NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I thought the opposite was happening. I thought more and more schools were adopting test optional stances.
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College Admissions Questions (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter NewlyRetired
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Ilov80s
Footballguy
MAC_32
Footballguy
The_Man
Footballguy
The VP for Admissions at DePaul University does a lot of fascinating in-depth data visualizations about higher ed admissions. To be honest, a lot of it is pretty technical, but if you’re really interested in the topic, his stuff is invaluable.
This week, he came out with a ton of stuff about full-pay students at private colleges. You can find it all here:
https://highereddatastories.blogspot.com
The biggest takeaway is that full-pay students (those who receive no financial aid from the college) overwhelmingly attend the most selective schools. It raises the question, are kids of rich parents better qualified, do they have the kind of applications that selective colleges like, or are these colleges disproportionately admitting rich kids? He doesn’t answer that question, but seems to lean toward the latter. Some of his findings:
The schools that admit less than 15% of applicants enroll only 5.3% of all students, but take 14.4% of all full-pay students. The schools that admit between 15-30% enroll 13.7% of all students, but take 36.4% of all-full pay students. Collectively, the most selective schools (those that admit less than 30% of applicants) enroll only 19% of private college students, but take more than half the full-pay students in the country.
Within each selectivity band, you can see which colleges take the most full-pay students. Not surprisingly, they tend to be schools that have reputations where dumber rich kids can sometimes buy their way in.
For the private schools that admit fewer than 15% of applicants, 47% of enrolled students are full pay.
In this band, Brown and Duke are are at the top end of enrolling full-pay kids, 57 and 55%.
For the private schools that admit between 15-30% of applicants, 44% of enrolled students are full pay.
Tufts and Wake Forest are at the top of this group in enrolling full-pay kids, along with BC, Georgetown, Bates and Wash U in St. Louis, among others.
For those that admit 30-45%, it goes down to 29% full pay. Here some of the ones that admit the most full-paying kids are Skidmore, Trinity, Lafayette, Lehigh and NYU.
To me, the biggest takeaway is that for even the colleges that claim to be “need blind” - except for maybe the very, very top colleges - there is a definite admissions boost that comes with checking the “Does Not Need Financial Aid” box on the application.
This week, he came out with a ton of stuff about full-pay students at private colleges. You can find it all here:
https://highereddatastories.blogspot.com
The biggest takeaway is that full-pay students (those who receive no financial aid from the college) overwhelmingly attend the most selective schools. It raises the question, are kids of rich parents better qualified, do they have the kind of applications that selective colleges like, or are these colleges disproportionately admitting rich kids? He doesn’t answer that question, but seems to lean toward the latter. Some of his findings:
The schools that admit less than 15% of applicants enroll only 5.3% of all students, but take 14.4% of all full-pay students. The schools that admit between 15-30% enroll 13.7% of all students, but take 36.4% of all-full pay students. Collectively, the most selective schools (those that admit less than 30% of applicants) enroll only 19% of private college students, but take more than half the full-pay students in the country.
Within each selectivity band, you can see which colleges take the most full-pay students. Not surprisingly, they tend to be schools that have reputations where dumber rich kids can sometimes buy their way in.
For the private schools that admit fewer than 15% of applicants, 47% of enrolled students are full pay.
In this band, Brown and Duke are are at the top end of enrolling full-pay kids, 57 and 55%.
For the private schools that admit between 15-30% of applicants, 44% of enrolled students are full pay.
Tufts and Wake Forest are at the top of this group in enrolling full-pay kids, along with BC, Georgetown, Bates and Wash U in St. Louis, among others.
For those that admit 30-45%, it goes down to 29% full pay. Here some of the ones that admit the most full-paying kids are Skidmore, Trinity, Lafayette, Lehigh and NYU.
To me, the biggest takeaway is that for even the colleges that claim to be “need blind” - except for maybe the very, very top colleges - there is a definite admissions boost that comes with checking the “Does Not Need Financial Aid” box on the application.
Kind of silly if he doesn’t answer the questions you mentioned. You have to look at the scores and grades, etc. to see if colleges are doing what he’s insinuating, i.e. taking dumb rich kids over smart poor kids. I’m sorry but that screams the anecdotal welfare folks picking up their checks driving Escalades. I’d think that most full pay kids go to solid schools and have access to way more test prep, etc. I don’t want to dive into the cesspool that would be the whole discussion about those kids being smarter because their parents likely went to good colleges and all that.
I just think it’s looking at one stat and not analyzing why those kids got in more often, but assuming that colleges prefer no financial aid needed. I’ve got an anecdote where I got into a prestigious college over a not as smart kid whose family was much more wealthy and his dad went to that college. It was years ago, but that stupid rich legacy kid didn’t get in over the middle class financial aid needing kid.
The_Man
Footballguy
The author is one of the foremost college admissions leaders and thinkers in the entire U.S., in part because of his mastery of and reliance upon data. He simply mined the data to reveal that:
14% of all full-pay students attend the 2.44% of private institutions that admit under 15% of students
36% attend the 6% admitting 15-30%
So, 50% of full-pay students attend 8.44% of schools in the country - those that are most selective.
He actually did post a few conclusions on Twitter, which I'll now post here:
I think parts of all of these are true - saw #3 and #4 a lot when my kid was going through the process. The "prestige" colleges didn't have to offer discounts because people would do whatever it took to pay for them if their kid got in. As a result, the less prestigious colleges would compete on price by offering merit aid/scholarships (i.e., discounts).
I get what he mined, but I thought his conclusions that colleges prefer full pay students and allow rich dumb kids to get in were based on data that doesn’t prove it. I can see what you said that less prestigious colleges have to offer scholarships to get top students but they are doing the to get kids who would get into prestigious colleges. Why would a kid go to a less prestigious school if it cost exactly the same as a better school? It might happen on the off chance but not regularly.
He just lost me with the rich dumb kid comment which I have seen the opposite of in my own life and I think is similar in reality to the Escalade welfare lady. My oldest is going to college next year and he’s going to apply to one prestigious college and that’s because I went there. He loved UNC and that’s his top choice and he isn’t thinking about Duke because of the cost. Heck, he might not get in there anyway but he’s smart enough to realize the difference in schools isn’t enough to be saddled with the extra $150k+ in loans he’d take out. We aren’t rich but make enough and Duke isn’t going to give him a scholarship that likely goes to a kid who got a 1580. He’s not in the data point because, like many others needing aid, he realizes that the equivalent of a new house isn’t worth it if your parents don’t have $900k laying around for 3 kids.
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chet
Footballguy
Probably not MIT but she'll apply to Harvard in all likelihood. Another dream/reach but you can't get in if you don't apply.Is she applying to MIT? We could rub elbows over a beer when you come to visit!
Love to have a beer!
The_Man
Footballguy
Don’t remember her ACT but I think you’re right that a 34 is table stakes for a white girl to be considered at a place like Stanford. Even a 32 isn’t going to be helpful
But my increasing awareness is that ED/SCEA doesn’t really mean much at the very top of the pyramid like Stanford or MIT. Where it makes a big difference is at schools that don’t want to be a backup - Penn, Northwestern, Washington U in STL - or the liberal arts colleges. At those schools, an ED applicant whose profile exceeds the 75th percentile of the average admitted students can still enjoy some predictability in Admissions. But for Stanford, it’s always going to be a long shot so you have to decide if that’s how you want to shoot your ED bullet.
chet
Footballguy
Stanford's early admit rate is ~9.5% and their regular admit rate is ~2.5%. I know it's not apples to apples (athletes, stronger applications early etc.) but even with all of that, there does appear to be a distinct advantage to applying early there. I agree that applying early decision is the one way to definitively indicate to a school that it's not a backup.
The_Man
Footballguy
This is a crazy story:
Penn's former varsity men's basketball coach is accused of taking bribes to use of his allocated recruiting spots to get a kid into school. The kid never played, or even went out for the team - the coach (allegedly) pocketed the bribe, and the kid just went about his life as a student.
Penn's former varsity men's basketball coach is accused of taking bribes to use of his allocated recruiting spots to get a kid into school. The kid never played, or even went out for the team - the coach (allegedly) pocketed the bribe, and the kid just went about his life as a student.
Gawain
Footballguy
The_Man
Footballguy
With the Admissions season about to ramp up again, here are a couple of recent interesting stories:
To me, this is pretty cool - of course, when you're the most selective school in the country you can afford to downplay your selectivity. But I like them using their position as market leader to try to shift the focus on admissions away from selectivity, which is pretty much all it seems to be about these days.
This is yet another black eye for the College Board. I'd be so angry if my kid took the August SAT, only to see them being scored vs. people who had already seen (and even taken) the test.
No ####. That’s ridiculous. My son stopped taking them after the spring including getting a worse score than a previous one when he did better. That was that one everyone wanted rescored. It’s frustrating feeling like there are better times to take these test than others.
As long as he gets into his top choice, I guess it doesn’t matter, but it wouldn’t surprise me that the ACT starts to take precedence. The ACT was barely even mentioned when I was taking the SATs and now they seem to be on par. With all the SAT scoring changes, seemingly bad curves and now this, I would think that schools might start preferring the ACT.
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Nigel
Footballguy
HUGE relief at the Nigel household today. In the wake of feeling like she got screwed by the harsh SAT curve, ACT score were released today and she got a 35. So happy for her. She has one more SAT subject score she wants to improve but the heavy lifting is over with, thank goodness.
The_Man
Footballguy
Congrats to her! That's an amazing score.
Is she still fixated on Georgetown? Would be happy to DM my son's admission experience there - I actually respect that they seem to be one of the very few highly selective schools genuinely interested in quality applications over quantity. Which is why they require 3 Subject tests, and also don't give a bump to Early applicants - my memory is that they're one of the few schools whose Early accept rate is lower than its Regular. FWIW, he only took and submitted 2 Subject scores and still got in, though the 2 he did submit were very good.
My son really thought he was going to Georgetown until a very late change of heart, so we went through the whole process, including the admitted students welcome day.
Nigel
Footballguy
Yup, still all-in on Georgetown, 90% sure if she gets in she will go there. Any advice/insight on their process is appreciated.
The_Man
Footballguy
You probably know all this stuff, but I'll share my thoughts/impressions.Nigel said:Yup, still all-in on Georgetown, 90% sure if she gets in she will go there. Any advice/insight on their process is appreciated.
Georgetown makes applicants jump through hoops a little - the 3 Subject tests, their own application rather than the Common App, and they also don't send admissions decisions electronically. You still have to wait and check the mailbox. I think it's kind of cool. When every other school seems to be focused on jacking up the number of applications they receive, Georgetown seems to actually be limiting its applicants to kids who really want to be there.
Also, Georgetown doesn't have binding Early Decision, just Early Action. As a result, they are super serious when they say they only take kids Early that they are 100% certain would also get in Regular Decision. In fact, here's a quote I found from the student paper from a couple of years ago: “Georgetown strategically keeps its early action acceptance rate lower than that of the regular acceptance rate…. Georgetown accepted 11.9 percent of its 7,822 early action applicants to the Class of 2021” while the “overall acceptance rate for the Class of 2020 was around 16.4 percent.” So if she doesn't get in Early, don't let her get too upset, because she still might get in Regular.
One good thing about applying Early is that they will let you get away without submitting all 3 Subject tests, because they assume you might be taking them on Nov. 1, which is too late for Early deadlines. But if you don't get in Early, they will expect to see them for Regular. As I said above, my kid was burned out on testing, and he had an 800 and 780 on two Subject tests (Lit and Math II) so he rolled the dice and didn't take a third. If she only has 2 or even 1 good Subject score to date, I'd just submit those ones with the Early app, knowing you can always retest and/or add the other scores if she ends up in Regular Decision.
The School of Foreign Service is the hardest to get into. Though they talk about the acceptance rate at all the schools being about the same, it was clear to me that there was some self-selection going on, with some of the most qualified applicants going for SFS. I wouldn't apply there - apparently it's very easy to transfer between schools once you're in, and I really think the College of Arts and Sciences is a little easier to get into (that's where my kid applied).
The other thing I've heard is that if you're Catholic, and you can connect it in some meaningful way to an essay, or your record of service/extra-curriculars, it can give you a little boost. But just being Catholic doesn't give you a boost if you can't demonstrate how that's influenced you in some meaningful way.
One last thing to think about -- a 35 ACT is going to make her an attractive applicant to a lot of schools. And at most other schools (but not Georgetown), applying ED gives you a boost. Is there any other school she might possibly be willing to use that ED chit at, or is that impossible, knowing that she wouldn't be happy without at least applying to Georgetown and seeing if she could get in? I think I know the answer but it might at least be worth discussing with her.
Good luck! It's such a stressful process, and all you can do is try to keep your kid on an even keel as they go through it. But it usually seems to work out pretty well in the end.
bigbottom
Footballguy
Nigel
Footballguy
Thanks for the effort, great info.
She’s definitely going EA at a couple others besides GTown but I’m not sure she’d be up for ED elsewhere. It makes sense though, will talk to her about it.
She’s got the Catholic angle covered with some of the extracurriculars, and to be honest they were done primarily for thus reason. Have to play the game.
Does anyone know whether each school knows what other schools kids apply to, at the time that the acceptance decision is made? I'm assuming that the answer is 'no' for early admission, 'yes' for any schools using the common application, but what about the rest? Are they able to share information with other schools on who has applied?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
read this when you have some time. It may help answer your questions
https://www.forbes.com/sites/noodleeducation/2015/06/16/how-the-fafsa-and-act-can-hurt-your-application-and-not-for-the-reasons-you-think/#3f05afec20c3
bigbottom
Footballguy
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Damn... Things seem so much more complicated, nuanced, and more data driven than 20 years ago. I fear what this system will look like in 12 years when my kids are applying.
Good luck to all.
Good luck to all.
Yep. After reading that I almost don’t even want to fill out the FAFSA form. I doubt we’ll get much of anything and that’s awful.The Z Machine said:
Data analytics are going to make a whole different world. So much for each application being individual. Oh, we think it’s highly unlikely they’ll accept our acceptance so let’s deny them. Reminds me of that Gattaca movie where your future has already been decided because of all the data of the past.
My son has his top choice (UNC, in state and his top choice) but it would be sad if any of his other options just ignored him because he has a top choice which is $50k less per year.
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Thanks - I stumbled across that article shortly after I posted the question, and it's exactly what I was looking for.
What's disturbing is HOW they're using data analytics. I started looking for info on how analytics played into the admissions process, thinking that I'd find that either analytics aren't being used or that they're being used to identify outstanding students in a more fair way...correctly adjusting for things like students at more competitive high schools getting lower grades than those in easier high schools, or students' GPAs being unfairly influenced by some !@#$% teacher who never gives grades above 80.
What I've actually found is pretty disturbing - it seems that colleges are pretty sophisticated in their use of analytics, but that they don't have much interest in identifying the very best students. There's no discussion of using data to find students who will achieve the highest college grades, earn the most earlier in their career, or have the best chance of becoming CEOs eventually.
The entire focus seems to be:
1. Find students who will say 'yes' if accepted.
2. Find students who will meet the minimum threshold of eventually graduating from the college if enrolled.
With that in mind, it begins to make sense that schools are rejecting top high school students, seemingly at random. The students are playing the wrong game, and it doesn't matter how well they play it if they don't understand the rules. In order to keep people from gaming the system, the colleges are deliberately trying to mislead everyone about their admissions criteria.
Tick
Footballguy
Daughter got National Merit... trying to decide between the various schools that offer very good automatic scholarships. http://nmfscholarships.yolasite.com/ is a pretty old list (Oklahoma's scholarship has decreased significantly, or at least failed to keep up with rising costs). Does anyone have any good resources to find automatic NM scholarships?
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Can you flesh this out a bit more? What game are the colleges playing and why?zoobird said:
Once armed with this knowledge, what can students do?
BeTheMatch
Footballguy
Apparently a lot of this stems from the rankings of colleges put out by US News and World Report. The formula is public and has a heavy weighting on the percentage of accepted applicants who enroll. So the colleges are trying very hard not to accept students who are likely to turn them down. Some of the actionable implications for students would be:
1. Do everything possible to prevent the colleges from knowing that you're applying to lots of other schools.
2. Encourage each college to think that you're their first choice.
3. I read somewhere about one college that created a private social network for applicants to ask questions, learn about majors, etc. They were using machine learning to evaluate what kinds of interactions were made by students who were likely to attend if offered a spot. So in general...take every opportunity to engage and show interest.
4. Rather than trying to show the most/best extracurriculars, find a way to show a connection to the extracurriculars specifically available at the school you're applying to. So "I'm top 10 in debate nationally" may be less valuable than "I'm top 200 in debate nationally and my idol is a guy who graduated from my high school and goes to your college now".
SteelCurtain
Footballguy
Just for clarity and accuracy, this article is a several years old. Colleges/universities no longer are able to see the order schools are listed on the FAFSA.
Nigel
Footballguy
Confirmed - I sounded this alarm/caused a bit of panic at my house the other day after reading this, only to be reprimanded shortly thereafter for disseminating outdated info.
chet
Footballguy
The_Man
Footballguy
A lot of blah blah there. But the lawsuit has revealed a lot of stuff.chet said:
Consider this: it came out in court that 40% of white admitted students are either legacy or recruited athletes.
Last year, Harvard accepted 1,962 students. Half were white - 981. Only 60% of those weren’t legacy or athletes. So that’s 588 kids.
M/F ratio is 50/50. So that’s 294 boys and 294 girls in the whole country. Is your kid one of the top 300 applicants in the whole USA? Because that’s roughly what it takes - and don’t forget first-generation college kids are now getting a boost, making it even tougher to get one of those 300 spots.
SteelCurtain
Footballguy
The ultra selectives is like playing the lottery.
Harvard denies more valedictorians than they admit. Harvard denies more perfect SATs than they admit.
Its not different at Stanford, Yale, Princeton and a few other super elites.
E-Z Glider
Footballguy
Couple questions... My daughter is in a great spot academically. She's top 10 in a class of 300+, has a great resume, and crushed the SAT's. I think she could have a legit shot at Ivy league, but she's just not interested. Her 1st choice right now is a local private school and she will have no problem getting accepted. Problem is, we're not going to qualify for any type of financial aid, so the question becomes, how much of her college savings does she want to blow on undergrad, when she'll almost certainly have more schooling to come?
My questions specifically are...
My questions specifically are...
- Her first choice school (Dickinson) offers different levels of merit-based scholarships. The highest level is $20k per year and the 2nd highest is $15k per year, but they both list the same qualifications (which she meets). I think she will go there for sure if she gets the $20k. What can she do to help ensure she gets the maximum scholarship offer?
- Her special interest counselor suggested that she apply to Duquesne because they apparently have a huge endowment right now and are really trying to recruit top level science students. He said one of their students applied last year and ended up getting an offer she couldnt refuse. This is particularly interesting to me because he also said that final offers are negotiable? As in, my daughter could potentially take this offer from Dusquesne into Dickinson and use it to negotiate a better deal. Is this really common practice?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
your daughter sounds like an excellent student, but if you are new to this process, you need to know that girls across the country have dynamite applications. The Ivy's turn away a TON of girls with perfect SAT's and class valedictorians. I don't say this to discourage you, just to set your expectations correctly.Couple questions... My daughter is in a great spot academically. She's top 10 in a class of 300+, has a great resume, and crushed the SAT's. I think she could have a legit shot at Ivy league, but she's just not interested. Her 1st choice right now is a local private school and she will have no problem getting accepted. Problem is, we're not going to qualify for any type of financial aid, so the question becomes, how much of her college savings does she want to blow on undergrad, when she'll almost certainly have more schooling to come?
My questions specifically are...
TIA
- Her first choice school (Dickinson) offers different levels of merit-based scholarships. The highest level is $20k per year and the 2nd highest is $15k per year, but they both list the same qualifications (which she meets). I think she will go there for sure if she gets the $20k. What can she do to help ensure she gets the maximum scholarship offer?
- Her special interest counselor suggested that she apply to Duquesne because they apparently have a huge endowment right now and are really trying to recruit top level science students. He said one of their students applied last year and ended up getting an offer she couldnt refuse. This is particularly interesting to me because he also said that final offers are negotiable? As in, my daughter could potentially take this offer from Dusquesne into Dickinson and use it to negotiate a better deal. Is this really common practice?
We were in the same boat as you in not being able to get any financial aid so our hope was on merit scholarships.
One thing we learned is that most colleges have merit scholarships that are above and beyond what they list on their web site that are for the top students they want to attract.
What this thread has shown and from my own experience, is that the essay is incredibly important when it comes to the high end merit scholarships since the top kids applications all start to look the same. The essay gives the admissions people a chance to differentiate the students.
I have certainly heard of people using one scholarship to negotiate with another school but this is another spot where expectations need to be measured.
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The_Man
Footballguy
I'm a big Dickinson fan - my sisters went there (and loved it) and 2 of my best friends are professors there.
Even though it's her first choice, don't apply Early Decision there - that locks you in and kills their motivation to offer merit aid. But I would apply by their non-binding Early Action deadline and be sure to demonstrate additional interest in whatever other ways possible as well.
And then she should of course apply to some other schools. If/when you get a great offer from (for example) Duquesne, there's absolutely nothing wrong with going back to Dickinson and shopping the offer. It can't hurt, but just be prepared for them not to match it, or even to sweeten their offer. There's a food chain, and the lower schools on the chain have to pay more money to get students who otherwise wouldn't go there. It's why the Ivy League doesn't have to offer merit aid, and why Dickinson has to offer merit aid to attract Ivy-qualified kids, and why Duquesne has to offer even more to get those kids. So don't expect Dickinson to offer the same discount to get your kid that Duquesne does.
Good luck!
Even though it's her first choice, don't apply Early Decision there - that locks you in and kills their motivation to offer merit aid. But I would apply by their non-binding Early Action deadline and be sure to demonstrate additional interest in whatever other ways possible as well.
And then she should of course apply to some other schools. If/when you get a great offer from (for example) Duquesne, there's absolutely nothing wrong with going back to Dickinson and shopping the offer. It can't hurt, but just be prepared for them not to match it, or even to sweeten their offer. There's a food chain, and the lower schools on the chain have to pay more money to get students who otherwise wouldn't go there. It's why the Ivy League doesn't have to offer merit aid, and why Dickinson has to offer merit aid to attract Ivy-qualified kids, and why Duquesne has to offer even more to get those kids. So don't expect Dickinson to offer the same discount to get your kid that Duquesne does.
Good luck!
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E-Z Glider
Footballguy
This somewhat concerns me. My daughter doesnt really have a unique story to tell. She wrote her essay as part of her AP English class, so she got a good start on it. My wife works for J&J and they have free college admissions help, so she also turned it into them for critique. I feel its as strong as its going to be, but its still nothing extraordinarily unique.
That's great to hear! and yes, she is applying Early Action.
This "demonstrating additional interest" is what Im hoping to find out more about. She has already done 2 official college visits/tours. They also suggested checking in at the registrar when there and pimping it on social media. She is also going to schedule an interview with them. Any other suggestions?
Certainly wouldnt be looking for them to match the offer. All I would be hoping for is them to possibly sweeten it a bit. Honestly, I didnt even know this was a thing before yesterday.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
She does not need to tell a story per say. But if you can construct the entire application to highlight a specific interest/skill, then it helps focus the student in the eyes of the admissions office.
In the old days (when we went to school), colleges looked for well rounded students to create a well rounded campus. Recently colleges have changed things up a bit to try and look for students who specialize in something with the thought that if they get enough students who specialize in numerous different items, they can create the well rounded campus in that fashion.
My daughter wants to be a writer, so her entire application was focused on that skill (awards, activities, essay and recommendations). Ironically we did not know we were doing this at the time as it just worked out that way, but I believe it was key in her receiving a full tuition merit 4 year scholarship.
The above focuses on the top end scholarships that the colleges don't publicize. For the $20ker size, just having a solid application that is above the average should be more than good enough.
In terms of demonstrating interest, visits and interviews are great. Also look for any local college fairs that this school may be attending and go to that. These are small things to do but they can't hurt.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
oh that reminds me. Everyone who has a child applying should implore their kids to scrub their social media accounts clean, even if they think they are harmless. More and more colleges look at these accounts to get a quick indication of the child outside of the academic environment and you have no idea if something small might offend some one in admissions.
This is one of those better to be safe than sorry things.
The_Man
Footballguy
An interview would be a really good idea. And at that interview, she should tell the admissions office that Dickinson is her first choice.
I don't know if your daughter has a personal relationship with her college counselor, but if she does the counselor might be able to tell Dickinson (based on the school's relationship with the Admissions office) that your daughter is very interested in attending. Though that tends to work better if the high school has regularly sent kids to Dickinson and your daughter actually knows the counselor well enough to have a discussion with them.
E-Z Glider
Footballguy
Her counselor also told us about a student he had a few years ago that sent out a bunch of applications and ended up getting an offer for a full-ride from University of Nebraska (I really had no idea this type of thing happens?). It was completely out of left-field, but she ended up accepting the offer sight-unseen. She's still there and loves it.
We're going to a seminar on Monday where they're going to discuss which schools are offering the most money right now and how to find them. Starting to make me feel like we did this all backwards. Instead of visiting a dozen schools first and then picking her top choices (WITH NO IDEA OF ACTUAL COSTS!), we really should've just sent out hundreds of applications and then visited the top dozen offers to see which she liked best.
We're going to a seminar on Monday where they're going to discuss which schools are offering the most money right now and how to find them. Starting to make me feel like we did this all backwards. Instead of visiting a dozen schools first and then picking her top choices (WITH NO IDEA OF ACTUAL COSTS!), we really should've just sent out hundreds of applications and then visited the top dozen offers to see which she liked best.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This is just my opinion, but I think you did it the right way. Certainly all financial cost info is easy enough to find so that should not be an issue. It would take less than 5 minutes to create a small list of 6-10 schools your daughter likes and list the cost of each.
chet
Footballguy
IMO there are 6 colleges that if your child is admitted, they owe it to themselves to attend. Oxford, Cambridge, Stanford, Harvard, Princeton and Yale. It's a crapshoot to get in to any of these even for the best qualified students so it's best not to get your hopes up but you have to work hard on the essays and supplementals because that's what differentiates you--everyone who gets a legitimate look has the test scores and academics.
If, like most, you don't get in then you look to a school that best meets the needs of the student and the family.
If, like most, you don't get in then you look to a school that best meets the needs of the student and the family.
