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****Official**** 2017 Denver Broncos (1 Viewer)

thatguy

Footballguy
The coaching search is on. 

I know Shanahan would do wonders for the offense, but I'm not sure he's a great leader of men, and that's an area this team was severely lacking in this past season without Peyton's leadership. I worry he might be too much like Josh McD. Not the dictator side or the whole Napoleon Complex. Just his youth and tendency to be more about X's  and O's than a guy who can bring a group of men together.

Joseph is intriguing as he seems to be a great leader who can relate to and gain the trust and respect of his players. I do worry about losing Wade but Joe Woods has obviously done an amazing job with the No Fly Zone and seems ready to assume a larger role and more responsibility.  It would be a seamless transition I imagine since he'll probably keep the defensive philosophy the same. All signs point to McCoy coming back as OC if Joseph is the guy,  and I think he would definitely help get the offense back on track and be great for both Paxton and Trevor. I just worry if Joseph might have a little too much John Fox in him.  But, nonetheless,  he's my first choice.

Dave Toub is intriguing but I'll admit I know next to nothing about him,  other than I've heard good things. The upside is I believe he'd be more likely to keep Wade around,  but Wade might leave no matter what given the allure of coaching with his son in Washington. Toub is almost certainly more in the Joseph mold than the Shanahan mold.  A great leader who as a coach will be more of a delegator--an approach that can work great if you have great coaches beneath you. 

 
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Regarding free agency,  the only OT worth pursuing is Whitworth but he's a risk for a few reasons.  He's coming off of a great season,  but he is 35. He might still have a few high level seasons in him.  But he might not. Further,  I'm not sure how he fits in the zone scheme,  but there's no guarantee Denver sticks with the zone blocking scheme to begin with. 

I would love to land Calais Campbell. He is my dream target.  But he'll be super expensive.  Nonetheless he'd be a perfect fit and having him line up opposite Wolfe with Von and Ray/Barrett coming off the age edge would be an absolute nightmare.  He would make us forget all about Malik in a hurry. Most likely they let Sylvester walk then just bring in a couple big boys on relatively cheap short-term contracts.

An ILB like Zach Brown or the likes would be nice too.

Obviously landing those 3 is kind of my fantasy world scenario. But realistically, Campbell, a solid LB (there are several others besides Brown) and an OG (there are quite a few decent OG's out there as opposed to the complete dearth of starting caliber OT's) is possible.  Maybe not likely,  but possible if they're willing to shell out big money to another defensive player. 

 
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Then we have the draft. 

This class is super bereft of offensive line talent specifically offensive tackles but maybe Cam Robinson from Alabama is an option.

I would hate for them to reach just to fill the need so I could see D lineman or linebacker being the pick if someone they like a lot is there at 20.

I know some in the Sports Talk Radio Community here in Denver have been pimping this lately but honestly this is something I have wanted since the kid was still at Valor High School:  I would love for them to take Christian McCaffrey. Family connection, Colorado boy and just a super athlete. Would immediately give us a punt returner, a great change-of-pace back who can also line up in the slot. We could also run two back sets with him and Anderson/Booker--he could be a Tevin Coleman type as a receiver out of the backfield, only better and more versatile (I'm sure we all still have nightmares about him). I think too that keeping him out of the Patriots hands would be huge because I can only Imagine all of the ways that Belichick would utilize him. Normally I wouldn't advocate picking a guy just to block a potential rival but in this case I think McCaffrey is going to be great for whoever picks him and I would just as soon that be the Broncos.

Also it's possible Dalvin Cook falls to 20 and I think that would be an amazing pick as well.

 
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Also hearing that McCoy to be the offensive coordinator
If so they hire McCoy and retain Wade I'd give Denver an A+ on how they filled their open coaching positions, would be incredibly well done job if all of that came to fruition.

 
If so they hire McCoy and retain Wade I'd give Denver an A+ on how they filled their open coaching positions, would be incredibly well done job if all of that came to fruition.
It would but we might have jumped the gun on the Philips news, I'm still hearing it is still very much in question.

 
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Re: OT there's always the yearly trade for Joe Thomas speculation. I think last year the asking price was a first rounder and Shaq Barrett. 

With each passing year, and with the Browns continuing to be nowhere near contention,  the price might get lower. As much as I like Shaq, I felt like he took a step back this year,  or maybe it's just that Shane Ray took a big step forward. Either way,  if the Browns still have their eyes set on Shaq then I'd pursue this aggressively. Ray appears to have the goods and Dekoda Watson can probablybe re-signed for cheap to replace Shaq. Maybe Shaq, a 2nd and 4th might be enough.  If I'm elway,  I do that in a second. Hell I'd even do Shaq and 1.20 for Thomas. At 32, he should still have 4-5 years of high level production left.  He would be our Gary Zimmerman 2.0. 

 
I don't know a lot about Vance Joseph, but Elway has been right way more than he has been wrong, so I trust that this hire will be a good one.  :thumbup:   :thumbup:

 
My only hope/concern is that if Wade is not retained, and it's now sounding like he won't be, they hire the next DC from the current staff--preferably Joe Woods as I already alluded to. It's imperative that they keep the scheme and defensive philosophy intact and retain as many of the incumbent defensive coaches as possible. Bringing in a DC from the outside could be a disaster.

 
My only hope/concern is that if Wade is not retained, and it's now sounding like he won't be, they hire the next DC from the current staff--preferably Joe Woods as I already alluded to. It's imperative that they keep the scheme and defensive philosophy intact and retain as many of the incumbent defensive coaches as possible. Bringing in a DC from the outside could be a disaster.
I know this is mostly trying to talk myself into thinking losing Wade will be OK, but historically Wade's defenses start out great when he shows up and then fade.  Maybe Woods can bring a young energy and prevent the defense from going stale.  I do believe it's important to mix things up every now and then to prevent complacency.  Still, I'd feel a lot better if Wade were coming back.

 
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That is actually a solid point.  I think Woods (assuming it plays out that way) will stick with Wade's general philosophy and maybe work in some wrinkles of his own.  As the coach of the NFZ my mouth waters at the potential schemes he might implement in the defensive backfield. And like you said he should bring a youthful energy. This could be good or bad. If the players truly respect him he could absolutely reinvigorate them but I know that a lot of the players really appreciated Wade for his laid-back attitude so we'll have to see how his personality meshes with the likes of Talib and the rest of the gang.

 
Any of you guys post at in-thinair.com?  I think I mentioned this place last year.  Probably some of the most reasonable and active Bronco-fan interaction on the internet.

 
Nope, but I'll have to check it out. Thanks for the suggestion.

Well, looks like it's official. Wade to the Rams. 

I really hope they don't try to get cute and #### this up. Just do what it takes to lock Woods up before he decides to follow Wade to LA.

 
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So excited about these hirings. Both AFC West guys. Both basically taking "demotions" to come hear.  A lot of teams would probably be happy with either as their head coach. McCoy showed during his years in Denver to be a great offensive mind with the flexibility to get the most out of any quarterback he had to work with. I really think he is the best guy to bring Paxton along. The job that he did with Orton and Tebow and then the seamless switch to Manning was pretty amazing to watch. Meanwhile Musgrave did a phenomenal job with the development of Carr and the transformation of the Oakland offense into one of the best in the league. I can't wait to see what these two guys bring to this offense. 

I was sad to see Joe D bolt for a lateral position but you can't keep everyone. 

Now just get Joe Woods locked up!

 
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Truth be told, I'm uneasy with all of the coaching changes.  Elway hit the 'reset button;' I'm not 100% sure it was necessary.  We are headed into 2017 with the following:

* First year head coach W/ just one year as coordinator under his belt

* Turnover at all three coordinator positions

* First year DC, while letting Wade walk.

* New offense to be installed with a new QB coach.

I mean, yeah some changes were necessary, but I honestly believe we were a couple of pieces away from contending again (RT, PR/KR, and maybe some other veteran OL to push for starting roles on camp).  Now, who knows.

 
I think it'll be okay. As long as we don't change our defensive philosophy I'm not too worried. It's pretty clear we just don't have the talent or the talent developers necessary to run Kubiak's scheme effectively. I think bringing in McCoy and Musgrave is genius. Musgrave has done great things with the quarterbacks he's worked with, including Rodgers and Carr and McCoy has shown the flexibility and ingenuity to mold his offensive scheme to highlight what his players do best,  rather than try to force his players into inflexible roles not aligned with their skill sets. I think Vance Joseph will be a really good head coach because he will let the coordinators do their thing and focus on bringing the team together which from everything I've heard is his strong suit. What makes me feel good about all of this is from what I've heard there aren't a lot of egos in this bunch which is rare considering the All Star nature of this coaching group. I think Joseph will do a great job with delegation,  as will McCoy and I don't see ego becoming a problem.  

 
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I do get what you're saying in that such a huge shakeup can be problematic especially when a team is only a couple pieces away. And I agree that we were only a couple pieces away. Not a couple pieces away from making the playoffs or making a deep run but winning the Super Bowl again. Every team is flawed and the Broncos are no different but I think missing out on the playoffs this year was pretty inexcusable given the level of talent that they had. And realize that the top level talent isn't going anywhere.  I do believe that the coaches brought in to develop that talent and develop cohesion between those players are top-notch.

 
Truth be told, I'm uneasy with all of the coaching changes.  Elway hit the 'reset button;' I'm not 100% sure it was necessary.  We are headed into 2017 with the following:

* First year head coach W/ just one year as coordinator under his belt

* Turnover at all three coordinator positions

* First year DC, while letting Wade walk.

* New offense to be installed with a new QB coach.

I mean, yeah some changes were necessary, but I honestly believe we were a couple of pieces away from contending again (RT, PR/KR, and maybe some other veteran OL to push for starting roles on camp).  Now, who knows.
I don't think we had this last year.  And I was fine letting our ST coach gone.  Wanted him fired in the season when he kept having returners take the ball out of the end zone 5 yards back.

 
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Between McCoy, Musgrave, and Davidson, the Broncos have a combined 19 years OC experience.  That  is reassuring to me for a 1st year head coach. 

These three have all coached in E-P and WCO systems, they all seem to be very flexible in what they have done.

Interestingly, McCoy, the new OC, was a QB coach under Davidson (Carolina, 2007-2008, E-P) and QB coach under Musgrave (Carolina, 2000, WCO).  He hired two of his former bosses for his staff.

 
Nice start to FA solidifying the interior o line, Ronald Leary 4 years $35 million, ~$20 million guaranteed. Presumably Leary will play LG where he played in Dallas and Garcia will shift to RG.

Also hearing Calais Campbell might take less to come "home" to Denver.  Jax offering $14+ million/year, Denver's offer reportedly in the $13 million/year range. Please make this happen! 

 
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New word is that Dallas is now trying to trade Romo to either Denver or Houston. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

 
Siemian to the Jets was originally rumored to be part of a potential deal but apparently the door has been shut on that.

 
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This offseason has been a disaster.  Elway #### the bed this FA.

We have zero NFL quality tackles on the roster (I'm not counting Schofield or Stephenson) and there are zero available in FA.

Why focus any attention on Romo?  He couldn't last behind a top 5 o-line in Dallas.  What makes you think he will last behind this POS we are currently fielding?

 
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This offseason has been a disaster.  Elway #### the bed this FA.

We have zero NFL quality tackles on the roster (I'm not counting Schofield or Stephenson) and there are zero available in FA.

Why focus any attention on Romo?  He couldn't last behind a top 5 o-line in Dallas.  What makes you think he will last behind this POS we are currently fielding?
What I don't understand is if they weren't going to break the bank for Calais, why not go after Whitworth or Wagner, or both. I'd have preferred Wagner, a plug and play RT, to Leary. He only got about $0.5 million/year more. Not to say I'm against the Leary signing but I'd rather they had spent the money on a tackle.

 
Now they're stuck choosing from the likes of Clady/Beachum/Fluker... 

My preference is Beachum, let's get it done #7!

 
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They couldn't even get Chris Baker who the Bucs got for a measly 3 years $18 million. It seems like maybe they were passing on some of the earlier signings to save money for Romo and now they've missed the boat on most of the real difference makers. And it looks like Houston is clearing space to go after Romo so Denver probably isn't even the favorite at this point anyway. I'd kind of like to see them get Romo anyway just to spite Houston.

I really hope Elway has something up his sleeve like a trade for Joe Thomas yes please.

 
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This offseason has been a disaster.  Elway #### the bed this FA.
While I'm not happy with how day 1 went, it is basically just that--day 1. Hard to say he shat the bed "this FA" after a single day. There are still quality players out there--granted most of the elite players are gone but I'm at least willing to see how it plays out before making such a negative and sweeping analysis.

 
While I'm not happy with how day 1 went, it is basically just that--day 1. Hard to say he shat the bed "this FA" after a single day. There are still quality players out there--granted most of the elite players are gone but I'm at least willing to see how it plays out before making such a negative and sweeping analysis.
The only LT on the market is the guy from Jacksonville.

 
as a KC fan this has been kinda crazy to watch.....

Can't believe Wagner and or Whitworth were not on speed dial and honestly that Elway didn't have one of them locked up prior to FA "officially" opening up......IMO there is no way they don't pay one of those guys even more than they are worth.....and the same for Reif or a guys in the next tier....and then more swings and misses on Campbell, Williams, Baker, etc.....Elway talks of filling needs through free agency so draft can be BPA, yet he did very little....I would argue tackle was a bigger need than guard.....and now the Romo thing looks to be going sideways.....

I kinda think Elway in some ways needs to get over himself/their selves in that without a guy like Manning having the street creed to help draw FA's.....Denver really is just another town to play football in like any other.....and players will follow the money......he has shown a pattern of not wanting to pay market value or even a little higher to secure top level replacements.....his seems to really struggle gauging market value (ie Anderson last year as well) and seems to be too stubborn to pay what he needs to....it's almost like he thinks guys should feel "honored to sign with the mighty Broncos" and fact is, that's just not the case....his legacy, etc. doesn't really mean anything to some of these younger guys and Denver is just another town like the rest.....he wants guys that "want to be a Bronco", yet he has been acting recently like that's a one way street.... cause if money talks, he hasn't been acting like he wants the guys enough....

and an underlying factor in this remains that Von is getting Denver's QB money and that contract is going to hurt them moving forward in certain negotiations....guys like Brady take less money than they deserve and continually restructure in order to help the team....not sure Von will ever do that....Elway has swung and missed on QB's evaluations (OZ and Lynch), offensive line evaluations, market value for players, etc.....his one hit was Manning which helped get the Ware's and Wards, etc....now he looks like a fish out of water....

 
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Signed former Raiders RT Menalik Watson 3 years approximately 18 million dollars. Could be a nice value signing if he can stay healthy.

 
Siemian to Jets still very much in play, though not sure it would be in the form of a 3 team deal (Denver, NYJ, Dallas) ala rumors yesterday. Still I can't imagine they trade Trevor unless they know they're getting Romo.

I still have hope that things will work out. I have to believe Elway has a plan. Sign Beachum/Clady and the O Line is passable with some strong pieces in the middle. Or there is still the possibility they trade for a LT. Maybe not Thomas, but Staley and Peters are possible targets.  Find a few big bodies to rotate at NT. Maybe kick the tires on some bargain barrel DE's and go heavy in the draft (not necessarily 1st round) on DL's. I'd still like to see them sign an ILB too. I think they'd still have the cap space to get a deal done with Romo (maybe heavily incentive laden).

Also, I think one reason they aren't breaking the bank for big names is that they have 10 draft picks, so it will be important to set aside enough of their remaining cap space to sign their rookies. 

 
Lastly, I'm not entirely ready to write off Sambraillo and Stephenson, and to a lesser extent Schoefield.  A new scheme, new coaching staff might be just what is needed to push these guys to a higher level. Regarding Sambraillo, I hope he is spending every waking hour this offseason in the weight room because I think strength, or lack thereof, has been his biggest problem.

 
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Alfred Williams was saying yesterday if they weren't' getting Romo then it made no sense overplaying for older o line help.

 
Most of what comes out of Alfred Williams mouth is complete garbage in my opinion. That being said neither Watson or Leary are that old. They are 28 and 27 years old respectively and should be entering their primes

 
In any case he's been saying that for a while and he was more referring to guys like Andrew Whitworth who is 35 years old.

 
Well, no Beachum. Now stuck choosing from Clady and company. Or trading for a LT (my preference). Or drafting one. I'd hate for them to go this route since pretty much any OT they pick at 20 would be a reach. I'd much rather they get an instant difference maker like McCaffrey or Howard. Nonetheless, if they go this route, I think my preference is Ryan Ramczyk as I believe he has the most upside, but his injury worries me. There's no guarantee he'll be healthy enough to step in and play from day one, to say nothing of whether he even has that ability in the first place. 

 
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Two player questions... 

Shane Ray finally going to start? 

Heuerman, if healthy, becomes TE that starts? 

 
Two player questions... 

Shane Ray finally going to start? 

Heuerman, if healthy, becomes TE that starts? 
Yes, Ray will start opposite Miller as the ROLB. I would expect that AJ Derby right now is in place to be the starter at tight end ahead of Heuerman. And given the depth of this draft class they might even draft someone better than both of them.

 
Regarding Heuerman, he did show some brief flashes toward the middle to end of last year but as I said Derby is almost definitely still ahead of him as the primary pass-catching tight end.

 
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Okay, when I first looked at the moves yesterday I was a little upset/confused by them, but now that I have sobered up and thought about it, I can understand it.

TJ was a great locker room guy, leader, hard-hitter, etc, but he clearly lost a step last year. There were numerous plays that he got beat badly by TEs going down the field. He has missed 5 games over the last two years and was dinged pretty much for the entirety of both these years. He is already battling hamstring issues this preseason. He committed 6-7 penalties last year for chunks of yardage. Now this was a staple of a Phillips defense--he didn't care about some of the stupid aggressive stuff, but Wade is gone and this obviously wasn't going to fly in the new system. Finally, he has two very good players backing him up that do not cost what he costs. All this when taken into account, you can see why the move was made. I will miss him as a personality on the sidelines, but TJ, the player, was on the decline. 

Despite the fact I think Brock is a waste of human flesh, I also can understand this move. This was a guy we were willing to offer 17-19 million dollars a year for in the past and now we got for the league minimum . He knows the system but as a fan, I hope he never sniffs the field. Plus when Lynch comes back, Elway can exact some sweet revenge on Brock and fire him because unless the team is extremely healthy, I don't see Denver having the luxury of keeping 3 QBs on the active roster.

I hope Sloter makes it through waivers and maybe we can get him back for the practice squad, I would love to see Dymonte Thomas find a spot too. 

 

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