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Colin Kaepernick Thread and related anthem kneeling issues/news

Dr. Awesome

By Dr. Awesome,
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squistion

John Chavez‏ @jchavezfbnm 4h4 hours ago Replying to @realDonaldTrump "Thinking NFL players are 'protesting the flag' is like thinking Rosa Parks was protesting public transportation."

SWC

says the guy who is on an internet politics forum while the game is on saying he doesnt want to be bothered by political stuff during the game take that to the bank bromigos 

Sammy3469

Hmmm...if you wade into an issue by telling people who are kneeling because of a racial issue to stop kneeling, you by definition are dealing with race whether you mention race or not.  This isn't har

GoBirds

GoBirds 10,194

Posted
Posted
Just now, GroveDiesel said:

Are you somehow equating players protesting with success or failure?

Because a lot of the Bills players kneeled and Shady went so far as to call the President an ###hole. And they managed to beat the Broncos who didn't do a lot of protesting.

The ones making the biggest deal definitely came out flat or completely blew it like Pittsburgh. Didn't see Bills game did they stay in locker room too? Shady has always been pretty childish, see Chip Kelly. Seahawks personalities have been big on the black power fists in the air and taking it further than most but both teams in that game skipped it. Will be interesting to see if the level of demonstrations continue or if Tomlin and Carroll get the focus back to football. 

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Hang 10

Hang 10 3,657

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Posted (edited)

You guys may not like it but this is winner for Trump. So now you have democrats calling for anthem protests because they hate Trump. Think about that. Trump has pushed them into a corner now where they have to disrespect our country and the troops to protest Trump. And sorry, the majority of people agree with him .

Edited by Hang 10
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KCitons

KCitons 4,164

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, squistion said:

Fun Fact:

NFL Teams Didn’t Stand For The National Anthem Until 2009

http://dailysnark.com/nfl-teams-didnt-stand-national-anthem-2009/

No NFL player stood for the national anthem until 2009—before then, the players stayed in the locker room as the anthem played. NFL teams got patriotic in recent years because it was good for business. A 2015 congressional report revealed that the Department of Defense had paid $5.4 million to NFL teams between 2011 and 2014 to stage on-field patriotic ceremonies; the National Guard shelled out $6.7 million for similar displays between 2013 and 2015.

 

This is an interesting dynamic. If the DoD paid the NFL, the contract may address how the teams are supposed to act during the National Anthem. If they remained in the locker room prior to 2009, then it would be reasonable to assume that by contract (and subsequent payoff) the players are now on the field. Should those players now choose to not comply with the terms , they could be held accountable. 

And since it's the government that is paying, Trump could be the person to apply pressure. 

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Old Smiley

Old Smiley 231

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

The ones making the biggest deal definitely came out flat or completely blew it like Pittsburgh. Didn't see Bills game did they stay in locker room too? Shady has always been pretty childish, see Chip Kelly. Seahawks personalities have been big on the black power fists in the air and taking it further than most but both teams in that game skipped it. Will be interesting to see if the level of demonstrations continue or if Tomlin and Carroll get the focus back to football. 

Pittsburgh has blowing it in their DNA. Didn't take a protest to make them look bad on the road. Seahawks are shaky with or without.

 

Bunk.

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Radical Larry

Radical Larry 676

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Hang 10 said:

You guys may not like it but this is winner for Trump. So now you have democrats calling for anthem protests because they hate Trump. Think about that. Trump has pushed them into a corner now where they have to disrespect our country in the troops to protest Trump. And sorry, the majority of people agree with him .

So what does trump "win"?

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squistion

squistion 12,581

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

Not only that they don't want any controversial nonsense that would cause their sponsors any problems.  A little nuance from the tweet copier would have realized that.

Like Confederate flags at NASCAR events?

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Limp Ditka

Limp Ditka 8,962

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, GroveDiesel said:

Are you somehow equating players protesting with success or failure?

Because a lot of the Bills players kneeled and Shady went so far as to call the President an ###hole. And they managed to beat the Broncos who didn't do a lot of protesting.

He is and it's glorious to watch

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Mr. Know-It-All

Mr. Know-It-All 662

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2 hours ago, waterworld said:

Much more than half were booing.   And disrespecting the flag and anthem is not an acceptable form of protest.  

 

Waiting for the Trump tweet that says 150% of the fans were booing, it was the largest booing of flag/anthem protests of all time, it was YUUUUUGE!

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squistion

squistion 12,581

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Posted
13 minutes ago, Hang 10 said:

You guys may not like it but this is winner for Trump. So now you have democrats calling for anthem protests because they hate Trump. Think about that. Trump has pushed them into a corner now where they have to disrespect our country and the troops to protest Trump. And sorry, the majority of people agree with him .

Wait, what Democrats are calling for anthem protests? The only one I am aware of is Donna Edwards, an African American who is no longer a member of Congress. We haven't heard Shumer, Pelosi, or other current Democrats in the House or Senate calling for protests.

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Hang 10

Hang 10 3,657

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Posted
4 minutes ago, squistion said:

Wait, what Democrats are calling for anthem protests? The only one I am aware of is Donna Edwards, an African American who is no longer a member of Congress. We haven't heard Shumer, Pelosi, or other current Democrats in the House or Senate calling for protests.

You just answered your own question. And why does it matter that she's black? 

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squistion

squistion 12,581

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

Which drivers fly confederate flags?

Didn't say any drivers did. However a little more background on the subject from a 2015 article, which shows NASCARs attempt to move away from the Confederate symbol, but was meeting resistance from the fans.

https://www.sbnation.com/nascar/2015/9/10/9299515/nascar-confederate-flag-darlington-south-carolina

NASCAR’s Confederate flag conundrum

[...]

And the "throwback" theme extended beyond what was happening on the track. Throughout Darlington's infield and the camping grounds surrounding the track located in a sleepy town of almost 6,300, there persisted the inescapable sight of a red flag with blue bars and white stars.

The Confederate flag and NASCAR have long been intertwined, the roots of each extending to the Deep South with some regarding both as Southern institutions. For decades the stars and bars were omnipresent at NASCAR races. Darlington's used to label its spring event the "Rebel 400," featured the flag prominently on programs and other advertisements and played "Dixie" during pre-race ceremonies.

Over the years, though, the sanctioning body has distanced itself greatly from the Confederate flag. This summer, following the shooting deaths of nine African-Americans at the hands of a white supremacist inside a Charleston, S.C. church -- two hours south of Darlington -- NASCAR CEO and chairman Brian France called it an "offensive symbol" and said, "we will go as far as we can to eliminate the presence of that flag."

NASCAR attempted to eradicate the flag from the speedway's grounds through a program where fans would turn in a Confederate flag and receive an American one in return. Except despite NASCAR's effort, the flag was quite conspicuous throughout the Darlington weekend. From flags to t-shirts, hats to can coolers, tattoos to pants it was impossible not to turn your head and see the symbol being displayed in some fashion.

At one flag exchange point there were no takers as of Sunday morning and a box of American flags sat untouched. Two security guards were clueless such a swap existed, while another dismissed the idea.

"No one in this crowd is going to give up their Confederate flag for an America one," the guard said. "They already own an American flag. Plus, they think by handing over the Confederate flag would be a form of surrendering in their mind."

Because either NBC didn't want to show a national television audience an event where the controversial flag was being displayed so freely, or event organizers wanted to give spotters a clearer view of the speedway (attendees say both reasons were cited by security, though neither could be confirmed as a Darlington spokesman declined comment), security personnel instructed patrons to take down their flags whenever cars were on the track.

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squistion

squistion 12,581

Posted
Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Hang 10 said:

You just answered your own question. And why does it matter that she's black? 

Gee, I dunno, I guess I might expect that it should not be surprising that an African American ex-member of Congress, with nothing to lose, would speak out in favor of Kaep's protest regarding oppression of blacks and other minorities. Wouldn't be shocked to hear Al Sharpton weigh in it too. I suspect high profile members of the African American community might have a bias towards perceived discrimination against blacks.

And actually I didn't answer might own question. You said Democrats (plural) were calling for anthem protests. I was only aware of one person, which would be one singular Democrat, not several or more Democrats as you were inferring.

Edited by squistion
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IvanKaramazov

IvanKaramazov 21,923

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, Hang 10 said:

You guys may not like it but this is winner for Trump. So now you have democrats calling for anthem protests because they hate Trump. Think about that. Trump has pushed them into a corner now where they have to disrespect our country and the troops to protest Trump. And sorry, the majority of people agree with him .

I would prefer for this not to be correct, but it pretty clearly is.

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Hang 10

Hang 10 3,657

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Posted
2 minutes ago, squistion said:

Gee, I dunno, I guess I might expect that it should not be surprising that an African American ex-member of Congress, with nothing to lose, would speak out in favor of Kaep's protest regarding oppression of blacks and other minorities. Wouldn't be shocked to hear Al Sharpton weigh in it too. I suspect high profile members of the African American community might have a bias towards perceived discrimination against blacks.

 

Sheesh talk about the bigotry of low expectations.

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Ramblin Wreck

Ramblin Wreck 14,155

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Posted
11 minutes ago, squistion said:

Didn't say any drivers did. However a little more background on the subject from a 2015 article, which shows NASCARs attempt to move away from the Confederate symbol, but was meeting resistance from the fans.

https://www.sbnation.com/nascar/2015/9/10/9299515/nascar-confederate-flag-darlington-south-carolina

NASCAR’s Confederate flag conundrum

[...]

And the "throwback" theme extended beyond what was happening on the track. Throughout Darlington's infield and the camping grounds surrounding the track located in a sleepy town of almost 6,300, there persisted the inescapable sight of a red flag with blue bars and white stars.

The Confederate flag and NASCAR have long been intertwined, the roots of each extending to the Deep South with some regarding both as Southern institutions. For decades the stars and bars were omnipresent at NASCAR races. Darlington's used to label its spring event the "Rebel 400," featured the flag prominently on programs and other advertisements and played "Dixie" during pre-race ceremonies.

Over the years, though, the sanctioning body has distanced itself greatly from the Confederate flag. This summer, following the shooting deaths of nine African-Americans at the hands of a white supremacist inside a Charleston, S.C. church -- two hours south of Darlington -- NASCAR CEO and chairman Brian France called it an "offensive symbol" and said, "we will go as far as we can to eliminate the presence of that flag."

NASCAR attempted to eradicate the flag from the speedway's grounds through a program where fans would turn in a Confederate flag and receive an American one in return. Except despite NASCAR's effort, the flag was quite conspicuous throughout the Darlington weekend. From flags to t-shirts, hats to can coolers, tattoos to pants it was impossible not to turn your head and see the symbol being displayed in some fashion.

At one flag exchange point there were no takers as of Sunday morning and a box of American flags sat untouched. Two security guards were clueless such a swap existed, while another dismissed the idea.

"No one in this crowd is going to give up their Confederate flag for an America one," the guard said. "They already own an American flag. Plus, they think by handing over the Confederate flag would be a form of surrendering in their mind."

Because either NBC didn't want to show a national television audience an event where the controversial flag was being displayed so freely, or event organizers wanted to give spotters a clearer view of the speedway (attendees say both reasons were cited by security, though neither could be confirmed as a Darlington spokesman declined comment), security personnel instructed patrons to take down their flags whenever cars were on the track.

The sponsors have no say in fans doing something controversial.  They are concerned about their drivers that they pay millions of dollars to for sponsorship.  Stop moving the goalposts

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Hang 10

Hang 10 3,657

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Posted
1 minute ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

The sponsors have no say in fans doing something controversial.  They are concerned about their drivers that they pay millions of dollars to for sponsorship.  Stop moving the goalposts

I'm not sure he really wants to have a conversation about worst things that NFL fans do on Sundays. 

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GoBirds

GoBirds 10,194

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Posted
8 minutes ago, Sammy3469 said:

The confederate flags flying everywhere in the infield? :shrug: 

Still looking for proof that their fan base consists of a significantly larger portion of bigots? Big accusation to throw out there, we saw a couple confederate flags when the camera panned to the parking lot.....FACT! I just wondered if there was more proof before making such an accusation. 

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Sammy3469

Sammy3469 10,260

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Posted
Just now, GoBirds said:

Still looking for proof that their fan base consists of a significantly larger portion of bigots? Big accusation to throw out there, we saw a couple confederate flags when the camera panned to the parking lot.....FACT! I just wondered if there was more proof before making such an accusation. 

Well that's "a couple" of more than you would see at any other sporting event.

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GoBirds

GoBirds 10,194

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Posted
1 minute ago, jonessed said:

I would be pissed if I was an NFL owner.  Trump has put them in an unwinnable position that has no end in sight.  No matter what they do they are going to alienate a large segment of their fan base.  

It's a no win, the players have them by the balls and these protests are a disfunctional mess where no one is doing the same thing for the same reason except they hate the President who is asking them to respect the country and anthem. What do you do as an owner besides hope the players are ready to move forward soon. 

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Hang 10

Hang 10 3,657

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, jonessed said:

I would be pissed if I was an NFL owner.  Trump has put them in an unwinnable position that has no end in sight.  No matter what they do they are going to alienate a large segment of their fan base.  

They made their beds on this one. They play their games in stadiums paid for by American tax dollars and they allow their players to offend those same Americans. Trump just said what people on their couches have been saying for a year.

Edited by Hang 10
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Sammy3469

Sammy3469 10,260

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Posted
Just now, Hang 10 said:

They made their beds on this one. The play their games in stadiums paid for by American tax dollars and they allow their players to offend those same Americans. Trump just said what people on their couches have been saying for a year.

They don't allow anything...they collectively bargained that with the NFLPA.  Too bad you don't like workers exercising their rights.

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eoMMan

eoMMan 5,663

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Posted
47 minutes ago, Hang 10 said:

You guys may not like it but this is winner for Trump. So now you have democrats calling for anthem protests because they hate Trump. Think about that. Trump has pushed them into a corner now where they have to disrespect our country and the troops to protest Trump. And sorry, the majority of people agree with him .

No, it just makes him look like a clown. He's the President...not some B celebrity making funny comments on late night TV. Honestly, all this talk about respect or disrespect for the military, how about the disrespect Trump shows for the position of the President of the United States? Another example is how just last week he was tweeting about the low ratings on the Emmys. 

He's a clown and it's embarrassing he's our President.

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Hang 10

Hang 10 3,657

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Posted
1 minute ago, Sammy3469 said:

They don't allow anything...they collectively bargained that with the NFLPA.  Too bad you don't like workers exercising their rights.

Im not sure where it's written in the deal that says players can wipe their asses with the flag but if it's in there than shame on the NFL for not getting a better deal to protect their product.

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DaVinci

DaVinci 2,014

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Posted
10 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

Still looking for proof that their fan base consists of a significantly larger portion of bigots? Big accusation to throw out there, we saw a couple confederate flags when the camera panned to the parking lot.....FACT! I just wondered if there was more proof before making such an accusation. 

I’m going to Talladega in a couple of weeks. I'll conduct a scientific poll. :banned:

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Sammy3469

Sammy3469 10,260

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Hang 10 said:

Im not sure where it's written in the deal that says players can wipe their asses with the flag but if it's in there than shame on the NFL for not getting a better deal to protect their product.

Well considering the players are standing up for their American rights, they are doing anything but "wipe their asses with the flag".

 

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Apple Jack

Apple Jack 4,828

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Posted

Somebody wiped their ### with the flag? The anthem is dumb. The anthem at athletic events is really dumb. And the way people attach whatever meaning they want to the actions of others and a "patriotic" song with music stolen from a Brit and words written by a pro-slave ahole...sad! People should really try to be better and stop just going along with what was there when they arrived. TWOOPS!!!!

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jonessed

jonessed 3,213

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Sammy3469 said:

Well considering the players are standing up for their American rights, they are doing anything but "wipe their asses with the flag".

 

This has nothing to do with free speech.  There is no constitutional right to say or do whatever you want at work.

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T J

T J 641

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Sammy3469 said:

Well considering the players are standing up for their American rights, they are doing anything but "wipe their asses with the flag".

 

You seriously think that's what they're doing? I don't. Not in the least. 

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