Hawkeye21
Footballguy
That's because he was a rookie that was suppose to be a rotational player. He played more due to injuries. What do you expect?
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***Chicago Bears Thread*** Poles is playing 5D chess! (15 Viewers)
- Thread starter flapgreen
- Start date
KCitons
Footballguy
Yeah, not MT's fault he was drafted by the Bears.
But, if I asked for a sandwich and you gave me two pieces of bread with #### between them, I have a right to complain. You can't just say "you asked for a sandwich, you should be happy that you got one"
twistd
Footballguy
That was supposed to be Pace's forte, getting players off of other teams practice squads, getting UDFAs, he was going to be creative in his acquisition of talent. I'm not seeing that much.
twistd
Footballguy
My other worry with Floyd is that he is too small to be a every down player. He may end up as a designated pass rusher. He didn't look good against the run. I hope he continues to develop as a pass rusher, and can hold up against the run. We will see.
twistd
Footballguy
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Sometimes people don't know what the hell they want. Just because it doesn't look appetizing doesn't mean it doesn't taste great and is healthy for you.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
http://deadspin.com/the-bears-mitch-trubisky-pick-keeps-looking-worse-and-w-1794796075
King:
The Bears and Niners had an understanding that if Chicago’s man was still on the board after Cleveland picked (Chicago GM Ryan Pace wouldn’t tell Lynch who Player X was; the Niners figured it was Thomas), the Bears would give at least two third-round picks to move from three to two.
[...]
“See if we can get one last thing with Chicago,” Lynch said to Marathe.
Marathe called the Bears. “To try to solidify this now,” Marathe said to Pace, “we’re gonna need a little bit more to finish. It wouldn’t have to be much. Like, your four. So let’s say your third, 67 overall, this year, your three next year, and your four this year, 111 overall … I’m not gonna string you along … No … I will do it quickly. Let me get with John and Kyle and I’ll call you right back.”
The Bears agreed. They’d give two third-round picks and a fourth-rounder to move up one spot.
“Man, who do they want?” Lynch said. “Gotta be Solomon, right?”
“Call me crazy,” Marathe said. “But I think it’s Trubisky.”
“Then why’d they go get Glennon?” Lynch said.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
pantherclub
Footballguy
As a fan how the hell could you read that and not want the entire front office escorted off the premises immediately.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I thought they got screwed the moment the trade happened but I have no idea what it's like to manage a team and what it's like to be in the trade room during a draft. When put on the spot we all can make ill-advised moves in order to do what we think needs to be done. I think I understand why they made the trade but I still disagree with it.
Regardless of any of that, it's all over now. I'm ready for the new season now and I'm ready to see if this players can make this team better.
RBM
Footballguy
####### laughing stock of the league.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/heres-what-nfl-execs-are-saying-about-the-bears-draft-and-its-not-good/
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/heres-what-nfl-execs-are-saying-about-the-bears-draft-and-its-not-good/
KCitons
Footballguy
-My best explanation is Lynch is Pace's cousin, because he made him look like a genius. Good for Lynch, i hope he does well.
-Seems likely that Fox is a dead man walking. I always think its a bad idea to leave somebody who knows they dont have a future with an organization in place even temporarily. If Fox decides to really be a #####, he could do a lot to mess up the development of these long term projects the Bears are banking on. That could mean not playing young guys but could just as easily mean playing guys before they are ready and setting them up to fail. A lot of Bears fans would be ok with this I think.
- The bottom line is if Trubisky is a successful franchise QB, this is all trivia. Of course we dont like Pace getting trade raped, but if he is correct that this guy is going to be his Drew Brees, ok sure, you cant take any chances and you go lock him down whatever the cost. If Trubisky is even just 'good', its a disaster. He has to be 'the answer' for a decade, or this is a debacle. Thats a tall order.
- The other picks arent really relevant. If Trubisky is really good, they should be great pieces to help him. If he's not, the Bears are so screwed it doesnt matter.
-Seems likely that Fox is a dead man walking. I always think its a bad idea to leave somebody who knows they dont have a future with an organization in place even temporarily. If Fox decides to really be a #####, he could do a lot to mess up the development of these long term projects the Bears are banking on. That could mean not playing young guys but could just as easily mean playing guys before they are ready and setting them up to fail. A lot of Bears fans would be ok with this I think.
- The bottom line is if Trubisky is a successful franchise QB, this is all trivia. Of course we dont like Pace getting trade raped, but if he is correct that this guy is going to be his Drew Brees, ok sure, you cant take any chances and you go lock him down whatever the cost. If Trubisky is even just 'good', its a disaster. He has to be 'the answer' for a decade, or this is a debacle. Thats a tall order.
- The other picks arent really relevant. If Trubisky is really good, they should be great pieces to help him. If he's not, the Bears are so screwed it doesnt matter.
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Yeah, because that's what the Bear's have. Let's not overreact too much yet. It wasn't a great draft but it wasn't the worst either.
KCitons
Footballguy
Maybe, maybe not. My #### sandwich reference was in response to people saying "fans asked for this, now they are complaining"
Gustavo Fring
Footballguy
The sky has officially fallen in here. Was the trade bad - yes, I don't think anyone is arguing that. Could they have gotten him at #3? Most likely, but it was definitely not a certainty - so if Pace really had MT that much higher than any other QB in this draft, you need to lock down your guy that you think could be your franchise QB.
The Redskins were bailed out in 2012 by also taking Kirk Cousins, but they gave up three FIRST round picks and a second rounder to acquire RGIII as their franchise quarterback. Moving from 6th to 2nd.
Bottom line - this trade is not going to ruin the Bears draft picks for years to come if he doesn't end up working out. If MT does work out and he ends up being the best QB of this class and a franchise player, then two 3rd rounders and a fourth will not be overpaying in hindsight. Let's give the guy a chance to see what he can do.
The Redskins were bailed out in 2012 by also taking Kirk Cousins, but they gave up three FIRST round picks and a second rounder to acquire RGIII as their franchise quarterback. Moving from 6th to 2nd.
Bottom line - this trade is not going to ruin the Bears draft picks for years to come if he doesn't end up working out. If MT does work out and he ends up being the best QB of this class and a franchise player, then two 3rd rounders and a fourth will not be overpaying in hindsight. Let's give the guy a chance to see what he can do.
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
And I'm saying the most vocal fans are by far the biggest morons. The team finally spent a high draft pick on a QB. They have the first overall QB picked in the draft. How about try getting behind him and support him now. There is no more Cutler to bash so lets start getting better.
KCitons
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
KCitons
Footballguy
No. I'm going to give him a chance. For no other reason, other than I'm a fan. But, much like losing a game, or a super bowl, I don't have to like every play, player, or decision.
I'm able to have an independent thought outside of blind support.
Why are so many analysts, coaches, and football fans questioning what the Bear's have done in the draft? They must be the morons.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I don't think that many hate the pick of Trubisky, I just think everyone hates the value of the pick because of the trade. I feel the same way, I hated the trade and still do. I think the 49ers took advantage of the Bears and I wish it was the other way around. I'm over that now though.
I'm also not sold on Trubisky being the best QB in the this class. I would have rather traded down and got whatever QB was available like Watson, Mahomes or Kizer. Regardless of any of that I'm just excited to have a new QB and just hope he becomes a great player. A rookie QB should represent optimism for a fresh start, not all the negative crap. Save the negative stuff for if he fails. If he sucks then I'll be right back on board with hating everything about this draft. As of now I choose to be optimistic.
I think you can make an argument that at least from a fans perspective, we know more about how Pace values Trubinksy now than we would have without the trade.
IE- if they just took him at 3,we wouldnt know if he just intended to take whichever QB was available at 3 and didnt have a particularly high regard for Trubinksy. And we'd also wonder if he tried to trade down but couldnt. At least this way we know with absolute clarity that Trubinsky was THE guy he wanted, and the other two werent even close to acceptable alternatives. Doesnt matter as far as value goes, but for fans we at least know that this IS the guy he wanted, and he wanted him really bad. Not just A guy.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I think Pace has a really good idea of how he wants this team to look in a few years and I really like that about him. I feel like he knows what he's doing now it's just a matter of him being right. I see a lot of potential going forward but the sad thing is that I can also see it just being a major failure. I think I'd feel more excited with a slightly better coaching staff. I'm not all that happy with Fox and the other guys other than Fangio. Fangio is the only guy I feel like I trust. Maybe I'm wrong.
KCitons
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
The rest of the hate is on the trade away of picks and the unknown players. People seem to hate seeing their team pick players they aren't familiar with. One of the huge reasons with paying too much attention to mock drafts.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
What does that even mean? The organization has been a catastrophe for decades. Pace is being aggressive and trying to change that. What's he losing control of?
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I think it's been covered enough as to why the trade wasn't very good. I know you think it was good because they got the guy they wanted and there is some truth to that but there seems to be more evidence that the Bears got taken by the 49ers.
This is what people don't like. Gave up extremely valuable picks to move up one spot to take a player that seems very likely would've been available to them anyway. Drafted 3 players out of 5 that were from schools they never heard of. Didn't draft any highly rated defensive players in a year known for being a very strong class. Only being able to draft 5 players is a big blow to a team that has way too many needs yet.
I get the displeasure that most have. What I don't get is the constant complaining and even booing of players. That's just dumb.
KCitons
Footballguy
I agree. Don't boo a rookie at a basketball game. Boo him on the football field if he fails.
flapgreen
Footballguy
More insight from the 49ers side. Excellent article by Peter King.
https://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2017/05/01/san-francisco-49ers-nfl-draft-room-bears-trade-reuben-foster-peter-king
https://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2017/05/01/san-francisco-49ers-nfl-draft-room-bears-trade-reuben-foster-peter-king
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
There's no evidence they got taken more than anyone else gets taken. Where is that coming from? No one is revealing to others exactly what they're doing or what other teams are telling them they're doing. Reports out everywhere that other teams were interested in the pick. There was concern that another could move up. Maybe they would have. Maybe they wouldn't have. Doesn't matter. The idea of getting "taken" is hilarious to me. I think Bears fans are so used to getting beat up and abused that anything different scares them. Battered wife syndrome
KCitons
Footballguy
This. This is what I'm talking about when I say Pace is going to lose control. Players play for money, but you can't disrespect them. It won't be long and this team will divide into factions. Front office, coach Fox, and Players.
nightmare
Footballguy
If M Glennon can't beat out the rookie for the job he is what he has alway's been -a backup.
flapgreen
Footballguy
So Glennon gets what he and everyone else knew was only a 1 year contract for 16-18 million, a better offer than he got from anyone else in the league, and now he feels disrespected? He's either delusional or his agent was lying to him. Everyone and their mother knew the Bears would likely be drafting a franchise QB this year. I LOL at thinking this team will be divided because of players considering that a sign of disrespect. Come back to reality fellas
flapgreen
Footballguy
twistd
Footballguy
The trade was bad because you could have had the same player at 3. You bought in to the idea that teams were trying to trade up for your player and they weren't. You got screwed by bidding against yourself. John Lynch, a rookie GM, took you to the cleaners. In addition you hurt your reputation around the league. When other teams are questioning what you did it isn't good for you trying to deal with teams down the road. You have a team that has holes all over the place, but you traded away valuable draft capital, that you didn't have to trade away, for a player who would had been available at your pick. And you chose a guy who might not be better than the players chosen 10 to 13 picks later. Possibly not better than Kizer who was taken 50 picks later. That is why it is bad.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
William Munny
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
twistd
Footballguy
The funny thing is that just like this Trubisky thing, with Glennon the Bears were bidding against themselves. No one else was offering Glennon anywhere near what the Bears were offering him. So that was a ####### thing to do too.
Actually I thought, after signing Glennon, the Bears would not draft a QB highly this year. I thought they would give Glennon a chance and see what he could do. I thought they would use their draft picks to build the roster and look at a QB next year, in a better class of QBs, if Glennon failed.
This is disrespectful. Sign the kid, tell him you are going to be the starter, then invite him to the draft party and let him watch while he finds out you lied to him and drafted his replacement. It was an organizational screw up. Again makes the organization look bad.
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