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2018 Elections Thread

squistion

By squistion,
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Stuart Ullman

Stuart Ullman 840

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, toshiba said:

So you talk in hyperbole and I talk in facts and numbers and you go stomping out of the room?  That is about why I expect from most of the Trump supporters I have encountered.

Please quote examples of my hyperbole in the short exchange we've had. Thanks in advance.

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Plorfu

Just got back from a polling place with my LD's State Senate candidate. We're a traditionally red Arizona district with two insanely terrible Republican incumbents and a fairly sane Senate Republican

Bruce Dickinson

I helped get a lesbian Native American elected to Congress.  In Kansas.   And helped prevent Kris Kobach from being in charge of an entire state.   How was your autumn?

Bruce Dickinson

Tonight, Ann Coulter tweeted "Kansas is dead to me".   But cut her some slack.  She's been pissed off at us ever since we dropped a house on her sister.  

TobiasFunke

TobiasFunke 29,546

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Stuart Ullman said:

My father, brother, and I have never voted before. The first time we ever voted was for President Donald Trump in 2016. Fast forward 2-years later and this is the first time we are voting in mid-term elections. We are all voting Republican down the ticket.

There are more like us. Be afraid.

I appreciate the honesty. I think most Trump supporters are motivated in large part by a shared desire to create enemies and then make them miserable, but you come right out and say it. 

 

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Stuart Ullman

Stuart Ullman 840

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Just now, TobiasFunke said:

I appreciate the honesty. I think most Trump supporters are motivated in large part by a shared desire to create enemies and then make them miserable, but you come right out and say it. 

 

I hare no desire to create enemies. Isn't this like sports? My team is going to beat your team in November. Go Republicans!

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Stuart Ullman

Stuart Ullman 840

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2 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

Mmm hmm

I promise you, Trump supporters don't rejoice in cruelty. We want a common sense President who's going to rebuild the economy, the military, and add some respect back to our nation. Those things are going to benefit everyone regardless of race or creed.

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TobiasFunke

TobiasFunke 29,546

Posted
Posted
Just now, Stuart Ullman said:

Apparently you can see what's in my heart and read my mind. Quick, what did I have for lunch?

No, but I can read your words and understand what they mean. When you say "be afraid," when you troll, when you treat politics like sports and nothing more, you are showing very clearly that you are more concerned with your side winning and the other side suffering then in doing what's best for Americans. It fits with everything we've seen from Trump and his supporters for three straight years now.

When conservatives were super mad during the Obama administration, very few people considered the anger a positive thing.  Most of us would have preferred bipartisan efforts to solve our problems, and regretted that people were so angry about ARRA and Obamacare and gay marriage and DACA and the various other things that enraged conservatives. We were happy that those measures existed because we believed they were in the country's best interests, but I heard very few people taking pleasure in the anger and misery of their fellow Americans. I'm sure there were some, but it wasn't a main feature and was rarely discussed.

In the case of Trump however, and it seems in your case as well, the anger and misery of your fellow Americans is a feature of the movement, perhaps its main feature. It was the case during the campaign- how many posts asking for explanations of Trump support mentioned "making liberals mad"- and it's the case today, as your posts show.  I think it's absurd to argue otherwise. I could find you countless examples  of it from the past week alone.

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TobiasFunke

TobiasFunke 29,546

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8 minutes ago, Stuart Ullman said:

I promise you, Trump supporters don't rejoice in cruelty. We want a common sense President who's going to rebuild the economy, the military, and add some respect back to our nation. Those things are going to benefit everyone regardless of race or creed.

You can't erase three years with three sentences. The only way Trump supporters can convince us they don't rejoice in cruelty is to stop rejoicing in cruelty. Over half the country is angry and miserable. If you think they shouldn't be, you can calmly and rationally explain to them why they shouldn't be. Or you can order "liberal tears" mugs, cheer cruel insults and divisive rhetoric, and tell them to "be afraid" of elections.

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Stuart Ullman

Stuart Ullman 840

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1 minute ago, TobiasFunke said:

No, but I can read your words and understand what they mean. When you say "be afraid," when you troll, when you treat politics like sports and nothing more, you are showing very clearly that you are more concerned with your side winning and the other side suffering then in doing what's best for Americans. It fits with everything we've seen from Trump and his supporters for three straight years now.

When conservatives were super mad during the Obama administration, very few people considered the anger a positive thing.  Most of us would have preferred bipartisan efforts to solve our problems, and regretted that people were so angry about ARRA and Obamacare and gay marriage and DACA and the various other things that enraged conservatives. We were happy that those measures existed because we believed they were in the country's best interests, but I heard very few people taking pleasure in the anger and misery of their fellow Americans. I'm sure there were some, but it wasn't a main feature and was rarely discussed.

In the case of Trump however, and it seems in your case as well, the anger and misery of your fellow Americans is a feature of the movement, perhaps its main feature. It was the case during the campaign- how many posts asking for explanations of Trump support mentioned "making liberals mad"- and it's the case today, as your posts show.  I think it's absurd to argue otherwise. I could find you countless examples  of it from the past week alone.

I appreciate the time you took to write out this post. It's clearly well thought out and time was put into it. I think part of the pickle we've found ourselves in is that each side is the perfect yin to the other's yang. When I see those attack Trump and denigrate an entire group of people over their political affiliation, I immediately want to defend my side of the aisle. "You're just mad because XYZ". In a sense, both sides bait each other into the behavior that the other complains about.

I apologize for my comments. In no way would they lead to anything constructive. I will do my best to be a better person going forward. I appreciate you taking the time to relay your thoughts in a respectful manner and help me continue to grow as a person and learn to navigate this touchy political environment.

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TobiasFunke

TobiasFunke 29,546

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This is pretty hilarious, from Mitch McConnell:

"Sen. Mitch McConnell is warning Democrats to think carefully about "presidential harassment" if they win majority of the House. The Kentucky Republican told AP that threats to investigate Trump's finances and businesses would "help the president get re-elected" in 2020."

If he actually thought that, he obviously wouldn't say it.  He'd just let the Dems dig their own grave.

I'm not sure what he's going for here- probably trying to motivating his base for the upcoming midterms by highlighting the threat of investigations.  But acting like he's got the Dems' best interests in mind here is transparent and silly.

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Hilts

Hilts 4,297

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47 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

This is pretty hilarious, from Mitch McConnell:

"Sen. Mitch McConnell is warning Democrats to think carefully about "presidential harassment" if they win majority of the House. The Kentucky Republican told AP that threats to investigate Trump's finances and businesses would "help the president get re-elected" in 2020."

If he actually thought that, he obviously wouldn't say it.  He'd just let the Dems dig their own grave.

I'm not sure what he's going for here- probably trying to motivating his base for the upcoming midterms by highlighting the threat of investigations.  But acting like he's got the Dems' best interests in mind here is transparent and silly.

We need to get some nice guy McConnell memes going. 

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-fish-

-fish- 13,791

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, TobiasFunke said:

This is pretty hilarious, from Mitch McConnell:

"Sen. Mitch McConnell is warning Democrats to think carefully about "presidential harassment" if they win majority of the House. The Kentucky Republican told AP that threats to investigate Trump's finances and businesses would "help the president get re-elected" in 2020."

If he actually thought that, he obviously wouldn't say it.  He'd just let the Dems dig their own grave.

I'm not sure what he's going for here- probably trying to motivating his base for the upcoming midterms by highlighting the threat of investigations.  But acting like he's got the Dems' best interests in mind here is transparent and silly.

I can't remember where I saw it, but apparently McConnell met with White House leadership recently to develop a strategy for the expected flood of subpoenas that that they expect if the Democrats take the House.   Unless they can figure out something , they know that they're going to be spending the next two years responding to document subpoenas 24/7.

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

Posted
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3 hours ago, TobiasFunke said:

This is pretty hilarious, from Mitch McConnell:

"Sen. Mitch McConnell is warning Democrats to think carefully about "presidential harassment" if they win majority of the House. The Kentucky Republican told AP that threats to investigate Trump's finances and businesses would "help the president get re-elected" in 2020."

If he actually thought that, he obviously wouldn't say it.  He'd just let the Dems dig their own grave.

I'm not sure what he's going for here- probably trying to motivating his base for the upcoming midterms by highlighting the threat of investigations.  But acting like he's got the Dems' best interests in mind here is transparent and silly.

No it's a threat and he expects the current spineless Democratic leadership to cave as usual. Hopefully they don't but if history is any indicator they will.

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TobiasFunke

TobiasFunke 29,546

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1 minute ago, NCCommish said:

No it's a threat and he expects the current spineless Democratic leadership to cave as usual. Hopefully they don't but if history is any indicator they will.

It's not a threat, because McConnell is in no position to deliver on it one way or another. He's gonna endorse Trump and try to get him re-elected no matter what the Dems do if they take the House. And if he genuinely believed what he was saying he'd keep it to himself so that the Dems would actually go ahead and do the thing he's absurdly saying would harm their own interests. It makes no sense as a threat. It doesn't make much more sense as anything else either, but it's funny.

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roadkill1292

roadkill1292 10,465

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It's hard for me to envision fence-sitters and luke warm Repubs rallying to Donald's banner if and when Mueller drops a report detailing Don's evasion of a billion dollars in taxes. What does Turtle Man think -- that everybody in the crazy base is gonna vote twice?

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toshiba

toshiba 2,131

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Just now, roadkill1292 said:

It's hard for me to envision fence-sitters and luke warm Repubs rallying to Donald's banner if and when Mueller drops a report detailing Don's evasion of a billion dollars in taxes. What does Turtle Man think -- that everybody in the crazy base is gonna vote twice?

Trump supporters don't care!  Why can't you understand this?

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

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30 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

It's not a threat, because McConnell is in no position to deliver on it one way or another. He's gonna endorse Trump and try to get him re-elected no matter what the Dems do if they take the House. And if he genuinely believed what he was saying he'd keep it to himself so that the Dems would actually go ahead and do the thing he's absurdly saying would harm their own interests. It makes no sense as a threat. It doesn't make much more sense as anything else either, but it's funny.

Of course it's a toothless threat but that has worked before. 

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Jackstraw

Jackstraw 4,381

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Posted

These people have no shame. Voter suppression is about the most Un-American thing I can think of. They are jerking people off the voting roles and freezing applications and not even telling the voters in question. They have suppressed about 2% of the total vote on the 2014 race in a tight race. ALL I NEED IS AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE. 

Georgia's Secretary of State Brian Kemp (now running for Gov) has purged voter rolls & is now freezing tens thousands of voter registration forms through "exact match" tests. 70% of the frozen registrations are from black applicants, the AP reports.

https://www.wabe.org/voting-rights-become-a-flashpoint-in-georgia-governors-race/

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T J

T J 640

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4 hours ago, toshiba said:

Trump supporters don't care!  Why can't you understand this?

I think the issue has more to do with disagreement with liberal stances so if Trump's it, that's better than the alternative regardless what his baggage is or how big a tool he is. Truly do not support liberal stances on enough things so I did and would vote Trump. Would much prefer a similar, but far less ridiculous president but like I said - if it's Trump I'll take that over the alternative.

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JIslander

JIslander 2,811

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44 minutes ago, T J said:

I think the issue has more to do with disagreement with liberal stances so if Trump's it, that's better than the alternative regardless what his baggage is or how big a tool he is. Truly do not support liberal stances on enough things so I did and would vote Trump. Would much prefer a similar, but far less ridiculous president but like I said - if it's Trump I'll take that over the alternative.

I get it. I mean tax evasion, sexual assault, Russian money and mobs wont do it, its gonna take that shooting of someone, amirite?

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

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59 minutes ago, T J said:

I think the issue has more to do with disagreement with liberal stances so if Trump's it, that's better than the alternative regardless what his baggage is or how big a tool he is. Truly do not support liberal stances on enough things so I did and would vote Trump. Would much prefer a similar, but far less ridiculous president but like I said - if it's Trump I'll take that over the alternative.

And what are these alternatives you are so afraid of that you'd vote for him instead

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T J

T J 640

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1 hour ago, NCCommish said:

And what are these alternatives you are so afraid of that you'd vote for him instead

Afraid of? Can’t it just be that I’m one of the deplorables and much prefer a Trump like agenda? It’s really that simple. 

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

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11 minutes ago, T J said:

 Doesn’t matter. Nobody’s mind changes on here. 

Not true. I have been presented with facts that stood in stark contrast to my opinion and then formed a more fact based opinion on more than one subject here. Minds don't change when you have nothing but empty rhetoric to offer.

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T J

T J 640

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7 minutes ago, NCCommish said:

Not true. I have been presented with facts that stood in stark contrast to my opinion and then formed a more fact based opinion on more than one subject here. Minds don't change when you have nothing but empty rhetoric to offer.

Where are facts going to influence a person’s take on abortion? Race? Any number of topics. You talk about empty rhetoric as if it’s a “gotcha”. Don’t work that way holmes. Never has and it never will.  

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timschochet

timschochet 33,373

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Posted
40 minutes ago, badmojo1006 said:

Idaho Republican Lt. Governor wants murder charges brought against women who have abortions

So much for pro-life

Isn’t this a logical conclusion for those who consider abortion murder? I’ve always thought so. 

If you regard abortion as undesirable death, then it’s okay simply to call for it to be illegal. But once you start calling abortion murder, then logically you should be in favor of punishments similar to other murders: Long imprisonment or life imprisonment or the death penalty. 

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

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1 hour ago, T J said:

Where are facts going to influence a person’s take on abortion? Race? Any number of topics. You talk about empty rhetoric as if it’s a “gotcha”. Don’t work that way holmes. Never has and it never will.  

Well there are many facts on both subjects.  And I said empty rhetoric not as a gotcha but more as what often gets offered instead of you know facts.

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

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57 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Isn’t this a logical conclusion for those who consider abortion murder? I’ve always thought so. 

If you regard abortion as undesirable death, then it’s okay simply to call for it to be illegal. But once you start calling abortion murder, then logically you should be in favor of punishments similar to other murders: Long imprisonment or life imprisonment or the death penalty. 

If he wants the death penalty then that isnt very prolife. Further even when the bible mentions abortion it isnt classified as murder. 

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timschochet

timschochet 33,373

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1 minute ago, NCCommish said:

If he wants the death penalty then that isnt very prolife. Further even when the bible mentions abortion it isnt classified as murder. 

Well, no “pro-life” person should be for the death penalty under any circumstances, right? Isn’t that also a contradiction? 

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NCCommish

NCCommish 7,522

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Posted
2 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Well, no “pro-life” person should be for the death penalty under any circumstances, right? Isn’t that also a contradiction? 

Well isn't a contradiction that prolifers vote for people who pursue policies against feeding the hungry,  housing the homeless and healing the sick?

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