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WR Michael Thomas, NO (1 Viewer)

Mr. Irrelevant

IBL Representative
Fascinated to get the discussion started on this guy, as I expect him to be a very polarizing figure.

On the one hand, he's doesn't seem to have a single dominating trait -  he's 6'3" but it's often said he 'plays smaller' and he's not overly fast or explosive - and didn't produce big numbers at OSU. Analytics are likely to say, "don't touch this guy with a 10-foot pole" (e.g. ZWK's numbers hate the guy).

Yet every scouting report I've seen raves about his body control, his sure hands, and especially his route-running. He passes every "eye test" out there: e.g. Matt Waldman's RSPTurf Show Times.

There's a good detailed evaluation of his pros and cons at the Daily Norseman, but in general people are all over the place with him - some compare Thomas to combine warriors like Charles Johnson, others to #2 / possession guys like Eric Decker. 

Bottom line is he's being mocked consistently in the 2nd, occasionally late 1st of the NFL drafts. Who's interested in him at what price in your rookie drafts?

 
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Fascinated to get the discussion started on this guy, as I expect him to be a very polarizing figure.

On the one hand, he's doesn't seem to have a single dominating trait -  he's 6'3" but it's often said he 'plays smaller' and he's not overly fast or explosive - and didn't produce big numbers at OSU. Analytics are likely to say, "don't touch this guy with a 10-foot pole" (e.g. ZWK's numbers hate the guy).

Yet every scouting report I've seen raves about his body control, his sure hands, and especially his route-running. He passes every "eye test" out there: e.g. Matt Waldman's RSPTurf Show Times.

There's a good detailed evaluation of his pros and cons at the Daily Norseman, but in general people are all over the place with him - some compare Thomas to combine warriors like Charles Johnson, others to #2 / possession guys like Eric Decker. 

Bottom line is he's being mocked consistently in the 2nd, occasionally late 1st of the NFL drafts. Who's interested in him at what price in your rookie drafts?
When I watched him I didn't see "sure hands" or "great" route running.  He struggles to catch and get his head around on timed routes (quick slants etc.).  He did seem to have good fake moves and suddenness after the catch or fake moves with his routes so that was good.  Definitely has body control decent moves and quickness.  I'm really undecided on this guy and some have him as #2 WR in this class but I see him clearly below Doctson and Treadwell for sure and possibly some others like Corey Coleman and even Braxton Miller.  Not quite sure where I'm going to put him yet as I haven't done my rankings. 

 
A lot depends on where he lands, however that's what makes these discussions so much fun.

I see a bigger possession wr who might struggle against NFL press coverage. The combine should be very interesting for Thomas. He could show very well there and that might push him up some for me.
He'd have to run much faster than he appears on film for me to consider him a mid-1st rounder (and I agree that beyond the top 5, everyone else in this draft class seems flawed to one degree or another).

My fear is that he tests out kinda big, kinda strong, kinda fast, without being really exceptional at anything. Those guys (even ones with much better college production than Thomas) tend to have NFL careers where they hang on rosters for years as #2 / #3 options without ever threatening to become true #1's - which doesn't really interest me for dynasty purposes. For every DeAndre Hopkins there are 20 Marquess Wilson, Mohammed Sanu, Terrance Williams types.

Having said that, the NFL has hit on quite a few of these "tweeners" in the past few years - Hopkins, AR15, Jordan Mathews, etc. - so if he goes much earlier than his combine numbers would suggest I'd have to rethink my position a little.

 
Just watched the VT game. I like him but speed is not his game. This year is also difficult to talk about from a numbers angle because the QB play was so bad. 

In the VT game you see him put on some good moves and roll back into open zones. He also tries to avoid running into other receivers zones. However, Jones isn't great at making passing reads. 

 
Part of the problem with the evaluation of Thomas is how OSU used him. Urban's spread is more geared on the run and specifically the zone read. 

He does have good hands and runs good routes, but what I remember most is the zone read wr screens, seems he did that a lot at OSU. I'm wondering how he will do against NFL caliber press coverage.

He had some good moments against press in college. The Virgina Tech game jumps to mind against Fuller. I think he could be a good possession wr and red zone threat. 

Fantasy wise seeing him as a late 2nd to early 3rd in Rookie Drafts.
Yea, let me see the rookie draft where this guy slides to the late 2nd or early 3rd of a rookie draft.  I'm not a big fan of his, but my guess is you're going to be seeing him a lot more in the top 10 then you will with pick 20+ unless he tears an ACL at the combine.

 
Wow. From a Buckeye fan that seems like a serious indictment on Thomas. I find this very interesting. Why do you feel this way? 

 
He'd have to run much faster than he appears on film for me to consider him a mid-1st rounder (and I agree that beyond the top 5, everyone else in this draft class seems flawed to one degree or another).
What top 5? I did not now a consensus had formed.

I don't dispute the fact that he's a possession WR and I've heard comps thrown around for Thomas such as Decker, his cousin, Marshall and the worst one was Reuben Randle and he would probably not be so terrible if he had good knees.

Mayock ranks him as this WR3, same thing for Jeremiah who has him at player #34 overall and Bucky Brooks has him at WR5.  We'll see if those guys know what they are talking about but my point is I don't see a top 5 right now that does not have him in the conversation.

 
Rivals writer Adam Gorney believes that Ohio State WR Michael Thomas is "a better athlete on the outside than [Ole Miss WR] Laquon Treadwell."
 
Rivals just pumped out their first mock draft of the 2016 calendar year, with Gorney projecting Thomas to the Los Angeles Rams at No. 15. The analyst believes the 6-foot-3, 210-pound wideout "will impress at the combine and pro day," which could result in him "moving up draft boards soon." Along with the Rams, NFL Media's Bucky Brooks has suggested that the Chargers, Bengals, Ravens and Browns could also turn out to be nice fits for Thomas. For what it's worth, both Gorney and fellow Rivals analyst Mike Farrell do not have Treadwell being selected in the top-20 in this particular mock draft.

 
 
Source: rivals.com 
Feb 26 - 8:49 PM

 
I like Thomas a lot and was making the argument for him in this forum last year as a nice devy draft target, saying he was/is a better prospect than Devin Smith. 

Draft stock will be dependent upon how fast he runs, but I think NFL teams are going to like him a lot more than "draft Twitter" and the guys obsessed with market share do. 

Thought the weigh-in numbers were very encouraging for him. Legit 6'3 with huge hands and decent arm length. 

(Note: I'm a Buckeye homer, but feel like I'm pretty objective on OSU prospects. Wasn't real high on Smith as a fantasy target last year and not real high on Braxton Miller this year for example. I do think Jalin Marshall should be much more on the fantasy radar than he is currently though.)

 
What top 5? I did not now a consensus had formed.
As of right now I'd expect elliot,  Treadwell, doctson, Henry and Coleman to go top five in most drafts, with Boyd and Thomas in the 6/7 range and things getting a bit more muddled after that. 

 
As of right now I'd expect elliot,  Treadwell, doctson, Henry and Coleman to go top five in most drafts, with Boyd and Thomas in the 6/7 range and things getting a bit more muddled after that. 


Thanks for responding but can't say I agree on that being a consensus top 5. I can tell from your post in other threads you are really high on D Henry, I'm not and he's not my #2 RB and might not be #3 either but I'll also add landing spot for RB is more critical than any other position. Which is also why I don't see a consensus top 5. I'd use a guy like Leveon Bell as an example, after this combine I saw him in next to no one's top 10 list, did not even crack some peoples top 10 RB list but when he went both high in the draft and to a homerun spot it drastically altered his value.

But as of now I'd put Thomas right around where you have him.

 
In start 1 rb ppr leagues I would drop Henry down too, both in positional and overall rankings. In start 2 rb non ppr, he's 1.2.

 
In start 1 rb ppr leagues I would drop Henry down too, both in positional and overall rankings. In start 2 rb non ppr, he's 1.2.
I would put Henry as my second RB in a non PPR league but I don't play in those kinds of leagues or one RB leagues either. 

In 2 RB PPR leagues Henry is not my second ranked player or even second ranked RB, maybe not even third.

 
Thanks for responding but can't say I agree on that being a consensus top 5. I can tell from your post in other threads you are really high on D Henry, I'm not and he's not my #2 RB and might not be #3 either but I'll also add landing spot for RB is more critical than any other position. Which is also why I don't see a consensus top 5. I'd use a guy like Leveon Bell as an example, after this combine I saw him in next to no one's top 10 list, did not even crack some peoples top 10 RB list but when he went both high in the draft and to a homerun spot it drastically altered his value.

But as of now I'd put Thomas right around where you have him.




Bucky Brooks made a good call that year:

Le'Veon Bell emerging as best running back in 2013 NFL Draft

 
Yes sir and I actually remember I was bored to death in a conference in Vegas and reading my twitter timeline when he  tweeted that article out and I read it, from that day going forward it put Bell on my radar big time and earned Bucky a lot of creed for me after how Bell performed. Though I will say  I've since noticed a trend with Bucky. I still respect him and his opinion, but I can tell his scouting is a lot heavier on tape/production  than workout numbers. As an example he's been extremely high on Jeremy Hill and Kadeem Carey the past few years, right or wrongly.

But still, when I say people did not have him in their top 10 players or sometimes even top 10 RB's I'm talking about these boards doing rankings and lists. In the lead up to the draft that year whenever people would put out their top 10 overall lists I never saw Bell on it, at best he seemed to be hovering around RB10 on some peoples list. Personally having read this Brooks article I had him much higher, but still not as high as I would end up having him when he hit a homerun landing spot.

 
Does anyone know Michael Thomas's birthdate? Wikipedia has it as 8/16/94, but that is suspiciously identical to the birthdate that Mike Thomas has on his USM player profile.

My list is also missing Josh Doctson and Sterling Shepard's birthdates (though it looks like folks might have pieced together Doctson's).

 
Yes sir and I actually remember I was bored to death in a conference in Vegas and reading my twitter timeline when he  tweeted that article out and I read it, from that day going forward it put Bell on my radar big time and earned Bucky a lot of creed for me after how Bell performed. Though I will say  I've since noticed a trend with Bucky. I still respect him and his opinion, but I can tell his scouting is a lot heavier on tape/production  than workout numbers. As an example he's been extremely high on Jeremy Hill and Kadeem Carey the past few years, right or wrongly.

But still, when I say people did not have him in their top 10 players or sometimes even top 10 RB's I'm talking about these boards doing rankings and lists. In the lead up to the draft that year whenever people would put out their top 10 overall lists I never saw Bell on it, at best he seemed to be hovering around RB10 on some peoples list. Personally having read this Brooks article I had him much higher, but still not as high as I would end up having him when he hit a homerun landing spot.


Bell shot up after the NFL draft for a lot of people but here's a link showing that there were some people who had him in their top 5 before the draft:




 
SB Nation's Arif Hasan did not find a perfect data match while looking for Ohio State WR Michael Thomas' NFL stylistic comp.
The closest comp Hasan found in the data was Stevie Johnson (88.4). "Johnson is a fantastic player, but perhaps not the most exciting or a true #1," Hasan wrote. "Thomas as a player matches Johnson on hook routes like curls and comebacks and square routes, like digs and outs." Indeed, you can imagine the first-round hopeful Thomas being a little discouraged by the comp, though Hassan points out that Thomas is clearly superior in one important metric over Johnson. "He does much better than Johnson in deep routes (Johnson struggles quite a bit at those) but overall carries a similar profile—his relative rates of success against man, zone, and press coverage are similar (they struggle—relatively—against man coverage), he wins contested catches as often, drops the ball as often, and has a similar build," Hasan wrote.

 
 
Source: Cold Omaha 
Mar 7 - 11:58 PM

 
 

Earlier this week, Ohio State WR Michael Thomas met with the New Orleans Saints, San Diego Chargers and had an "outstanding meeting" with the Cleveland Browns, reports TFY Draft Insider's Tony Pauline.
Some teams had Thomas running a forty in the low 4.3s at OSU's pro day this week, though the Buckeyes' track is notoriously fast and other reports had him in the mid-4.4s. Regardless, Thomas by all accounts had a great day. One of Pauline's sources gushed the following from the scene: "Best workout of the day. Ran faster than I expected, ran terrific routes and caught the ball really well. Much better receiver than people give him credit for." NFL Media analyst Bucky Brooks likens Thomas to Michael Crabtree.

 

Source: Walter Football 
Mar 12 - 5:50 PM
 
Sports Illustrated's Doug Farrar compares Ohio State WR Michael Thomas to Broncos WR Cody Latimer.
Latimer, of course, was a second-rounder in 2014 out of Indiana who has busted hard thus far, with a grand total of eight career receptions. "Thomas isn’t a 6' 5", 240-pound behemoth in the Calvin Johnson mold, nor will he tear up the field as a Jordy Nelson would," Farrar explains. "And he’s not quite as physical as a Julio Jones... so where exactly does he fit? I believe that with the right kind of training, Thomas can be a high-rep, complementary receiver in multiple positions." We personally compare Thomas to Michael Crabtree. To each their own. The 6-foot-3, 210-pound Thomas posted 56 catches for 781 yards and nine touchdowns last season.

 
 
Source: Sports Illustrated 
Mar 19 - 1:46 PM

 
Neither will be particularly good.
What do you base that on?  You are unequivocal in your player evaluations, yet you rarely give an explanation as to what is behind your thinking. Plus you are supposedly new here and have only made 27 posts, which doesn't give us any track record to indicate that you do or do not know what you are talking about.  Hard to place a value on an opinion under these circumstances.

 
What do you base that on?  You are unequivocal in your player evaluations, yet you rarely give an explanation as to what is behind your thinking. Plus you are supposedly new here and have only made 27 posts, which doesn't give us any track record to indicate that you do or do not know what you are talking about.  Hard to place a value on an opinion under these circumstances.
A fair point. I base most of my opinions on the eye test and a lifetime of watching players who go on to fail or excel at the NFL level. Despite a lot of people who would be rich if they got paid by the word on these sites I try to keep it simple. Nobody wants to read a book about these guys. I watch guys, and if you watch enough you see guys make pro plays. You see guys do things other guys don't do in college, and those are the guys I focus on. I dont see that from Thomas or Miller. 

 
I would put Henry as my second RB in a non PPR league but I don't play in those kinds of leagues or one RB leagues either. 

In 2 RB PPR leagues Henry is not my second ranked player or even second ranked RB, maybe not even third.
Smart. A lot of people who draft Henry will be kicking themselves.

 
Pro Football Focus analyst Wes Huber referred to Ohio State WR Michael Thomas as "yet another of the [Big Ten's] undervalued playmakers."
"Thomas is a first-round talent that could provide his team with a true No. 1 option in the passing game as well as above-average blocking ability for the run," Huber writes. The analyst is particularly smitten with the 6-foot-3, 212-pounder's fearlessness toward using the middle of the field, noting that he "displays zero hesitation." Bleacher Report's Jason Cole reported last week that the Redskins rank Thomas as their No. 1 wide receiver in this draft class. Meanwhile, on our side of the track, Rotoworld draft analyst Josh Norris has three receivers ranked ahead of the Ohio State product on his fifth Big Board of the pre-draft season -- but he places Thomas at a more-than-respectable No. 15 overall, a sign of just how good he considers the upper-echelon of this receiving class to be.

 
 
Source: Pro Football Focus 
Mar 26 - 8:13 PM

 
Pro Football Focus analyst Wes Huber believes that Ohio State WR Michael Thomas was criminally underused by the program.
"While it’s true that, out of this drafts wideouts provided with 80-plus targets last season," Huber wrote, "Thomas ranked sixth from-the-bottom in total snaps per target. Under-utilization should not be viewed as a weakness, however, as Thomas will enter the NFL starving for attention." Last season, the 6-foot-3, 212-pound wideout caught 56 passes for 781 yards and nine touchdowns. He caught nine scores in each of his two seasons with the Buckeyes. Sports Illustrated's Doug Farrar compared him to WR Cody Latimer in March, but we like Michael Crabtree as a more fitting comparable here.

 
 
Source: Pro Football Focus 
Apr 2 - 5:59 PM

 
I didn't even have him on my radar prior to last night, but there was a teaser special about Mariuchi doing a WR camp on the NFL network.  During the teaser they covered Michael Thomas and how he performed during last season, and what he needs to improve.  He looks fairly talented to me.  My first pick isn't until pick 10 in this year's rookie draft, but I'm hoping he's still around.

I also think it doesn't help having the same name as Mike Thomas.  I just heard about Michael Thomas in passing and was like "Oh yeah, he played for the Jags."  The buzz on him seems to be way less than Treadwell, Doctson, Fuller, Coleman, Miller, Cooper, Caroo, etc.  Not sure why.

 
I think the lack passing at Ohio St this year and the amount of weapons there hurt Thomas. I think the Braxton hype really over shadowed him. 

Also, he isn't a flashy player. He doesn't win enough contested catches and he doesn't have great speed.

After what I've seen and read, he's the type of guy who could turn into one of those underrated PPR machines.

 
 

Rotoworld's Josh Norris "wouldn't be surprised" if some teams rank Ohio State WR Michael Thomas "as the class’ top receiver."
"There’s so much of Michael Crabtree’s game in Michael Thomas," Norris wrote. "He truly is sneaky athletic after the catch as he destroy defenders’ angles of anticipation and glides into full speed very quickly, in a similar fashion as Demaryius Thomas." In the Bengals' rendition of our running Draft Needs series, Evan Silva identified receiver as the organization's most pressing positional need. Norris followed suit in a mock draft exercise, slotting the club Thomas in Rd. 1 and Leonte Carroo in Rd. 3.

 
 
Source: Rotoworld 
Apr 7 - 12:51 PM


 
Fox Sports 1 NFL insider Mike Garafolo hears that the Los Angeles Rams, New Orleans Saints, Dallas Cowboys and Washington Redskins are all high on Ohio State WR Michael Thomas.
"[The] [m]ore I dig on WRs in draft," Garafolo wrote, "[the] more I hear OSU's Michael Thomas has best skill set to transition to NFL." He went on to name-check the aforementioned quartet of teams showing interest in the 6-foot-3, 212-pound wideout. Rotoworld's Josh Norris has been a Thomas fan throughout the pre-draft process, comping him in some respects to both Michael Crabtree (due to his sneaky athleticism) and Demaryius Thomas (in his remarkable ability to accelerate to full speed at a moment's notice). Pro Football Focus also sees him as a first-round-caliber receiver.

 
 
Source: Mike Garafolo on Twitter

 
VERY in-depth fantasy breakdown on Michael Thomas from Matt Harmon who shares what he sees as Thomas' strengths and weakness' and the best spot for him to be fantasy relevant.

After breaking down Michael Thomas' game and noting his current ADP and how others view Thomas, Harmon concludes that the landing spot for Thomas is going to determine his fantasy value and he suggests the worst and best landing spots for him.

I'm sure a lot of people were wanting an objective look at Thomas' fantasy future and Harmon delivers.  

http://www.nfl.com/fantasyfootball/story/0ap3000000651949/article/michael-thomas-fantasy-future-hinges-on-landing-spot


Michael Thomas' fantasy future hinges on landing spot



 
I am from Ohio, so of course, I was born an Ohio State fan. I think Michael Thomas has much more talent & potential than most are led to believe. There was so much talent on the Ohio State team that I felt as if they were trying to give everyone their fare share of touches. Plus, juggling between JT & Cardale did not help Thomas and the other receivers.

 
Brendon1215 said:
I am from Ohio, so of course, I was born an Ohio State fan. I think Michael Thomas has much more talent & potential than most are led to believe. There was so much talent on the Ohio State team that I felt as if they were trying to give everyone their fare share of touches. Plus, juggling between JT & Cardale did not help Thomas and the other receivers.
Fellow OSU fan and agree. The passing offense was just a mess this year. Juggling the QBs hurt. Cardale Jones seemed to lose confidence early and struggled mightily with his accuracy. New OC and new QB coach who had a tough time getting things pointed in the right direction until the OC finally moved up to the press box in game 12. Brutal pass blocking from the new RT. A bunch of bad shotgun snaps from the Center. Coaches too worried about everyone getting touches in a manufactured way instead of just letting it happen naturally. Plus, almost half the games were played in crappy weather conditions. 

It led to some ugly passing numbers across the board for the OSU offense. I understand why the stat guys are so down on Thomas, but I think the film guys assessments are going to end up being a bit more accurate in this specific case. Harmon is right that landing spot will be important. A good spot and I like him a lot in the mid-1st. Even with a bad spot, I will target him in the late 1st. 

 
Fellow OSU fan and agree. The passing offense was just a mess this year. Juggling the QBs hurt. Cardale Jones seemed to lose confidence early and struggled mightily with his accuracy. New OC and new QB coach who had a tough time getting things pointed in the right direction until the OC finally moved up to the press box in game 12. Brutal pass blocking from the new RT. A bunch of bad shotgun snaps from the Center. Coaches too worried about everyone getting touches in a manufactured way instead of just letting it happen naturally. Plus, almost half the games were played in crappy weather conditions. 

It led to some ugly passing numbers across the board for the OSU offense. I understand why the stat guys are so down on Thomas, but I think the film guys assessments are going to end up being a bit more accurate in this specific case. Harmon is right that landing spot will be important. A good spot and I like him a lot in the mid-1st. Even with a bad spot, I will target him in the late 1st. 
Probably helps him if he falls too in the sense that a "better" team will get him.  Big difference between the Browns or Rams taking a WR vs. if he fell to the Ravens or Chargers.

 
Quote

NFL Media draft analyst Lance Zierlein noted that Ohio State WR Michael Thomas sometimes runs into issues against press coverage.
"My biggest concerns are his inconsistency in adjusting to poor throws and the difficulty he has with releasing quickly against press coverage," Zierlein wrote, adding, "If Thomas doesn't improve against press coverage, he'll get a heavy dose of it in the pros." The analyst tabs him as the most overrated receiver in this draft class. Props to Zierlein for the bold claim, as there are some who would probably argue just the opposite. Fox Sports 1 insider Mike Garafolo has heard from those in the know that Thomas "has the best skill set to transition to [the] NFL," while Rotoworld's Josh Norris believes that his ability after the catch "destroy defenders' angles of anticipation."

 
 
Source: NFL.com 
Apr 18 - 4:16 PM


 
Just saw him being compared to DeAndre Hopkins, that's pretty high praise.

It sounds like he fits in well with this WR class, everyone has differing opinions and no one knows who the top WR will be.

 
Quote

 



NFL Media draft analyst Chad Reuter compares Ohio State WR Michael Thomas to DeAndre Hopkins and calls Thomas a top-10 talent for teams in need of a receiver.
"I don't care about his 40-yard dash results (4.57 seconds) -- he has elite quickness, hands and agility," Reuter wrote. "Every time I watch him, all I can think of is how DeAndre Hopkins is ripping up the league with a similar skill set." The analyst calls Thomas the fourth-safest prospect in the process. Rotoworld's Josh Norris believes Thomas' movement after the catch "destroy defenders' angles of anticipation." We compare Thomas to Michael Crabtree.

 
 
Source: NFL.com 
Apr 20 - 1:35 PM










 


 
 

An anonymous NFL scout dismissed Ohio State WR Michael Thomas as being a No. 3 receiver in a conversation with the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.
"Long strider, nonexplosive," said the scout. "Had his issues with drops. You like the size. He's somewhat of a diva. Takes after his uncle (Keyshawn Johnson) a little bit. Once you get to know him I think you can channel him. I see him as No. 3." Thomas had 113 catches for 1,602 yards (14.2) and 18 scores across three seasons eligibility. "He's a build to speed guy," another scout said. "He's just so damn inconsistent. He could be the best blocker. He can crush people. He just doesn't do it all the time. He's got great catching range, all this and that. He also drops balls."

 
 
Source: Milwaukee Journal Sentinel 
Apr 22 - 2:58 PM

 
I like his potential and he will be a guy I target during the next years offseason, I say this because I could see Thomas not having much of an impact right away and taking a couple years to gain experience and better his game before he is really a fantasy contributor

 
 

Rotoworld's Josh Norris sees Ohio State WR Michael Thomas as third-best player available on Day 2.
"[Thomas] can take short passes and surprises with acceleration and balance to pick up yards after the catch," Norris wrote. "A large portion of Thomas’ catches were made within ten yards of the line of scrimmage, but he can also win vertically and adjusts to the football while it is in the air." On Thursday, TFY Draft Insider's Tony Pauline reported that multiple NFL clubs believe Thomas has not received the attention he deserves and "will be a much better NFL receiver than college wideout."

 
 
Source: Rotoworld 
Apr 29 - 2:18 PM


 

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