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RB Ronald Jones, Cowboys (1 Viewer)

The Dude said:
Performance as a runner last week was blech.  He is not a must start - he has to prove it against a tough defense first.
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Great news! He has that chance this week.

I also think this discounts the 75 yards he had vs the 9ers in Week 1, but I get it, it was week 1.

I am forced to start him, but am not looking forward to the match up, and I don't trust Arians to keep feeding him the larger share of the ball. But there is opportunity here, and unquestionably to me RoJo is a much different (and better) back than he was last year.

 
While his performances to date can be best described as solid...he hasn’t had ‘the Week’...the 150/2 type performance where because you started him, that’s why you won.

Before the Arians proclamation, that opportunity was not there.  You bet on the fact that it could be.  That opportunity is here now...it’s up to RoJo to seize it.  

 
He looks really good most of the time but that fumble last week really was atrocious. He wasn’t even hit, was just switching hands. 

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Great news! He has that chance this week.

I also think this discounts the 75 yards he had vs the 9ers in Week 1, but I get it, it was week 1.

I am forced to start him, but am not looking forward to the match up, and I don't trust Arians to keep feeding him the larger share of the ball. But there is opportunity here, and unquestionably to me RoJo is a much different (and better) back than he was last year.
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I don't think it's great news if he is a possible flex starter.   I don't feel comfortable starting him much and against a real D, I doubt he can be started.   Tough D and possible back seat in the RBBC due to the fumble has the makings of little points from Jomes this week. 

 
TheDirtyWord said:
While his performances to date can be best described as solid...he hasn’t had ‘the Week’...the 150/2 type performance where because you started him, that’s why you won.

Before the Arians proclamation, that opportunity was not there.  You bet on the fact that it could be.  That opportunity is here now...it’s up to RoJo to seize it.  
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He has had all year to seize it with the carries he was getting -- and when Arians did finally give him a majority number of carries, he fumbled and leaned on Barber late in the game and on the winning drive.

Point being I have no idea what opportunity exists for RoJo -- as always, it's really fluid and not dependable.

DocHolliday said:
I don't think it's great news if he is a possible flex starter.   I don't feel comfortable starting him much and against a real D, I doubt he can be started.   Tough D and possible back seat in the RBBC due to the fumble has the makings of little points from Jomes this week. 
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The great news wasn't so much pointing to the fact that he would make for a flex opportunity this week, but more to answer the statement that he hasn't faced a top D yet. I'd argue he already did (and seemed to do well) in Week 1, and "great news" he has a chance to prove himself against that same tough D again this week.

I am forced to start him this week given lack of other better options. Not so great news for me -- and for anyone else debating him this week, given fluid variable situation and a tough run D.

 
davearm said:
It's not just Jones.  It's also the team.  TB has been a wasteland for FF RB production.  None of their RBs topped 100 fantasy points in 2017, 2016, 2014, and 2013, and several other years the leader was in the 120-140 range.  They've had two studly Doug Martin seasons in a decade, the rest anywhere from below average to awful.

2019 Jones 85 and counting, currently RB23

2018 Barber 132 (RB26)

2017 Barber 72 (RB52)

2016 Rodgers 78 (RB50)

2015 Martin 209 (RB3)

2014 Rainey 84 (RB41)

2013 Rainey 92 (RB39)

2012 Martin 265 (RB3)

2011 Blount 123 (RB29)

2010 Blount 138 (RB24)
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None of those teams were coached by Bruce Arians so they are kind of irrelevant.

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
He has had all year to seize it with the carries he was getting -- and when Arians did finally give him a majority number of carries, he fumbled and leaned on Barber late in the game and on the winning drive.

Point being I have no idea what opportunity exists for RoJo -- as always, it's really fluid and not dependable.
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Couple of things...

1) In his rookie year, RoJo played 90 snaps.  19 after week 9.  So his average of 25/game in year 2 is a huge leap.  And this is inclusive of a gradual ramp up strategy it looks like Arians has employed with RoJo.  The last two games since Arians made him the starter?  82.

2) In those two games; 39 touches, 188 YFS, 2 TD’s.  That doesn’t seem like he isn’t seizing the opportunity.  Yes, he did fumble.  Yes, Barber was in on the final drive.  It was also his first fumble.  And from Arians comments this week, seems like he’s still excited about RoJo.

We know what Barber is...or more so, what he isn’t - an ascendant talent.  To what degree is RoJo one, TBD...but Arians seems committed now to finding out.  Isn’t that the type of situation we look for?

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
He has had all year to seize it with the carries he was getting -- and when Arians did finally give him a majority number of carries, he fumbled and leaned on Barber late in the game and on the winning drive.

Point being I have no idea what opportunity exists for RoJo -- as always, it's really fluid and not dependable.

The great news wasn't so much pointing to the fact that he would make for a flex opportunity this week, but more to answer the statement that he hasn't faced a top D yet. I'd argue he already did (and seemed to do well) in Week 1, and "great news" he has a chance to prove himself against that same tough D again this week.

I am forced to start him this week given lack of other better options. Not so great news for me -- and for anyone else debating him this week, given fluid variable situation and a tough run D.
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It's the fumble and benching that concerns me and that's a shame since Jones had a nice game.   

 
Ministry of Pain said:
I get what you're saying, my point was I don't trust him. I woulda been better to let him go if I don't but then he has a nice game and you want to hold him.

My apologies for not saying explaining it a little more. 

Cheers Doc
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I knew exactly what you mean.  He's pretty much the same for me in a 10 team dynasty league, 31 man rosters with IDP.  I've got players who I don't trust enough to start, but I can't bring myself to cut to make roster space.  Guys like RoJo, Corey Davis, an injured Cam Newton, still holding out hope for Antonio Brown 2020, the unicorn (Preston Williams).  If you never start them, aren't they a liability more than an asset?  I guess I could trade him, but no one is going to give me the first round pick I used on him in the first place.

 
Chaka said:
None of those teams were coached by Bruce Arians so they are kind of irrelevant.
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I knew that was coming.

Funny thing is, the trend spans multiple coaching regimes (5 in fact, since 2010), multiple player groups along the LOS and at the skill positions, multiple front offices. 

Maybe they all sucked and Arians is the savior.  It's a theory anyway.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
I get what you're saying, my point was I don't trust him. I woulda been better to let him go if I don't but then he has a nice game and you want to hold him.

My apologies for not saying explaining it a little more. 

Cheers Doc
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You are fortunate not to have to make a decision with Jones.   Bye weeks and injuries can make this time of the season for many of us.   In short bench leagues, Jones still has value.   Who are your RBs?  You must be pretty loaded.  

 
TheDirtyWord said:
We know what Barber is...or more so, what he isn’t - an ascendant talent.  To what degree is RoJo one, TBD...but Arians seems committed now to finding out.  Isn’t that the type of situation we look for?
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DocHolliday said:
It's the fumble and benching that concerns me and that's a shame since Jones had a nice game.   
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Ministry of Pain said:
I get what you're saying, my point was I don't trust him.
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Kind of all sums up the point I was trying to make (apologies if it wasn't clear).

  • RoJo is absolutely in the theoretically ideal situation we look for :


    looks much better than he did last year
  • demonstrably better than Barber given comparable workload (103/410/4 with 4YPC and 45.6 YPG and another 19 targets/16/201 in the air for RoJo  vs 94/320/4 and 3.4 YPC/35.6 YPG with 13/8/37 receiving for Barber)
  • Bruce finally saying he deserves more time and committing to him early in the game

[*]Problem is that in the game where Arians finally followed through with committing to RoJo as a starter, he fumbled and Arians pretty much benched him for Barber for the rest of the game and when it mattered most -- in the game-winning drive.

  • Barber: 11/43/1 and 1/1/4 receiving
  • RoJo: 11/29/1 and 8/8/77 receiving

[*]Given the two bullets above, I don't trust what's going to happen or how much we can depend on RoJo -- despite the great receiving work in the last game.

  • I don't trust Arians not to rebalance the load or change direction with who he gives starter carries to
  • I have lost a little trust in RoJo -- especially this weekend against a really tough run D

TB has what looks to me a tough schedule -- NO (one of the best run Ds), ATL (surprisingly 6th overall in YPG allowed to RBs, JAX (up and down run D but can play stout), IND (8th fewest fantasy PPG to RBs), an easy one v DET, then HOU (no rushing TDs allowed and only 1 RB >44 yards since WK5).

A lot of reason why it's hard to trust RoJo going forward.

I desperately wish I could. The one hope is that he retains being a solid target for passes in PPR.

 
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Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Kind of all sums up the point I was trying to make (apologies if it wasn't clear).

  • RoJo is absolutely in the theoretically ideal situation we look for :


    looks much better than he did last year
  • demonstrably better than Barber given comparable workload (103/410/4 with 4YPC and 45.6 YPG and another 19 targets/16/201 in the air for RoJo  vs 94/320/4 and 3.4 YPC/35.6 YPG with 13/8/37 receiving for Barber)
  • Bruce finally saying he deserves more time and committing to him early in the game

[*]Problem is that in the game where Arians finally followed through with committing to RoJo as a starter, he fumbled and Arians pretty much benched him for Barber for the rest of the game and when it mattered most -- in the game-winning drive.

  • Barber: 11/43/1 and 1/1/4 receiving
  • RoJo: 11/29/1 and 8/8/77 receiving

[*]Given the two bullets above, I don't trust what's going to happen or how much we can depend on RoJo -- despite the great receiving work in the last game.

  • I don't trust Arians not to rebalance the load or change direction with who he gives starter carries to
  • I have lost a little trust in RoJo -- especially this weekend against a really tough run D

TB has what looks to me a tough schedule -- NO (one of the best run Ds), ATL (surprisingly 6th overall in YPG allowed to RBs, JAX (up and down run D but can play stout), IND (8th fewest fantasy PPG to RBs), an easy one v DET, then HOU (no rushing TDs allowed and only 1 RB >44 yards since WK5).

A lot of reason why it's hard to trust RoJo going forward.

I desperately wish I could. The one hope is that he retains being a solid target for passes in PPR.
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Good post. I was coming here to eat some crow on how hard I've been on him. I dont think we will know for sure until next year

 
davearm said:
I knew that was coming.

Funny thing is, the trend spans multiple coaching regimes (5 in fact, since 2010), multiple player groups along the LOS and at the skill positions, multiple front offices. 

Maybe they all sucked and Arians is the savior.  It's a theory anyway.
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And I addressed that as well. How many players are on the team from 2016 let alone 2010?

You can't make a single valid argument that poor fantasy RB performance is institutional.

 
Chaka said:
You can't make a single valid argument that poor fantasy RB performance is institutional.
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I tend to agree but it's an interesting question @davearm poses on how much the FO/GM/scouting staff impacts personnel trends and thus positional performance over time -- longer than, say, any HC or two's tenure.

On the other side of the coin and more towards your point, @Chaka, extending the timeframe just a little earlier than 2010 puts backs like Cadillac Williams and Warrick Dunn in the conversation -- I don't have stats but I would bet they are ranked more towards the Muscle Hamster's side of the spectrum than Rodgers.'

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
I tend to agree but it's an interesting question @davearm poses on how much the FO/GM/scouting staff impacts personnel trends and thus positional performance over time -- longer than, say, any HC or two's tenure.

On the other side of the coin and more towards your point, @Chaka, extending the timeframe just a little earlier than 2010 puts backs like Cadillac Williams and Warrick Dunn in the conversation -- I don't have stats but I would bet they are ranked more towards the Muscle Hamster's side of the spectrum than Rodgers.'
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Yeah, sure. Maybe. 

Anyone want to do a breakdown on the turnover in FO/GM/scouting for the TB Buccaneers since 2010?

And I know you weren't trying to be adversarial, and neither am I but the more layers deep you go looking for a correlation the more likely you are going to find Pi.

 
Chaka said:
And I addressed that as well. How many players are on the team from 2016 let alone 2010?

You can't make a single valid argument that poor fantasy RB performance is institutional.
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You're making my point for me.  The players have turned over (as well as coaches and FO staff), yet the trend continues.

 
davearm said:
You're making my point for me.  The players have turned over (as well as coaches and FO staff), yet the trend continues.
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No, I'm not. My point is that with all the turnover, at all levels of the organization, there is no valid argument for an institutional cause for the lack of production. 

ETA: This isn't Washington where you can point to Snyder as a meddlesome owner or the inexplicable retention of Bruce Allen running the show. The Glazer's have, seemingly been hands-off and I don't know how many GM's, let alone scouts have turned over since 2010.

 
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Ronald Jones rushed four times for 13 yards, tacking on two catches for another receiving yard in Tampa Bay's Week 11 loss to the Saints.

The good news is he out-touched Peyton Barber 6-2 and led the Bucs with four (lol) carries. Down 20-0 with 6:42 remaining in the second quarter, Tampa Bay foreseeably abandoned the run entirely and leaned on Cameron Brate (10/73) and Mike Evans (4/71) for the rest of play. Unfortunately for those who roster Jones, it was Barber who happened to be in on the goal line for Jameis Winston's six-yard dump off into the end zone. Dare Ogunbowale was also stuffed on the one-yard line while the team was in hurry-up late in the fourth quarter. Jones is still the back to roster among the three, but his inconsistent usage in the passing-game keep him locked as an RB3/4 in Week 12 against the Falcons.
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Ronald Jones rushed six times for eight yards and wasn't targeted in the passing game in the Bucs' Week 13 win over the Jaguars.

Jones got the first couple carries for the Bucs, but Peyton Barber then capped a first-quarter drive with an explosive 15-yard touchdown run. There was nothing else explosive about Barber's day, but he had the "hot hand" after that score and was fed the ball relentlessly as the Bucs protected a 25-point lead. Barber finished with 17-44-2 on the ground and a two-point conversion while Jones watched from the sideline. Jones is impossible to trust headed into a Week 14 date with the Colts.
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From the presser:

“Peyton had the hot hand... RoJo missed a blitz pick up and that’s it, you don’t get to play anymore.”

I hate Arians.

 
As a person who got rooked by the match up and also the fact this guy had hit double digits multiple times this year and was trending upwards...but this is why you don't want these guys on your roster because when he misses it's a complete hole on your roster and on a pivotal week for many trying to make the playoffs or perhaps even Round 1-2 for some leagues, this guy evaporates completely. 

Today should be a huge art of his 2019 season or discussion when folks start pimping this guy in the off season. I think the Bucs would b fools to bring this guy back as a potential RB1, they must go out and solidify their running game and OL as it pertains to the Run, until they can get that ironed out, it's only going to make Winston worse. I believe if he had a true RB1, a Top6 Level NFL RB behind him it could have helped immensely and it just never really happened. 

When you measure him in the 20-30 range at RB today, all the WRs in the 25-50 range, this guy need nothing in terms of Flex today. If you had to start him as your RB2, I truly feel bad for you however he was a juicy Flex option and duped a lot of folks today into trying to go with him, shame on us. 

And that brings up another calling card for him which is you can never trust him so even when he has B2B 15 and 16 pt weeks you try and start him and get the 3 point and under performance and he rides your bench the rest of the year until a bye week hits, that's about all you can hope for with him, bye week filler material. 

 
Why the Bucs benched Ronald Jones

Excerpt:

JACKSONVILLE — Facing a Jaguars defense that allowed more than 200 rushing yards in each of its previous three games, Bucs running back Ronald Jones had his best opportunity for a big day on the ground.

But midway into the third quarter, Jones was benched, his carries taken by Peyton Barber.

And after the Bucs’ 28-11 win over the Jaguars Sunday, coach Bruce Arians said he pulled Jones for missing a blitz pickup.

“Peyton had the hot hand,” Arians said. “He was out there making plays and he did a better job in the blitz pickup. RoJo missed a blitz pickup and that’s it. You don’t need to play no play no more. It’s that simple.”

Jones logged just eight yards on six carries. He didn’t have a touch after the opening drive of the second half. That drive ended with Jones missing a blitzing cornerback D.J. Hayden on first down at the Jacksonville 33.

Hayden couldn’t wrap up quarterback Jameis Winston, but he safety Andrew Wingard to force a strip sack from the opposite side for the Bucs only turnover.

Barber led the Bucs in rushing with 44 yards on 17 carries. Take away his 15-yard touchdown run in the first quarter and Barber averaged just 1.8 yards a carry. The Bucs had just 74 yards rushing on the day. Barber hadn’t had more than 11 carries in any of the last eight games as Jones emerged as the team’s primary rusher.
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Buccaneers coach Bruce Arians said Ronald Jones was benched for a pass-protection error in Week 13 against the Jaguars.

"RoJo missed a blitz pickup and that's it,'' coach Arians said. "You don't get to play no more.'' Jones got the start and played for the entire first quarter but was promptly benched and out-touched by Peyton Barber 17 to 6 the rest of the way following his whiffed assignment. Jones didn't even return to the field for Tampa Bay's two-point try in the fourth quarter. Even if he were allowed back into their starting lineup against the Colts, Jones (and Barber, for that matter) obviously can't be trusted for fantasy unless one or the other misses time.

SOURCE: Rick Stroud on Twitter

Dec 3, 2019, 11:21 AM ET
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Contrarian thinking on Jones II - perhaps Arians tactics will light a fire under his ### and he comes alive again in week 14, or not lol?

A sneaky Flex play or simply a hold, or done?

 
Team Smokin' said:
Contrarian thinking on Jones II - perhaps Arians tactics will light a fire under his ### and he comes alive again in week 14, or not lol?

A sneaky Flex play or simply a hold, or done?
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How could you have any confidence starting him. The potential reward is not great enough to counter the tremendous risk.

 
lod001 said:
Jones is a hold, wait for arians to go away. He's a clown.
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That's the question, is Arians going away? I feel like hes going to have a long leash, especially if they go with a young qb next year to replace Winston.

 
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Wise Old Owl said:
That's the question, is Arians going away? I feel like hes going to have a long leash, especially if they go with a young qb next year to replace Winston.
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Yeah, it's unfortunate for Jones owners that this clown arrived. He's very unhealthy however and he could easily leave on his own again. Winston should be making him age in dog years.

 
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It's a shame as RoJo really progressed this year.

And have zero doubt he'll have another game or two ROS where he goes off. 

But I can't see how I could ever be confident starting him in any game going forward. Touches were already variable with Arians not committing when RoJo was solid, and if he benches players for a single mistake, that just ups the risk.

Dropped Rojo for a lotto/cuff -- Jones may help another team, but I'm honestly OK with that as I can't see any situation where I would trust having him in my lineup.

 
Buccaneers coach Bruce Arians said Ronald Jones is "still the starter."

We don't believe it. Jones was benched in the first quarter of Sunday's win over the Jaguars for missing a blitz pickup mid-game, paving the way for Peyton Barber to rush for 17/44/2 off the bench. It's always possible Jones starts and handles a bulk of the work over Barber, but it isn't worth finding out in the first round of the fantasy playoffs. Jones lacked explosiveness (3.56 YPA) on 11.3 carries per game in his four previous starts, anyhow. The Bucs' backfield is clearly one to avoid barring an injury.

SOURCE: Scott Smith on Twitter

Dec 4, 2019, 3:33 PM ET
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Winston throws five picks in a game? Sure, keep zinging 50 times per week.

Jones misses one block? GET HIM!!!!!

 
"Jones still the starter," Arians.

What exactly does this mean? I mean Arians took the Belichick benching for a fumble to an extreme. The whole world knows now. I just wonder what happens this week? Arians calls his number, gets him a TD and 75 yards and all is well again?

 
Team Smokin' said:
"Jones still the starter," Arians.

What exactly does this mean? I mean Arians took the Belichick benching for a fumble to an extreme. The whole world knows now. I just wonder what happens this week? Arians calls his number, gets him a TD and 75 yards and all is well again?
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I lost by 5 points last week.  Jones and Lockett killed me.   I have faith that Lockett will get targets moving forward.   I do not trust Jones and he is getting cut on waivers today.   I can't make any sense of the Jones and Barber RBBC.   

 
DocHolliday said:
I lost by 5 points last week.  Jones and Lockett killed me.   I have faith that Lockett will get targets moving forward.   I do not trust Jones and he is getting cut on waivers today.   I can't make any sense of the Jones and Barber RBBC.   
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OUCH! I have Lockett in another league and still got the W. Playing him again this week. He's been great! Beat my expectations as a WR #2 going in. I am tempering projections this week just like every other "expert." Playing against A Robinson this week. Let's go, Tyler!

Jones II sits in another league, but my options are weaning with a bunch of RB #3's to choose from: Michel, Scarbrough, Jones II, and Laird plucked this week. Traded away David Johnson with Ingram to receive Evans and Sony. Lost K Johnson early. Team is limping home as the #3 seed. Probably gonna start Michel and Laird this week - yikes! Thought Jones II would be a RB #2. Lost last week to drop from #2 to #3 seed because of him, I mean Arians and his missed assignment.

 
Team Smokin' said:
OUCH! I have Lockett in another league and still got the W. Playing him again this week. He's been great! Beat my expectations as a WR #2 going in. I am tempering projections this week just like every other "expert." Playing against A Robinson this week. Let's go, Tyler!

Jones II sits in another league, but my options are weaning with a bunch of RB #3's to choose from: Michel, Scarbrough, Jones II, and Laird plucked this week. Traded away David Johnson with Ingram to receive Evans and Sony. Lost K Johnson early. Team is limping home as the #3 seed. Probably gonna start Michel and Laird this week - yikes! Thought Jones II would be a RB #2. Lost last week to drop from #2 to #3 seed because of him, I mean Arians and his missed assignment.
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I'm sticking with Lockett as well.  I dropped Jones for Guice this week but am not starting him.  I wanted away from the TB mess.   Good luck.  

 
Ronald Jones rushed 11 times for 36 yards in the Buccaneers' Week 14 win over the Colts, adding four receptions for 23 additional yards.

Jones drew the start after getting benched in Week 13. Still, Peyton Barber continued to get plenty of work on early downs, and Dare Ogunbowale once again served as the offense’s pass-down RB. Jones has been the Buccaneers’ best RB for the majority of the season, but coach Bruce Arians continues to utilize an evenly split three-back committee. He’s a low-end RB3 at best ahead of the team’s Week 15 matchup against the Lions.
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Ronald Jones rushed 14 times for 77 yards and a touchdown, additionally collecting 3-of-4 targets for 32 yards in Tampa Bay's Week 16 loss to the Texans.

Peyton Barber (5/13) didn't touch the ball for nearly two full quarters following his costly fumble on the team's fifth possession. Jones still fought through the teeth of Houston's front-seven for bulk gains including a 49-yard run that was registered as the team's longest since Doug Martin rattled off a 56-yard scamper against the Colts in 2015. Jones also recorded a 23-yard catch with the Bucs down a single score and dropped another screen pass that would have gone for a chunk. It's impossible to project this backfield weekly, but Jones' consistency at least afforded him touches in this one. Maybe coach Bruce Arians allows him to build off this performance for the Bucs' regular season finale against the Falcons next week.
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Can’t say I’m upset with this performance.  I was forced to start him with Cook out and Mattison questionable.  It was between him and Kerryon just back from IR.  Glad I went with Jones on this one. 

 
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