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College Admissions Questions (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter NewlyRetired
- Start date
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
thanks for the kind words.
I am unsure if you have followed this thread but in case you haven't, my daughter has a lot of problems socially. Really smart hard working kid, but she wants no part of life outside of writing her stories on her computer and only interacting with people online, never in real life if she can help it.
I think this odd state of hers (which she turned into an incredible essay that got her a full scholarship to Trinity) is something that I don't see her over coming. My wife and I are planning for her to be with us for life.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Applications are up for many reasons, one of which is so many schools (over 900 and growing) have gone test optional. Almost every school that has gone test optional has seen their numbers of applicants increase, which is obviously a boon to the school.
chet
Footballguy
I wasn't aware and I didn't mean to give unsolicited advice where you're aware of the issue and are working on it. Appreciate all of your thoughts here.
bigbottom
Footballguy
Interesting. Took my son to UCLA and USC recently. He fell in love with USC and was underwhelmed by UCLA.
bigbottom
Footballguy
Is she happy? If she’s not a social person but enjoys her studies, her solitude and her online interactions, maybe that’s the best situation for her? Just spitballing here.
chet
Footballguy
Different strokes. I will say that my daughter went on the tours with no preconceived notions of any school--she goes to a French high school and doesn't have the same exposure to American colleges that most American HS students have. I'm not saying that's a good thing or a bad thing just that she made her judgement mostly on the tour and info session.
I think she wrote off UCSD when the student tour guide announced her gender pronoun preferences. I think she wrote off USC because of its location in LA. Again, I'm not saying she's right or wrong with her decision process but it's really her choice and there are a ton of great schools. I actually am happy that she's narrowing it down.
bigbottom
Footballguy
Different strokes indeed. I’m definitely sold on the fact that some campus environments just connect with people for whatever reason. USC is in a not so great part of town for sure, but we were five minutes into the campus tour and I could already tell he was in love. He’s only a sophomore though, and has a ways to go yet. But he seems focused.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
my daughter is super nerdy (in a good way). She loves Marvel, Lord of the Rings, Star Wars and anything having to do with anime.
We tried to get her to look for an anime club on campus but she would not try.
She loves going to sci fi conventions and doing some cosplay but only if she is with us.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
yes, she is happy in general. She is just a super loaner. Pretty much the opposite of what you would think a regular teenaged girl would be like.
I think she would like to have one close friend that she could watch movies with but anytime she was in a setting with more than 1 on 1 she has struggled.
She basically just wants the real world to leave her be and let her write her stories for her fans all over the world.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I have no idea why this is but it seems like so many colleges around the country are surrounded by bad areas, and yet when you are on campus, you would never know, almost like you are in an oasis.
James Daulton
Footballguy
Man, most FBGs seem to have really high performing kids. Remind me to yell at my daughter for slacking so bad in high school. 
bigbottom
Footballguy
Not sure, but we're engaging a college admissions consultant to help us navigate the process. Have you considered this?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Yes. They write one letter and it is then uploaded to the Common App and eventually distributed to all of the schools your child decides to apply to.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
We did not use one (the information in this thread was fabulous for us as I learned so much). Let us know how it works out for you and what you learn.
chet
Footballguy
Yes. We looked at it last year. At that time, I wasn't sure my daughter would be competitive for the selective schools but it appears she will be so it's worth revisiting. Did you use a big one (Ivywise or similar) or something smaller? Interested in your thoughts.
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bigbottom
Footballguy
Individual local consultant with very good reputation and credentials. You have to interview to be selected for representation by her (which I think is crazy). Formerly worked in the admissions offices at Brown and Rice.
chet
Footballguy
So I just had an initial fact finding call with a big, well known NYC based admissions consultant and I have to say I was more than a little surprised with their fee schedule. A 90-minute initial consultation was $1350, $1850 or $2850 depending on whether you used a former admissions officer with 3-years, 5-years or 8+-years of experience. Then, a 20-hour package was priced at $1250/hour, $1775/hour or $2700/hour.
No way.
May I ask what yours charges and does she work with out of state kids?
The_Man
Footballguy
Freshman year has gone really well for my son at Brown. Made straight A's in the Fall (his school is a little famous for grade inflation) but also really connected with a couple of professors in his intended major. Socially it was a little slower, as he came to school after a gap year of living abroad on his own and wasn't too in to the same kind of stupid stuff I did as a freshman. His long-time girlfriend goes to Boston University, and they pretty much see each other every 2 weekends out of 3. At first we wanted him to stay on campus more and be a bit more social, but then we decided - if he loves his studies, is doing great, and is happy because he sees his girlfriend so much, then why in the world should we be telling him to do anything different? And, as the year has progressed, he's made a wider circle of friends. Still not the biggest, but enough that he has people to hang with during the week, and the basis of a social life if the unthinkable were to ever happen and he broke up with his GF. He had a couple of study abroad things for this summer fall through, so he's a little bummed to be coming home and working some regular jobs, but we're actually pretty happy to have him home.
Nigel
Footballguy
How important is it to have a “meaningful” summer job on the resume? My daughter has been working various service-industry jobs the past couple of years, and we’re thinking she should do something this summer that would look more impressive. She’s all about banking as much money as she can, which I appreciate, but I think doing something that pays less (or not at all) might be worth it. She’s interested in life sciences, maybe pre-med, so I’m suggesting she find something in a lab or a hospital.
Am I overrating how important that is?
Am I overrating how important that is?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I can only tell from my own experience. My daughter never held a meaningful job and it did not effect her.
I would think a job is well down on the list after grades, quality of courses, test scores, awards, extra curricular activities, the essay etc of items that they look at.
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The_Man
Footballguy
My honest takeaway is that it's gotten almost impossible to game the system, because it's impossible to know what they're looking for. But my sense is that what comes through most is a genuine commitment to something. So if her genuine commitment is to working hard (and maybe serving others) and she can possible connect her service employment into a meaningful essay, then you might have something. If the life science job is truly meaningful, then that might also be something, like if the head of the lab writes her a recommendation letter, But if it's a very generic, low-level experience it might not really mean all that much.
It really is a crap shoot out there, and it's really hard for girls. There used to be some boost for girls applying in the sciences, but that's gone, and it might even be gone for engineering now too. There are just far, far more highly qualified and diligent girls than boys. If anything, my son got a little boost from being a boy with a demonstrated interest in the liberal arts - most guys now are looking for computers, science, engineering, or business.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I agree with all of this.
We talked about this last year but it is good to go through again for the new guys.
The level of competition for girls is outrageous. They dominate high schools across the country but colleges want diversity so boys (who mature later) get an even shot. What this means is that so many extremely competent girls do not get into their first choice schools.
======
The part of focusing your application on a singular strength (if they have one) is very well received by colleges. Back when we went to school, colleges wanted a balanced student for a balanced campus. Now that has flipped where colleges look for kids with singular strengths, and build their campus intelligence diversity through getting a sampling of as many strengths as they can find.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
If you feel your child has a singular strength (something that really pops) you should be able to manipulate the common app such that the awards, the recommendations, the extra activities and the essay all help highlight it. If done correctly, the application can end up telling a unique story about your child that helps them stand out.
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
The above posts hit it square on the head. The pool of well qualified female college applicants is so over saturated it is not even funny.
I have posted my daughter’s trials and tribulations of getting into college this year throughout this thread. I can’t believe her first year is over here in two weeks.
All and all she had a good time. I think taking 16 credit hours really kicked her butt. Being a kid who has pretty much never gotten lower than an “A” on a report card, getting a ‘C’ in OChem really destroyed her. But when she talked to the older students, she learned how tough that class is and she should be thankful she even passed is what most told her.
Overall, She got really good grades. She Is active in sorority (which is just a huge money sink IMO) and seemed to enjoy the comradery that it provided, but did avoid the party scene that’s associated.
We were hoping she would be done in two years because she was considered a Junior by the time the first semester was over, but due to class unavailability, she will have to attend a total of two and a half years. She is still on pace for a Bio Major with a Chem and Math-stats Minor.
She better make the big bucks. Since we are footing the bill for most of this, a return contribution would be nice.
I will post later what my tips and experiences were on getting her in college but didn’t want this post to ramble on too much.
I have posted my daughter’s trials and tribulations of getting into college this year throughout this thread. I can’t believe her first year is over here in two weeks.
All and all she had a good time. I think taking 16 credit hours really kicked her butt. Being a kid who has pretty much never gotten lower than an “A” on a report card, getting a ‘C’ in OChem really destroyed her. But when she talked to the older students, she learned how tough that class is and she should be thankful she even passed is what most told her.
Overall, She got really good grades. She Is active in sorority (which is just a huge money sink IMO) and seemed to enjoy the comradery that it provided, but did avoid the party scene that’s associated.
We were hoping she would be done in two years because she was considered a Junior by the time the first semester was over, but due to class unavailability, she will have to attend a total of two and a half years. She is still on pace for a Bio Major with a Chem and Math-stats Minor.
She better make the big bucks. Since we are footing the bill for most of this, a return contribution would be nice.
I will post later what my tips and experiences were on getting her in college but didn’t want this post to ramble on too much.
WTF, geez there are a lot of people with money to burn. My wife and I do very well but I’m not “buying a new car” for an ex-admissions officer for half a work week. My son’s a junior and his top choice is UNC, thankfully in state. I’ll check this thread out as we are going to be doing all the prep work this summer. He’s not far from all A’s and got a solid ACT/SAT score so we just have to work on all the other stuff. Clubs, job (which I do think is meaningful as much as a club, NC State mentioned it) but not a sports guy. We are trying to find an internship opportunity in the medical field but who knows. I don’t remember it being as stressful when I went to college although I got lucky without a early decision so one application and done.So I just had an initial fact finding call with a big, well known NYC based admissions consultant and I have to say I was more than a little surprised with their fee schedule. A 90-minute initial consultation was $1350, $1850 or $2850 depending on whether you used a former admissions officer with 3-years, 5-years or 8+-years of experience. Then, a 20-hour package was priced at $1250/hour, $1775/hour or $2700/hour.
No way.
May I ask what yours charges and does she work with out of state kids?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
depends on the school. If your child has a strong application outside of test scores, look into the ever growing list of test optional schools.
My daughter had good test scores but we still chose to go test optional because her test scores were much worse than the rest of her application.
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Nigel
Footballguy
First SAT went well (1420) and she is working with a prep-guy now to try to Squeeze out a few more points. Had not seen some of the math before so that’s the focus. Even at that she’s right in the middle percentile of most schools on her list, and sounds like girls need to do a little better.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
A note for parents of juniors: The essay prompts are the same as last year so your kids should have access to them to start thinking about which prompt they want to respond to.
Stay on them for the essay. It is said the essay won't get them into a school but it can keep them out.
The essay is also an important tool to separate the top students when determining merit based scholarships.
Stay on them for the essay. It is said the essay won't get them into a school but it can keep them out.
The essay is also an important tool to separate the top students when determining merit based scholarships.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
that is a very solid first run. Many kids see a small improvement on the second go. If you can squeeze it up to the high 1400's, that should be good for all but the top tier (Ivey's, MIT, Stanford etc) schools and only miss out on a few of the ultra hard second tier schools (Tufts, Amherst, Duke etc)
chet
Footballguy
Kids with hooks (recruited athletes, legacies, URM, first gen going to college etc) can be closer to the 25%ile but "unhooked" kids need to be closer to the 75%ile. I haven't heard about girls needing higher scores other than here but it wouldn't surprise me.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This article was from 2015, and it has only gotten worse for girls since then at the selective schools. Give it a quick read so that you can see the issue. If you don't want to read the whole article I will clip one important paragraph.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/07/30/achieving-perfect-gender-balance-on-campus-isnt-that-important-ending-private-colleges-affirmative-action-for-men-is/?utm_term=.76edaabb5cf4
Colleges won’t say it, but this is happening because elite schools field applications from many more qualified women than men and thus are trying to hold the line against a 60:40 ratio of women to men. Were Brown to accept women and men at the same rate, its undergraduate population would be almost 60 percent women instead of 52 percent—three women for every two men.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
One interesting stat from that article is that 70% of class valedictorians are female.
Fishboy
Footballguy
Hard to believe that I'll be picking up my daughter this Saturday and year 1 at Louisville is already done. The year went very well. Assuming finals this week go as she plans, she'll end up with her 4.0 GPA.
Unlike other posters, the sorority thing was a very positive experience. I was doubtful at first, but it ended up being a very good thing. Made many friends and they have tons of activities to keep the kids busy and social. Part of the sorority has her volunteering to be a college mentor to a local under privileged student. She really enjoys this activity and loves her "Little Buddy" as they are called.
The fact that we live in WI and chose to go to school in KY made the sorority such a positive influence. Knowing no one when she arrived, she met some very good friends. It's not like the high school 2.0 that her old friends have when they all go to one of 5 or so of the state schools. 3 of the 4 roommates she'll have next year are from the sorority.
All this and even ended her relationship of 5+ years with her boyfriend. He was a good kid, but overall I'm not terribly upset given the situation. Both are great kids, but I've always been of the philosophy to enjoy life and have fun before the whole serious relationship thing. She's still going through that emotional aspect, but overall I'm happy with her progress of her 1st year.
Seems like year 1 was a success for many of the FBG kids. Has to be because of great parenting.
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
My Two cents/ rant (and you will see this theme in most of my responses in this thread), my daughter killed herself in high school working to have the best resume she possibly could have. President of that, captain of this, extracurricular activities out the Ying Yang, good test scores, 52 transferable college credits and was top five of her class with a 4.6 GPA. Other than the merit based scholarships from the multiple schools that she got accepted into, she got zero outside scholarships—despite applying for everything.
We fall into that category where we make too much money, but we are not FBG rich. So zero grants and zero work study because that is need based. In other words, the cost of college is completely on us. So, while you really want them to attend their college of choice, you really need to take that into account when thinking about what school they/you can realistically afford.
The one school my daughter didn’t get accepted in to was close to $70,000 a year. We were really bitter at the time, but now we realize that was the best thing that ever could’ve happened. My daughter chose an affordable school and we are going to still be in about 20k in debt after year one. The parent plus loan basically is a blank check.
What we heard time and time again was you have to have a story and that is the catch that schools/ scholarships look for. So that essay that most schools want you to write, is probably one of the most important things in my opinion.
IMHO, it’s all about sports now. Every boy who’s decent enough to play is practicing all week with games on the weekend. Add in personal lessons as well. I know girls are into sports as well but the push for boys to be on every travel team, etc. has to be affecting their grades. My 7th grader’s lacrosse and football team practiced 4-5 nights a week. We are lucky to be the neighborhood across the street so he’s got time to do his work, but I’d stop quickly if his grades ever got bad. My junior isn’t into sports anymore so he’s got time to study, do clubs, work and prep for the standardized tests. With practice time and parents working on highlight reels, education isn’t the biggest thing. Parents don’t post on Facebook about Johnny’s good homework grade. Maybe I’m different from other parents but my son’s scholarship chances are academic and I don’t want them going to a worse school so they can play sports.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I agree with this.
I want to add, only half jokingly, that I think biology has a good deal to do with this.
Boys in 9th and 10th just aren't as equipped as girls to studying a ton of hours.
Hell, when picking my daughter up from school very day, I have no idea how boys that age are even looking at the boards given what the girls are wearing.
NutterButter
Footballguy
I've heard good things about going this route. It seems like they help with everything from applications, major selection, school selection, financial aid, etc. Considering the cost of college in general, an extra grand or two is worth it to navigate the process. If they manage to get us a grant or scholarship that we wouldn't have even considered, they will pay for themselves. Its always nice to have that third party objective source of info instead of having everything that your kid hears be coming from you.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
For the parents of younger boys who might be reading, the lesson is this:
*If your freshman boy is doing really well compared to the girls in his class, he is way ahead of the curve. Just tell him to keep it going.
*If your freshman boy appears to be struggling to match even the top 1/3 of the girls, do not worry, that is completely normal. Colleges, even the semi selective ones, will leans towards giving boys a break for the freshman and sophomore grades (which they won't do for girls), specifically if the boy wakes up and has a great junior and senior year to show improvement and maturity.
*If your freshman boy is doing really well compared to the girls in his class, he is way ahead of the curve. Just tell him to keep it going.
*If your freshman boy appears to be struggling to match even the top 1/3 of the girls, do not worry, that is completely normal. Colleges, even the semi selective ones, will leans towards giving boys a break for the freshman and sophomore grades (which they won't do for girls), specifically if the boy wakes up and has a great junior and senior year to show improvement and maturity.
Fishboy
Footballguy
Daughter #2 is a junior in HS, so we're just starting this whole process all over again.
Another one with no desire to go to college in state. Ranked #2 in her class and has been saying she wants to be an actuary since middle school.
Here are the schools she's considering so far:
Another one with no desire to go to college in state. Ranked #2 in her class and has been saying she wants to be an actuary since middle school.
Here are the schools she's considering so far:
- Purdue - toured it back in January. Very highly ranked actuary program, which means they are in demand, so give out very little in terms of scholarships.
- Alabama - plan on touring later this summer. This is my daughter's #1 choice and it's really because of how generous they are for out of state merit scholarships. She's shooting for the Presidential Scholar award, which is ACT of 33-36 or SAT of 1490-1600 where they award $25K/year. Even at out of state tuition, this puts them into instate equivalent her in WI. 30-32 ACT still awards 19K/year.
- Iowa - plan on touring later this spring. Don't see this as a likely scenario, as their out of state tuition is stupid and they offer little in terms of out of state merit scholarships.
- Vanderbilt - This one is probably both the wild card and the stretch school, as they only have about an 11% acceptance rate. Additionally, being private we don't see much published about their merit type scholarships. Plus my daughter thinks it's too small. But we'll still tour and see what it all has to offer.
Lol, my oldest is very social with lots of friends, including girls, but he’s got no game so he can study. My 7th grader is going to be a tough challenge at that point. He’s all about girls already and they love him. Let’s just say that he told me and my wife something two girls on snap chat said to him (both in the upper echelon of looks) about what they were doing this summer. It wasn’t over the line but getting there. On the one hand as a dad I couldn’t be more proud (amazingly hypocritical but I luckily have all boys) but he’s going to be the one I worry about. I know we weren’t distracted like that in my high school.
NutterButter
Footballguy
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bigbottom
Footballguy
Those numbers are absolutely absurd. It’s $3500 all in for ours. Not sure if she works with out of state kids.So I just had an initial fact finding call with a big, well known NYC based admissions consultant and I have to say I was more than a little surprised with their fee schedule. A 90-minute initial consultation was $1350, $1850 or $2850 depending on whether you used a former admissions officer with 3-years, 5-years or 8+-years of experience. Then, a 20-hour package was priced at $1250/hour, $1775/hour or $2700/hour.
No way.
May I ask what yours charges and does she work with out of state kids?
Here is the description of her services:
My services cover all aspects of preparing for and submitting applications to colleges and universities including:
• Standardized test planning and scheduling
• Developing a target list of schools
• Building relationships with target schools, including planning and making visits
• Essay topic selection and critical review
• Developing a resume
• Preparing for interviews
• Application review
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bigbottom
Footballguy
Yep. I look at it this way - I’m paying for two things: (1) the consultant’s expertise; and (2) preserving my relationship with my son by not being all up in his business as he navigates the process. With our consultant, only the first meeting is with the parents. After that, the consultant works directly with the kid without parents managing the communication.
bigbottom
Footballguy
Fascinating. I initially thought the fee we were paying was ridiculous, I certainly wasn’t looking to pay that much. But she came highly recommended and helped our best friend’s son navigate the process with great success (he’s at an Ivy now). Of course, now that I heard about the NYC prices from Chet, our consultant feels downright reasonable. My son is only a sophomore so we won’t have our first meeting until next month.
Courtjester
The Town Drunk
So, Bruce any suggestions for some good scholarships offers out there for College Juniors. I literally just want her to win anything – – even $500 just to say she got something.
i can’t tell you how frustrated she was with this whole scholarship process as a HS senior. I posted about it many many pages back with her whole experience with the Coke scholarship. She got to one of the final rounds where they cut it down from 2500 to like 1500 and the last requirement was for her to send a picture. We did it and within a few days of sending it, she was told no. It was like it is one thing to be denied because of academic stuff, but when they don’t like your picture, good God!!
i can’t tell you how frustrated she was with this whole scholarship process as a HS senior. I posted about it many many pages back with her whole experience with the Coke scholarship. She got to one of the final rounds where they cut it down from 2500 to like 1500 and the last requirement was for her to send a picture. We did it and within a few days of sending it, she was told no. It was like it is one thing to be denied because of academic stuff, but when they don’t like your picture, good God!!
chet
Footballguy
WTF? That's awful. Did you ever follow up with them? They should know that their process is completely unacceptable.
chet
Footballguy
My daughter's first language is English but she attends a French high school. Any thoughts on her taking French as one of the SAT subject tests? She'll easily score 800 on it but will admissions officers frown on French being one of her two required subject tests since most of her courses are taught in French?
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