-calculator/ has it as 5754 to 2408. 

Dan Hindery's dynasty trade value chart has it as 39+38+24 to 30+7+5+18+8+8 or 101 to 76, which is a bit closer and assumes those 2nds are worth more than either Tate or Westbrook. Not sure that is true, but to each their own. 

 

 

 

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Devy League - a lot of the better players that are 2020 draft eligible are already on rosters, but both devy and reg. rookies can be taken in the rookie draft.

Team A got N'Keal Harry WR Patriots and a 2020 2nd (mid probably)

Team B got Zamir White RB Georgia and a 2020 1st (mid probably)

Edited by JohnnyU
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2 hours ago, barackdhouse said:

Three things stand out to me. One, the commish shouldn't have made up the rules on the fly regarding expecting 2020 payment, though it is somewhat standard for deposits to be paid when a trade is questionable or involves future picks. I don't think this is *that* bad, but I get your criticism of it.

Second, I wouldn't scream collusion when an imbalanced trade goes through. People use koithat word too loosely and the commish probably did, too. Imbalanced is worth talking about, but collusion is a whole other can of worms.

Third, this trade is garbage and it sucks. I absolutely understand we all evaluate players and situations differently, and I also acknowledge that sometimes we overthink things. I think you got a little over your skis with this one. No offense, you know I defend your position on here quite a bit and value your perspective. But I wouldn't come close to taking that entire Lockett side for *either* Godwin by himself or Adams by himself, and if I were a league member I'd be very vocal about it, short of saying "collusion". The QB debate doesn't move the needle either way for me. In a bubble I'd rather have Jones than Wentz but they are throw ins in this deal.

The value imbalance here is what makes this so bad. Dynastytradecalculator.com has this as 99.6 to 48.8, with both Godwin or Adams basically equalling the entire other side. This isn't even the 4 quarters vs 1 dollar debate. This is 4 quarters for 2 dollars and a quarter. Sorry.

 

1 hour ago, Arodin said:

In my assessment, Godwin and Adams are both potential top-10 WRs for a LONG time.  Lockett and Dede conceivably could be viewed similarly by some owner somewhere,  but their consensus value is a tier or two lower.  

Let’s call Wentz and Jones a wash.  Both are servicable starters, either could be great, both could flop.  Tate has been around long enough to be basically a solid bye week filler/bench depth, but doesn’t swing the needle much.

Do two 2nds make up the difference between two top-tier players and two lesser ones?  Not in my book.  I’d say you got fleeced and badly.

Rules should be written in advance and enforced uniformly, but that’s a separate topic.  In a ruleset where the Commissioner has veto authority over trades for reasons of “imbalance” I think reversing this is justifiable,  In a ruleset where collusion is the only ground then obviously not,

 

1 hour ago, barackdhouse said:

https://dynasty101.com/trade-calculator/ has it as 5754 to 2408. 

Dan Hindery's dynasty trade value chart has it as 39+38+24 to 30+7+5+18+8+8 or 101 to 76, which is a bit closer and assumes those 2nds are worth more than either Tate or Westbrook. Not sure that is true, but to each their own. 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Shrugs said:

Yeah Dan, I’m almost willing to concede the possibility one could make a valid argument about Lockett and Godwin being a wash, but Godwin is four years younger. Then Adams is worth much more than the rest of that crap.

thank you all for the good responses. I can admit it's better long term for another team but I was trying to make a push for 2019. regardless, good thoughts here and I appreciate the discussion 

Edited by Dr. Dan
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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

Devy League - a lot of the better players that are 2020 draft eligible are already on rosters, but both devy and reg. rookies can be taken in the rookie draft.

Team A got N'Keal Harry WR Patriots and a 2020 2nd (mid probably)

Team B got Zamir White RB Georgia and a 2020 1st (mid probably)

I'm not in any devy leagues but initially I like Team B

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2 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

So I've eluded to this trade in a few threads and largely avoided posting it because the commish frequents this forum and I didnt want it to turn into a problem on the forum. However I really want the opinions of this group. 

After making this trade the commish said we either had to pay 2020 dues (not anywhere in the rules) or be immediately kicked out and trade vetoed. He said I was "trading away 3 studs and receiving two 2nds and a bunch of castaways"

I had every intention of coming back in 2020, however I'm not a fan of making up rules on the fly because an inner circle of the commish and 1st and 2nd place had an issue with the trade. My trade partner and I traded back, and needless to say decided to not come back.

Got: Lockett, Daniel Jones, Westbrook, Tate, two 2020 2nds

Gave: Godwin, Adams, Wentz

My reasoning: I like Godwin, but he was a must for my trade partner. Prior to this trade he had 2 pretty big stinkers and.hia stock seemed to be falling. I wanted Lockett and he wanted Godwin. Godwin and Lockett arent too far off and I like Locketts long term situation way better than Godwin (what if TB drafts the next Mariota?? Or signs him!?!?). I feel Lockett will finish ranked higher than Godwin. I explained this to the league and the commish

Adams' toe gets me nervous, and his season has been largely disappointing. Sure, he could go for more in some leagues but nobody in this league gave me anything for him. The best offer I got from someone else was a single late 1st. His situation long term isnt that great either with Rodgers and himself getting older. In the end, his toe has me extremely nervous

Wentz is a bum. Jones isnt much lower, and I think he will finish higher than Wentz as well. Why the commish called him a stud is beyond me. 

Westbrook was doing quite well before getting hurt. I think hes a really good target ROS. He was averaging 11.1 fp/g prior to getting hurt. We have a lot of flex players and he was better than who I was flexing at the time (corey davis)

Tate has been averaging 15.7 points per game this year. Again, he would have been a flex play for me, better than Hockenson, J. Samuels, Frank Gore- which were my flex options with Preston Williams out for the year. 

I firmly believed this made my team better. The commish and his inner circle felt it was collusive (I can honestly say it was not, I really like the guys I was getting and felt I'd finish better end of season with those 4 than the 3 I was giving up)

Full disclosures: the commish knows all of the people in this league through another forum or other leagues. My trade partner and I only know each other. I had played in 1 league last year with the commish. 

I don't like the trade for you but you offered a plausible explanation as to why you made it and how it works for you (and none of us know what will happen) and that should be enough to satisfy your commissioner.

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10 teamer, non PPR....

I gave up Juju (I'm still in the playoff hunt)

I got TY Hilton and a 2nd round rookie pick (going to be in the 11-14 range)

This was about an hour before last night's game :bag:, and I'm down Juju, Preston Williams, and Allen on bye.  My only other option this week was Corey Davis. 

 

Edited by matttyl
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12 team ppr

I gave up 

2020 1st (mid to late)

2020 2nd (mid to late)

Gallup

Rock Armstead

Gronk

 

For

Kelce

2020 3rd (mid)

Tannehill

Currenty in 4th and in win now mode, old team looking to grab one title before rebuilding. Had Doyle and Irv Smith at TE. Losing Gallup pushes G Tate or Renfrow into my starting lineup. Tannehill serves as Lamar insurance as I only had Fitz behind. 

Edited by FF Wiseguy
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37 minutes ago, FF Wiseguy said:

12 team ppr

I gave up 

2020 1st (mid to late)

2020 2nd (mid to late)

Gallup

Rock Armstead

Gronk

 

For

Kelce

2020 3rd (mid)

Tannehill

Currenty in 4th and in win now mode, old team looking to grab one title before rebuilding. Had Doyle and Irv Smith at TE. Losing Gallup pushes G Tate or Renfrow into my starting lineup. Tannehill serves as Lamar insurance as I only had Fitz behind. 

Pretty expensive for Kelce - I own him in a league where I’m for sure one of the top 2-3 teams and if I was offered this I may take it and hope I could get by with guys like Brate and Hurst.

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22 hours ago, FF Wiseguy said:

12 team ppr

I gave up 

2020 1st (mid to late)

2020 2nd (mid to late)

Gallup

Rock Armstead

Gronk

 

For

Kelce

2020 3rd (mid)

Tannehill

Currenty in 4th and in win now mode, old team looking to grab one title before rebuilding. Had Doyle and Irv Smith at TE. Losing Gallup pushes G Tate or Renfrow into my starting lineup. Tannehill serves as Lamar insurance as I only had Fitz behind. 

You better win now!

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On 11/22/2019 at 10:47 AM, matttyl said:

10 teamer, non PPR....

I gave up Juju (I'm still in the playoff hunt)

I got TY Hilton and a 2nd round rookie pick (going to be in the 11-14 range)

This was about an hour before last night's game :bag:, and I'm down Juju, Preston Williams, and Allen on bye.  My only other option this week was Corey Davis. 

 

Wow. At the beginning of the season JuJu looked impossible to trade for. I do not like the trade as I am not sure Hilton is a true “win-now” piece to help you. Brissett is struggling and they seem to have gone run heavy to compensate. On top of that is the major age difference. Hope it works out for you but I would take JuJu for that price all day.

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21 minutes ago, King of the Jungle said:

Wow. At the beginning of the season JuJu looked impossible to trade for. I do not like the trade as I am not sure Hilton is a true “win-now” piece to help you. Brissett is struggling and they seem to have gone run heavy to compensate. On top of that is the major age difference. Hope it works out for you but I would take JuJu for that price all day.

I'm not a huge JuJu fan but yeah at that cost it's auto accept. I think you could have held out for a more reliable win now type vet. Also, don't like making dynasty trades to just cover a bye or try to win a week, unless it's a must-win game for the playoffs. I actually try to be on the opposite side of those trades. :)

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On 11/21/2019 at 6:42 PM, Dr. Dan said:

So I've eluded to this trade in a few threads and largely avoided posting it because the commish frequents this forum and I didnt want it to turn into a problem on the forum. However I really want the opinions of this group. 

After making this trade the commish said we either had to pay 2020 dues (not anywhere in the rules) or be immediately kicked out and trade vetoed. He said I was "trading away 3 studs and receiving two 2nds and a bunch of castaways"

I had every intention of coming back in 2020, however I'm not a fan of making up rules on the fly because an inner circle of the commish and 1st and 2nd place had an issue with the trade. My trade partner and I traded back, and needless to say decided to not come back.

Got: Lockett, Daniel Jones, Westbrook, Tate, two 2020 2nds

Gave: Godwin, Adams, Wentz

My reasoning: I like Godwin, but he was a must for my trade partner. Prior to this trade he had 2 pretty big stinkers and.hia stock seemed to be falling. I wanted Lockett and he wanted Godwin. Godwin and Lockett arent too far off and I like Locketts long term situation way better than Godwin (what if TB drafts the next Mariota?? Or signs him!?!?). I feel Lockett will finish ranked higher than Godwin. I explained this to the league and the commish

Adams' toe gets me nervous, and his season has been largely disappointing. Sure, he could go for more in some leagues but nobody in this league gave me anything for him. The best offer I got from someone else was a single late 1st. His situation long term isnt that great either with Rodgers and himself getting older. In the end, his toe has me extremely nervous

Wentz is a bum. Jones isnt much lower, and I think he will finish higher than Wentz as well. Why the commish called him a stud is beyond me. 

Westbrook was doing quite well before getting hurt. I think hes a really good target ROS. He was averaging 11.1 fp/g prior to getting hurt. We have a lot of flex players and he was better than who I was flexing at the time (corey davis)

Tate has been averaging 15.7 points per game this year. Again, he would have been a flex play for me, better than Hockenson, J. Samuels, Frank Gore- which were my flex options with Preston Williams out for the year. 

I firmly believed this made my team better. The commish and his inner circle felt it was collusive (I can honestly say it was not, I really like the guys I was getting and felt I'd finish better end of season with those 4 than the 3 I was giving up)

Full disclosures: the commish knows all of the people in this league through another forum or other leagues. My trade partner and I only know each other. I had played in 1 league last year with the commish. 

Your league gonna overturn this when Godwin gets his third TD? 

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8 hours ago, King of the Jungle said:

Wow. At the beginning of the season JuJu looked impossible to trade for. I do not like the trade as I am not sure Hilton is a true “win-now” piece to help you. Brissett is struggling and they seem to have gone run heavy to compensate. On top of that is the major age difference. Hope it works out for you but I would take JuJu for that price all day.

Well, I’ll win this week in spite of Hilton’s performance.  Maybe I can move him after a big game or something.  This weeks win locked me into a playoff spot and still a shot at a bye 

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8 hours ago, tombonneau said:

I'm not a huge JuJu fan but yeah at that cost it's auto accept. I think you could have held out for a more reliable win now type vet. Also, don't like making dynasty trades to just cover a bye or try to win a week, unless it's a must-win game for the playoffs. I actually try to be on the opposite side of those trades. :)

Fully agree.  But it was a must win for me.  

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20 minutes ago, ChuckLiddell said:

Made a big move for the playoff push:

Traded 2 firsts (both playoff teams) and a late 3rd for Derrick Henry.  Henry slots in as my RB1 over the terribly mediocre and horribly disappointing trio of Gurley/Mixon/Freeman.

Nice, I was thinking of offering the same.

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6 hours ago, ChuckLiddell said:

Made a big move for the playoff push:

Traded 2 firsts (both playoff teams) and a late 3rd for Derrick Henry.  Henry slots in as my RB1 over the terribly mediocre and horribly disappointing trio of Gurley/Mixon/Freeman.

I own Henry and drafted him as a rookie, so I’ve been waiting for this. And I’m in the playoffs. But I’d be tempted to accept that offer. 

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9 hours ago, ChuckLiddell said:

Made a big move for the playoff push:

Traded 2 firsts (both playoff teams) and a late 3rd for Derrick Henry.  Henry slots in as my RB1 over the terribly mediocre and horribly disappointing trio of Gurley/Mixon/Freeman.

I'll take Henry. 

And btw great example of why you don't give up on guys so early. He goes from being valued as a second in early 2018 - people were trying to give him away for anything - to now 2 firsts + a year later. I mean just go back and read That Henry thread 

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2 hours ago, tombonneau said:

I'll take Henry. 

And btw great example of why you don't give up on guys so early. He goes from being valued as a second in early 2018 - people were trying to give him away for anything - to now 2 firsts + a year later. I mean just go back and read That Henry thread 

Exactly. I was tempted to dump him for a second rounder this offseason.

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1 hour ago, Dr. Octopus said:

Sure but Henderson has not looked all that great in his limited work. It’s not a terrible deal but I found it odd.

I saw a game earlier where Henderson came in and looked like he was shot out of a cannon.  He's got a lot of life in those legs and someday he will get to show more of it.  I like getting Etienne, but I hate losing Henderson more than Gurley. 

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33 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I saw a game earlier where Henderson came in and looked like he was shot out of a cannon.  He's got a lot of life in those legs and someday he will get to show more of it.  I like getting Etienne, but I hate losing Henderson more than Gurley. 

I'm getting lower on Etienne as I'm not sure he is an NFL 3 down back. My biggest issue is he's 200 pounds. Hes my rb6 in 2020 right now. Henderson could still be a bust (I'm still holding out hope) and Gurley doesnt looks great. Not sure which side I would want here tbh, so I'll call it an even swap given the LAR woes and Henderson off to a slow start

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9 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

I'm getting lower on Etienne as I'm not sure he is an NFL 3 down back. My biggest issue is he's 200 pounds. Hes my rb6 in 2020 right now. Henderson could still be a bust (I'm still holding out hope) and Gurley doesnt looks great. Not sure which side I would want here tbh, so I'll call it an even swap given the LAR woes and Henderson off to a slow start

You never know with Etienne, he could land in a horrible situation, but I like his talent just as much as Taylor or Swift.  In fact, he could land in a better situation making him more valuable in dynasty than either.  I predict that a better team will draft Etienne before Taylor or Swift, who will probably go earlier in the draft.  This is the risk you take when you trade for college players over proven NFL players.  It could backfire on you in a heartbeat.

Edited by JohnnyU
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35 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

You never know with Etienne, he could land in a horrible situation, but I like his talent just as much as Taylor or Swift.  In fact, he could land in a better situation making him more valuable in dynasty than either.  I predict that a better team will draft Etienne before Taylor or Swift, who will probably go earlier in the draft.  This is the risk you take when you trade for college players over proven NFL players.  It could backfire on you in a heartbeat.

This is very true. The upside is there, especially if a better team takes him. 

This RB class seems over rated to me in general. We may only see one 1st rounder, and it could be in the teens to 20s again. It's way better than 2019 but not nearly as good as what many made it out to be. 

There are teams looking at RBs round 2 and 3 and Etienne may very well find himself in a great situation. I dont play devy leagues, and I am just starting to make my rookie tiers. A lot can change after the draft is over

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3 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

This is very true. The upside is there, especially if a better team takes him. 

This RB class seems over rated to me in general. We may only see one 1st rounder, and it could be in the teens to 20s again. It's way better than 2019 but not nearly as good as what many made it out to be. 

There are teams looking at RBs round 2 and 3 and Etienne may very well find himself in a great situation. I dont play devy leagues, and I am just starting to make my rookie tiers. A lot can change after the draft is over

I disagree with you about only 1 1st rd RB.  I believe there will will be at least two and possibly three.

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3 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I disagree with you about only 1 1st rd RB.  I believe there will will be at least two and possibly three.

That would make me feel much better. I think there should be but I was surprised to see some sites with 2-3 round grades, based on league feedback, on some very good RBs. Its early. 

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2 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

That would make me feel much better. I think there should be but I was surprised to see some sites with 2-3 round grades, based on league feedback, on some very good RBs. Its early. 

Ii think this class of RBs is better than most years and some teams will look at that to wait until the 2nd round.  I just think the grades on Taylor and Swift, and probably even Etienne, are too good for the 2nd round.

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1 minute ago, JohnnyU said:

Ii think this class of RBs is better than most years and some teams will look at that to wait until the 2nd round.  I just think the grades on Taylor and Swift, and probably even Etienne, are too good for the 2nd round.

Do you think there are enough teams where their biggest need is RB/would go for a RB round 1? 

Miami, since they have so many picks, seems like an obvious choice

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5 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

Do you think there are enough teams where their biggest need is RB/would go for a RB round 1? 

Miami, since they have so many picks, seems like an obvious choice

I can definitely see at least two teams taking a RB in Rd 1 and I can see teams trading up to the later part of Rd 1 to take one of the three if he's still on the board late in Rd 1.  Having said that, there are other RBs with great value to be had in Rd. 2 or later.  The depth of this RB class is great, both at the top and later.   I just don't see the top 3 dropping in the draft.  

Edited by JohnnyU
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