Infinite New York football Giants thread

[monk 196]

15 hours ago, The Frankman said:

https://www.bigblueview.com/2019/3/1/18244587/dave-gettleman-wants-instincts-from-a-qb-so-who-has-them-nfl-draft-kyler-murray-dwayne-haskins

 

Interesting viewpoint on "Gettleman-speak". If you read between the lines, it sounds likehe's talking about Haskins as the pick.

How do you figure? He said when it comes to QBs he focuses on instincts did't mention any QBs specifically.

[monk 196]

Haskins looks fat and had the slowest QB time in the 40  ...  Slower than Eli Manning and slower than his his NFL comp and body double Jameis .

They also showed a comparison of last Years QBs 40s vs Haskins and Haskins was 5 yards behind the group

[King of the Jungle 1,390]

10 minutes ago, monk said:

Haskins looks fat and had the slowest QB time in the 40  ...  Slower than Eli Manning and slower than his his NFL comp and body double Jameis .

They also showed a comparison of last Years QBs 40s vs Haskins and Haskins was 5 yards behind the group

If your going to compete in the underwear Olympics at least come prepared. I don’t think guys need to train to become something they are not, but don’t be the worst in any category. To me that is a red flag especially for a top prospect at their position.

[The Frankman 3,346]

On 3/2/2019 at 2:11 PM, monk said:

Haskins looks fat and had the slowest QB time in the 40  ...  Slower than Eli Manning and slower than his his NFL comp and body double Jameis .

They also showed a comparison of last Years QBs 40s vs Haskins and Haskins was 5 yards behind the group

... first, Haskins slipped running the 40. Watch the whole QB group here. --> https://www.giants.com/news/watch-quarterbacks-throw-at-nfl-combine

 

His mobility in the pocket wasn't an issue in college as he showed he was able to work the pocket and move around enough to make throws consistently. As was said during the 'cast, you're not drafting Haskins to run zone reads and blow past people. I watched the guy throw and the ball jumps outta his hand. If the Giants want a pocket passer who displayed his talent at the highest level in big games, this is the pick assuming they get a QB in the 1st.

Edited March 4, 2019 by The Frankman

[monk 196]

18 hours ago, The Frankman said:

... first, Haskins slipped running the 40. Watch the whole QB group here. --> https://www.giants.com/news/watch-quarterbacks-throw-at-nfl-combine

 

His mobility in the pocket wasn't an issue in college as he showed he was able to work the pocket and move around enough to make throws consistently. As was said during the 'cast, you're not drafting Haskins to run zone reads and blow past people. I watched the guy throw and the ball jumps outta his hand. If the Giants want a pocket passer who displayed his talent at the highest level in big games, this is the pick assuming they get a QB in the 1st.

Daniel Jones is bigger, more athletic and his deep throws were by far the best of the bunch. Haskins has an arm but if you ask me he was putting way to much air under it ... they looked punts 

[Boone22 340]

If I’m the Giants I offer their 2nd round pick to Arizona for Rosen.  

[Yenrub 788]

They let Collins walk...for absolutely nothing 

I'm not happy about that

[dhockster 1,834]

1 hour ago, Yenrub said:

They let Collins walk...for absolutely nothing 

I'm not happy about that

I am not sure I understand either. Safety is a position you can build a defense around. Has Collins play been that bad?

 

[monk 196]

This team is in really bad shape 

[ConstruxBoy 1,241]

Penn State alum rooting for Barkley who lives in Charlotte and saw Gettleman’s work. Sad for Saquon. 

[The Frankman 3,346]

3 hours ago, Yenrub said:

They let Collins walk...for absolutely nothing 

I'm not happy about that

https://www.sny.tv/giants/news/giants-wont-tag-landon-collins-who-they-shouldve-traded-during-season/304775428

 

It's mind-boggling. Dude walked for nothing and he could've at least fetched a 2nd or 3rd in trade... WTF? How do you effing trade for Ogletree (who sucks in coverage) and trade Collins, who is a box safety who causes havoc at the line?

2 hours ago, dhockster said:

I am not sure I understand either. Safety is a position you can build a defense around. Has Collins play been that bad?

 

He's a box safety whose coverage skills aren't really good due to aggressive angles that he takes. He's gotten flamed in games vs. good TEs (Ertz, Kittle, etc.) but the Giants secondary as a whole wasn't good last year.

Edited March 5, 2019 by The Frankman

[monk 196]

Yeah ... and how many other Safties get flamed by Ertz, Kittle, ? And there are 2 major components being able to tackle in the box is one of them. How many good covergae Safties can do that ... Overall  I think Collins is probably a top 5-6  Safety.  

Looks like the Giants are getting a top pick next year ... I really think they need to forget about QB in a year of bad QBs and focus on building both lines. with a new line with a year or two of experience then you grab your QB ... Tua, Herbert, Fromm etc ... 

[Yenrub 788]

9 minutes ago, monk said:

Yeah ... and how many other Safties get flamed by Ertz, Kittle, ? And there are 2 major components being able to tackle in the box is one of them. How many good covergae Safties can do that ... Overall  I think Collins is probably a top 5-6  Safety.  

Looks like the Giants are getting a top pick next year ... I really think they need to forget about QB in a year of bad QBs and focus on building both lines. with a new line with a year or two of experience then you grab your QB ... Tua, Herbert, Fromm etc ... 

If they put a competent FS next to Collins we would see him return to his 2016 form. 

[Yenrub 788]

One more thing from me about Collins. 

Reports are the Giants could have gotten a 3rd round pick for him at the trade deadline..They let him walk for nothing but hopes of compensatory pick in 2020

Guess what they are missing in this draft? 

Edited March 6, 2019 by Yenrub

[monk 196]

25 minutes ago, Yenrub said:

If they put a competent FS next to Collins we would see him return to his 2016 form. 

Very very good point ! The supporting saftey cast was disgraceful last season!

[IrishTwinkie 464]

Put me in the camp of not liking the Collins situation. The defensive is already missing major pieces. Now it will be missing one more piece. I am not sure I see the logic here at all. <Rant deleted>

[The Frankman 3,346]

Quote

Giants assigned a tender to restricted free agent Corey Coleman.

A former first-round pick, Coleman was almost certainly given the original-round designation. That tender will pay him $2.025 million this season. If another team is able to sign him away, they would owe the Giants a first-round pick. Simply put, that is not going to happen. Coleman only caught five passes for 71 yards in eight games with the Giants last season, but he did flash as a kick returner

Well this pretty much locks Coleman in as the kick returner and 3rd WR. You don't tender a 1st round pick unless he had/has a defined role.
 

Quote

Giants re-signed Aldrick Rosas to a one-year contract.

Rosas was an exclusive rights free agent, so he had no choice but to sign once the Giants offered him the tender. Rosas was exceptional last season, converting 32-of-33 kicks including 10-of-11 from 40 yards or more on his way to a Pro Bowl berth.

Giants re-signed C Jon Halapio to a one-year contract.

Halapio was an exclusive rights free agent, so he did not have any choice but to sign once he was tendered. Halapio opened last season as the Giants' starting center before a broken ankle sent him to injured reserve. He is expected to be fully healthy by the time OTAs roll around

Both expected.
 

Quote

NFL.com's Ian Rapoport reports the Giants are "leaning toward" keeping Olivier Vernon.

The Giants have been shopping their expensive pass rusher but are apparently finding his tedious contract untradable. Coming off back-to-back disappointing seasons, Vernon counts $19.5 million against the cap in 2019. The Giants could clear $11.5 million in cap space by cutting Vernon, so that likely remains an option.

Jesus tapdancing Christ Giants, cut this dude and resign Collins.

Edited March 7, 2019 by The Frankman

[kodycutter 923]

The #Browns are sending G Kevin Zeitler to NYG in exchange for #Giants pass-rusher Olivier Vernon, sources tell me and @MikeGarafolo

Confirmed now by multiple sources and reporters on Twitter such as - Ian Rappaport, Adam Schefter, Giants beat reporters, etc.

ALSO:

Art Stapleton on Twitter: 
I'm told Giants are sending a fourth rounder for the Browns' fifth rounder as part of the Vernon-for-Zeitler deal.

 

[IrishTwinkie 464]

My gut is saying this is a good thing. Vernon didn't seem like a fit and they needed a RG. Now maybe they can find a pass rusher in draft or focus on RT. 

[travdogg 2,999]

20 minutes ago, IrishTwinkie said:

My gut is saying this is a good thing. Vernon didn't seem like a fit and they needed a RG. Now maybe they can find a pass rusher in draft or focus on RT. 

Good deal for both teams. Though I'm starting to think pass rusher might be the direction in round 1, instead of finding an heir apparent at QB.

[The Frankman 3,346]

Quote

Giants acquired RG Kevin Zeitler and a 2019 fifth-round pick from the Browns in exchange for DE Olivier Vernon and a 2019 fourth-round pick.

This is a huge get for GM Dave Gettleman and the Giants. They wanted to get rid of Vernon badly, and not only were they able to accomplish that, they got Zeitler in return, who graded out as Pro Football Focus' top pass-blocking guard in 2018 and turned 29 today. He has three years left on his contract as the league's third-highest paid guard, but Zeitler is certainly worth it. He'll slide in as a foundation piece for the Giants' offensive line. They just need a quarterback, among other things.

 

The Browns are on the losing end of this trade, shipping a premier guard out for an overpaid pass rusher, but there's no doubt pass-rusher is a far more valuable position than interior offensive line. Zeitler was Pro Football Focus' top pass-blocking guard last year, but GM John Dorsey seemed motivated to move him. They want Austin Corbett to step into that void. Vernon was a big disappointment in New York, but maybe a change of scenery and a shift back to 4-3 base defensive end will help jolt his game. Vernon is theoretically still in the prime of his career.

This is actually a great deal for the G-Men. Zeitler goes to RG and replaces Jamon Brown (who the Giants want to re-sign), Pulley is at C and depending on what happens with Halapio/NFL draft you could actually have legit depth and options to replace Wheeler at RT. Vernon was out of sorts in the 3-4 and wasn't much of a factor last year, a return to a 4-3 will do him good.

Edited March 8, 2019 by The Frankman

[The Frankman 3,346]

ESPN: Olivier Vernon trade signals another Giants move is coming

 

I'm in the boat that the Giants could find a good 3-4 pass rusher in FA AND a safety (the market is flooded with safeties since the market depression last year) which would allow them to draft Haskins at #6. There's a lot of doublespeak with Gettleman and it's not a good feeling for fans when the GM doesn't appear to have a solid future plan and eschews analytics, but one thing he's constantly said is a) he wants to draft a franchise QB b) he's not going to reach for a QB. If the Giants haven't traded for/signed a Oliver replacement by the Draft, the possibility of them getting a pass rusher at #6 is very real...

 

[Ilov80s 30,013]

Pure smoke

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/rotounderworld-radio-fantasy-football-show/id1013135614?mt=2#episodeGuid=tag%3Asoundcloud%2C2010%3Atracks%2F586742754

[The Frankman 3,346]

Breaking down Dave Gettleman's ultimate plan for Giants

 

It's funny that NY writers are still trying to pin down his specific plan because he seems to change it and make moves at the last second to contradict it. One of the Giants best beat men break everything down her and after reading it... it makes sense more than other pieces I've read.

[Yenrub 788]

Interesting listen, Evan Silva talks about the Giants and why they have been so bad in recent years 

https://soundcloud.com/rotounderworld/big-blue-bubble-boy

 

[The Frankman 3,346]

Collins signed with Washington for HUGE money... wow, highest paid safety for now.

[The Frankman 3,346]

Giants having a very bleh FA period so far....

[monk 196]

On 3/8/2019 at 4:34 PM, The Frankman said:

ESPN: Olivier Vernon trade signals another Giants move is coming

 

I'm in the boat that the Giants could find a good 3-4 pass rusher in FA AND a safety (the market is flooded with safeties since the market depression last year) which would allow them to draft Haskins at #6. There's a lot of doublespeak with Gettleman and it's not a good feeling for fans when the GM doesn't appear to have a solid future plan and eschews analytics, but one thing he's constantly said is a) he wants to draft a franchise QB b) he's not going to reach for a QB. If the Giants haven't traded for/signed a Oliver replacement by the Draft, the possibility of them getting a pass rusher at #6 is very real...

 

Blake Bortles for a conditional Draft pick >>>>> Haskins for the #6 pick in the Draft 

[The Frankman 3,346]

5 minutes ago, monk said:

Blake Bortles for a conditional Draft pick >>>>> Haskins for the #6 pick in the Draft 

Now you're just trolling.

[shadyridr 14,318]

This team is so bad. The fact that they still have Eli on the roster earning 22m is mind boggling. Just trade a 3rd for Rosen, draft 2 stud defensive players, and franchise tagging Collins would have been my plan. If Rosen sucks, then they can trade up for Tua next year as they will have a bad record again. What on earth are they trying to accomplish? They have no good defensive players, a horrible oline, a horrible/aging expensive QB and their two best players play WR & RB. It makes no sense at all.

[Yenrub 788]

56 minutes ago, shadyridr said:

This team is so bad. The fact that they still have Eli on the roster earning 22m is mind boggling. Just trade a 3rd for Rosen, draft 2 stud defensive players, and franchise tagging Collins would have been my plan. If Rosen sucks, then they can trade up for Tua next year as they will have a bad record again. What on earth are they trying to accomplish? They have no good defensive players, a horrible oline, a horrible/aging expensive QB and their two best players play WR & RB. It makes no sense at all.

They don’t have a 3rd round pick in this draft, they used it on Sam Beal (CB Western Michigan) in the supplemental draft.

In theory the OL should be better with the addition of Zeitler from Cleveland at RG. They still need to upgrade the RT spot though.

They don't have a ton of money for free agency so they have to hit the bargain bin. 

Maybe things will look better in 2020

[The Frankman 3,346]

Quote

Giants agreed to terms with S Antoine Bethea, formerly of the Cardinals, on a two-year contract.

Bethea, a 13-year veteran, nearly played every snap for the Cardinals in 2018, but he was not the same player as he once was. Bethea will get snaps with the Landon Collins-less Giants and provides leadership, but the Giants need to re-stock their safety group via the draft.

uhhhhhhhh...

 

I think they are looking in the draft for safety. There are/were plenty of young cover safeties they could have payed, but it goes to asset allocation like I posted earlier.

Edited March 12, 2019 by The Frankman

[Yenrub 788]

Nothing against Bethea but signing a 35 year old player doesn’t seem like the kind of thing you want to do during a rebuild

I guess the bright side is that he can help teach others Bettcher's defensive scheme 

[monk 196]

2 hours ago, The Frankman said:

Now you're just trolling.

That's about what I would expect from Haskins.

Bridgewater , Tyrod Taylor, Bortles, Tannehill are all QBs that could be had for nothing that are as good or better than Haskins 

[IrishTwinkie 464]

Collins got 14 mil a year? Way too much. I liked him. a lot. But not nearly that much. The league is becoming more and more about the passing game. That is his biggest weakness. I was hoping he would go outside the NFC East, cause I am already tired of the low hanging fruit "revenge" story line that will shoved down everyone's throat. I am glad the Giants didn't pick up that kinda of salary load. I wish him success, except when he plays the Giants.

[Bracie Smathers 3,688]

4 hours ago, shadyridr said:

This team is so bad. The fact that they still have Eli on the roster earning 22m is mind boggling. Just trade a 3rd for Rosen, draft 2 stud defensive players, and franchise tagging Collins would have been my plan. If Rosen sucks, then they can trade up for Tua next year as they will have a bad record again. What on earth are they trying to accomplish?

Giants Consider Drafting Quarterback To Mentor Eli Manning

Quote

NEW YORK—Insisting that they didn’t want to push the 38-year-old signal caller onto the field before he’s ready, Giants general manager Dave Gettleman told reporters Tuesday that the team was considering drafting a quarterback to mentor Eli Manning. “I think it will be good to keep Eli on the bench for a year or two so he can learn the ropes of being an NFL quarterback,” said Gettleman, noting that Manning could really benefit from watching and working with someone who had experience leading a Division I football team. “He’s definitely got the talent, he’s just raw. This will give him time to work on his mechanics and learn the playbook. Sometimes, you just need to be patient with someone like Eli, but it would be a shame if he was never given a chance to reach his true potential.” Gettleman added that, barring injury, Eli probably wouldn’t be ready for the starter role until the 2021 NFL season.

 

 

[Jello_Biafra 417]

Not sure what they got for Beckham yet, but it's not enough. Not sure we have a true #1. Sheppard plays outside but is better in the slot. A WR in the 2nd?

[GroveDiesel 9,214]

4 minutes ago, Jello_Biafra said:

Not sure what they got for Beckham yet, but it's not enough. Not sure we have a true #1. Sheppard plays outside but is better in the slot. A WR in the 2nd?

2019 1st, 2019 3rd, Jabril Peppers.

Giants didn't get nearly enough IMO.

[ffmail4me 834]

Bump Shepard and Engram for sure right?? 

[Balco 332]

This gives Giants opportunity to rebuild. Take the OBJ salary hit this year and get cap situation settled going forward.

 

[shadyridr 14,318]

Trade Beckham  keep Eli. Makes sense

[fantasycurse42 8,316]

Complete tank mode.

[Jello_Biafra 417]

I'm being mocked by Bucs fans. I feel like calling in sick.

[Mr. Irrelevant 1,745]

On 3/5/2019 at 5:04 PM, monk said:

This team is in really bad shape 

I'll take "Spoke Too Soon" for $1,000, Alex.

[Yenrub 788]

25 minutes ago, shadyridr said:

Trade Beckham  keep Eli. Makes sense

WFT! They are "rebuilding" by letting their 2 best young players go but keeping 38 year old Eli and signing 35 year old Betha 

They must really want me to stop pulling for this team

[monk 196]

27 minutes ago, Jello_Biafra said:

I'm being mocked by Bucs fans. I feel like calling in sick.

Just remind them who their QB is !

[pantherclub 2,005]

Tank for Tua

 

Lose for Lawrence.

 

Bold move cotton

[Jello_Biafra 417]

8 minutes ago, monk said:

Just remind them who their QB is !

I tried.

[The Frankman 3,346]

18 minutes ago, Yenrub said:

WFT! They are "rebuilding" by letting their 2 best young players go but keeping 38 year old Eli and signing 35 year old Betha 

They must really want me to stop pulling for this team

They traded Saquon?

 

The reason you keep Eli is the hit is only for one year. I'm shocked they traded Odell but this is a pretty blatant attempt to restock the cupboard. This also seems to indicate the Giants probably won't take a QB with the #6 pick.

[Jello_Biafra 417]

Now they'll trade both 1sts for pick 1 and take Murray.