He wouldn’t have had to do anything. All he had to do was use the extra vote and Shan was gone. Your scenario happened except for his double voting for Shan. If he wanted to take her and the idol out of the game.
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Survivor Season 42: Starts Wednesday March 9, 2022 (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter NewlyRetired
- Start date
Well he did have to make sure that Genie and Shan didn't double up to vote him out. Otherwise it would have been a 2-2 tie. So guess he just had to make sure Genie voted for Shan or Shan voted for Genie.
Genie voted for him, which is fine. I’m just saying that if he wanted to get Shan out, he had it setup exactly right last night. It was obvious that Genie was voting for him so as long as Shan votes for Genie, he’s in the driver’s seat. He voted for Genie and Genie went home but if he double voted for Shan, she would have gone home instead.
He’s not the mastermind he thinks he is as now he’ll give back the extra vote and he’s kept her super powerful and having a potential ally. She gave an advantage to the other girl (can’t recall her name) and he should know that she did. He’s made up his mind that he’s riding along but no one else has seen him do anything so he’s not sitting pretty like her.
I know. The show folks really wanted idols to be known. That’s why they created that new steal an idol advantage. They want to have a tribal where someone thinks they are safe only to lose their idol. I’m not a big fan of it.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
True. I just like the hidden part of idols and the surprise and it seems like they are trying to remove all surprises except this new steal.It's better than awarding an idol nullifier by coin flip.
Jayrok
Footballguy
Genie would have been better off playing this game 8-10 years ago. Hard working, nice to others, loyal to anyone who asks, and trusts everyone. She got absolutely dismantled in the outwit category.
Her thinking that she was tight with both Shan and Ricard is tragic, especially her thinking that running to tell them both that she found the idol. How naïve can one player be? Then she gets to TC and does the woe is me speech about being on the bottom. Hey Genius, you basically handed them the only thing that could have saved you at that TC.
Speaking of which, we shouldn't underestimate how colossally dumb that whole scene went. She finds the idol, great. But then commits a cardinal sin by running to tell her adversaries, whom, we must assume, she believes she is in an alliance with. How can all 3 be in an alliance when there are only 3 in the tribe? Someone's got to go.
Then, she let's them talk her out of opening it... to leave it alone. And she agrees
Then they trick her into going along with Shan uttering the phrase at the challenge, you know, just to see if the other 2 are in play.
Then Shan tells her friend at the hilltop that she has the idol. I suppose it is hers not because she found it, but because she uttered the phrase... is that correct? Just so so dumb.
Then Shan wants to keep that idol and also have Richard give her back the extra vote. He was smart to keep that. He should have told her, ok, here's the extra vote but give me the idol. Fair is fair.
Shan is smart and if she continues to get away with manipulating everyone, she deserves the win. I hope she's out before the merge. I don't know who is the worst player, JD or Genie.
Her thinking that she was tight with both Shan and Ricard is tragic, especially her thinking that running to tell them both that she found the idol. How naïve can one player be? Then she gets to TC and does the woe is me speech about being on the bottom. Hey Genius, you basically handed them the only thing that could have saved you at that TC.
Speaking of which, we shouldn't underestimate how colossally dumb that whole scene went. She finds the idol, great. But then commits a cardinal sin by running to tell her adversaries, whom, we must assume, she believes she is in an alliance with. How can all 3 be in an alliance when there are only 3 in the tribe? Someone's got to go.
Then, she let's them talk her out of opening it... to leave it alone. And she agrees
Then they trick her into going along with Shan uttering the phrase at the challenge, you know, just to see if the other 2 are in play.
Then Shan tells her friend at the hilltop that she has the idol. I suppose it is hers not because she found it, but because she uttered the phrase... is that correct? Just so so dumb.
Then Shan wants to keep that idol and also have Richard give her back the extra vote. He was smart to keep that. He should have told her, ok, here's the extra vote but give me the idol. Fair is fair.
Shan is smart and if she continues to get away with manipulating everyone, she deserves the win. I hope she's out before the merge. I don't know who is the worst player, JD or Genie.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
I wonder if production wasn't expecting the players to share as much information about the idol activation stuff as they have. At this point, only the non-Naseer members of Luvu might be in the dark about it.
Jayrok
Footballguy
After the 3 phrases were mentioned at the challenge, Genie should have ran back to the camp and secured the idol. Possession is 9/10 of the law? Or quickly after they realized it would be her tribe at TC that night.
In retrospect, it seems that Xander should have just held the 3-way idol and waited for the 2 other phrases to be uttered first so that once he said his line, the idol would be in play. He still would have lost his votes prior to that but his tribe wouldn't have to know he had an idol coming. Or maybe I'm missing something.
Genie's parting line was good. "Man I actually hope it rains on them tonight... ain't nobody going to attend that fire."
In retrospect, it seems that Xander should have just held the 3-way idol and waited for the 2 other phrases to be uttered first so that once he said his line, the idol would be in play. He still would have lost his votes prior to that but his tribe wouldn't have to know he had an idol coming. Or maybe I'm missing something.
Genie's parting line was good. "Man I actually hope it rains on them tonight... ain't nobody going to attend that fire."
bryhamm
Footballguy
It is hers because she was the one to open up the package. Thus, Shan's vote was gone until the idol became activated ... which happened to be at the next IC.
I do find if very coincidental that Naseer found his (as well as Brad's rehidden one) the very episode before they do a tribal swap/merge or whatever is coming up. This was the last chance for the idols to become activated. Producers had to have moved them into more obvious places.
bryhamm
Footballguy
This doesn't make sense. There was no idol for Genie to secure. Shan has it. Now, from Genie's pov, it should have still been there. So, from that pov she should have mentioned something about going to get it. Then, when they balked at going to get it, she might have been able to figure out that it was already grabbed.
As soon as there is any type of merge he’ll be outed unless those people want to get the rest of Luvu out and need him.
I don’t think they anticipated it but they seem to be pushing it that way including placing advantages right in the middle of the fire area.
Runkle
Footballguy
The idol wouldn't become active until after Genie possessed it and she says the words at the next challenge after that. So she still wouldn't have been safe.
Corporation
Angry Bovine
I think Bryhamm has it right. The person who opened the idol (regardless of who was standing around) was the one who took the risk. Had Naseer not found the idol, Shan wouldn't have had a vote. Once the idol became active, it was Shan's regardless of who ran back to camp to grab it (just like you can't steal an idol out of someone's bag). Once it became active, I presume Shan could give it away (which you would think would never happen but we've seen a lot of trading of advantages already).
So how are we voting on this? After tribal, did Ricard give the advantage back to Shan like he said he would or did he decide to keep it? You would think a "mastermind" would not give up an advantage, but if that's the case he missed the easy opportunity to get rid of Shan at tribal (just like Shan did to JD). That would lead you to think he's giving it back to maintain the trust with his number 1 ally. I'll vote he doesn't give it back.
Runkle
Footballguy
I'm talking from Genies perspective as if their idol wasn't claimed yet. If it hadn't been claimed there's no reason for her to think it would have been activated to be claimed by her after the challenge.
It was Shan's because she opened the package and took the idol necklace from the package. If Genie went back to get it after the immunity challenge there wouldn't have been an idol in the package so she would have been SOL.
bryhamm
Footballguy
They opened it and then they put something back in there (a bracelet, maybe) and put the package back. But, Shan kept the idol.
Maik Jeaunz
Footballguy
Ricard: "Shan and I as a duo are running this game."
meanwhile his tribe has lost 3 challenges in a row. please go home, dude.
meanwhile his tribe has lost 3 challenges in a row. please go home, dude.
Maelstrom
Footballguy
There was a long discussion up-thread about this, but it seems the wording of the rules make it seem like you NEED to say it the next tribal after you take it. Whether you have to continue saying it isn't really mentioned, but at least that initial one after finding it seems fairly clear that you have to say it then.
UOFI_316
Footballguy
This. They (Shan) opened it, took the actual idol, and then put Ricard's bracelet back in and wrapped it up the same way and put it back in the tree.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
That's apples and oranges. The things in the fire were for the boat trip to Edge of Extin... er, Prisoners Dilemma Island. They wanted a member from each tribe there that night, and thus placed the invitations where someone was guaranteed to find them. That is not what they've done with the placement of the things that became idols.
The fire-thing scenario was closer to having the S39 tribes draw a name out of a bag to send someone to Island of the Idols than to a regular idol situation.
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Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
They were running the tribe, sure. A tribe which is down to 2. They aren't running anything related to the other 10 people still in the game.
mr. furley
Footballguy
they've got to do away with these phrases that players have to utter to activate the idols
they're way too far fetched and having them repeat the same dumb phrase each week is stupid
they're way too far fetched and having them repeat the same dumb phrase each week is stupid
Corporation
Angry Bovine
The language of it said that the phrase has to be uttered at the same tribal. I think Xander played it right. He said it the first time, then didn't say it again until another team said it, then all 3 finally said it when Naseer came in with the surprise that the producers didn't show us. And they totally probably left it on the well to ensure someone found it
Corporation
Angry Bovine
They don't have to do it anymore, it just had to be said at the same challenge to activate it. They all 3 now have a fully active idol.
mr. furley
Footballguy
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
It's now a real idol, so presumably a real idol will be re-hidden and the other two idols won't be affected.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
didn't shan say that the idol would become a souvenir, once the tribes merged? or did i mishear her?
Runkle
Footballguy
I believe the three-way "shared" idol (we still don't know what that even means... can each of the three use it once each? Or is it a single idol that once one of the three uses, the other two can't?) was said to be "good until the merge", yes.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
Only if the three phrases were not said at the same time. If that never happened by the merge, then there was no chance for the things to become idols (thus they would become "souvenirs"), and the holders of them would get their votes back.
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Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
Maelstrom
Footballguy
The language of it said that the phrase has to be uttered at the same tribal. I think Xander played it right. He said it the first time, then didn't say it again until another team said it, then all 3 finally said it when Naseer came in with the surprise that the producers didn't show us. And they totally probably left it on the well to ensure someone found it
You'd have to look back at the actual clue wording, it definitely seems to indicate it's necessary to say it at the "next" tribal after it's found. Probably relatively moot point now though that it's been completed. I agree that Xander did ok in not going first after that time.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Nick Vermeil
Footballguy
“With this idol, you’ve found new power in the game. When played, you can remove any one remaining player and have them replaced by a sitting congressperson or endangered species.”
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
And now we know why we'd barely learned anything about Erika. There's more mystery/suspense in this cliffhanger decision if we don't know how she feels about everyone. (Still seems very likely that she'll break the hourglass, though.)
Why we've still barely learned anything about Heather, I have no idea.
Why we've still barely learned anything about Heather, I have no idea.
bryhamm
Footballguy
I can't see a logical reason why she wouldn't break it. It would give her safety. Yeah, it might piss off the 5 people that won the challenge and now don't have safety, but so what.
bryhamm
Footballguy
rick6668
Footballguy
Yeah, you never know, but breaking it gives her immunity at the next tribal if I heard that right. That's not even a real choice, you take immunity every time. It's the only way to ensure you don't go home.
El Floppo
Footballguy
While the people picked her after they had the choice, she randomly picked the rock that had her sit out in the first place.
bryhamm
Footballguy
That was how I heard it too. She basically switches everything. So the group that won the challenge + Naseer would no longer have immunity. The group that lost the challenge + herself would now have immunity.
The ONLY thing I can think of is that it looks like just before the immunity challenge she will be brought back and will tell them all her decision. It's possible she thinks if she doesn't change things the group that won the challenge might then have some loyalty to her for not putting them in danger. I don't think that would be worth it, but it is possible she does this.
bryhamm
Footballguy
James Bond
Footballguy
Gotta say, I'm not loving this season. Although it is fun to see everyone scrambling due to the "twists," it seems like they're overdoing it. Too many twists really changes the game.
Instead of the usual merge, you have to earn the merge (and immunity). After you do so, a single person can change it all on a whim. Suddenly, immunity is not immunity. But you have an idol. Whoops, it's stolen. Well you still have an alliance with a majority of the votes. Whoops, there's a steal-a-vote and/or an extra vote out there. It's a totally different game. And not necessarily a better game. It's chaos.
Maybe they felt like the game was stale or people had too good a strategy. Idols and idol-nullifiers were introduced over time but this season everything is on it's head. Is this really needed to keep Survivor interesting or is it just jumping the shark?
Instead of the usual merge, you have to earn the merge (and immunity). After you do so, a single person can change it all on a whim. Suddenly, immunity is not immunity. But you have an idol. Whoops, it's stolen. Well you still have an alliance with a majority of the votes. Whoops, there's a steal-a-vote and/or an extra vote out there. It's a totally different game. And not necessarily a better game. It's chaos.
Maybe they felt like the game was stale or people had too good a strategy. Idols and idol-nullifiers were introduced over time but this season everything is on it's head. Is this really needed to keep Survivor interesting or is it just jumping the shark?
