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***2018 Dallas Cowboys*** (1 Viewer)

I agree with your premise but if you think the Joneses are just lavishly spending money than you haven’t paid attention for the past five years.
That wasn't my point. It was more that teams like the Bengals have been hampered by ownership that didn't want to spend money. That is not the reason the Cowboys have been generally ineffective at producing a contender over the last 23 years.

 
 Yay, all the Eagles fans feel the need to post about their favorite team again, this is awesome. 
You're the first one who brought up the eagles in here today.  Everyone else was just having pretty respectful conversation about the Cooper trade and Cowboys' recent moves.

 
I think I've been pretty objective and fair in here all day long.  Just said I thought the 1st was an over payment, as did you and every other cowboys fan except for one. 
Oh really? 

That actually surprises me that Howie offered even a 2nd up for him.  He might have made sense for us because we already have a good QB and offense to bounce back in.  I'm not sure Dak and that offense is the best situation for him to turn it around in.

Also, you're right it remains to be seen.  But he needs to be "Great" for you to be satisfied giving up a 1st, right?  And if he does turn out to be "great", then he is going to cost you a LOT of money to keep around.  It seems more of a lose-lose than a win-win.  The only win I see from this is if you are making a deep playoff run this year or next and I'm not sure I see it.

I am just trying to wrap my head around how a guy who is doing absolutely nothing in Oakland can really go for a 1st round pick.   I agree it seems like a 3rd or 4th wouldn't have done it, so that wasn't an option.  It just seems that these days, a 1st rounder (likely a top 15 pick but who knows) should be worth a lot more than that.
Do you not realize that every time you guys posted here you do it with such a condescending and prententoius tone that it makes me wonder if you’re sitting on a yacht holding a champagne glass with your pinky out while your wife, Muffy pets her toy dog.

The amount of energy you put into talking about the Dallas Cowboys makes it obvious that you’re so envious of them for God knows what since you guys are obviously the kings of the NFL. It’s ####### weird dude. 

 
You're the first one who brought up the eagles in here today.  Everyone else was just having pretty respectful conversation about the Cooper trade and Cowboys' recent moves.
If you could ever post something that didn’t have a negative slant for the Cowboys I might be inclined to believe you. You don’t. 

 So there’s no reason you can’t talk about the Cowboys or say that they suck but to constantly pretend like you’re just offering football banter without being biased is just being disingenuous..

 
Oh really? 

Do you not realize that every time you guys posted here you do it with such a condescending and prententoius tone that it makes me wonder if you’re sitting on a yacht holding a champagne glass with your pinky out while your wife, Muffy pets her toy dog.

The amount of energy you put into talking about the Dallas Cowboys makes it obvious that you’re so envious of them for God knows what since you guys are obviously the kings of the NFL. It’s ####### weird dude. 
"I don't think Dak and that offense is the best situation for Cooper to turn it around in" isn't very condescending or pretentious.  At least, it wasn't meant to be. 

 
Which one of these doesn't belong.

1. Gordon and an early/mid 7th for a late 5th.

2. Landry for a fourth and seventh.

3. Cooper for a 1st.
That really say's it all right there. And also shows how terrible the Dolphins front office is as well. They gave away Landry for nothing. Landry has put up monster numbers and that is all the Dolphins could muster up for him. Oh wait.....of course they wait till the 11th hour when the entire league knows they are at odd's over a contract extension and know they can get him cheaper in terms of trade assets. The Dolphins are a laughing stock front office.

Gruden made a great trade based on Coopers body of work.

Now....Amari is uber talented and maybe the change of scenery will be exactly what he needs. But a 1st was a big price to pay. I think they could have gotten him for a 2nd and 5th. But Jones pushed the panic button (and hey the passing offense is just awful right now). So....time will tell who won the deal.

 
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"I don't think Dak and that offense is the best situation for Cooper to turn it around in" isn't very condescending or pretentious.  At least, it wasn't meant to be. 
However it would’ve been a good move for the Eagles, right? :lmao:

 Im done, you just don’t get it or see it.

ive made my point or at least said how I felt. I won’t make an issue of it going forward. It’s just a shame, because you’re obviously a passionate fan you just can’t remove your hatred for the Cowboys to make it a worthwhile discussion.

 
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If you could ever post something that didn’t have a negative slant for the Cowboys I might be inclined to believe you. You don’t. 

 So there’s no reason you can’t talk about the Cowboys or say that they suck but to constantly pretend like you’re just offering football banter without being biased is just being disingenuous..
Welcome to Football Jones in the Eagles thread.

As for your first point, I actually made my first post about the trade and said I liked the trade for you guys.  I hadn't read what was offered up yet and thought it was good that they addressed the need and went for it.  There was no negative slant there.

Later I read it was a 1st and was very surprised.  If we had given up a first I would have been as pissed off as most of your fans are.  If the Bills gave up a first for him I also would have thought that was an over payment.  I also asked the question as to if Oakland would have taken a 2nd, cause I seem to think they would have.  Would be surprised if Gruden would have said no to a 2nd and actually kept Cooper this year.  That locker room is a mess and he's on a mission to clean house there and stockpile assets for the move to Vegas.

 
However it would’ve been a good move for the Eagles, right? :lmao:

 Im done, you just don’t get it or see it.

ive made my point or at least said how I felt. I won’t make an issue of it going forward. It’s just a shame, because you’re obviously a passionate fan you just can’t remove your hatred for the Cowboys to make it a worthwhile discussion.
No, I usually support Howie but I'm not thrilled that he offered a 2nd for Cooper.  I actually met Howie on Sunday, if I knew he had offered that I would have begged him not to haha.  No chance would any of our fans be happy with us giving up a 1st for Cooper.  ANY nfl team paying that much for him seems very odd when there's draftable guys in the teens that are far more attractive from a talent and contract perspective.

 
Welcome to Football Jones in the Eagles thread.

As for your first point, I actually made my first post about the trade and said I liked the trade for you guys.  I hadn't read what was offered up yet and thought it was good that they addressed the need and went for it.  There was no negative slant there.

Later I read it was a 1st and was very surprised.  If we had given up a first I would have been as pissed off as most of your fans are.  If the Bills gave up a first for him I also would have thought that was an over payment.  I also asked the question as to if Oakland would have taken a 2nd, cause I seem to think they would have.  Would be surprised if Gruden would have said no to a 2nd and actually kept Cooper this year.  That locker room is a mess and he's on a mission to clean house there and stockpile assets for the move to Vegas.
 I can’t control other posters, you and everybody else on the board knows how I feel since you decide to post our private message but let’s move on from that display of etiquette. 

I’m not happy at all we gave up a first for Cooper. I also don’t know enough about him to know if he could potential he live up to a first round pick, I tend to doubt it. 

 It honestly makes me sick to my stomach because it makes me think of the Joey Galloway trade. ?

 
My point was if you are talking about football success, what have the Jones done, besides hiring Jimmy Johnson which got them 3 super bowls, to have football success? In the last 22 years, they are tied for last place in Super Bowl wins, Super Bowl appearances, and Conference Championship game appearances. During that time they have only had 2 playoff wins, both of which were wildcard games. Those 2 playoff wins are better than only 5 other teams during that time span (Buffalo, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Kansas City, and Detroit).

I give them full credit for making a great hire which got them 3 Super Bowls. But Jones also fired that great coach, which may have prevented them from getting more than 3  Super Bowl wins. Jones has done nothing in the last 23 years to distinguish himself as a great owner. And while some teams struggle at winning because their ownership won't spend money, Jones does not have that excuse. He has shown a willingness to spend money, it just hasn't helped him be any more successful.

Now if you were making the point that the Jones aren't dumb in regards to making money, then I am 100% in agreement with you.
Like I said, many people besides myself feel Dallas is on the verge of something really good.

Lots of talent & youth which isn’t easy to do. The cap is the elephant in the room & we’re good there starting in the offseason.

My simple point is JJ deserves some of the credit for putting us in a nice position for the future.

Past that, we just have to see what happens.

 
Deamon,

LOL. I’ve gone out if my way to avoid confrontation mainly because of some thin-skinned posters.

I think the problem lies with people trying to figure out hidden meanings & such. It’s just ridiculous.

Bottom line, other SP posters don’t want to see the bloodbath. I don’t mind talking Cowboys/Eagles, but I’m going to stop when it looks like it could get ugly.

 
Like I said, many people besides myself feel Dallas is on the verge of something really good.

Lots of talent & youth which isn’t easy to do. The cap is the elephant in the room & we’re good there starting in the offseason.

My simple point is JJ deserves some of the credit for putting us in a nice position for the future.

Past that, we just have to see what happens.
Where do have us cap wise? I haven’t looked recently but don’t believe it’s super rosy if I recall correctly. 

 
Where do have us cap wise? I haven’t looked recently but don’t believe it’s super rosy if I recall correctly. 
The Cowboys are $55 million under the cap in 2019, however, that does not include Lawrence who is not signed for next year. It also has Elliot and Prescott on the last year of their rookie deals, so the Cowboys could have a significant bump in their salaries in 2020 if they resign Elliot and Prescott to long-term deals. Even if they let Prescott go, they probably won't be able to get by with a 4th round starting QB again.

 
The Cowboys are $55 million under the cap in 2019, however, that does not include Lawrence who is not signed for next year. It also has Elliot and Prescott on the last year of their rookie deals, so the Cowboys could have a significant bump in their salaries in 2020 if they resign Elliot and Prescott to long-term deals. Even if they let Prescott go, they probably won't be able to get by with a 4th round starting QB salary again.

 
The Cowboys are $55 million under the cap in 2019, however, that does not include Lawrence who is not signed for next year. It also has Elliot and Prescott on the last year of their rookie deals, so the Cowboys could have a significant bump in their salaries in 2020 if they resign Elliot and Prescott to long-term deals. Even if they let Prescott go, they probably won't be able to get by with a 4th round starting QB again.
I’m not saying you’re wrong but I thought it was 74 million next year. 

 Also, I see them moving on from Sean Lee and his $10 million salary

 
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I’d have to look myself, but I remember looking into it earlier & it was pretty good.
I don't mean to single to you out but this is what I find challenging with our fan base. Only looking at certain facts with looking at a bigger picture.  We have multiple high end players to pay still and that space is spoken for.  McClay is not going on a shopping spree with that money, it's staying on current players (Zeke and Lawrence - hopefully). I am going to look at the cap and other players - but as thought it was not rosy.

Suddenly, I am jackwagon fan because I am critical of the team and skeptical that all is as Rosy as others. This now equals I am not fan. Anyone else remember when I got called a blind homer a couple years back. Too funny.

 
I don't mean to single to you out but this is what I find challenging with our fan base. Only looking at certain facts with looking at a bigger picture.  We have multiple high end players to pay still and that space is spoken for.  McClay is not going on a shopping spree with that money, it's staying on current players (Zeke and Lawrence - hopefully). I am going to look at the cap and other players - but as thought it was not rosy.

Suddenly, I am jackwagon fan because I am critical of the team and skeptical that all is as Rosy as others. This now equals I am not fan. Anyone else remember when I got called a blind homer a couple years back. Too funny.
I think you already knew what the cap situation was (in general), LOL. I didn’t give you an exact figure because I couldn’t recall it. Put it this way, it’s above par.

Like I’ve said previously, what’s not to like? I’m not the only who views this team as up & coming.

You can pick on Dak, but nothing says he has to be our QB forever. We have the means to replace him if that’s the direction they go.

 
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I just like it because we’ve got some interested Philly fans. :)

I’ve been trying tell them we could close fast. They have the better team right now, but we have the means to gain ground quickly.

 
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I don't mean to single to you out but this is what I find challenging with our fan base. Only looking at certain facts with looking at a bigger picture.  We have multiple high end players to pay still and that space is spoken for.  McClay is not going on a shopping spree with that money, it's staying on current players (Zeke and Lawrence - hopefully). I am going to look at the cap and other players - but as thought it was not rosy.

Suddenly, I am jackwagon fan because I am critical of the team and skeptical that all is as Rosy as others. This now equals I am not fan. Anyone else remember when I got called a blind homer a couple years back. Too funny.
For the record, I don’t consider you a “jackwagon” fan.

It’s just that you aren’t seeing the upside I do.

Who’s right? We’ll find out.

 
Deamon,

LOL. I’ve gone out if my way to avoid confrontation mainly because of some thin-skinned posters.

I think the problem lies with people trying to figure out hidden meanings & such. It’s just ridiculous.

Bottom line, other SP posters don’t want to see the bloodbath. I don’t mind talking Cowboys/Eagles, but I’m going to stop when it looks like it could get ugly.
Ya I thought I was being pretty fair in here today and was trying to be respectful and not take shots.

 
I see it at about 48 million next year and 113 Million in 2020. Per Sport Trac.

2019 Expiring Contracts: Lawrence/Beasley/Austin

2020: Expiring Contracts: Dak/Lee/Collins/Jones/Heath/Jaylon/Gregory/M. Collins/Cooper

So, a "Franchise QB", Lee could be expendable or traded, our RT, a potential Pro Bowl CB, Heath can go, our starting WLB, depth pass rusher, depth DL, a WR we just gave a first pick for. In addition to the money spent on Lawrence for 2019.  Guessing Austin and maybe even Beas could be gone.

Lot's of work to do.

 
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I see it at about 48 million next year and 113 Million in 2020. Per Sport Trac.

2019 Expiring Contracts: Lawrence/Beasley/Austin

2020: Expiring Contracts: Dak/Lee/Collins/Jones/Heath/Jaylon/Gregory/M. Collins/Cooper

So, a Franchise QB, Lee could be expendable or traded, our RT, a potential Pro Bowl CB, Heath can go, our starting WLB, depth pass rusher, depth DL, a WR we just gave a first pick for. In addition to the money spent on Lawrence for 2019.  Guessing Austin and maybe even Beas could be gone.

Lot's of work to do.
I got my numbers from Overthecap.com if you are interested. I think they do a pretty good job.

 
For the record, I don’t consider you a “jackwagon” fan.

It’s just that you aren’t seeing the upside I do.

Who’s right? We’ll find out.
Who's right about what?  The level of appropriate optimism?

I really wish you would be more specific. You generalize and don't talk factually.

 
Who's right about what?  The level of appropriate optimism?

I really wish you would be more specific. You generalize and don't talk factually.
I thought I spelled it out. You don’t see the upside I do. 

I don’t state things as fact because they’re my opinions.

Bottom line, you don’t like the direction we’re headed & I do.

If we crash & burn in the coming seasons, you’ll be right.

 
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I thought I spelled it out. You don’t see the upside I do. 

I don’t state things as fact because they’re my opinions.

Bottom line, you don’t like the direction we’re headed & I do.

If we crash & burn in the coming seasons, you’ll be right.
Oh good - more generalizations about my thoughts. I will stop as I don't wish to hijack any further.

 
Oh good - more generalizations about my thoughts. I will stop as I don't wish to hijack any further.
At this point, I’ve learned to just stop.

You’re offering nothing but pessimism which would be ok if you weren’t also looking for a MB fight (no thanks, LOL).

I’ve got nothing other than to say I like the direction we’re headed. End of story.

 
At this point, I’ve learned to just stop.

You’re offering nothing but pessimism which would be ok if you weren’t also looking for a MB fight (no thanks, LOL).

I’ve got nothing other than to say I like the direction we’re headed. End of story.
“Nothing but pessimism”. Read again my friend. 

 
Definitely cheaper, but I think Cooper is a major upgrade on Dez.
Cooper Averages over first 3 years: 68 catches, 986 yards, 6 TD's

Bryant Averages over first 3 years: 67 catches, 957 yards, 9 TD's

Or how about 2017:

Cooper: 48 catches, 680 yards, 7 TD's

Bryant: 69 catches, 838 yards, 6 TD's

To the bolded: ????

 
At this point, I’ve learned to just stop.

You’re offering nothing but pessimism which would be ok if you weren’t also looking for a MB fight (no thanks, LOL).

I’ve got nothing other than to say I like the direction we’re headed. End of story.
There's a difference between a pessimist and a realist. Something an optimist might have a hard time seeing.

 
Cooper Averages over first 3 years: 68 catches, 986 yards, 6 TD's

Bryant Averages over first 3 years: 67 catches, 957 yards, 9 TD's

Or how about 2017:

Cooper: 48 catches, 680 yards, 7 TD's

Bryant: 69 catches, 838 yards, 6 TD's

To the bolded: ????
Let’s get real, LOL.

You’re ready to die on this hill? ;)

How long would Cooper last as a street FA?

 
There's a difference between a pessimist and a realist. Something an optimist might have a hard time seeing.
The difference is his realistic view is general pessimism & my realistic view is general optimism.

I get it, but no need to continue to banter about it. He’s ready to give up on Dak & I’m not. I want to evaluate him after this season. And so on.

Just too many differences to meet in the middle.

 
The difference is his realistic view is general pessimism & my realistic view is general optimism.

I get it, but no need to continue to banter about it. He’s ready to give up on Dak & I’m not. I want to evaluate him after this season. And so on.

Just too many differences to meet in the middle.
Wrong again. 

I said under this idiot coach - I have no faith he can improve as they can’t figure it out. They can’t even manage the clock.

Yes, I also said that my eyes tell me a new coach may not be able to fix his deficiencies either. 

Im all for one more year of Dak with a new HC. Is that more clear?

 
The difference is his realistic view is general pessimism & my realistic view is general optimism.

I get it, but no need to continue to banter about it. He’s ready to give up on Dak & I’m not. I want to evaluate him after this season. And so on.

Just too many differences to meet in the middle.
I would say that you are an extreme optimist as opposed to a general optimist. For instance, you acknowledge that Garrett probably needs to be replaced, but then make it sound like finding a quality replacement is a foregone conclusion. The Giants are a pretty stable organization, how do you think they feel about the Pat Shurmur hire? Adam Gase was a sexy head coaching candidate. How do you think the Dolphins feel about him now? Even Bill O'Brien was thought to be a pretty good hire by the Texans. Have you watched some of his coaching decisions this year? Finding a quality head coach is not very easy, but you don't let that get in the way of your narrative.

And I am not asking you to. You just might want to acknowledge that you are a lot more optimistic then sometimes facts support. It might help you understand why so many people take a contrary position to you in this forum.

 
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Who's gonna be watching an all new episode of Hanging out with Mr.Cooper next week he he he... Zeke and Cooper about take some of us to the Fantasy Title 

 
Wrong again. 

I said under this idiot coach - I have no faith he can improve as they can’t figure it out. They can’t even manage the clock.

Yes, I also said that my eyes tell me a new coach may not be able to fix his deficiencies either. 

Im all for one more year of Dak with a new HC. Is that more clear?
Ok. I gotcha.

 
I would say that you are an extreme optimist as opposed to a general optimist. For instance, you acknowledge that Garrett probably needs to be replaced, but then make it sound like finding a quality replacement is a foregone conclusion. The Giants are a pretty stable organization, how do you think they feel about the Pat Shurmur hire? Adam Gase was a sexy head coaching candidate. How do you think the Dolphins feel about him now? Even Bill O'Brien was thought to be a pretty good hire by the Texans. Have you watched some of his coaching decisions this year? Finding a quality head coach is not very easy, but you don't let that get in the way of your narrative.

And I am not asking you to. You just might want to acknowledge that you are a lot more optimistic then sometimes facts support. It might help you understand why so many people take a contrary position to you in this forum.
Yeah, I’m pretty optimistic about our future, but that doesn’t mean I’m wrong.

I totally get you along with others don’t see it. Right now, all we can do is give our opinions.

 
Who's gonna be watching an all new episode of Hanging out with Mr.Cooper next week he he he... Zeke and Cooper about take some of us to the Fantasy Title 
Doubtful...just checked the IBL record of the Elliot owners

22-27 also owns Cooper

23-26

18-31

17-32

26-23

16-33

22-27

18-31

One owner with a shot at the playoffs

For the Cooper owners it worse

34-15 - only playoff lock

20-29

19-30

9-40

23-26

19-30

11-36

Basically a who's who of the worst teams in the league.

 
Who knows, but it's looking REALLY good, IMO.

Very few teams have our combination of talent, youth, cap room (starting in the offseason), & personnel department.
if my team just traded a first for cooper i wouldn't be touting their personnel department as a strength, but that's just me

 

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