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****OFFICIAL 2021 OFF- SEASON DYNASTY TRADES****


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No, they won't accept

Barkley on this one, it isn't that close

It's a bit much to say the trade should be overturned. It's just a bunch of junk for a bunch of junk.

5 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

He's gets to a WR4 by being a WR2 for two weeks and a WR6 for four. That's bad for trying to win week to week.

That is the bigger point in this equation.  Golladay has been extremely consistent when healthy and it 2019 the QB carousel that fed him while Stafford was out didn't slow him at all.  That is very valuable in this fake game and Slayton is no where near that and as a deep threat primarily doesn't project to that either.  He is a great best ball WR4 and good upside flier when in a pinch but not even close to the value of Golladay 

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6 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

He's gets to a WR4 by being a WR2 for two weeks and a WR6 for four. That's bad for trying to win week to week.

10 games this year with less then 50 yards receiving...12 games with less then 5 receptions...still only 24 and talented so there is hope but I am not a fan of players who are that unreliable.

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1 minute ago, Gally said:

That is the bigger point in this equation.  Golladay has been extremely consistent when healthy and it 2019 the QB carousel that fed him while Stafford was out didn't slow him at all.  That is very valuable in this fake game and Slayton is no where near that and as a deep threat primarily doesn't project to that either.  He is a great best ball WR4 and good upside flier when in a pinch but not even close to the value of Golladay 

We were talking about *my* WR4, not a WR4 in the NFL. And as my WR4 he is competing with my second QB in superflex to make it into my lineup.

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2 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

I swear to God if I draft the next Jefferson, Gibson, Higgins, Aiyuk, Kareem Hunt, Kamara at 2.03 this will really be a grand slam. That 2.03 is worth two Slaytons.

That would be nice. Yeah, I was going to point out that your 2.03 in Superflex is looking at a top twelve talent, really. It's going to go Lawrence, Wilson/Fields, Lance, Jones before then, maybe.

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8 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

No, no we mean WR4 on my roster, not a WR4 vs the rest of the field in fantasy. 

 

6 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

####. Just remembered it is superflex as well so in the WR4 replaceable category, we are literally talking about the QB2 (on my roster) to compare to.

 

1 minute ago, barackdhouse said:

We were talking about *my* WR4, not a WR4 in the NFL. And as my WR4 he is competing with my second QB in superflex to make it into my lineup.

People have completely missed this distinction but that's ok. We're talking about bench pieces here. All of them.

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Just now, rockaction said:

That would be nice. Yeah, I was going to point out that your 2.03 in Superflex is looking at a top twelve talent, really. It's going to go Lawrence, Wilson/Fields, Lance, Jones before then, maybe.

there is no maybe

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Just now, barackdhouse said:

there is no maybe

Just naturally cautious about declaratives. Comes from years of the social sciences/political philosophy. When there are so many factors, absolutes become tricky. It's a natural tendency.

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7 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

We were talking about *my* WR4, not a WR4 in the NFL. And as my WR4 he is competing with my second QB in superflex to make it into my lineup.

Okay. Go do better for your WR4.

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2 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

At no point in any of this did I try and say Slayton is worth as much as Golladay. People are arguing that the sky is blue.

You didn't, but you said his upside was at least on par, IIRC. That'll get a lot of people to conflate the two.

Besides, I don't think everyone is coming down on your deal. I personally like it. Other people probably do, too, in some respect, especially once they think that you've really gotten a first-rounder in a 1QB league.

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FWIW, Slayton is my WR6 and I feel comfortable dealing guys ahead of him for a draft pick or two. I'm confident he can be a reasonable WR5.

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9 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

We were talking about *my* WR4, not a WR4 in the NFL. And as my WR4 he is competing with my second QB in superflex to make it into my lineup.

I knew that was what you meant by WR4 however having a WR1 as your teams WR4 is a huge advantage and giving away that type of talent because he is only your "WR4" is generally not good business.

 

I do understand that the 2.03 was your real target but that is nowhere near the value of Golladay IMO.  I think you sold cheap........which might be fine but it is a big benefit to your opponent which does hurt you.

 

Good diacussions.

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2 minutes ago, rockaction said:

FWIW, Slayton is my WR6 and I feel comfortable dealing guys ahead of him for a draft pick or two. I'm confident he can be a reasonable 

You're welcome....hahahhaa

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Just naturally cautious about declaratives. Comes from years of the social sciences/political philosophy. When there are so many factors, absolutes become tricky. It's a natural tendency.

Oh me, too. It's magic football though. My bet (because that's what this is, and bets have an absolute finality to them) is that 4 QBs go before 2.03.

Golladay would be a bye week fill in on this roster. I wouldn't be starting him over Tyreek, Jefferson, Juju or my QB2 choice between Brady and Carr. I am a little thin at RB3 so I would probably start him over my RB3 in a flex. Really good chance Slayton never sniffs my lineup, but if he happens to hit then this is a profitable play. Not counting on it much. My real bet here is 2.03 and value (Slayton's chances are much greater than zero).

Really, really good chance I come out of this draft with 2 more WRs that I would bump to my personal WR4 or 5 and either of Golladay or Slayton (if I did or didn't make the deal already) would get bumped to WR5 or 6, and I'm also probably coming out with 2 more RBs that would fill a flex spot also. Maybe a better QB2 as well.

So far Golladay's ceiling has been around WR12 among an ocean of players at multiple positions that can replace his production. During a bye week. He just isn't a ceiling play. 

The comp here isn't Golladay v Slayton, it is Golladay v 2.03 plus Slayton. 

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6 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

Okay. Go do better for your WR4.

How does one of the top WRs in the draft sound? I realize I'm not getting that with *this* deal. But I will probably be getting that. Making my current WR4 my WR5, no?

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7 minutes ago, rockaction said:

You didn't, but you said his upside was at least on par, IIRC. That'll get a lot of people to conflate the two.

Besides, I don't think everyone is coming down on your deal. I personally like it. Other people probably do, too, in some respect, especially once they think that you've really gotten a first-rounder in a 1QB league.

no no it's all fair

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19 minutes ago, barackdhouse said:

Oh me, too. It's magic football though. My bet (because that's what this is, and bets have an absolute finality to them) is that 4 QBs go before 2.03.

Golladay would be a bye week fill in on this roster. I wouldn't be starting him over Tyreek, Jefferson, Juju or my QB2 choice between Brady and Carr. I am a little thin at RB3 so I would probably start him over my RB3 in a flex. Really good chance Slayton never sniffs my lineup, but if he happens to hit then this is a profitable play. Not counting on it much. My real bet here is 2.03 and value (Slayton's chances are much greater than zero).

Really, really good chance I come out of this draft with 2 more WRs that I would bump to my personal WR4 or 5 and either of Golladay or Slayton (if I did or didn't make the deal already) would get bumped to WR5 or 6, and I'm also probably coming out with 2 more RBs that would fill a flex spot also. Maybe a better QB2 as well.

So far Golladay's ceiling has been around WR12 among an ocean of players at multiple positions that can replace his production. During a bye week. He just isn't a ceiling play. 

The comp here isn't Golladay v Slayton, it is Golladay v 2.03 plus Slayton. 

I would for sure be starting Golladay over Juju in that scenario as Juju would be my WR4.  Before you say that Golladay is in flux because of his QB being traded and him being a FA Juju is in similar with an aging Ben that really fell off in production for a good portion of the year.  I have Golladay quite a bit higher than Juju so there is part of your disagreement.  

 

Like I said, it's great discussion and made me send a few offers out for Golladay in my leagues in case they see him like you do.  

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Another FFPC league, this kind of pissed me off.

I traded: Jonnu, 5th

I got: 2022 3rd

 

Then the new Jonnu owner traded him away for Boyd and Robby Anderson

I don't mind so much because I'm consolidating and I made some roster space. Jonnu was going to do me no good, but how the hell did he fetch so much when I shopped him a bit and nobody wanted to pay more than a 3rd? That's what annoyed me. The flip happened less than 3 hours later, the market for Jonnu was set by what I traded him for, and someone gives up 2 top50 WR's for him? I don't get it. 

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21 minutes ago, Zyphros said:

Another FFPC league, this kind of pissed me off.

I traded: Jonnu, 5th

I got: 2022 3rd

 

Then the new Jonnu owner traded him away for Boyd and Robby Anderson

I don't mind so much because I'm consolidating and I made some roster space. Jonnu was going to do me no good, but how the hell did he fetch so much when I shopped him a bit and nobody wanted to pay more than a 3rd? That's what annoyed me. The flip happened less than 3 hours later, the market for Jonnu was set by what I traded him for, and someone gives up 2 top50 WR's for him? I don't get it. 

Yeah, that's aggravating.

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I guess we just need to resign ourselves to the fact that some leagues have traders that are fair and others that aren't. Then decide how badly you want to participate in the latter.

I have a Zealots league I'm probably leaving after this year. Half of it are players that don't have a clue.

Sure, guy, I'd love to trade Chubb for the #6 pick in this draft.

Or sure, guy 2, I'll take ten of your spare parts for Chubb, Lamb, and Chase Young.

I thought a bit, guy 3, about giving you the #2 overall for Daniel Jones, but I think I might be able to do better.

Or, why wouldn't I, guy 4, give you two firsts (including the #2) and a second for Watson? :wall:

Edited by Andy Dufresne
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3 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

I guess we just need to resign ourselves to the fact that some leagues have traders that are fair and others that aren't. Then decide how badly you want to participate in the latter.

I have a Zealots league I'm probably leaving after this year. Half of it are players that don't have a clue.

Sure, guy, I'd love to trade Chubb for the #6 pick in this draft. Or sure, guy 2, I'll take ten of your spare parts for Chubb, Lamb, and Chase Young.

There are some guys that you just can't trade with and yet they seem to give away players to other teams.  I have actually had an owner say the only way he will trade with me is if I overpay by a lot because he doesn't want to help my team because my team is generally strong.  Then he gives away players to other owners for basically nothing (the exact guys I just inquired about and gave a better offer for).  Damn frustrating. 

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On 2/2/2021 at 10:15 AM, barackdhouse said:

We were talking about *my* WR4, not a WR4 in the NFL. And as my WR4 he is competing with my second QB in superflex to make it into my lineup.

In 2019 Slayton finished as WR 41 in PPG.

In 2020 Slayton finished as WR 71 in PPG.

I'd say he isn't just a WR4 on your roster, he's also a WR4 in the NFL.

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6 minutes ago, kutta said:

In 2019 Slayton finished as WR 41 in PPG.

In 2020 Slayton finished as WR 71 in PPG.

I'd say he isn't just a WR4 on your roster, he's also a WR4 in the NFL.

I've got him at 34 and 53 for total points in PPR, Weeks 1-16. I know people love PPG for predictive purposes. I love players who play. 

Edited by rockaction
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18 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I've got him at 34 and 53 for total points in PPR, Weeks 1-16. I know people love PPG for predictive purposes. I love players who play. 

But for Slayton the PPG is deceiving also because he is very inconsistent so it is likely that when he puts up his 25 pt game it's on your bench

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2 hours ago, Matt's Eagles said:

12 Team PPR

Team A got

Miles Sanders

 

Team B

got Dionte Johnson

Sanders by a hell of a lot, you'd have to add a 1st to Diontae to get Sanders from me.

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4 hours ago, Zyphros said:

Another FFPC league, this kind of pissed me off.

I traded: Jonnu, 5th

I got: 2022 3rd

 

Then the new Jonnu owner traded him away for Boyd and Robby Anderson

I don't mind so much because I'm consolidating and I made some roster space. Jonnu was going to do me no good, but how the hell did he fetch so much when I shopped him a bit and nobody wanted to pay more than a 3rd? That's what annoyed me. The flip happened less than 3 hours later, the market for Jonnu was set by what I traded him for, and someone gives up 2 top50 WR's for him? I don't get it. 

A lot of teams are trying to consolidate.  When you were shopping him around I'm guessing you were asking for picks, not for players.   Player values go down a lot this time of year in FFPC leagues if you are willing to take on extra players.   Picks and roster spots go way up in value.

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Zealots Field superflex

Traded Diontae Johnson and the 2021 2.12

Received Calvin Ridley and 2021 4.06

Reasoning - I just don't trust Johnson's hands.

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5 minutes ago, Spike said:

Zealots Field superflex

Traded Diontae Johnson and the 2021 2.12

Received Calvin Ridley and 2021 4.06

Reasoning - I just don't trust Johnson's hands.

You won. Ridley is becoming the Next Big Thing at WR.

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6 minutes ago, Spike said:

Zealots Field superflex

Traded Diontae Johnson and the 2021 2.12

Received Calvin Ridley and 2021 4.06

Reasoning - I just don't trust Johnson's hands.

Ridley by a mile.

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36 minutes ago, Spike said:

Zealots Field superflex

Traded Diontae Johnson and the 2021 2.12

Received Calvin Ridley and 2021 4.06

Reasoning - I just don't trust Johnson's hands.

I think your reasoning should be...you got a great deal...not sure what the other guy is trying to accomplish...Johnson is intriguing but in a very best case scenario I still don't think he would be able to outscore Ridley if they are both healthy...the part I really don't understand is the draft picks (I am assuming 2.12 means it is the 12th pick in the second round)...if this deal was Johnson and a #1 for Ridley I could see the reasoning but you only had to give up a pick that is pretty far outside the stud zone which means you have zero exposure in this deal...this guy really has to be super-high on Johnson or really down on Ridley because it just doesn't make sense.

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20 hours ago, Matt's Eagles said:

12 Team PPR

Team A got

Miles Sanders

 

Team B

got Dionte Johnson

I really don't understand this deal...Sanders had a bit of a choppy year due to injuries and overall Philly ineptness but it's very easy to see he is legit and will still only be 24 in May...if I am dealing Sanders for a WR I would be aiming much higher or would at least need another quality player or draft pick attached to Johnson...obtaining a potential stud RB should not be this easy.

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7 hours ago, Spike said:

Zealots Field superflex

Traded Diontae Johnson and the 2021 2.12

Received Calvin Ridley and 2021 4.06

Reasoning - I just don't trust Johnson's hands.

The other guy needs to explain his reasoning.  Your's is simple.....you got a great deal on Ridley that you couldn't pass up. 

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FFPC BB

Gave
Moore, D.J.
Jacobs, Josh
2021 Pick 1.04
Schultz, Dalton
Sample, Drew
2022 4th Round

Got
Sanders, Miles
Gibson, Antonio
Hockenson, T.J.
2022 3rd Round
2021 Pick 3.07

2nd yr tm, middle of the road, nothing at te, lost a bit at wr but improved at rb and te imho. Schultz, Sample obvious cuts. Am i wrong to think right now top 3 rookies r Harris, Etienne, Chase and then whole bunch of guys?

Edited by NE_REVIVAL
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16 minutes ago, NE_REVIVAL said:

 Am i wrong to think right now top 3 rookies r Harris, Etienne, Chase and then whole bunch of guys?

I think so, but I hold the 1.04 and 1.05 in one league, so I'm biased. But I'm seeing guys very much worth having. It's not a throwaway pick by any stretch.

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9 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I think so, but I hold the 1.04 and 1.05 in one league, so I'm biased. But I'm seeing guys very much worth having. It's not a throwaway pick by any stretch.

Agreed, there is lots of talent 1.4+ but right now I'm thinking its much more of a crapshoot after what i think is big 3.

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23 minutes ago, NE_REVIVAL said:

Agreed, there is lots of talent 1.4+ but right now I'm thinking its much more of a crapshoot after what i think is big 3.

What are the odds that your personal top 3 actually go top 3?

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2 minutes ago, ghostguy123 said:

What are the odds that your personal top 3 actually go top 3?

Probably not that great, but it was just part of the calculation on the trade. I could look pretty silly a few months from now but I think I took the bird in the hand. 

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1 hour ago, NE_REVIVAL said:

FFPC BB

Gave
Moore, D.J.
Jacobs, Josh
2021 Pick 1.04
Schultz, Dalton
Sample, Drew
2022 4th Round

Got
Sanders, Miles
Gibson, Antonio
Hockenson, T.J.
2022 3rd Round
2021 Pick 3.07

2nd yr tm, middle of the road, nothing at te, lost a bit at wr but improved at rb and te imho. Schultz, Sample obvious cuts. Am i wrong to think right now top 3 rookies r Harris, Etienne, Chase and then whole bunch of guys?

 I would definitely bet that won't be the consensus top 3 when everything unfolds and not because I'm saying you are wrong to feel this way now just that the top 3 consensus players in early February don't usually hold.

And that's really the interesting part of your trade. I personally like Gibson and Sanders more then Jacobs and DJ Moore but I think opinions would be varied on them. The only thing I would have had any hesitation in your trade is the part of it were Hock was turned into 1.4. I feel like this trade involved 5 blue chip players or pieces and one really good piece in Hockenson. ETA but if I was picking out the 5 pieces/picks I would start with Sanders and Gibson.

Edited by menobrown
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12 hours ago, NE_REVIVAL said:

Gave Moore, D.J., Jacobs, Josh. 2021 Pick 1.04...
Got Sanders, Miles. Gibson, Antonio. Hockenson, T.J.

2nd yr tm, middle of the road, nothing at te, lost a bit at wr but improved at rb and te imho. Schultz, Sample obvious cuts. Am i wrong to think right now top 3 rookies r Harris, Etienne, Chase and then whole bunch of guys?

Personally, prefer Moore, Jacobs and the pick but can see either side.  I like the prospect of Chase or Smith and expect a RB to also be the mix, depending on landing spots, at the 1.04. 

That said, I have a preference for quality WRs due to stability and career length.

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