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***Chicago Bears Thread*** Poles is playing 5D chess! (12 Viewers)

rockaction said:
You both (flapgreen and Dr. Dan) make good points, methinks.  If the Bears didn't think they were playoff contenders, they don't go out and give up all that for Mack. Then again, talent evaluators seem -- in my brief perusal yesterday -- to have a lot of questions about the Bears, even with their upgrades.

Personally, I'm not sold on Trubisky, either, but my exposure to him is limited and should be taken with a massive dose of salt.
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I don't think anyone is ever sold on a second year qb, except for a handful of guys.  It goes without saying the team's success hinges on Trubisky.  What I love about Pace is that he's the first Bears GM in my lifetime who's taken a young qb and actually tried to build around him. He got his qb and now he's giving him every chance to succeed. There's no guarantees on anyone, but he's done his part. Let's hope he's right on Trubisky.   If he is, we're in for the best years of Bears football for most of our adult lifetimes. 

 
tdmills said:
Which is what Flapgreen said....any QB could fail. You brought up Cutler and it has no connection. 

The piece you're missing is a great defense and good running game = wins. Everything else is gravy. 
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to your first point, flap is putting his faith in the managements faith in the QB. I was showing that GMs have been wrong before. I used Cutler because it's one he can probably understand. 

you're absolutely right on the second part. However, again, Chicago had great running backs under Cutler and a top notch defense. Cutler just liked throwing ints. 

 
flapgreen said:
I don't think anyone is ever sold on a second year qb, except for a handful of guys.  It goes without saying the team's success hinges on Trubisky.  What I love about Pace is that he's the first Bears GM in my lifetime who's taken a young qb and actually tried to build around him. He got his qb and now he's giving him every chance to succeed. There's no guarantees on anyone, but he's done his part. Let's hope he's right on Trubisky.   If he is, we're in for the best years of Bears football for most of our adult lifetimes. 
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Yeah, he seems to have taken the right approach to surrounding him with some weapons, a hopefully reasonable line, a defense that will get him the ball back, etc.

Look at the Jets and Darnold: They've done none of that. He's playing behind a lousy line with inexperienced wideouts that are generally in their second or third year of playing time in the league. 

So yeah, there's that to build on for the Bears, as you put it. Sounds like a good approach.  

 
Dr. Dan said:
to your first point, flap is putting his faith in the managements faith in the QB. I was showing that GMs have been wrong before. I used Cutler because it's one he can probably understand. 

you're absolutely right on the second part. However, again, Chicago had great running backs under Cutler and a top notch defense. Cutler just liked throwing ints. 
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Cutler also had an atrocious OL and terrible offensive coaching. It's gonna be hard to replicate the defense they had then, but Trubisky has a very good OL, probably the best OL coach in the game, and a young offensive mind at HC.  Again, there's guarantees, but their GM has set the qb up perfectly. Now, we just have to hope it works. 

 
flapgreen said:
I don't think anyone is ever sold on a second year qb, except for a handful of guys.  It goes without saying the team's success hinges on Trubisky.  What I love about Pace is that he's the first Bears GM in my lifetime who's taken a young qb and actually tried to build around him. He got his qb and now he's giving him every chance to succeed. There's no guarantees on anyone, but he's done his part. Let's hope he's right on Trubisky.   If he is, we're in for the best years of Bears football for most of our adult lifetimes. 
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I think this is a very accurate statement 

 
For me, the move makes them a better team. Does Mack add value? He certainly does. Ppl talk about how tough this division is going to be but without a pass rusher the other teams in the division would have exposed the gap mercilessly. They plug a bona fide stud into the gap and check the box.

They gave up a lot of future potential to get a proven player today. This is not a one year player in a “going for it all” season. This is a crown jewel for many years to come. 

Folks here talking about how it all means nothing unless Trubinsky is suddenly a pro bowler this season are being irrational. This team is crawling out of the basement taking steps forward. I have always said that formidable lines on both sides of the ball will bring winning seasons. This move helps a lot. I wonder what kind of football shape Mack will be in? Can he step in and make an impact in week 1? 

On the flip side, the injuries have killed this team for many years now. Happens to all teams but this team has been bitten hard. No excuses but it would be nice to see what they have without the constant MASH unit. 

 
Speaking of injuries, lets keep our fingers crossed that our two new linebackers that missed training camp don't pull up lame around week 3. 

Legit concern of mine. 

 
Power Monster said:
For me, the move makes them a better team. Does Mack add value? He certainly does. Ppl talk about how tough this division is going to be but without a pass rusher the other teams in the division would have exposed the gap mercilessly. They plug a bona fide stud into the gap and check the box.

They gave up a lot of future potential to get a proven player today. This is not a one year player in a “going for it all” season. This is a crown jewel for many years to come. 

Folks here talking about how it all means nothing unless Trubinsky is suddenly a pro bowler this season are being irrational. This team is crawling out of the basement taking steps forward. I have always said that formidable lines on both sides of the ball will bring winning seasons. This move helps a lot. I wonder what kind of football shape Mack will be in? Can he step in and make an impact in week 1? 

On the flip side, the injuries have killed this team for many years now. Happens to all teams but this team has been bitten hard. No excuses but it would be nice to see what they have without the constant MASH unit. 
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Guys like Mack stay in shape at all times. Donald held out too and he'll be ready to go. 

 
RBM said:
Speaking of injuries, lets keep our fingers crossed that our two new linebackers that missed training camp don't pull up lame around week 3. 

Legit concern of mine. 
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Outside of the obvious being Trubisky, I'm most concerned about Leno. Bears have zero depth at tackle.  If he goes down, we're in trouble. 

 
White Lightning said:
The Bears got a HOF in the prime of his career at the second most important position in football. In exchange, they gave up two first rounders and got back second for a third and a fifth for sixth. Considering only 50% of first rounders pan out to be above average players, how many do you think become HOF?? Give me a break, this is an awesome deal for the Beloved. Mack, Roquan Smith, Leonard Floyd and Danny Travathian all being coached by Vic Fangio? 
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I agree - why do I have to give you a break?  :unsure:

 
Definitely the addition of Mack has improved the Bears defense to a possible Top 5 defensive unit. I also think with another year under Trubisky belt and with Allen Robinson, Jordan Howard, and I really like Trey Burton the Bears could easily take 2nd place and if not challenge for the the division against the Green Bay Packers. 

 
Dr. Dan said:
to your first point, flap is putting his faith in the managements faith in the QB. I was showing that GMs have been wrong before. I used Cutler because it's one he can probably understand. 

you're absolutely right on the second part. However, again, Chicago had great running backs under Cutler and a top notch defense. Cutler just liked throwing ints. 
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Cutler did get the Bears to the NFC Championship game. 

 
Dr. Dan said:
to your first point, flap is putting his faith in the managements faith in the QB. I was showing that GMs have been wrong before. I used Cutler because it's one he can probably understand. 

you're absolutely right on the second part. However, again, Chicago had great running backs under Cutler and a top notch defense. Cutler just liked throwing ints. 
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Cutler isn't an example of a GM being wrong. It's an example of a GM choosing the lesser of two evils. Having an average, overpaid veteran QB like Cutler beats dumpster diving for a career backup like Mike Glennon. Those were the options.

The Bears have now tried both and for all his faults, Cutler > Glennon by a mile.

 
The Glennon thing was a horrible mess, but at least it was only for a season and had no long lasting effects on the team.  Pace misjudged Glennon greatly, but it's obvious now signing Glennon was to ultimately assist in the development of their real qb. 

 
Survivor7700 said:
Definitely the addition of Mack has improved the Bears defense to a possible Top 5 defensive unit. I also think with another year under Trubisky belt and with Allen Robinson, Jordan Howard, and I really like Trey Burton the Bears could easily take 2nd place and if not challenge for the the division against the Green Bay Packers. 
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Anthony

Miller

 
Mr.Pack said:
Quoting this one for you GB, they're still the Bears.....lol
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The Pack's glory days are slowly coming to an end. You guys have had a lot of good years, hell for most of my life.  Time to hop in the backseat over the next couple seasons. ;)

 
flapgreen said:
The Pack's glory days are slowly coming to an end. You guys have had a lot of good years, hell for most of my life.  Time to hop in the backseat over the next couple seasons. ;)
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I'd agree if Thompson was still our GM. we will see, but the North has gotten significantly better long term lately. Vikings and Bears have done a lot to try and push Green Bay to secondary status in the division for the future, that's for sure. 

 
Just finished watching the press conference and Mack was literally squirming in his seat the whole time.  Has a penchant for using the word “absolutely” and some others repeatedly, but it’s obvious he was nervous and just itching to get to work.

Nagy seemed almost nonchalant about the whole thing... 

 
Ryan Pace: "When we look at this next draft, our first-round pick is Khalil Mack. Our second-round pick is Anthony Miller." Then in 2020, two second-round picks makes Pace confident.

 
So many of the older Bears fans have moved on from the boards. @RBM oldest member I know on here as a Bears fan.  @Mr.Pack probably the oldest Packers fan I know on here now. Both nice fellas. 

Grid left years ago. 

 
  • Smile
Reactions: RBM
Christo said:
Oakland can have all they fun they want trying to find another Khalil Mack with those 2 first round draft picks.
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I see people say this from time to time and always feel obligated to point out that the value of draft picks is primarily in the (relatively) cheap contract. Getting two 1sts for a guy in the final year of a contract that you won't be able to afford to extend is indeed a fleecing.

 
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So, is it fair to assume that the Bears D is better with the addition of Mack ? And if so, is it fair to assume that the Bears are less likely to get blown out of games and in turn are more likely to be involved in closer games ?

If so---doesn't this help Jordan Howard's fantasy prospects ?

 
flapgreen said:
This is  just a silly post and poor logic.  If the quarterback doesn't turn out, then the Bears are screwed because they traded a lot for Mack and paid him a huge contract. If any team's qb doesn't end up doing well, they're not a great team.  The Bears obviously thinks there's is, which is why they moved up for him and surrounded him with a lot of talent. Now, they've built an impressive defense as well.  The teams that are "one piece from the super bowl" don't have the cap space to even afford Mack. 

But you can go ahead and break down all the missing pieces we need to make the playoffs. I'll listen. 
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What part of his post are you saying is poor logic? Every team that craps out on QB is in a pinch, but he's saying the Bears are extra screwed bc they just gave away two 1sts which could've been spent on QB and a lot of money which could've been spent on QB. Without picks and cap space, the Bears are in the most precarious position of all the NFL teams when it comes to QB.

 
IHEARTFF said:
Good thing Trubisky is going to be way better this year. 
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Well, if he doesnt beat 7/7 with a 77 rating then the Bears are in big trouble. Hard to not be "way better" than that

In some places, all 7s is considered a jackpot. maybe Chicago hits a jackpot this year.

FTR I did try to trade for him, unsuccessfully, this offseason. I've always liked him (and Mahomes). Trubisky to Miller is going to be a sick combo for years. Wish I was able to stack, but I'll have to live with only Miller

 
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Whohoo!!!! Grassu finally cut!! I know I've obsessed over him, but I thought it was clear pretty quickly he couldn't play in the NFL. When he made the 53 this year I was yet again floored. How you ever keep an extra lineman that can only kinda play center I never understood.

 
flapgreen said:
Ryan Pace: "When we look at this next draft, our first-round pick is Khalil Mack. Our second-round pick is Anthony Miller." Then in 2020, two second-round picks makes Pace confident.
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A GM celebrating paying a "first-round pick" 141 million is a recipe for disaster.

 
Keith1 said:
So, is it fair to assume that the Bears D is better with the addition of Mack ? And if so, is it fair to assume that the Bears are less likely to get blown out of games and in turn are more likely to be involved in closer games ?

If so---doesn't this help Jordan Howard's fantasy prospects ?
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Howard is one of my favorite RBs, I have a signed jersey of his framed and hanging on my wall and I rarely fanboy anything. 

I try not to let bias get in the way of my drafting but the Mack signing sure as #### bumped him up my board and I was pretty excited to land him in the 3rd tonight.

Mack is obviously a difference maker and an upgrade to that extent should lead to better average starting field position, more RZ trips, better game scripts and etc. CHI has been near or at the literal bottom of the league in those categories over the past two years and Howard still somehow averaged 1200/7.5 on the ground. I imagine he has a decent shot at leading the league in rushing if an improved offense and defense leads to just some positive regression in those categories. 

 
FF Ninja said:
I see people say this from time to time and always feel obligated to point out that the value of draft picks is primarily in the (relatively) cheap contract. Getting two 1sts for a guy in the final year of a contract that you won't be able to afford to extend is indeed a fleecing.
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How many sacks does that value get you? Can that value command a double team? 

I don't disagree that the Raiders did well value wise. I wonder if Gruden lost his locker room with this. 

 
Survivor7700 said:
Definitely the addition of Mack has improved the Bears defense to a possible Top 5 defensive unit. I also think with another year under Trubisky belt and with Allen Robinson, Jordan Howard, and I really like Trey Burton the Bears could easily take 2nd place and if not challenge for the the division against the Green Bay Packers. 
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Vikes fan here.... good luck with that.  You added a great player to your already solid Def, but to assume you've only got to compete with the Pack for 1st or 2nd in NFC north ignores the fact that there's a pretty good team in Minny that says bring it on.  I will say our OL weakness makes this a concerning move, but I don't think GB is your biggest concern if you're looking at 1 or 2 in the NFC north.

 
scott46984 said:
Vikes fan here.... good luck with that.  You added a great player to your already solid Def, but to assume you've only got to compete with the Pack for 1st or 2nd in NFC north ignores the fact that there's a pretty good team in Minny that says bring it on.  I will say our OL weakness makes this a concerning move, but I don't think GB is your biggest concern if you're looking at 1 or 2 in the NFC north.
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I am not really a Bears fans. I am just saying they improved there team. I still Think Green Bay is the team to beat with Rodgers, but you are correct the the Vikings Defense is a force. I think the offense will go as far as Cousins will take it. 

 
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