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Dynasty & Redraft: QB Deshaun Watson, Texans


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53 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

sooooo....can someone explain it to me like I am a 3rd grader....how things work here as far as "moving forward" and being "investigated"....working itself out.....if its not criminal, and there are no police, DA, etc. involved......

who exactly is investigating what....?

does investigating just mean on their own both sides are looking for evidence in case it goes to civil court at some point....

just curious about what kind of timeline we are looking at etc....

tia

Investigating for the NFL will likely just be questioning witness, reviewing any texts, DM, etc.  If Buzbee is willing to let them see it.  Otherwise if it isn't criminal then it's a civil case and likely not much of substance will be revealed until it got to a discovery phase.

#NotALawyer

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And now you see why women are hesitant to come forward, you have 13 of them saying the same thing and still there is a not insignificant amount of people who assume they are just trying to hustle a bu

I find it humorous that some people think it's just an easy thing for a woman to lie about something like this about a high profile person, let alone finding 15+.  Like they just decide they're lookin

Any word on Bill Cosby?

20 hours ago, Soulfly3 said:

no, it's a choice

Buzzbee is a civil litigator (albeit a slimy one) not a prosecutor - he doesn't get to make that choice.

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10 minutes ago, Foosball God said:

Investigating for the NFL will likely just be questioning witness, reviewing any texts, DM, etc.  If Buzbee is willing to let them see it.  Otherwise if it isn't criminal then it's a civil case and likely not much of substance will be revealed until it got to a discovery phase.

#NotALawyer

thanks....and this question isn't necessarily for you..........sooooo....

1. Watson could settle tomorrow and be done with all 20+ or whatever

2. Watson's side says "we ain't settling ####" ......and then Buzbee and the 20+ could sit around for as long as they want and then eventually ask for a date for a civil trial....if so, how long can they drag it out and sit around and wait to file?

3.  meanwhile if #2 is happening....the NFL is doing their own thing.....but will they eventually have to wait for #2 to play out?

4. I guess I'm just wondering how long we kind of sit through what is going on now before there is actually something moving forward to a resolution....and does/will the NFL wait for said resolution before determining Watson's "status"....

like if the season were to start next week.....what if anything does the NFL do....?

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35 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

Buzzbee is a civil litigator (albeit a slimy one) not a prosecutor - he doesn't get to make that choice.

correct. but he can choose to deliver all that "damning" info to the Houston police, like he said he would, correct?

And didnt. And apparently wont. 

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10 minutes ago, Soulfly3 said:

correct. but he can choose to deliver all that "damning" info to the Houston police, like he said he would, correct?

And didnt. And apparently wont. 

because....conspiracy theories!

nevermind that the district attorney's office operates outside the political influence of the Houston PD, or that the Houston PD understands that a national audience is watching this story closely.  we're supposed to take buzbee at his word.  not happening.

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1 hour ago, Soulfly3 said:

correct. but he can choose to deliver all that "damning" info to the Houston police, like he said he would, correct?

And didnt. And apparently wont. 

He's a slime-ball, no doubt.

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24 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

He's a slime-ball, no doubt.

And this slime-ball behavior is not helping these women in the least. 

Instead it makes their claims seem fraudulent, which they very likely aren't (or at least not all of them)

Did his clients ZERO favors w that stunt. 

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No judgement by me at all.  He is totally and completely innocent till real evidence is provided.  21 women saying similar things all represented by one lawyer means absolutely nothing to me. All that shows is they want to show a pattern but a good attorney will just point out it can be a pattern created by the attorney.  At some point make the real evidence public. I assume texts? Video? Is there DNA? The women's background and past will also need to be scrutinized. Watson's reputation has been forever destroyed and at this point I do not think he has any reason or incentive to not fight this through conclusion to court and trial. I'm pretty sure criminal charges can be filed by the state no matter what at any time. This case can and should go to court if there is real evidence he committed a crime.  I'm no Watson fan either. I was and am on the Texans side of the contract dispute but that really is a non factor now.  My point which has been made by several others. It's just time to let this play out and let's see. Till then firmly on the innocent till proven guilty. Not the media driven narrative.

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43 minutes ago, Soulfly3 said:

And this slime-ball behavior is not helping these women in the least. 

Instead it makes their claims seem fraudulent, which they very likely aren't (or at least not all of them)

Did his clients ZERO favors w that stunt. 

Hes made over 700 million dollars by being a lawyer, I think he knows a bit more about what he is doing then some rando with a josh gordon infatuation named soulfly. 

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Rusty Hardin spitting truth....

Since March 19, Mr. Tony Buzbee has repeatedly promised to submit evidence to the Houston Police Department in support of his anonymous clients' complaints against Deshaun Watson. So far, he has not done so. Now, in response to media inquiries, Mr. Buzbee has abandoned his promise altogether and, in his words, will go "elsewhere to provide his evidence to investigative authorities."

His latest excuse for failing to go to law enforcement is also his lamest. Anyone who has dealt with HPD, as I have for many years, would know that Mr. Buzbee's suggestion that the Department would overlook legitimate complaints based upon a family connection of one of its officers is ludicrous. It is also insulting to the dedicated professionals at HPD and to common sense. 

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10 minutes ago, pantherclub said:

Hes made over 700 million dollars by being a lawyer, I think he knows a bit more about what he is doing then some rando with a josh gordon infatuation named soulfly. 

or a guy with a soulfly infatuation

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Just now, Razors Edge said:

 

Hmmmm, it seems more people are coming around to what I said earlier.

This is all a stunt, start to finish as I have said....gonna suck for some of you to understand that 20 women are lying, but get ready.

 

Can you point to another scandal where double digit women (or people for that matter) all lied about the same thing.  Or are you going to tell me this is the first time in history that it has happened?

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9 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Can you share another time 20 women accused a man of rape and didnt go to the cops? I'll do you one better, straight up refused to go to cops or accuse with their name publicly? 17 women put their name to it on the most powerful man in the world. People put their names behind it on the Prez, but not here? 

I'll wait, your answer to that is the same as mine. 

To go further and put in perspective...women put their name behind it in accusing a man who could quite possibly have them killed and never get caught. The most powerful person is capable of so much more than an athlete.

They are not accusing him of rape.  But good try.  

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17 minutes ago, Razors Edge said:

Can you share another time 20 women accused a man of rape and didnt go to the cops? I'll do you one better, straight up refused to go to cops or accuse with their name publicly? 17 women put their name to it on the most powerful man in the world. People put their names behind it on the Prez, but not here? 

I'll wait, your answer to that is the same as mine. 

To go further and put in perspective...women put their name behind it in accusing a man who could quite possibly have them killed and never get caught. The most powerful person is capable of so much more than an athlete.

The lawyers stunt is definitely suspect.  However it is very hard to get this many people who don’t know each other to collude around something like this.  
 

im not saying he’s guilty and i am waiting to see the evidence but it doesn’t look good that’s for sure.

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On 3/31/2021 at 4:18 PM, Razors Edge said:

Why didnt she go to the cops?

It seems everyone is doing everything but going to the cops. Maybe because trying to mack on a woman isnt a crime. Asking a woman to touch your parts isnt a crime. Forcing them to against their will is, any evidence of that? We are confusing hitting on women as criminal now, too? 

You hit on women by asking them to touch your parts? 

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1 hour ago, simey said:

You hit on women by asking them to touch your parts? 

🤔🤔 How many dates have I been on?

 

I'm kidding, it's not okay to ask a woman who is massaging you - while you are naked with only a hand towel over you to touch your ****.  Don't mistake someone doing their job for being interested in anything more.  Deshaun, regardless of how this whole thing pans out will lose some serious points in public opinion.  Too bad too. 

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This from one of the 18 massage therapists that say Watson was not inappropriate makes a lot of sense.

“If a therapist feels uncomfortable at any time during the session, he or she has the ability to end the session and immediately file a complaint with the Texas Department of Licensing and Regulations and vice versa. You don’t get a lawyer and file a lawsuit or go to the news media. You file a complaint immediately.”

So does this mean there have been no complaints filed through Texas Department of Licensing and Regulations from any on the 21 women filing lawsuits? 
 

This is very odd to have no police involvement or complaints to that licensing department if they are trained to do that immediately when a customer does something inappropriate. 

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41 minutes ago, Blackbear said:

This from one of the 18 massage therapists that say Watson was not inappropriate makes a lot of sense.

“If a therapist feels uncomfortable at any time during the session, he or she has the ability to end the session and immediately file a complaint with the Texas Department of Licensing and Regulations and vice versa. You don’t get a lawyer and file a lawsuit or go to the news media. You file a complaint immediately.”

So does this mean there have been no complaints filed through Texas Department of Licensing and Regulations from any on the 21 women filing lawsuits? 
 

This is very odd to have no police involvement or complaints to that licensing department if they are trained to do that immediately when a customer does something inappropriate. 

I think we have to assume that none of these ladies knew about each other until recently.....so prior to that at some point they have to individually weigh out the cost/benefit business factor of filing a report....I don't know what that would be since I'm not in the business....I would venture to guess they don't file complaints sometimes maybe when they could have......

now the cost/benefit has changed.........

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48 minutes ago, Blackbear said:

This from one of the 18 massage therapists that say Watson was not inappropriate makes a lot of sense.

“If a therapist feels uncomfortable at any time during the session, he or she has the ability to end the session and immediately file a complaint with the Texas Department of Licensing and Regulations and vice versa. You don’t get a lawyer and file a lawsuit or go to the news media. You file a complaint immediately.”

So does this mean there have been no complaints filed through Texas Department of Licensing and Regulations from any on the 21 women filing lawsuits? 
 

This is very odd to have no police involvement or complaints to that licensing department if they are trained to do that immediately when a customer does something inappropriate. 

Looking at their site and seeing the things about safeguarding consumers it looks more like something people that are going to see a massage therapist could do and potentially impact their license.  I'm not sure what a massage therapist would get out of filing a complaint to the licensing board?  Maybe they do some stuff that isn't readily shown on their website.  🤷‍♂️

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1 minute ago, Foosball God said:

Looking at their site and seeing the things about safeguarding consumers it looks more like something people that are going to see a massage therapist could do and potentially impact their license.  I'm not sure what a massage therapist would get out of filing a complaint to the licensing board?  Maybe they do some stuff that isn't readily shown on their website.  🤷‍♂️

Yeah, I don’t know either. But the reason I mentioned it is that this one masseuse mentioned they are trained to file complaints there. 

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Look, I don't know if Watson is guilty or not.  I'm not here to judge.  From a football perspective the NFL wants Watson playing football.  I look at some of the more recent players off-the-field stuff, such as Tyreek Hill or Kareem Hunt and look where they are today and come to the conclusion that if Watson doesn't go to prison over this, I have to think of him in the same light as Hill and Hunt and think he will be on the field playing eventually.  Those of you who panicked and sold him cheap are probably going to be sorry you did.  If he gets suspended 8 games, or even a year, you will be sorry you did.  He's young and will resurface somewhere and help teams in fantasy football, assuming he doesn't go for a long stretch in prison, which i don't think will happen.

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1 minute ago, JohnnyU said:

assuming he doesn't go for a long stretch in prison, which i don't think will happen.

you need criminal charges to go to prison. 

and, well.... not happening apparently.

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3 minutes ago, Soulfly3 said:

you need criminal charges to go to prison. 

and, well.... not happening apparently.

Of course, so why are people selling him cheap?  If you look at history on off-the-field issues, such as Hill and Hunt, you know they will be playing somewhere eventually, probably sooner than you think.  Before someone brings up Ray Rice, let's not forget he was well past his prime.  Watson is young and is a QB, a star one at that!!

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5 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Of course, so why are people selling him cheap?  If you look at history on off-the-field issues, such as Hill and Hunt, you know they will be playing somewhere eventually, probably sooner than you think.  Before someone brings up Ray Rice, let's not forget he was well past his prime.  Watson is young and is a QB, a star one at that!!

I would just add that is not the only issue Watson is facing. He has also demanded a trade and seems potentially willing to sit out. Houston has dug in their heels and said he wasn't being traded. Add in that Watson has a no trade clause and that Houston is absolutely terrible and has no picks, it's hard not to be down on Watson. There are just so many ways things can go wrong for him right now. 

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6 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Of course, so why are people selling him cheap?

I don't know who is selling him cheap but if they are I would imagine it's because he's a big time candidate to miss games whether that be a result of suspension or holdout.

I mean I did not think he'd be playing week one without a trade before this happened.

 

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1 minute ago, Ilov80s said:

I would just add that is not the only issue Watson is facing. He has also demanded a trade and seems potentially willing to sit out. Houston has dug in their heels and said he wasn't being traded. Add in that Watson has a no trade clause and that Houston is absolutely terrible and has no picks, it's hard not to be down on Watson. There are just so many ways things can go wrong for him right now. 

You know what?  I'm very happy sitting on Watson until this straightened itself out from a football perspective.  Anyone who sells him cheap are stupid, short of going to prison.  Even if he's suspended a year I would say that.  He's 25 isn't he?  A star QB, isn't he?  I'm flabbergasted at the thought of people selling low on Watson, but I should be out there buying.

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18 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Look, I don't know if Watson is guilty or not.  I'm not here to judge.  From a football perspective the NFL wants Watson playing football.  I look at some of the more recent players off-the-field stuff, such as Tyreek Hill or Kareem Hunt and look where they are today and come to the conclusion that if Watson doesn't go to prison over this, I have to think of him in the same light as Hill and Hunt and think he will be on the field playing eventually.  Those of you who panicked and sold him cheap are probably going to be sorry you did.  If he gets suspended 8 games, or even a year, you will be sorry you did.  He's young and will resurface somewhere and help teams in fantasy football, assuming he doesn't go for a long stretch in prison, which i don't think will happen.

let's just say it comes out that he did this stuff.....like I said before, it's not a one off like Hunt, etc...not condoning what Hunt did, but it was a one time thing.....with Watson, its a pattern/problem, etc...again just saying if he did do these things.....even if he doesn't go to prison for it....do you really think a team is going to trade for this guy and have him be the face of their franchise....?.....

if he "settles" I still don't think he gets traded cause most associate settling as being guilty....so its the same as above

I truly feel his only option (again assuming he did these things) is to fess up.....face the music....seek treatment and then tuck tail and thank the Texans for standing by him and try to play football for HOU if he is allowed......can just imagine the backlash and things this guy is going to hear either way....gonna be tough

if it turns out to be one of the biggest conspiracy theories of all time.....then he will be fine...maybe

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11 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

You know what?  I'm very happy sitting on Watson until this straightened itself out from a football perspective.  Anyone who sells him cheap are stupid, short of going to prison.  Even if he's suspended a year I would say that.  He's 25 isn't he?  A star QB, isn't he?  I'm flabbergasted at the thought of people selling low on Watson, but I should be out there buying.

Just depends what we think of as cheap. It is a situation where evaluations could be all over the place. I wouldn't trade away for peanuts but I might be ok with covering my risk and getting out if someone in my league is optimistic about Watson. I don't want to sell for half off but 20% might be something I willing to do just to play it safe. 

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12 minutes ago, Stinkin Ref said:

let's just say it comes out that he did this stuff.....like I said before, it's not a one off like Hunt, etc...not condoning what Hunt did, but it was a one time thing.....with Watson, its a pattern/problem, etc...again just saying if he did do these things.....even if he doesn't go to prison for it....do you really think a team is going to trade for this guy and have him be the face of their franchise....?.....

if he "settles" I still don't think he gets traded cause most associate settling as being guilty....so its the same as above

I truly feel his only option (again assuming he did these things) is to fess up.....face the music....seek treatment and then tuck tail and thank the Texans for standing by him and try to play football for HOU if he is allowed......can just imagine the backlash and things this guy is going to hear either way....gonna be tough

if it turns out to be one of the biggest conspiracy theories of all time.....then he will be fine...maybe

I've already said what i said about it.  Anything short of prison he will resurface as a young francthise QB for someone.  Whether that is 8 games or a year, it doesn't matter.  He's 25 and is a star QB and he sure as hell has a better chance at playing than either Hill or Hunt given the position he plays and his age.  Anyone, and I mean anyone who sells him cheap are stupid when it comes to fantasy football.

ETA:  Look, ethics has nothing to do with this or my thoughts.  I'm just looking at what the NFL has done in the past with off-the-field guys and this is a franchise QB guys.

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43 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Of course, so why are people selling him cheap?  If you look at history on off-the-field issues, such as Hill and Hunt, you know they will be playing somewhere eventually, probably sooner than you think.  Before someone brings up Ray Rice, let's not forget he was well past his prime.  Watson is young and is a QB, a star one at that!!

There was also a video of Ray Rice violently throwing a punch, connecting and dragging the out cold woman out of the elevator like a caveman. 

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14 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

There was also a video of Ray Rice violently throwing a punch, connecting and dragging the out cold woman out of the elevator like a caveman. 

Didn't I say Rice was well past his prime?  If you look at Hill and Hunt would would see what I mean and Watson is a step above those players because he is a star QB.  Anything short of prison, Watson will surly play again, just as Hill and Hunt did.  Especially since he is a star QB.  I'll say again, any of you fools that sold him cheap are on drugs, even if he is suspended 8 games or a year  Of course I back away from that if he is sentenced in a criminal trial.

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31 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Didn't I say Rice was well past his prime?  If you look at Hill and Hunt would would see what I mean and Watson is a step above those players because he is a star QB.  Anything short of prison, Watson will surly play again, just as Hill and Hunt did.  Especially since he is a star QB.  I'll say again, any of you fools that sold him cheap are on drugs, even if he is suspended 8 games or a year  Of course I back away from that if he is sentenced in a criminal trial.

Vick went to prison and played in the NFL for a few years after that and is now an analyst on FOX every Sunday. 

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

I've already said what i said about it.  Anything short of prison he will resurface as a young francthise QB for someone.  Whether that is 8 games or a year, it doesn't matter.  He's 25 and is a star QB and he sure as hell has a better chance at playing than either Hill or Hunt given the position he plays and his age.  Anyone, and I mean anyone who sells him cheap are stupid when it comes to fantasy football.

ETA:  Look, ethics has nothing to do with this or my thoughts.  I'm just looking at what the NFL has done in the past with off-the-field guys and this is a franchise QB guys.

put your NFL GM hat on, not your fantasy GM hat.....if he doesn't go to prison, but is found to have done these things in civil court, or settles with 20+ women.....would you trade for him as GM.....?....and have him become the face of your franchise and the be the move that you are tied to for the rest of your career...

I only ask because what happens in real football has an effect on what we do in this lovely hobby of ours...and the "anything short of prison" options above might even find it hard for him to see another snap in HOU.....

it is also IMO that really comparing this to Hill (who didn't do anything) and Hunt are not good examples to base decisions off of....this is a totally different beast with much more volume it appears at this point which changes the narrative pretty dramatically  IMO....

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

Didn't I say Rice was well past his prime?  If you look at Hill and Hunt would would see what I mean and Watson is a step above those players because he is a star QB.  Anything short of prison, Watson will surly play again, just as Hill and Hunt did.  Especially since he is a star QB.  I'll say again, any of you fools that sold him cheap are on drugs, even if he is suspended 8 games or a year  Of course I back away from that if he is sentenced in a criminal trial.

It's silly that people still want to debate a player like Watson would not play again.

You can go pull up the old Vick thread, the AB thread, the Tyreek Hill thread and see people yammering away all day they were done. People just don't learn.

There have been two players since I've been playing fantasy football who did something that led to them being truly done. Ray Rice who was a 27 year old RB coming off a 3.1 ypc season and Hernandez who died in prison. That's it.

Lesson. Still be good to elite, even if you go to prison so long as you still are considered good to elite if/when you get out, you play again. It's really that simple.

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@TomPelissero

Statement from Deshaun Watson’s attorney, Rusty Hardin, about the filing of a police report today concerning Watson: “We welcome this long overdue development. Now we will learn the identity of at least one accuser. We will fully cooperate with the Houston Police Department.”

I assume this is one of the two who were to file criminal proceedings outside of Buzbee (not doing the civil  thing)

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2 hours ago, menobrown said:

It's silly that people still want to debate a player like Watson would not play again.

You can go pull up the old Vick thread, the AB thread, the Tyreek Hill thread and see people yammering away all day they were done. People just don't learn.

There have been two players since I've been playing fantasy football who did something that led to them being truly done. Ray Rice who was a 27 year old RB coming off a 3.1 ypc season and Hernandez who died in prison. That's it.

Lesson. Still be good to elite, even if you go to prison so long as you still are considered good to elite if/when you get out, you play again. It's really that simple.

The only other I can recall is Rae Carruth. 

Ray Lewis is another example of playing again. 

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 1st criminal charge, not related at all to the women Mr. Buzbee is representing.  But Mr. Buzbee did confirm he filed a new lawsuit today also, which now makes it a total of 22 lawsuits.   Not sure why Watson’s lawyer, Mr Hardin, is saying he is glad that a criminal charge has been filed because he will now at least know the identity of one the anonymous women.  But this is a “new” woman, unrelated to Mr. Buzbee and the 22 anonymous women who have file lawsuits.  

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3 minutes ago, Kevrunner said:

 1st criminal charge, not related at all to the women Mr. Buzbee is representing.  But Mr. Buzbee did confirm he filed a new lawsuit today also, which now makes it a total of 22 lawsuits.   Not sure why Watson’s lawyer, Mr Hardin, is saying he is glad that a criminal charge has been filed because he will now at least know the identity of one the anonymous women.  But this is a “new” woman, unrelated to Mr. Buzbee and the 22 anonymous women who have file lawsuits.  

Because you need evidence. So now he can see what the evidence is. If his camp wins then it puts into question the other claims. And they would then need to provide evidence.

So, nobody can look at this case and say one way or the other. But it would sure be good if there is tangible evidence in form of video, conversations on phones, complaints to police and/or Texas department licensing, etc... 

Of course if he is guilty then we would want justice. But this Buzbee seems like a ##### when he says it isn’t about money... we want him to stop. Then turns no evidence over and makes excuses why he can’t. He’s evidently bluffing or slow playing a winning hand. But either way, he doesn’t seem trust worthy. 

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6 hours ago, menobrown said:

It's silly that people still want to debate a player like Watson would not play again.

You can go pull up the old Vick thread, the AB thread, the Tyreek Hill thread and see people yammering away all day they were done. People just don't learn.

There have been two players since I've been playing fantasy football who did something that led to them being truly done. Ray Rice who was a 27 year old RB coming off a 3.1 ypc season and Hernandez who died in prison. That's it.

Lesson. Still be good to elite, even if you go to prison so long as you still are considered good to elite if/when you get out, you play again. It's really that simple.

you really think this is apples to apples...?

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Watson will play again.  Barring an actual rape charge and conviction, he isnt going to jail.

He will do therapy/rehab and all that, and at the latest will be playing 2022, and could easily still be playing week 1 this year, though some sort of suspension seems likely.

Just my thoughts.  

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13 hours ago, Stinkin Ref said:

you really think this is apples to apples...?

I think these all follow a similar pattern, but of course it depends on what actually happened and if we find out what happened.  

Mike Vick was convicted spent years in prison and came out and played.  Watson is a far superior player to Vick.  Some team will take the PR hit for a top QB. 

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