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Dynasty & Redraft: WR John Ross, N.Y. Giants


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7 hours ago, QuizGuy66 said:

I still think he's gonna be boom or bust - it will depend on game situation and matchups.  But I do think he's a guy where it's vital for him to catch that first target no matter when it occurs.

-QG

Agreed BC he seems to have crisis of confidence very easily. Not good.  

Still staying with him in dynasty but thinking of dropping him for Anthony Miller in redraft BC it’s obvious that Boyd is the wr2 to own in Cincy this year.  He’s further along as an nfl player and he’s actually really good.  

Thisnyear John Ross seems to be a low target situational deep threat  that isn’t even being targeted deep.  Very strange. 

No doubt he will have his few weeks this season where he explodes for 1 or 2 tds.  But the usage and the body language o the field are very concerning to me.  

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3 minutes ago, Elevencents said:

In the right circumstances, yes. AJ Green injury could really make things worse or better who knows. I’d hold to see how it shakes out.

Probably worse, I think he's droppable.

IMO if Ross can't produce given his current situation I don't think he'll produce any time soon.

His snaps have decreased for three straight weeks, I was surprised to see him play on a season low 48% of the snaps despite the Green injury. He did see a season high 15% of Dalton's attempts but he once again struggled (3/16/0 on 7 targets).

Assuming Green's injury isn't serious, he looks like he's 5th in the pecking order. 

 

 

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27 minutes ago, SameSongNDance said:

Probably worse, I think he's droppable.

IMO if Ross can't produce given his current situation I don't think he'll produce any time soon.

His snaps have decreased for three straight weeks, I was surprised to see him play on a season low 48% of the snaps despite the Green injury. He did see a season high 15% of Dalton's attempts but he once again struggled (3/16/0 on 7 targets).

Assuming Green's injury isn't serious, he looks like he's 5th in the pecking order. 

 

 

I had high hopes for this guy, but he really seems to not get it. He's an actual liability on the field as this point, not an asset. It also doesn't help that Dalton is the QB. He's terrible. 

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John Ross played 31-of-65 snaps (48 percent) Week 3 against the Panthers.

He did end up with seven targets, but he played two fewer snaps than A.J. Green, who exited early with an injury, and just two more than Josh Malone. Through three games, Ross has five catches for 27 yards. It is tough to justify spending a redraft bench spot on him at this point.

Sep 24 - 12:06 PM

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5 hours ago, TheFanatic said:

Top 10 pick at WR playing in essentially his third game? Knee jerk much?

Picked up Boyd when an IR spot opened up on my team.  When it's time to drop someone it's gonna be Ross.  (This is redraft btw).

They will give Ross time to figure it out - the thing is this might be a whole painful season of that.  If he's in the wrong place on a pattern or if he is dropping a ball in a crucial spot that is going to affect his opportunity.  The good times feel like they are a ways away with J Ross.  I'm saying this as a Bengals fan.

What the game plan is if Green is out will be telling - though you have a healthy Eifert now and the other two tight ends could steal looks.  They like to throw out of the backfield to Gio.  And if they actually give Auden Tate an opportunity look out because that kid caught everything in preseason.

Not saying to throw in the towel quite yet in dynasty or anything but the situation is concerning - at least in the near term.

-QG

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14 hours ago, QuizGuy66 said:

Picked up Boyd when an IR spot opened up on my team.  When it's time to drop someone it's gonna be Ross.  (This is redraft btw).

They will give Ross time to figure it out - the thing is this might be a whole painful season of that.  If he's in the wrong place on a pattern or if he is dropping a ball in a crucial spot that is going to affect his opportunity.  The good times feel like they are a ways away with J Ross.  I'm saying this as a Bengals fan.

What the game plan is if Green is out will be telling - though you have a healthy Eifert now and the other two tight ends could steal looks.  They like to throw out of the backfield to Gio.  And if they actually give Auden Tate an opportunity look out because that kid caught everything in preseason.

Not saying to throw in the towel quite yet in dynasty or anything but the situation is concerning - at least in the near term.

-QG

Yeah, I'm a dynasty owner. Took a flyer on his due to draft position and who he was playing across from. I've been sitting on him more than a year. In a redraft, I'm not so sure he is someone that can be kept on a roster unless the benches are deep. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
Quote

ESPN's Katherine Terrell doesn't expect John Ross (questionable, groin) to play this week.

Ross returned to limited practice after being a mid-week downgrade in Week 5. The Bengals will take him to game-time but he may be held out another game. Alex Erickson will play in three-wide sets if Ross is ruled out.

Source: Katherine Terrell on Twitter 

Oct 13 - 6:21 PM

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
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NFL.com's Mike Garofolo reports John Ross (groin) will be sidelined "a few weeks."

Ross aggravated an existing groin ailment in Week 7. The No. 9 overall pick of the 2017 draft simply cannot stay healthy. Ross has seven career catches.

Source: Mike Garafolo on Twitter 

Oct 23 - 2:04 PM

 

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Is he droppable in dynasty at this point?  I’m thinking yes.  Green stil has a few years in him.  Boyd is now firmly ahead of him.  We are talking about the wr3 on the bengals here.

When he’s on the field, many times he looks lost.  He looks like he lacks passion.  He gives up on routes.  Almost like he really doesn’t want to be out there.  

And that’s when he’s not injured which has been most of his career thus far.   I’m close to giving up on him.  

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34 minutes ago, rickyg said:

Is he droppable in dynasty at this point?  I’m thinking yes.  Green stil has a few years in him.  Boyd is now firmly ahead of him.  We are talking about the wr3 on the bengals here.

When he’s on the field, many times he looks lost.  He looks like he lacks passion.  He gives up on routes.  Almost like he really doesn’t want to be out there.  

And that’s when he’s not injured which has been most of his career thus far.   I’m close to giving up on him.  

If the owner in my league dropped him, I would not add him.

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • 3 months later...

Bengals director of player personnel Duke Tobin labeled the John Ross trade rumors as "fake news."

Multiple media members reported Tuesday that the Bengals were shopping the former No. 9 overall pick. A split would seem to make sense for both sides, but perhaps Ross will get a fresh start under new coach Zac Taylor. Also, the Bengals would be selling Ross at an extreme low point. They'd be better off seeing what Ross can do in the new scheme, as long as he can stay healthy, which has been one of Ross' biggest issues dating back to his college days.

SOURCE: Paul Dehner on Twitter

Feb 27, 2019, 9:08 AM

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If Zac's offense is similar to what the Rams have been doing a speed guy is a vital part clearing out space for the other receivers. Of course you need a QB to drive the ball downfield which is debatable if Dalton can be that guy.

Trading Ross at this point makes zero sense considering what they would receive for him. Unless the guy is a cancer in the locker room for some reason.

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8 minutes ago, kittenmittens said:

Makes sense.  I'm sure they were in fact hoping somebody would overpay for him... But since he has done less than nothing they aren't getting anything for him, they might as well see if he cam be a 3rd year breakout guy.

It’s possible Ross’ agent leaked the story hoping a team might make an offer. Ross might want out of Cinci given how poor things have gone.

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  • 1 month later...

New Bengals coach Zac Taylor said he wants to give John Ross a "fresh start."

"Some of these players with what they've done in the past, it's good for a fresh start with a new coaching staff," was Taylor's exact quote. "Let's see what he can put on tape. He was electric in college." "In college" remains Ross' qualifier, as he has done so little through two NFL seasons. Injuries have been the primary culprit, though Ross struggled to make an impact even in a healthier 2018. Ross probably won't be playing for his roster spot this summer, but he is one of the Bengals most on the spot under the new coaching staff.

SOURCE: Geoff Hobson on Twitter

Apr 16, 2019, 5:51 PM

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On 4/24/2017 at 5:02 PM, Ilov80s said:

Just look at that 40 time. The way Ross can stress a defense vertically has the potential to be Randy Moss like. 

Randy Moss like.........:lol:

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25 minutes ago, Dez said:

Randy Moss like.........:lol:

LOL. John Ross was a definite miss for me. I stand by that he had the potential to put extreme vertical stress on a defense. 

Also in my defense, Ross went 9th overall and I doubt many were expecting that. They saw what I saw, it just hasn’t worked out. I also never said he would put up Moss numbers, just create space by stretching the field.

Edited by Ilov80s
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10 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

LOL. John Ross was a definite miss for me. I stand by that he had the potential to put extreme vertical stress on a defense. 

Also in my defense, Ross went 9th overall and I doubt many were expecting that. They saw what I saw, it just hasn’t worked out. I also never said he would put up Moss numbers, just create space by stretching the field.

DHB - 7th

Ginn - 9th 

Troy Williamson - 7th

Even Matt Jones (wasn't nearly as fast but insane size/speed combo) was a late first despite needing to switch from QB

Speed will get drafted super high if the wr did anything in college.

Prediction - Campbell, Isabella and Metcalf all go higher than they should

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48 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

DHB - 7th

Ginn - 9th 

Troy Williamson - 7th

Even Matt Jones (wasn't nearly as fast but insane size/speed combo) was a late first despite needing to switch from QB

Speed will get drafted super high if the wr did anything in college.

Prediction - Campbell, Isabella and Metcalf all go higher than they should

The ability to create and use that speed wisely has no value in the draft. It sometimes gets talked about but there's no evidence of it on draft day. There are many times that I think this is all that matters. We've seen holy cow fast RBs run right into a pile of defenders. WRs struggle to get open and sometimes "get killed" by a big hit we all saw coming. 

AB and then Beckham and then Taywan Taylor all had this talk how they use their speed some but when the ball is in the air, they have this fifth gear. Taylor hasn't done squat but this is an example of how draft reviewers should be thinking of speed. Hill has this almost jog to his screens/routes and then explodes like a video game. 

There isn't a sport that first step isn't super important in. I have played basketball til I was 30 and written of football for decades and always always always hear first step discussed. Sometimes draft folks say burst and that's it, that's good but it is everything and should be oh so common. It doesn't matter if it's a WR off the line, a DE into the line, a LB attacking a run, or a point guard beating his man, or a guy stealing second....it is oh so prevalent.

I called Ross from day one and have been pretty accurate for years on this. I totally recommend thinking of first step and how they use their speed. That will help dynasty people a ton. It's done wonders for me in FF

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59 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

DHB - 7th

Ginn - 9th 

Troy Williamson - 7th

Even Matt Jones (wasn't nearly as fast but insane size/speed combo) was a late first despite needing to switch from QB

Speed will get drafted super high if the wr did anything in college.

Prediction - Campbell, Isabella and Metcalf all go higher than they should

except Isabella not only did something in college, no one did it better... 

Yet you got guys like Butler (less of a resume) and Marquis Brown (tiny) who people are salivating over and taking even higher than Isabella may be. 

Heck, Butler just went 1.1 in GEDL early rookie draft

 

I just think you're selling Isabella short, no pun intended. 

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1 hour ago, Dr. Dan said:

except Isabella not only did something in college, no one did it better... 

Yet you got guys like Butler (less of a resume) and Marquis Brown (tiny) who people are salivating over and taking even higher than Isabella may be. 

Heck, Butler just went 1.1 in GEDL early rookie draft

 

I just think you're selling Isabella short, no pun intended. 

You might be right.  Seems like a good slot WR with speed to burn but i haven't seen many (any?) mocks with him in the first round. I'm thinking he does, but I'd be cautious.

In the right spot I'm thinking of him as a late first FF pick in PPR. 

1 hour ago, Dr. Dan said:

This is why I like what i see from Isabella

I'll have to look closer if you're this high on him.

He did play really well against Georgia, the only top opponent they played last year.  

Edited by -OZ-
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14 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

You might be right.  Seems like a good slot WR with speed to burn but i haven't seen many (any?) mocks with him in the first round. I'm thinking he does, but I'd be cautious.

In the right spot I'm thinking of him as a late first FF pick in PPR. 

I'll have to look closer if you're this high on him.

He did play really well against Georgia, the only top opponent they played last year.  

He had good games in previous years against top level teams as well.

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59 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

You might be right.  Seems like a good slot WR with speed to burn but i haven't seen many (any?) mocks with him in the first round. I'm thinking he does, but I'd be cautious.

In the right spot I'm thinking of him as a late first FF pick in PPR. 

I'll have to look closer if you're this high on him.

He did play really well against Georgia, the only top opponent they played last year.  

Two late, long TDs when the score was like 60-7.  It's not as good as the boxscore would lead you to believe.

Like pretty much every other receiver in this draft, Isabella's going to need to end up in the right system with a complimentary QB pairing and available targets for him to payoff.  

After next weekend we can finally start ranking these guys with some degree of clarity.  

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57 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Fair to say with a new coaching staff and his 3rd year this is probably make or break for Ross.

I think it's over. There was talk about him being traded for a candy bar this offseason. I think they draft a wr at some point in the first 3 rounds. 

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1 hour ago, Dr. Dan said:

I think it's over. There was talk about him being traded for a candy bar this offseason. I think they draft a wr at some point in the first 3 rounds. 

Just my humble opinion, I think a Ted Ginn type career is in the making.

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3 hours ago, skinfanjon said:

Two late, long TDs when the score was like 60-7.  It's not as good as the boxscore would lead you to believe.

Like pretty much every other receiver in this draft, Isabella's going to need to end up in the right system with a complimentary QB pairing and available targets for him to payoff.  

After next weekend we can finally start ranking these guys with some degree of clarity.  

 

59 minutes ago, menobrown said:

And one was a flea flicker.

 

 

Sure, lots of garbage time but lots of WRs had garbage time against UGA and didn't have big games. In 2017, Isabella had 163/1 against Miss State. That was an 11 point game and when Isabella scored his 69 yard TD it was in the 2nd quarter and gave UMass a 7 point lead. Also in 2017, UMass lost to Tennessee by 4 and Isabella had 90 total yards on 7 touches. In 2016 against Florida, UMass lost by 21 so not a total blowout. Isabella had the most scrimmage yards of any player on UMass or Florida. 

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8 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

 

Sure, lots of garbage time but lots of WRs had garbage time against UGA and didn't have big games. In 2017, Isabella had 163/1 against Miss State. That was an 11 point game and when Isabella scored his 69 yard TD it was in the 2nd quarter and gave UMass a 7 point lead. Also in 2017, UMass lost to Tennessee by 4 and Isabella had 90 total yards on 7 touches. In 2016 against Florida, UMass lost by 21 so not a total blowout. Isabella had the most scrimmage yards of any player on UMass or Florida. 

Did I say he's never done anything in the history of ever?

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31 minutes ago, skinfanjon said:

Did I say he's never done anything in the history of ever?

Oh so it's cool for you to "yeah but" Oz but if I add some extra info to support a player it's some kind of affront to you? 

Edited by Ilov80s
had the wrong poster
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14 minutes ago, skinfanjon said:

Uh, comment didn't have anything to do with Dr. Dan.

Sorry Oz. Point being, I have every right to add information on a player as you do. It wasn't a personal attack, just a discussion on a player.

Edited by Ilov80s
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3 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

Sorry Oz. Point being, I have every right to add information on a player as you do. It wasn't a personal attack, just a discussion on a player.

Sure thing, go for it.  I just saw that he commented specifically about the Georgia game while coming from a place of needing to look more closely at the prospect.  I just find the rush to defense of Isabella interesting.  I'm still forming opinions myself.  If you want to walk us through a game by game of his that'd be an awesome contribution to his thread.

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21 minutes ago, skinfanjon said:

Sure thing, go for it.  I just saw that he commented specifically about the Georgia game while coming from a place of needing to look more closely at the prospect.  I just find the rush to defense of Isabella interesting.  I'm still forming opinions myself.  If you want to walk us through a game by game of his that'd be an awesome contribution to his thread.

I actually thought this was the Isabella thread at the time lol. Just saw all the talk about and assumed I clicked the wrong thread. My opinion on him is pretty well developed at this point although draft capital and location is the final missing piece that is likely to pull him down a bit in my rankings.

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2 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

I actually thought this was the Isabella thread at the time lol. Just saw all the talk about and assumed I clicked the wrong thread. My opinion on him is pretty well developed at this point although draft capital and location is the final missing piece that is likely to pull him down a bit in my rankings.

It's all good.  For me the draft is 80% of the evaluation, so I have very few firm takes on any of these guys.  For example, Iast year I had absolutely no interest in Dante Pettis.  Then the Niners traded up for him in the 2nd, so I drafted him on every single team I have.  Took him mid 2nd in most leagues and now wouldn't deal him for less than the 1.03. Good decision.

Anyone who gets entrenched about a prospect at this stage is doing themselves a major disservice imo.

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  • Faust changed the title to Dynasty & Redraft: WR John Ross, N.Y. Giants

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