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2023 New York Jets: Bye Bye (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter Dr. Octopus
- Start date
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I can’t say for sure but I can’t see why the coaching staff would be in on a “tank” since they’ll all be fired at season’s end. I could see something like that torpedoing an 11-0 Jet season Just as easily
Desert_Power
Footballguy
TLEF316
Footballguy
They did. Aghalor got a step down the middle and carr was rushed in the pocket and overthrew him
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NYRAGE
Footballguy
Well they didn’t give it away on the prior drive fwiw. Kind of odd that they would wait until the last drive to tank.
I think people just underestimate how incompetent the coaching is on the team. Not to mention the lack of talent.
I’m glad the Raiders won, but man it took everything for them to win despite Darnold’s multiple gaffs and the extraordinary coaching blunders. Way too close for comfort.
I think people just underestimate how incompetent the coaching is on the team. Not to mention the lack of talent.
I’m glad the Raiders won, but man it took everything for them to win despite Darnold’s multiple gaffs and the extraordinary coaching blunders. Way too close for comfort.
TLEF316
Footballguy
I really want to meet the 23 year old sports management major running the Jets twitter account.
You just know that he/she feels absolutely ridiculous coming up with tweets about how the fan base is "heartbroken" over that loss. That play brought more happiness than any Jets moment in damn near a decade.
You just know that he/she feels absolutely ridiculous coming up with tweets about how the fan base is "heartbroken" over that loss. That play brought more happiness than any Jets moment in damn near a decade.
rockaction
Footballguy
Deamon
Footballguy
I can't see that it was on purpose. Why would a coach who is going to be fired, want them to land the #1 pick and succeed? And why would you try to win all game just to give it up on a final play that may/may not have even been caught? I don't buy that players/coaches try to lose games on purpose.
RC94
Footballguy
My father is a Jets fan and his fear is that they will fire Gase but force any new coach to keep an assistant(s) that a new coach might not want, which will drive away the top candidates. I don't think they will do that because I can't think of an assistant worth forcing anyone to keep, but it does seem like a Jets thing to do.
Hmmmm....so let's see which scenario would I choose and be best for the Jets going forward.
1. Greg Williams putting the defense in prevent defense mode and Jets winning yesterday 28-24 putting them 2nd overall in Trevor Lawrence chase as Jags would have tie-breaker with one win each with 4 to go and not a game for either team that they likely would win going foward.
2. Greg Williams, as per his persona and style of play his entire career as a DC, calls for an all out blitz leaving corners naked and Jets losing yesterday 31-28 keeping them 1st overall in the Trevor Lawrence chase over the Jags who also lost with the Seahawks, Rams, Browns and Patriots on deck for the final 4 games on Jet schedule.
Ummm...give me scenario #2 all day and all night and yet peeps in the media and even some in Jet Nation no so much here on this message board, are "up in arms" this morning and want Williams fired for his bold defensive call which by the way likely would have worked had the Raider O-line and Carr not handled the blitz package surprisingly so well. Give me a break...there is nothing whatsover to complain and ##### about. Things worked out perfectly.
So relax my Jet brothers....things couldn't have worked out better. Jets played an exciting game for a change of pace. Darnold showed glimpses once again despite some mistakes. The RB's Johnson and Adams showed some nice things. Becton after a tough start dominated in 2nd half. Quinnen, Mims and Davis all had some nice moments. I mean what is there to complain about?
Honestly, I commend Williams for not sitting back and even tho it backfired..."oopsie daisy"(haven't used that term in decades I don't think...lol) it didn't work out and so the Jets now are in commanding position to win the Lawrence sweepstakes as their remaining schedule is daunting indeed.
My revised "scare rankings" now that the Raiders are out of the way and who were in my rankings I did last week just behind the Browns and it proved to be correct as that was a damn close call yesterday would be in order:
Cleveland(Baker can implode at any given time and that franchise is still cursed despite their great season thus far)
Patriots(I've gone over infinitum that Belichek hatred of Jets factor but Pats winning and staying in playoff hunt lessons my worry significantly)
Rams and Seahawks I'm not worried whatsoever.
Yeah it was the "same old Jets". But the positive is yeah tho the Jets should have won I'm also 1000% convinced of this but had we won, we could have kissed Trevor Lawrence goodbye.
The Jags would be almost certainly getting Lawrence because despite how competitive they've been lately, with a remaining schedule of the Titans, Ravens, Bears and Colts, they aint winning another game this season either. Yeah the Bears game worries me a tad but the Bears should be able to take care of business.
So let's take a collective deep breath as we dodged a bullet yesterday and so instead of castigating Greg Williams, we should be applauding him and his reckless ways....lol.
1. Greg Williams putting the defense in prevent defense mode and Jets winning yesterday 28-24 putting them 2nd overall in Trevor Lawrence chase as Jags would have tie-breaker with one win each with 4 to go and not a game for either team that they likely would win going foward.
2. Greg Williams, as per his persona and style of play his entire career as a DC, calls for an all out blitz leaving corners naked and Jets losing yesterday 31-28 keeping them 1st overall in the Trevor Lawrence chase over the Jags who also lost with the Seahawks, Rams, Browns and Patriots on deck for the final 4 games on Jet schedule.
Ummm...give me scenario #2 all day and all night and yet peeps in the media and even some in Jet Nation no so much here on this message board, are "up in arms" this morning and want Williams fired for his bold defensive call which by the way likely would have worked had the Raider O-line and Carr not handled the blitz package surprisingly so well. Give me a break...there is nothing whatsover to complain and ##### about. Things worked out perfectly.
So relax my Jet brothers....things couldn't have worked out better. Jets played an exciting game for a change of pace. Darnold showed glimpses once again despite some mistakes. The RB's Johnson and Adams showed some nice things. Becton after a tough start dominated in 2nd half. Quinnen, Mims and Davis all had some nice moments. I mean what is there to complain about?
Honestly, I commend Williams for not sitting back and even tho it backfired..."oopsie daisy"(haven't used that term in decades I don't think...lol) it didn't work out and so the Jets now are in commanding position to win the Lawrence sweepstakes as their remaining schedule is daunting indeed.
My revised "scare rankings" now that the Raiders are out of the way and who were in my rankings I did last week just behind the Browns and it proved to be correct as that was a damn close call yesterday would be in order:
Cleveland(Baker can implode at any given time and that franchise is still cursed despite their great season thus far)
Patriots(I've gone over infinitum that Belichek hatred of Jets factor but Pats winning and staying in playoff hunt lessons my worry significantly)
Rams and Seahawks I'm not worried whatsoever.
Yeah it was the "same old Jets". But the positive is yeah tho the Jets should have won I'm also 1000% convinced of this but had we won, we could have kissed Trevor Lawrence goodbye.
The Jags would be almost certainly getting Lawrence because despite how competitive they've been lately, with a remaining schedule of the Titans, Ravens, Bears and Colts, they aint winning another game this season either. Yeah the Bears game worries me a tad but the Bears should be able to take care of business.
So let's take a collective deep breath as we dodged a bullet yesterday and so instead of castigating Greg Williams, we should be applauding him and his reckless ways....lol.
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NYRAGE
Footballguy
Maybe Chris Johnson promised him a good recommendation letter if Gase could keep his genius in check and lose these games.
I'm kidding.
One somewhat funny thing is this is kind of what you expect when the head coach has no interest in the defense. I mean they ran the same exact defense the play before, but Carr missed the throw. You think Gase should have said something to Williams after that play. It totally highlights the dysfunction of the current coaching system. One head coach for the defense and one head coach for the worst offense in the league.
TLEF316
Footballguy
Oh, I dont think anyone with a brain is upset about what Greg did yesterday. Whether it was a poor decision by a notoriously aggressive DC, a spite move against Gase (to saddle a man I'm sure he hates with 0-16) or a last minute phone call from the owners box, I'm beyond thrilled that he did it.
If this works out and the Jets land Lawrence, I'm all for building a statue of Williams outside the stadium.
It was literally a decision that could shape this franchise (in a good way) for the next 15 years. It made my month.
And I have absolutely no shame in anything the Jets do at this point. Not with the Jags showing their ### and playing Mike Glennon over Minshew.
Also, Gore goes out yesterday and the Jets rush for over 200 yards against a potential playoff team (I know they were down a couple of guy, but still) SHOCKER....
If this works out and the Jets land Lawrence, I'm all for building a statue of Williams outside the stadium.
It was literally a decision that could shape this franchise (in a good way) for the next 15 years. It made my month.
And I have absolutely no shame in anything the Jets do at this point. Not with the Jags showing their ### and playing Mike Glennon over Minshew.
Also, Gore goes out yesterday and the Jets rush for over 200 yards against a potential playoff team (I know they were down a couple of guy, but still) SHOCKER....
NYRAGE
Footballguy
There is not one Jets fan here that is complaining about Williams. Let's face it. It was a Christmas miracle, but it was totally a stupid call. They had one guy spying on Carr doing nothing. It's like the one time (two times actually) that Williams doesn't play 2-deep safeties. The right play with that little time left was keeping the ball in front of you, not giving them deep pass one on one. Thank God for that call. I cheered like we won the Super Bowl. It felt dirty to be honest, but we have to be practical at this point. Winning doesn't help us.
NYRAGE
Footballguy
The bolded is something I wondered yesterday, but it could also sabotage his efforts to land a job after this.
I mentioned it yesterday, but perhaps the biggest shame (on Gase) is that it took an injury to Gore to see a couple of younger guys run like crazy yesterday. It makes no sense to watch Gore run so much week after week. None at all. Hall of Famer or not, he has no future on this team and he's 63. Gase is the worst coach we have ever had by far.
Well than I've been reading more than you have as I'm in two Jet FB groups and 90% are #####ing and moaning about Williams play call. I fell differently about the play call. I like being aggressive there...I do. I don't think it was stupid at all. The only reason it didn't work was due to tremendous blocking on that play and Carr pulling a Tom Brady and deftly ####ing a few steps up in the pocket and throwing up a moon ball.
I'm not playing contrarian here. I'm a huge Greg Williams fan and I'd actually like to keep him as DC for whoever comes in to be the HC. I know that's not going to happen but I like very much the way Williams coaches up his players.
Anyways, it worked out just great. I just think there would be alot and I do mean alot more #####ing and moaning had the Jets won than had we lost. And so the kind of #####ing I'm reading from peeps in Jet Nation and in the media seems very disingenuous...that's all I'm saying.
TLEF316
Footballguy
I mean, the man is 62 years old. How much longer is he really going to work?
He's a got a 20 year body of work as a DC. People know what he's about. If they're gonna pass on hiring him in the Spring its not going to be because of one poor decision.
Obviously if he admits he did it to spite his HC, he's probably not going to get hired. But we all know that's not going to happen.
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Not sure you saw it but last night ESPN with Tim Hasselback showed a bevie of similar situations where Williams went all out blitz at end of game just like the scenario from yesterday and each time it worked out just fine as the QB's were pressured so much so that they either threw the ball well short or there was no prayer of a chance for a miracle to occur.
Yesterday it didn't work out simple as that. But it's more because the Raiders did a phenomenal job picking up the blitz and just as impressively as I just said in my previous comments, Carr using some very impressive and dept footwork to just barely avoid rush and give himself enough time to throw up that moon ball he threw up there.
Let's put it another way, I hate hate hate the prevent defense. I've seen not only the Jets over the years lose tons of games because of playing the prevent instead of being aggressive and pressuring the QB but plenty of other teams blow games late by sitting back. I'm sorry and maybe this puts me on an island here, I love Greg Williams style of defense and I applaud his play call at end of the game. I also give credit where credit is due and the Raiders deserve a ton of it for executing so well to handle that defensive call there by GW.
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QuizGuy66
Footballguy
At this point Williams seems like a guy that would be imposed on a head coach not selected by one. Buddy Ryan levels of loyalty exhibited by him. Given the way Gase stabs people in the back they kind of deserve each other. Given his long experience and how the NFL just loves to recycle guys I wouldn't be surprised to see him land another job but glad he's probably not a guy my Bengals would ever hire (if only because of how he backstabbed Hue Jackson)
-QG
-QG
TLEF316
Footballguy
I have no issue at all with being aggressive.
But in this particular situation, (time, score and position on the field) what he did opens the team up to exactly what happened. Yeah, the blitz pickup was great. But once that happened, you've put yourself in a situation where one man getting beat by one other man loses the game. And that's exactly what happened.
If you play 6 DB's (or even 7......or 8.....)and just have them all drop back, the best case scenario for Oakland is a 40+ yard hail mary where you (the Jets) have a numbers advantage to knock the ball down. (assuming the QB even makes an accurate throw that his guys have a chance of catching)
I get that miracles happen...or PI could be called. But dropping back is still the absolute no brainer best option. you protect the sideline and the the endzone and you concede anything they want in the middle of the field.
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NYRAGE
Footballguy
Cimini:
How crazy was G Williams' call? Per
@ESPNStatsInfo
data (since 2006): #Jets became first team to send 6+ pass rushers in this situation: Final 15 secs of regulation Between a 4-8 pt lead 40+ yards to the end zone Covers 251 previous pass plays. Only the Jets.
NYRAGE
Footballguy
They showed I believe 4 scenarios and all of them were at the end of the game...last seconds type of situations. Now I'm not so naïve to believe that in GW's 20 year history as DC or HC, there haven't been calls my him that haven't blown up in his face just like yesterday's did. Obviously there have been.
My only point I'm trying to make here is I really really like Williams style of pressure defense and him being aggressive rather than sitting back on that last play is not the reason the Jets lost the game. I obviously don't have empirical data for this comment of mine but the Raiders executed what likely was a 1 in 10 chance to be successful. Bravo to them but criticizing GW especially when most of the time his play call would be successful, is pretty disingenuous.
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QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Thanks for the explanation Maximus 
Wanted to be sure it wasn't, say, with 1 minute left vs like 15 seconds. The last play yesterday seemed more like a Hail Mary situation and that is one where max coverage is the norm. I do think the decision was at face value (i.e. not some secret plot by GW to tank or make Gase look bad). We'll have to agree to disagree on the merits of the call.
-QG
Wanted to be sure it wasn't, say, with 1 minute left vs like 15 seconds. The last play yesterday seemed more like a Hail Mary situation and that is one where max coverage is the norm. I do think the decision was at face value (i.e. not some secret plot by GW to tank or make Gase look bad). We'll have to agree to disagree on the merits of the call.
-QG
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Actually it was idiotic based on the game situation, but I'm glad he did it. Literally the only way they lose that game is to let the receivers get behind the defensive backs and he left them with no support.
Once again no empirical data for this opinion of mine but I have a strong hunch that the Johnsons will let Douglass pick whoever he wants to be the HC and they will let him run the football operations and let him make all the decisions that Douglass feels is necessary in order for the Jets to become a winning team again.
Now obviously the Johnson's will be consulted by Douglass but I just have this hunch that the Johnson's might have seen by how unsuccessful the arrangement has been to have this separation of GM and HC over they years for the team combined with the fact that Douglass has as much credibility footballwise as any GM the Jet have had since maybe Terry Bradway, they'll do things a bit differently.
That's another reason why I think the next coach of the Jets should be a guy like Joe Brady who despite being a very good offensive mind and who would be great as far as building a new culture, the fact he'd be so young, it would allow Douglass to make all the football decisions with obvious consultation with a Brady type but you get the picture.
We'll see how it plays out but for some stupid reason I'm actually kind of hopeful that the Jets will do things differently going forward now that we have Douglass in charge and he's now been here for a bit.
TLEF316
Footballguy
Yeah, I certainly dont think the GM and the coach need to be hired at the same time. I do think their contracts should EXPIRE at the same time (this way they're on the same page in terms of long term vs short term) but I think the reporting structure is far more important.
Owner/Team President hires GM....GM hires coach with some input from upper management (assuming you have someone up there that actually understands football). Coach then reports directly to GM. Coach picks his own assistants so there are no excuses.
Picking/firing the head coach needs to be the GM's call so he can be held more accountable for the game day performance of the team he put on the field. Its really not rocket science.
Owner/Team President hires GM....GM hires coach with some input from upper management (assuming you have someone up there that actually understands football). Coach then reports directly to GM. Coach picks his own assistants so there are no excuses.
Picking/firing the head coach needs to be the GM's call so he can be held more accountable for the game day performance of the team he put on the field. Its really not rocket science.
TLEF316
Footballguy
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
NYRAGE
Footballguy
=Smackdown=
Footballguy
Any truth to the rumor Gase got extended for 5 years?
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I guess one of the most important play calls in Jet history especially if you are in full tank mode and want to draft what could be a franchise altering player like Trevor Lawrence, was a bit to much for the Johnson's so cya Greg....lol
And my friends ask me all the time how do I continue after all these years to remain loyal to this team.
Now I have another reason to show them why I love this team so much as it's decisions like this to can Williams who after one "egregious" decision, he gets fired while Gase, who has made oh I dunno a hundred fireable decisions keeps his job.
Lets Go Jets!. On to Seattle...
And my friends ask me all the time how do I continue after all these years to remain loyal to this team.
Now I have another reason to show them why I love this team so much as it's decisions like this to can Williams who after one "egregious" decision, he gets fired while Gase, who has made oh I dunno a hundred fireable decisions keeps his job.
Lets Go Jets!. On to Seattle...
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
NYRAGE
Footballguy
None whatsoever. They are who they are which is one of the worst defenses in the NFL with some of the worst personnel in the league. No Gregg Williams doesn't change a thang!!
On to Seattle where they will get torched by a pissed off Russell Wilson and Jamal Adams.
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I love it...my phone is blowing up from friends of mine asking me how I feel about the GW getting fired. A few seem a bit surprised that I'm so happy seeing IMO it gives the Jets an even better chance to lose their last 4 games of the season than they already had.
As I said, Jets are going to get absolutely torched next week versus a pissed off Russell Wilson and a revenge minded Jamal Adams.
As Bart Scott so famously said "Can't Wait"...lol
As I said, Jets are going to get absolutely torched next week versus a pissed off Russell Wilson and a revenge minded Jamal Adams.
As Bart Scott so famously said "Can't Wait"...lol
Mystery Achiever
Footballguy
This is what I came in to post.TLEF316 said:
NYRAGE
Footballguy
4 more passes to Waller in 10 seconds with no timeouts left would have been an even bigger miracle.
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