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****OFFICIAL 2021 OFF- SEASON DYNASTY TRADES****


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No, they won't accept

I don't know why so many people are saying that this is a fair return (despite preferring CMC as they should). It isn't. This is a fraction of what it should cost for a guy like CMC, either that or th

It's a bit much to say the trade should be overturned. It's just a bunch of junk for a bunch of junk.

7 hours ago, slackjawedyokel said:

Start 1QB league, $500 salary cap:

Team A receives: Tom Brady $41

Team B receives: Marcus Mariota $32

I'd take Mariota unless my team had a 2-year window. If I had all older players, I'd probably take Brady and worry about rebuilding later.

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8 hours ago, bostonfred said:

I can respect that.  But i think that's an important point to make when commenting on a trade like this, because the point of this thread is to guage trade value across leagues and your opinion is probably a pretty common one but also one that makes  your thoughts on what he's worth in picks pretty one dimensional.  

Some thoughts - If you're going to comment that picks 2, 5 and 7 are cheap for bell, I assume that means you'd pay four early picks. If you had bell would you trade him for the top five picks?  Like 1.1, 1.2. 1.3, 1.4 and 1.5? If you had the top 5 picks in this year's draft would you trade all five of them for bell?  Is there a price that's too high for you when acquiring a stud?

I probably undervalue rookies more than I should, but I think others over value them. It's amazing to me how many people think every player drafted in the first two rounds this year is going to be a stud or at least take over the starting role soon. Looking back at drafts from the last five years, it's actually amazing how many players don't make it, and how long it takes for some of them to make it.

Sure, maybe this year is different. Maybe this is the year when all the studs come out and we have 7 rookie starting RB's, we have young TE's taking the league by storm, and we have another Julio and AJ Green in the class. And maybe not. I'd bet against that happening but it's that time of year where everyone loves their rookies.

That said, sure picks 1,2,3,4 would probably get Bell away from me, especially if I was rebuilding. That gives me Davis and the 3 top RB's. The problem with that is still, unless one of those guys turns out to be Zeke-like, I've got a bunch of pieces that probably still won't give me the production of Bell and whoever else I put out there, so it would have to be a rebuild situation.

ETA: my team last year started Winston, DJ, Hyde, Jordy, Davante Adams, D. Thomas, and Ertz at the skill positions, for the most part. I went 15-1 and won the championship. I am under no illusions that this is a great team, but I do know that the only reason I have a shot again this year is because of DJ. Bell is the same way. If you have him, you have a shot to win it all with some decent pieces around him. It's really hard to win a championship without a guy like Bell or DJ.

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13 hours ago, msudaisy26 said:

We are playing an imaginary football game by betting on what players will accumulate stats, and we have no say in what plays are called. If you don't like risks, you are doing it wrong. 

For the record I think that 2019 1st should have been left out or on the other side. 

Well there are different levels of risk. Bell has his share of risks (injury/suspension) but one thing we do know is that when he's on the field he's one of the biggest difference makers in this game.

The risk the other side is taking is hoping that he can hit on those picks at a greater than 50% rate (and then we get into the issue of how big the "hit" needs to be). If McCaffrey has "only" a Darren Sproles type career is that enough of a "hit". If Howard turns into Etrz or Ebron is that "good enough"? 

The other risk is that some of those players (especially TEs) will take time to develop which means using roster spots on these guys without really knowing what you have for a few seasons perhaps, and thus not having flexibility to pick up guys on waivers.

I wouldn't have said Bell was "super" cheap - but I clearly favor that side of the deal, no matter what the rest of my roster looks like. Trying to move Murray in a separate deal would have been more beneficial most likely - I agree throwing in that extra first round pick on that side was very foolish, because if he doesn't hit on these rookies this year he will be doubling down on his "mistake" in 2019.

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3 minutes ago, steelers1080 said:
7 hours ago, slackjawedyokel said:

Start 1QB league, $500 salary cap:

Team A receives: Tom Brady $41

Team B receives: Marcus Mariota $32

I'd take Mariota unless my team had a 2-year window. If I had all older players, I'd probably take Brady and worry about rebuilding later.

I'm the opposite.  For less than 2% of the cap gimmie the elite scorer.  In a 1 QB league I'll worry about getting a long term answer later, it's too easy to find a stopgap if necessary.

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Do 4 quarters make a dollar?  10 teamer - qb, rb, wr, wr, flex, flex, te, k, idps....

A gets David Johnson

B gets Ingram, C Hyde, J Landry, a 2018 first (likely early), a 2019 first (who knows, but generally a weaker team's pick)

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6 minutes ago, matttyl said:

Do 4 quarters make a dollar?  10 teamer - qb, rb, wr, wr, flex, flex, te, k, idps....

A gets David Johnson

B gets Ingram, C Hyde, J Landry, a 2018 first (likely early), a 2019 first (who knows, but generally a weaker team's pick)

Technically yes, but I'd take Johnson.

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Just wrapping up our rookie draft - here are some trades that went down.  The third one is the one I'd like to hear feedback on.  Not involved in these.

  • 55 House of Pain gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.11;Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.08;Year 2017 Draft Pick 4.08
  • Fat Axl gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.08

 

 

This next one was made with 1.05 on the clock - IFM wanted to get Cook and Williams.  Drafted Williams with 1.05, cook went 1.06

 

With Cook gone, he moved down again

  • I Fellate Myself gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.07
  • Fat Axl gave up Lynch, Marshawn OAK RB; Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.11

and again..

  • I Fellate Myself gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.11;Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.04
  • Fighting Cotons gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.12;Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.01

he took Curtis Samuel at 1.12, then moved 2.01 for...  

  • The Great #### gave up Year 2018 Round 2 Draft Pick from The Great ####;Year 2018 Round 2 Draft Pick from 55 House of Pain
  • I Fellate Myself gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.01

and called it a day after this blockbuster...

  • I Fellate Myself gave up Hogan, Chris NEP WR
  • Rainbows and Unicorns gave up Year 2018 Round 4 Draft Pick from Rainbows and Unicorns

 

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18 hours ago, ghostguy123 said:

12 team PPR (1.25 for TE)

Picks 2,5,7,10 and a 2018 2nd

for

Leveon Bell, Demarco Murray, and a 2019 1st (could be anywhere but best guess is in the 4-7 range with upside if he bombs on some of those picks)

A little light for Bell. Seems like people really forget that rookies bust at a rate of 50% (its actually higher than that IMO) and even when they pan out, they don't typically put up top 2 RB seasons like Zeke did in year 1. The outlier isn't what Oz posted, that's the most likely scenario where you end up with 1 good to great player, 1 ok player and 2 outright busts. Ghost's example of Bell and next year's 2 (was that spent on Evans or Sankey?) was the true outlier (even Bell wasn't considered a true stud right out of the gate with his 3.5ypc, which coincidently allowed me to acquire him after his rookie season.)

IMO:

Murray =< 10 + 2nd (likely late it looks like)

2019 1st = 5 (highly unlikely most of those rook's put up big numbers right away, especially if it is Davis, McCaf, Howard and Engram as someone proposed)

Bell > 2 + 7

Other team shouldn't have given up its future first along with the players, worst thing you can do if rebuilding. Even great players are rarely fantasy forces their rookie seasons.

 

 

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32 minutes ago, menobrown said:

Having a hard time with this math.

Based on the original post: "(could be anywhere but best guess is in the 4-7 range with upside if he bombs on some of those picks)" Law of averages suggests he WILL bomb on probably 50% of those picks. And I am assuming that if the poster is projecting it there already that far out that the rest of that teams squad is weak.

If you like, change that to 2019 1st = 7, that leaves

Bell >= 2 & 5. A lot closer, but I'd still lean towards Bell.

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44 minutes ago, Buckna said:

Based on the original post: "(could be anywhere but best guess is in the 4-7 range with upside if he bombs on some of those picks)" Law of averages suggests he WILL bomb on probably 50% of those picks. And I am assuming that if the poster is projecting it there already that far out that the rest of that teams squad is weak.

If you like, change that to 2019 1st = 7, that leaves

Bell >= 2 & 5. A lot closer, but I'd still lean towards Bell.

I don't agree with the 50% law of average bomb rate in this draft with those picks but not the issue I had.

I just don't see see current pick 5 in this draft is worth remotely as little as waiting two years for a random draft pick when this specific draft has extremely strong options at 5 and for that matter at 7.

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2 hours ago, oldmanhawkins said:

This next one was made with 1.05 on the clock - IFM wanted to get Cook and Williams.  Drafted Williams with 1.05, cook went 1.06

Thomas on his own is worth those two picks, so getting Abdullah for free. Abdullah is worth mid 2nd IMO, but some teams will be giving up on him while he has some + news. 1.7 is kind of a garbage pick this year, not much different from 2.10. I would have taken Cook first and hoped 1.6 got spooked by the back injury news. He did the right thing by trading down, but I don't like what he did by moving it to 2018 2nds or taking Samuel early.

 

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3 hours ago, matttyl said:

Do 4 quarters make a dollar?  10 teamer - qb, rb, wr, wr, flex, flex, te, k, idps....

A gets David Johnson

B gets Ingram, C Hyde, J Landry, a 2018 first (likely early), a 2019 first (who knows, but generally a weaker team's pick)

I would take the Landry side

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Just now, One More Rep said:

I would take the Landry side

Interesting.  I should have mentioned it's a non-PPR league.  You kinda caught me off guard by calling that side the "Landry side" because of that - I'd call it the Hyde/Ingram side, but anyway.....

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Just now, matttyl said:

Interesting.  I should have mentioned it's a non-PPR league.  You kinda caught me off guard by calling that side the "Landry side" because of that - I'd call it the Hyde/Ingram side, but anyway.....

Non PPR would probably change it for me but still a solid return in my opinion

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I like the pair of picks side, primarily because of this year's draft. Next year's swap is basically a roll of the dice to which team's draft slot is better or worse. (Sort of like for better or worse.)

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How is god's name is pick 5 this year worth that 2019 1st?  Even if I knew that 2019 1st would be the #1 I would take pick 5 this year, and I am generally one of the bigger "I don't devalue future picks" arguers.  This is a very good draft class through pick 5.  The top 5 picks in this draft could easily be the #1 in other years.  Heck, even the rookie drafts so far this year are in all different orders cause there are a lot of good players. 

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5 hours ago, oldmanhawkins said:

Just wrapping up our rookie draft - here are some trades that went down.  The third one is the one I'd like to hear feedback on.  Not involved in these.

  • 55 House of Pain gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.11;Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.08;Year 2017 Draft Pick 4.08
  • Fat Axl gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.08

 

 

This next one was made with 1.05 on the clock - IFM wanted to get Cook and Williams.  Drafted Williams with 1.05, cook went 1.06

 

With Cook gone, he moved down again

  • I Fellate Myself gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.07
  • Fat Axl gave up Lynch, Marshawn OAK RB; Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.11

and again..

  • I Fellate Myself gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.11;Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.04
  • Fighting Cotons gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.12;Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.01

he took Curtis Samuel at 1.12, then moved 2.01 for...  

  • The Great #### gave up Year 2018 Round 2 Draft Pick from The Great ####;Year 2018 Round 2 Draft Pick from 55 House of Pain
  • I Fellate Myself gave up Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.01

and called it a day after this blockbuster...

  • I Fellate Myself gave up Hogan, Chris NEP WR
  • Rainbows and Unicorns gave up Year 2018 Round 4 Draft Pick from Rainbows and Unicorns

 

I think I see the problem.  Far riskier leaving Cook on the board than Williams, although it's unlikely he'd be there either.  He should have attempted to swap 1.07 for 1.06 before picking (Cook).

Don't like the end result.  Lynch wasn't enough for 1.07 -> 1.11 and getting two 2nd's for 2.01 is poor return as well.  Samuel feels early at 1.12 but that's personal preference and if it had been Zones or JJSS I'd be ok with that.

Team A gave Michael Thomas, Ameer Abdullah, Chris Hogan
Team A got Mike Williams, Marshawn Lynch, Chris Samuel, 2018 2nd, 2018 2nd, 2018 4th.

Yuck.

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5 hours ago, Buckna said:

A little light for Bell. Seems like people really forget that rookies bust at a rate of 50% (its actually higher than that IMO) and even when they pan out, they don't typically put up top 2 RB seasons like Zeke did in year 1. The outlier isn't what Oz posted, that's the most likely scenario where you end up with 1 good to great player, 1 ok player and 2 outright busts. Ghost's example of Bell and next year's 2 (was that spent on Evans or Sankey?) was the true outlier (even Bell wasn't considered a true stud right out of the gate with his 3.5ypc, which coincidently allowed me to acquire him after his rookie season.)

IMO:

Murray =< 10 + 2nd (likely late it looks like)

2019 1st = 5 (highly unlikely most of those rook's put up big numbers right away, especially if it is Davis, McCaf, Howard and Engram as someone proposed)

Bell > 2 + 7

Other team shouldn't have given up its future first along with the players, worst thing you can do if rebuilding. Even great players are rarely fantasy forces their rookie seasons.

 

 

wut

no

I wouldn't take a 2019 1st for 1.16.  Waiting two years for a pick that might not even be earlier?  That's horrible return.  You're talking about Dalvin Cook now to wait two years and get what could be 1.12?  That's nutty.

I think it's good return for Bell.  I traded him earlier for 1.03, 1.07, and 2018 1st and I'd do it again.  Awful orphan team, full rebuild, and contract issues retaining Bell helped, but I have to assume this guy giving up Bell is going full rebuild too.  Bell carries a lot of future risk with the lack of long term commitment from PIT, his status in the drug program, and his injury history.  He's very easy to bail out on if you are two years from legit contention.  Same with Murray.  I have leagues where I'd take either side of this trade and not think twice.  If I'm contending I'd happily give all those picks for the now power in that trade and if I'm stripping it down to the primer I'd take those picks for the guys that are currently at the highest value they'll ever see again.

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8 minutes ago, Hankmoody said:

I wouldn't take a 2019 1st for 1.16. 

:porked:

Maybe not from a stacked team, but from a team rebuilding you wouldnt want a future 1st for a pick this year that probably wouldnt even be able to help you till 2019 anyway even if you did happen to draft a good player?

Pick 16 for a 2019 1st from a current rebuilding team is about the biggest dynasty no brainer there is.

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20 minutes ago, Hankmoody said:

wut

no

I wouldn't take a 2019 1st for 1.16.  Waiting two years for a pick that might not even be earlier?  That's horrible return.  You're talking about Dalvin Cook now to wait two years and get what could be 1.12?  That's nutty.

I think it's good return for Bell.  I traded him earlier for 1.02 and 1.07 straight up and I'd do it again.  Awful orphan team, full rebuild, and contract issues retaining Bell helped, but I have to assume this guy giving up Bell is going full rebuild too.  Bell carries a lot of future risk with the lack of long term commitment from PIT, his status in the drug program, and his injury history.  He's very easy to bail out on if you are two years from legit contention.  Same with Murray.  I have leagues where I'd take either side of this trade and not think twice.  If I'm contending I'd happily give all those picks for the now power in that trade and if I'm stripping it down to the primer I'd take those picks for the guys that are currently at the highest value they'll ever see again.

You traded Bell for 1.02 and 1.07? OK, THAT's low for Bell. 

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5 minutes ago, ghostguy123 said:

:porked:

Maybe not from a stacked team, but from a team rebuilding you wouldnt want a future 1st for a pick this year that probably wouldnt even be able to help you till 2019 anyway even if you did happen to draft a good player?

Pick 16 for a 2019 1st from a current rebuilding team is about the biggest dynasty no brainer there is.

Well all my 16 man leagues are IDP so that puts a bit more value on 1.16.

But under normal circumstances no - it would have to be an extreme situation.   2 years is a long time.  I have turned multiple teams around from garbage to playoffs in 2 years and have seen it done by others often enough not to bank on it.  And adding 1.16 this year for free only helps that cause thus making 2019 later.  I'd rather take my shot at Perine or Zones or Hunt.  They will all go for more than a 2019 1st as long as they don't Treadwell it up.  

Last year would have been much more likely, that's a different draft.

1.16 for a 2018 1st would also be much more likely, I'd have to see the full roster, but still not anywhere near 1.05 in any event.

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10 hours ago, matttyl said:

Do 4 quarters make a dollar?  10 teamer - qb, rb, wr, wr, flex, flex, te, k, idps....

A gets David Johnson

B gets Ingram, C Hyde, J Landry, a 2018 first (likely early), a 2019 first (who knows, but generally a weaker team's pick)

Depends on the league and my team. If my team is void of talent except for Johnson I make this move and start flipping the players for picks. No reason why you can't get a couple of seconds or a late 1st for Ingram or Hyde especially during the season if they are performing, and you should be able to get a 1st for Landry. So this trade could be 3 1st's and 3 2nd's or 5 1st's isn't a bad price. The league would also have to be very active.

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5 hours ago, thriftyrocker said:

12 team 0.5 ppr idp

Boyd + 2018 2nd (late)

for

Doctson (orphan team giving up Doctson fwiw)

Doctson by a lot

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4 hours ago, Hankmoody said:

I think I see the problem.  Far riskier leaving Cook on the board than Williams, although it's unlikely he'd be there either.  He should have attempted to swap 1.07 for 1.06 before picking (Cook).

Don't like the end result.  Lynch wasn't enough for 1.07 -> 1.11 and getting two 2nd's for 2.01 is poor return as well.  Samuel feels early at 1.12 but that's personal preference and if it had been Zones or JJSS I'd be ok with that.

Team A gave Michael Thomas, Ameer Abdullah, Chris Hogan
Team A got Mike Williams, Marshawn Lynch, Chris Samuel, 2018 2nd, 2018 2nd, 2018 4th.

Yuck.

Well he's at it again, but this one was a big win.  If he didn't give Thomas away he'd be the favorite.

55 house of pain gave up David Johnson 
IFM gave up tevin Coleman, a 2018 1st and three 2018 2nds

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12 team PPR, start QRRWWTKDFF

Holding 1.3, 2.10, and 3.4 when rookie draft opened tonight. Wanted any of the top 4 RBs in the first. Did not want WR due to roster makeup and league parameters. 

1.1 Fournette
1.2 McCaffrey

Traded 1.3 for 1.4 and 2.6.

1.3 Davis

Tried to trade back to 1.5 but couldn't get it done.

1.4 Mixon

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21 minutes ago, oldmanhawkins said:

Well he's at it again, but this one was a big win.  If he didn't give Thomas away he'd be the favorite.

55 house of pain gave up David Johnson 
IFM gave up tevin Coleman, a 2018 1st and three 2018 2nds

Even if that pick was guaranteed to be #1 overall that is still an awful trade.  Just terrible 

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12 team, start 1/2/3/1, 0.5PPR

I give: Charles, 2018 5th (should be late), $25 FAAB (out of a $1,000 budget)

I get: 3.03 + 2018 4th (who knows)

 

I give: 2.04 + 3.03 + 2018 4th (should be late)

I get: 2.02

 

Charles might have something left, but I just wanted to get out while I could.  4th and 5th rounders aren't terribly valuable in this league, FWIW.

On the 2nd trade, it was simply getting a better draft slot.  Plus I have three 1st and don't have the roster room for that many picks.

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2 hours ago, twistd said:

This occurred in my FFPC league:

Team A-Michael Thomas, Ebron, 2018 third, 15.09

Team B-Larry Fitzgerald, Bennett, Edelman, 14.07

One team has a win now mentality, that's certain.

Team A - not close.

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4 hours ago, twistd said:

This occurred in my FFPC league:

Team A-Michael Thomas, Ebron, 2018 third, 15.09

Team B-Larry Fitzgerald, Bennett, Edelman, 14.07

 

1 hour ago, twistd said:

After complaints to the commissioner, it has been reversed. 

Good because every single player is better compared to their counter part for team A.  Thomas and picks are worth more than Fitz and Edelman and Enron easily worth a lot more than Bennett especially in FFPC.  

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2 hours ago, Andrew74 said:

12 team, start 1/2/3/1, 0.5PPR

I give: Charles, 2018 5th (should be late), $25 FAAB (out of a $1,000 budget)

I get: 3.03 + 2018 4th (who knows)

 

I give: 2.04 + 3.03 + 2018 4th (should be late)

I get: 2.02

 

Charles might have something left, but I just wanted to get out while I could.  4th and 5th rounders aren't terribly valuable in this league, FWIW.

On the 2nd trade, it was simply getting a better draft slot.  Plus I have three 1st and don't have the roster room for that many picks.

Wow - $25 out of $1000 budget...might swing balance of power in league!!!

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1 minute ago, garlicduck said:

Wow - $25 out of $1000 budget...might swing balance of power in league!!!

:D

He wanted FAAB, so I threw out $25...and he accepted.  Half the league has hundreds of $ left at the end of the year. It was odd. 

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2 hours ago, twistd said:

After complaints to the commissioner, it has been reversed. 

The trade is terrible, but I don't think I've ever seen a commish reverse a trade in any of my leagues, nor would I want them to.  I used to be in leagues (long ago) where members had to vote to approve trades.  Of course, some people vetoed every trade and the leagues sucked because of it.  I just don't believe trades should be reversed because some (or even all) think they are unfair. 

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1 hour ago, sheerterror said:

I like this exit on Hilton.

Exit on Hilton?  It's not like he's Fitz or B. Marshall.  He's 27 to be 28 during season and finished as #5 WR last year and being drafted early in 2nd round of dynasty startups.  Not a bad return but I'll take Hilton.

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1 hour ago, garlicduck said:

Exit on Hilton?  It's not like he's Fitz or B. Marshall.  He's 27 to be 28 during season and finished as #5 WR last year and being drafted early in 2nd round of dynasty startups.  Not a bad return but I'll take Hilton.

Poor choice of wording, would return have made you feel better?

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On 5/25/2017 at 11:37 PM, slackjawedyokel said:

Start 1QB league, $500 salary cap:

Team A receives: Tom Brady $41

Team B receives: Marcus Mariota $32

Are there contract years involved?  I think Brady is more valuable in a small league but where I own Mariota I wouldn't trade him for Brady despite being one of the top contenders. Yes, that's illogical. But MM is one of my favorite players. 

 

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4 minutes ago, jadensdad said:

Ppr superflex 

team a - brandin cooks,Moncrief, 4.5

team b - diggs, Doyle, duke,3.6

I wouldn't trade Cooks if you put Moncrief and the pick on the other side.

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  • Gottabesweet changed the title to ****OFFICIAL 2021 OFF- SEASON DYNASTY TRADES****

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