Dynasty & Redraft: RB Sony Michel, Patriots

[voiceofunreason 1,028]

52 minutes ago, 32 Counter Pass said:

Agree. Steelers are another good fit. 

Yuk. Worst scenario. Good chance they keep Bell and then Ben is getting old fast. By the time he takes over the Steelers might be a completely different team.

Edited January 10, 2018 by voiceofunreason

[JohnnyU 3,934]

3 hours ago, Ack88 said:

Michel would be a perfect fit in New Orleans. That, from a pure talent lens, is where he would be great. Given that Kamara and Ingram are already there, this is exceedingly unlikely.

God I hope not.

[JohnnyU 3,934]

1 hour ago, 32 Counter Pass said:

Agree. Steelers are another good fit. 

OMG no.  From a fantasy perspective that is awful.

[Bfrahm3 224]

So just my 2 cents from what Ack88 said...he didn't say NO would be a good landing spot for him.

He more implied that if NO didn't have Kamara and or Ingram that how they run their offense would be the best fit for Michels talent/how he plays...so basically they would get the most out of him and he would have a high ceiling in there offensive style.

So for instance a team that will give him a good number of carries and use him as a main threat in the passing game (i.e. How NO used there RBs this year) would be great for Michel compared to maybe going to let's say Detroit, Baltimore or LA chargers where he would be in more of a committee

[Hankmoody 3,755]

5 hours ago, lod001 said:

Possibly depending on where they go.

Also, if I was RB weak and got that offer for 1.1, I would take it and grab 2 RBs. For every home run like Todd Gurley or Leveon Bell there are more swings and misses like Trent Richardson.

For the record, I have 1.3 and 1.4 and would not trade them for 1.1. 

He said 1.03 or 1.04 plus a WR, not both.  For me it would depend on the team, but I think I'd give 1.03 and 1.04 for 1.01.

[Zyphros 1,892]

I've only watched 2 games of his but something I noticed about him that put a bad taste in my mouth.  There were 2 occassions where the play wasn't blocked great and he ends up getting ankle tackled and he proceeds to get up and throw a hissy-fit complaining to the rest of the offense.  Not what I would want to see.  Some call it competitive fire, I call it being immature and a cry baby when things don't go his way.  

[32 Counter Pass 570]

2 hours ago, JohnnyU said:

OMG no.  From a fantasy perspective that is awful.

I should have added, assuming Bell doesn't resign.

[steelers1080 1,053]

16 hours ago, 32 Counter Pass said:

I should have added, assuming Bell doesn't resign.

Thought that was obvious. No way they draft a RB in the 1st or 2nd if they manage to resign Bell. A QB on the other hand...

[Faust 5,024]

Ask 5: Which draft prospect helped himself most in postseason?

[Faust 5,024]

2018 NFL Draft: Sam Darnold a playmaker in mold of Tony Romo

Excerpt:

Georgia RB Sony Michel

Player comp: Kareem Hunt

I was a big fan of Michel during the fall and he took his game to another level in the postseason. His balance, power and pass-catching skills remind me a lot of Hunt when he was coming out of Toledo last year. Hunt was a bargain for the Chiefs in Round 3, and due to the running back depth in this class, Michel could end up being an incredible value pick as well.

[Faust 5,024]

Walter Football's Charlie Campbell writes that Georgia RB Sony Michel is building momentum after a strong finish to his 2017 season.

Campbell says he spoke with a General Manager in need of a running back who doesn't believe that Michel will be available with their second-round pick. "Michel showed his big-play ability with speed to break off some long runs that led to some huge performances to help the Bulldogs make it to the National Championship," Campbell writes. It looks like Michel has a real chance of going in the first round, and Campbell believes he's likely to be gone within the first 45 picks.

Source: Walter Football 

Jan 22 - 4:23 PM

[voiceofunreason 1,028]

Reminds me of Felix Jones.

[Gandalf 520]

1 hour ago, voiceofunreason said:

Reminds me of Felix Jones.

The only difference is that Michel is a good RB. ?

[Faust 5,024]

Sony Michel has draft momentum after postseason surge

[Faust 5,024]

Who’s selected first in NFL draft, Chubb or Michel?

[menobrown 3,713]

2 hours ago, Gandalf said:

The only difference is that Michel is a good RB. ?

Felix Jones was tremendous until he was asked to no longer be a COP and be more of a feature/3 down back and the law of diminishing returns set in.  TJ Yeldon is similar to me in this way in that he looks the part of the 3 down/feature back when he's someone's backup or operating as the COP but when he's actually pressed into that role, of a feature type back,  it's to big for him. The more you ask, the less you get sometimes.

Since Sony was not the primary runner in college I can see this concern, I'd go so far as to label it his biggest concern, not that it will scare me off.

Edited January 23, 2018 by menobrown

[Pwingles 481]

12 hours ago, menobrown said:

Felix Jones was tremendous until he was asked to no longer be a COP and be more of a feature/3 down back and the law of diminishing returns set in.  TJ Yeldon is similar to me in this way in that he looks the part of the 3 down/feature back when he's someone's backup or operating as the COP but when he's actually pressed into that role, of a feature type back,  it's to big for him. The more you ask, the less you get sometimes.

Since Sony was not the primary runner in college I can see this concern, I'd go so far as to label it his biggest concern, not that it will scare me off.

It was more of a timeshare than people think, 758 carries vs 591, ~56% share

 

But I agree with some of the above, im thinking more Yeldon type of guy. Needs to be put in a situational type role

[Pipes 2,764]

Why Yeldon?  I see Michel filling a similar role as Kamara did.  I'm not predicting 1500 yards but I could see him putting up 1000 yards as a 1b option getting 10-15 touches a game.  Michel seems to have more burst and wiggle than Yeldon ever did imo.

[petekrum 369]

17 minutes ago, Pipes said:

Why Yeldon?  I see Michel filling a similar role as Kamara did.  I'm not predicting 1500 yards but I could see him putting up 1000 yards as a 1b option getting 10-15 touches a game.  Michel seems to have more burst and wiggle than Yeldon ever did imo.

Michel is vastly superior to Yeldon. I agree with you. 

[ComfortablyNumb 172]

The NFL is a copycat league. Which running game will other GM/Coaches attempt to copy the next few years?  I believe Michel projects as the next Kamara for a team with a decent bigger back - pretty similar to his last season at Georgia. He'll have much more value in PPR.

[Faust 5,024]

Daniel Jeremiah's top 50 prospects for 2018 NFL Draft

Excerpt:

Sony Michel, RB, Georgia

Rank: #28

Michel is one of my favorite players in this entire draft class. He has a perfect build for the position and runs with a nice blend of power, quickness and elusiveness. On inside runs, he's very loose/slithery and he runs with ideal pad level. He drops his shoulder on contact and generates space when none is available. He has enough juice to get to the perimeter, and while he lacks home-run speed, he's rarely caught from behind. In the passing game, he runs crisp routes and catches the ball smoothly. He's been very stout in pass protection. Overall, Michel reminds me a lot of Kareem Hunt and I think he's capable of making a similar impact at the next level.

[Faust 5,024]

Sony Michel NFL draft profile

2018 NFL Draft profile: Sony Michel brings speed, quickness and versatility to the Lions

[menobrown 3,713]

2 hours ago, Pipes said:

Why Yeldon?  I see Michel filling a similar role as Kamara did.  I'm not predicting 1500 yards but I could see him putting up 1000 yards as a 1b option getting 10-15 touches a game.  Michel seems to have more burst and wiggle than Yeldon ever did imo.

We don't know what Michel's role will be I'm simply talking about how they were used in college. The main issue with Kamara coming out was that he'd never had like more than 18 carries in a game. He landed in absolutely perfect landing spot to maximize his receiving ability and allow him to a fantasy beast without needing to push him to a higher carry total. Not all coaches know how to use their talent to their best of their ability.

 

1 hour ago, petekrum said:

Michel is vastly superior to Yeldon. I agree with you. 

You and pipes are taking this Yeldon comp wrong. I'm not comping the player so much as I'm comping how they were used in college and how that despite their frame and skill set it's not always a given they can actually handle being Bell/DJ type feature back.

I do like Michel's burst more myself but I would not consider him vastly superior, better but not vastly.  Yeldon looked outstanding in the two playoff games, that's a great role for him and if he was on a team like the Saints paired with Ingram or Kamara I think he'd look like a totally different player. But almost everytime he is asked to carry the load he wilts, this is the concern or question with Michel if he is asked to be that kind of RB.

 

[Concept Coop 1,749]

19 hours ago, voiceofunreason said:

Reminds me of Felix Jones.

When Felix cared, he was a really good football player.  I like this comp more than Hunt and and Kamara, personally. 

[Bfrahm3 224]

I like Michel as much as most of you guys but your gonna be disappointed if you think he's just gonna come in and perform like Kamara just because he has a couple similarities. It was like when we got all the great rookie WRs in 2014. The next couple years everyone thought the next batch of rookie WRs were gonna be able to do the same thing and instead we have like 3-4 in the last couple years that are actually high impact players. 

Can he be good, yes. Is he gonna come in and put up 1500 yards from scrimmage and a bunch of TDs just because a guy somewhat similar to him did it this year. Probably not

[JohnnyU 3,934]

24 minutes ago, Bfrahm3 said:

I like Michel as much as most of you guys but your gonna be disappointed if you think he's just gonna come in and perform like Kamara just because he has a couple similarities. It was like when we got all the great rookie WRs in 2014. The next couple years everyone thought the next batch of rookie WRs were gonna be able to do the same thing and instead we have like 3-4 in the last couple years that are actually high impact players. 

Can he be good, yes. Is he gonna come in and put up 1500 yards from scrimmage and a bunch of TDs just because a guy somewhat similar to him did it this year. Probably not

I agree with you that he probably won't come in and do what Kamara did, but he may be better than Kamara, especially as a runner.

[Pipes 2,764]

5 hours ago, Bfrahm3 said:

I like Michel as much as most of you guys but your gonna be disappointed if you think he's just gonna come in and perform like Kamara just because he has a couple similarities. It was like when we got all the great rookie WRs in 2014. The next couple years everyone thought the next batch of rookie WRs were gonna be able to do the same thing and instead we have like 3-4 in the last couple years that are actually high impact players. 

Can he be good, yes. Is he gonna come in and put up 1500 yards from scrimmage and a bunch of TDs just because a guy somewhat similar to him did it this year. Probably not

I brought up Kamara and specifically said he wouldn’t get 1500 yards.  Kamara had a record breaking season.  I think Michel will have a similar role as Kamara with 10-15 touches per game.  I don’t think anyone’s expecting Kamara numbers from him.

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

He's a beast, a legit NFL beast. 

Chubb, meh...

[Doctor Detroit 20,905]

On 1/22/2018 at 5:08 PM, voiceofunreason said:

Reminds me of Felix Jones.

[Concept Coop 1,749]

16 hours ago, Doctor Detroit said:

Mind expanding on this?  I really like the comp.  I even went back to watch some Arkansas clips to refresh my memory, and still liked it.  

FTR, I really like Michel and think he has a good shot to have a better career than Felix did.  But in terms of player strengths and play style, Felix might be the best comp I've seen thrown around for Michel.  

[Biabreakable 5,099]

I found 4 games of Michel on Draftbreakdown. Watched one of those games a few days ago and the other 3 games this afternoon.

If anyone has links to other games or cut ups of Michel I could watch. Ideally I would like to watch 10 games. I don't think 4 games is really enough.

I have a new high score for total points charted with 70 for Michel in his game against Kenucky. Previous high was 51

The play I would like to recommend people watch of Michel is at the 3:30 mark of the game against Georgia Tech. 

Sony Michel demonstrates vision, speed, ball security, acceleration, elusiveness, footwork, balance, pad level in that order on this play. 8 out of the 13 traits I am using on just this play.

I think I may need to add a new trait for this play called getting skinny in the hole or something like that. It didn't really come up watching Chubb, but maybe I just wasn't thinking about it at that time.

The blocking on this play is excellent, the defensive tackle gets sealed to the outside and there is a double team block on 61 that knocks him back. A llinemen is able to then block 40 and push him back, creating a very nice lane for Michel to run through. He times this play well and both hands are on the ball as he goes through the line, he is making himself a smaller target before he accelerates through the hole as the blocking clears it. He gets to top speed quickly defeating one defenders angle. He cuts back to the inside avoiding a tackle when near the side lie, keeping the ball alive. He makes the first defender miss, but some contact on his foot that he recovers from with good balance, landing on one foot and catching himself then transitioning to good pad level when he engages the second defender. 

Best run I have seen so far today. I think Chubb had some plays with 5 or 6 traits on the same play, but not 8.

While I do look at how a RB hits the hole each time, I am not sure if getting skinny deserves a separate category? It crosses over with pad level I think, being able to make yourself more compact in tight spaces, also presenting a smaller more difficult target.

I watched Michel's game against Kentucky and Michel running compact is something that stood out to me again on a few plays. Its something he does that I am not sure Chubb does as well.

Nick Chubb graded out with only 27 trait points in the game against Kentucky, Michel with 70.

In other games where I have watched both players

 

Auburn

Chubb 14

Michel 11

 

Notre Dame

Chubb 8

Michel 28

 

Georgia Tech

Chubb 37

Michel 46

 

[fruity pebbles 3,255]

His age gives me some pause. Older rookies really need to hit quickly or people are already talking about their age just as they’re hitting their stride. He’s 2 1/2 years older than Barkley and only 6 months younger than Gurley who’s been in the league 3 years already. Calvin Ridley is another older rookie. Both about the same age. Not a deal breaker obviously but something to think about.

Edited January 29, 2018 by fruity pebbles

[bicycle_seat_sniffer 5,109]

41 minutes ago, fruity pebbles said:

His age gives me some pause. Older rookies really need to hit quickly or people are already talking about their age just as they’re hitting their stride. He’s 2 1/2 years older than Barkley and only 6 months younger than Gurley who’s been in the league 3 years already. Calvin Ridley is another older rookie. Both about the same age. Not a deal breaker obviously but something to think about.

Sometimes you can over thing that. Kid looks legit and his mileage is low. Im guessing him being from haiti had something to do with his late college start.

[BigTex 859]

19 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Sometimes you can over thing that. Kid looks legit and his mileage is low. Im guessing him being from haiti had something to do with his late college start.

I could be wrong but he’s not from Haiti I believe just his father is from Haiti. His late age I believe has more to do with him bouncing around to different foster homes.

Tex

Edited January 29, 2018 by BigTex

[scott46984 58]

Watching this guy with interest.  following til draft

[ZWK 1,969]

6 hours ago, Biabreakable said:

I found 4 games of Michel on Draftbreakdown. Watched one of those games a few days ago and the other 3 games this afternoon.

If anyone has links to other games or cut ups of Michel I could watch. Ideally I would like to watch 10 games. I don't think 4 games is really enough.

I have a new high score for total points charted with 70 for Michel in his game against Kenucky. Previous high was 51

The play I would like to recommend people watch of Michel is at the 3:30 mark of the game against Georgia Tech. 

Sony Michel demonstrates vision, speed, ball security, acceleration, elusiveness, footwork, balance, pad level in that order on this play. 8 out of the 13 traits I am using on just this play.

I think I may need to add a new trait for this play called getting skinny in the hole or something like that. It didn't really come up watching Chubb, but maybe I just wasn't thinking about it at that time.

The blocking on this play is excellent, the defensive tackle gets sealed to the outside and there is a double team block on 61 that knocks him back. A llinemen is able to then block 40 and push him back, creating a very nice lane for Michel to run through. He times this play well and both hands are on the ball as he goes through the line, he is making himself a smaller target before he accelerates through the hole as the blocking clears it. He gets to top speed quickly defeating one defenders angle. He cuts back to the inside avoiding a tackle when near the side lie, keeping the ball alive. He makes the first defender miss, but some contact on his foot that he recovers from with good balance, landing on one foot and catching himself then transitioning to good pad level when he engages the second defender. 

Best run I have seen so far today. I think Chubb had some plays with 5 or 6 traits on the same play, but not 8.

While I do look at how a RB hits the hole each time, I am not sure if getting skinny deserves a separate category? It crosses over with pad level I think, being able to make yourself more compact in tight spaces, also presenting a smaller more difficult target.

I watched Michel's game against Kentucky and Michel running compact is something that stood out to me again on a few plays. Its something he does that I am not sure Chubb does as well.

Nick Chubb graded out with only 27 trait points in the game against Kentucky, Michel with 70.

In other games where I have watched both players

 

Auburn

Chubb 14

Michel 11

 

Notre Dame

Chubb 8

Michel 28

 

Georgia Tech

Chubb 37

Michel 46

 

That Michel run against Georgia Tech (here) looks to me like a pretty easy play for the RB. He gets through the hole untouched, mainly thanks to great blocking + misdirection + bad defense. Michel found the hole and got through it successfully, but I suspect that the majority of Combine RBs would manage to do that (it seems like a pretty easy initial read with the DT #90 immediately getting pinned to the outside by the RG). Once Michel makes it through the hole he has wide open field in front of him, with no LBs around and the DBs way downfield and moving in the wrong direction (thanks again to the misdirection and bad defense). It's hard to judge Michel's acceleration and speed since there aren't any defenders nearby to compare him to. When the DB #14 manages to cut off Michel (with another DB standing 5 yards farther downfield to help), Michel is able to pick up an extra 8 yards from there (by getting the first DB to mostly miss and then pushing/falling forward for a couple extra yards when the second DB gets to him), which seems slightly better than average for an RB in that situation.

[Biabreakable 5,099]

38 minutes ago, ZWK said:

That Michel run against Georgia Tech (here) looks to me like a pretty easy play for the RB. He gets through the hole untouched, mainly thanks to great blocking + misdirection + bad defense. Michel found the hole and got through it successfully, but I suspect that the majority of Combine RBs would manage to do that (it seems like a pretty easy initial read with the DT #90 immediately getting pinned to the outside by the RG). Once Michel makes it through the hole he has wide open field in front of him, with no LBs around and the DBs way downfield and moving in the wrong direction (thanks again to the misdirection and bad defense). It's hard to judge Michel's acceleration and speed since there aren't any defenders nearby to compare him to. When the DB #14 manages to cut off Michel (with another DB standing 5 yards farther downfield to help), Michel is able to pick up an extra 8 yards from there (by getting the first DB to mostly miss and then pushing/falling forward for a couple extra yards when the second DB gets to him), which seems slightly better than average for an RB in that situation.

I am still just experimenting with scoring or grading the players games this way.

I agree with you it is very well blocked play. I do think Michel times his burst well and hits full speed pretty quickly in the hole, which is why I give him credit for seeing it, then also speed, he clearly has speed. the defenders downfield are backtracking to make sure they don't miss the angle because of that speed, and acceleration, he gets to top speed right away. Then the elusive for the cut that makes the first defender miss, footwork and balance as he has to catch himself after the move to make the first defender miss, pad level for getting leverage on the last defender. If he had broken this tackle, or driven through it then I would credit him with burst and power, but he is still recovering from the side step cut back inside, that RB with less balance may have just fallen down on.

What a total score of just giving a + or - for whenever a player shows a trait is something that I am not sure what it means yet.

[Faust 5,024]

NFL.com Draft Prospect: SONY MICHEL (RB)

[Faust 5,024]

Georgia RB Sony Michel fumbles the ball every 54.6 times he touches the football, per a list compiled by Dane Brugler.

The average for a prospect is one fumble every 124.5 touches, so Michel's qualifies as a potential red flag. Other popular names who fit the "red flag" tier include Akrum Wadley (67.4) and Kalen Ballage (66.5). The opposite end of the spectrum includes Ronald Jones (207.7) and Saquon Barkley (193.3).

Source: NFL Draft Scout 

Feb 12 - 9:43 AM

[Faust 5,024]

NFL Network draft analyst Mike Mayock compares Georgia RB Sony Michel to Saints RB Alvin Kamara.

Mayock notes that Michel (5'11/208) has similar size to Kamara, and that both players have the ability to make tacklers miss with their shiftiness, but also run with a toughness. The only thing he questions about the comparison is whether or not he can be as effective as Kamara in the pass game. Kamara was a revelation in 2017; arguably the most impressive rookie in the NFL when you combine his impact in special teams, running the football and the pass game. If a team can get a player like that in Michel, that team will be jumping for joy for a long time.

Source: NFL.com 

Feb 17 - 8:33 PM

[Faust 5,024]

Rotoworld's Thor Nystrom believes that Georgia RB Sony Michel "will be a better pro than he was in college."

While Michel's quickness and burst through the hole are much ballyhooed, Nystrom likes an underrated aspect of his game that should help him to handle the rigors of NFL play -- that of the 5-foot-11, 208-pounder's strength. Writes the analyst, "He really came on at the end of his career, in large part because he added muscle without losing speed or quickness. He no longer can be taken down with arm tackles." Michel is Nystrom's third-favorite back in this class, trailing only Saquon Barkley and Ronald Jones. The Georgia standout is going to be in play for a Round 1 selection. If he doesn't get swept off the board on the first day, we don't expect him to be waiting around long on the second.

Source: Rotoworld 

Feb 17 - 1:22 PM

[Faust 5,024]

On the Rotoworld Football Podcast, Josh Norris believes it is in the realm of possibility that Georgia's Sony Michel ultimately becomes the 2018 NFL Draft's best RB.

Norris loves Michel's combination of balance on contact, evasion in tight and open space, speed to create big plays and vision with the ball in his hands. In fact, all of those traits can pop up in a single run and Michel's game against Vanderbilt can be presented as evidence. Michel's major hold back is his fumble rate, as he puts the ball on the ground once every 54.6 touches. Norris firmly believes Saquon Barkley is the top running back in the class, but if all the pieces come together and Michel hits his ceiling, it would not be a surprise to see him as the best running back from this draft class.

Source: Josh Norris on Twitter 

Feb 26 - 10:14 AM

[Faust 5,024]

Mike Mayock: Six QBs in play for first round of 2018 NFL Draft

Excerpt:

4) Alvin Kamara's rookie season won't be easily duplicated, but one prospect who might at least make a similar impact is Georgia's Sony Michel. The former Bulldogs star, who shared carries with Nick Chubb just as Kamara split carries in college, has the physical traits required for the role. One difference? Mayock sees Kamara as the more proven pass-catcher of the two, coming out of college. Kamara was a third-round pick of the New Orleans Saints and had a spectacular rookie showing with 1,554 total yards.

[Faust 5,024]

Georgia RB Sony Michel weighed 214 pounds and stood 5-feet-10 5/8 inches tall at the 2018 NFL Combine.

This is lead ball carrier size for Michel, who split time with Nick Chubb at Georgia over the last three or so seasons. The rest of Michel's profile includes 9 1/8 inch hands, 31 1/3 inch arms and 73 5/8-inch wingspan. Rotoworld Josh Norris has gone on the record many times declaring his love for Michel's game, but his tendency to fumble the football is a major red flag.

Source: Charles Robinson on Twitter 

Feb 28 - 10:35 AM

[Faust 5,024]

Georgia RB Sony Michel unofficially recorded 22 reps on the bench press at the NFL Scouting Combine.

Strong work from the 5-foot-10, 214-pound Michel. He couldn't ultimately keep up with teammate Nick Chubb, who hoisted the bar 29 times, but Chubb's built for this kind of thing. We'll be checking the two Georgia studs against each other throughout combine testing. Both should be off the board by the end of Day 2, but we're not discounting the possibility that either could sneak in late in Round 1.

Source: Andy Staples on Twitter 

Mar 1 - 5:14 PM

[zeeshan2 350]

Sony Michel 1st unofficial forty: 4.58

https://twitter.com/JoshNorris/status/969644065678594048

[fruity pebbles 3,255]

oof

[bicycle_seat_sniffer 5,109]

1 minute ago, fruity pebbles said:

oof

bad post

 

[fruity pebbles 3,255]

3 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

bad post

 

bad time

[Soulfly3 4,386]

Slower than the Chubbster