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2023 New York Jets: Bye Bye (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter Dr. Octopus
- Start date
rockaction
Footballguy
Interesting win. I'm not trying to be a sour####, but Wilson missed a lot of throws today. What I want to see is him look good, not necessarily win games. He looked okay. We know he can roll out and heave the ball now. I'd like to see him hang in the pocket and throw that fifteen-yard out that pro quarterbacks have to make.
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TLEF316
Footballguy
Was good to see him make some big plays and they certainly protected him better. But yeah....he missed some easy ones I'm big spots and taking that sack on 3rd down in OT was BRUTAL. Hopefully that was just a rookie mistake and he isn't making that same blunder 3 years from now like Sam did.
NYRAGE
Footballguy
rockaction said:
You're not a sourp*ss. Obviously Wilson is terrible. I foretold this prophecy and will keep reminding you guys. It was obvious that he would suck because...um, because he got drafted by the Jets My narrative will be proven correct unless it isn't proven correct.
Terrible win. I just feel so miserable about it. Woe is me. Hopefully we will be able to sleep tonight. I'm going to cancel my appointments tomorrow and just light some candles & wallow in bed.
rockaction
Footballguy
Oh, I'm happy they won, for sure. And I'm happy we have a guy that when plays break down can make plays. I'm just hoping we get a guy who can take three, five, and seven step drops and throw bullets with the proper hip motion and weight transfer. That's what I'll look for.
You know I liked Wilson coming out of school. Watching the other guys from his class have their struggles (besides Mac Jones tonight) has been a reminder that these guys don't develop overnight and that there's a lot of experience and seasoning to be had.
But you know that. Your gripe is with others, it's just in response to my thoughts on the game. I like and believe in the Jets: Wilson is on my main dynasty team, as is Mims, as is John Franklin-Myers, who is beasting for my IDP team as we speak. I'm able to put aside the woe-is-me attitude and hopefully assess talent. I hope it's coached right and allowed to flourish by the owners and front office.
And that's about it.
rockaction
Footballguy
Just so we know I'm not dreaming.
Football Perspective
@fbgchase
·8h
This was the best throw from Wilson today in a game where he had a number of great throws (and to be fair, a number of poor ones). But what a throw here
Football Perspective
@fbgchase
·8h
This was the best throw from Wilson today in a game where he had a number of great throws (and to be fair, a number of poor ones). But what a throw here
TLEF316
Footballguy
Obviously good to see a young team get a win. Happy for them.
Wilson- obviously the highlight plays are incredibly impressive. It makes it easy to see what people saw in him. But as mentioned earlier, the inconsistency on shorter stuff is a bit confusing. All we heard during the pre-draft process is how he was incredibly accurate on short to mid-range stuff. But he's constantly missing little 8 yard out routes and screen passes. Some of it is probably happy feet from the beating he's taken. So certainly no reason to panic. He's shown a tremendous ability to get out of trouble in the pocket, but you do worry that teams will start to scout his tendencies. At some point, a really good pass rusher is gonna guess right and just destroy him for an 18 yard loss.
running backs- Carter was ok. Great 2nd effort on the TD but I haven't seen too much explosiveness or the elite change in direction he was billed to have. I mean....2.9 yards per carry with a 13 yarder mixed in. Dissapointed that Ty Johnson hasnt shown anything either. Big play by Coleman to convert on that one short yardage situation with the over the top leap
WR's- Davis obviously made some plays in the 2nd half after a nightmare first half. Crowder coming back was certainly helpful, as he's just an incredibly solid vet. Berrios is Berrious. Cole made an impact finally. Mims non existent. My guess is they hold out Moore again next week. No point subjecting a guy with a concussion to a trans-Atlantic flight with the bye week coming up.
O-line- obviously Wilson didn't get murdered this week. So that's great. Run blocking is still really bad.
D-Line- JFM has been a revelation. Nothing super flashy but constantly making plays. Hopefully they pay him this summer. I thought Q had been a bit invisible the past couple of weeks but made some plays today. (2 sacks I believe) Overall, they were really aggressive....maybe too aggressive. Those screens and dumpoffs to McNichols were a huge problem until Q's brother started just getting tunnel vision and throwing himself at anyone coming out of the backfield.
LB's- Q Will2 is probably a limited player (Just basically a heat seeking missile) but he plays that role well. Gonna be tough to Jarrad Davis to play him off the field once he comes back. While I still dont think he's worth what they're paying him....the fear that CJ Mosley would no longer be an impact player after 2 years off was misguided. The guy is everywhere and still a top player. (IMO).
DB's- obviously they benefited from Brown and Jones being out, but they did their job for the most part. Seems like Salah is coaching them up. At the very least, everyone out there is getting their head around and looking for the ball (which is pretty much all I want to see from my DB's). Hopefully they can keep it up.
Wilson- obviously the highlight plays are incredibly impressive. It makes it easy to see what people saw in him. But as mentioned earlier, the inconsistency on shorter stuff is a bit confusing. All we heard during the pre-draft process is how he was incredibly accurate on short to mid-range stuff. But he's constantly missing little 8 yard out routes and screen passes. Some of it is probably happy feet from the beating he's taken. So certainly no reason to panic. He's shown a tremendous ability to get out of trouble in the pocket, but you do worry that teams will start to scout his tendencies. At some point, a really good pass rusher is gonna guess right and just destroy him for an 18 yard loss.
running backs- Carter was ok. Great 2nd effort on the TD but I haven't seen too much explosiveness or the elite change in direction he was billed to have. I mean....2.9 yards per carry with a 13 yarder mixed in. Dissapointed that Ty Johnson hasnt shown anything either. Big play by Coleman to convert on that one short yardage situation with the over the top leap
WR's- Davis obviously made some plays in the 2nd half after a nightmare first half. Crowder coming back was certainly helpful, as he's just an incredibly solid vet. Berrios is Berrious. Cole made an impact finally. Mims non existent. My guess is they hold out Moore again next week. No point subjecting a guy with a concussion to a trans-Atlantic flight with the bye week coming up.
O-line- obviously Wilson didn't get murdered this week. So that's great. Run blocking is still really bad.
D-Line- JFM has been a revelation. Nothing super flashy but constantly making plays. Hopefully they pay him this summer. I thought Q had been a bit invisible the past couple of weeks but made some plays today. (2 sacks I believe) Overall, they were really aggressive....maybe too aggressive. Those screens and dumpoffs to McNichols were a huge problem until Q's brother started just getting tunnel vision and throwing himself at anyone coming out of the backfield.
LB's- Q Will2 is probably a limited player (Just basically a heat seeking missile) but he plays that role well. Gonna be tough to Jarrad Davis to play him off the field once he comes back. While I still dont think he's worth what they're paying him....the fear that CJ Mosley would no longer be an impact player after 2 years off was misguided. The guy is everywhere and still a top player. (IMO).
DB's- obviously they benefited from Brown and Jones being out, but they did their job for the most part. Seems like Salah is coaching them up. At the very least, everyone out there is getting their head around and looking for the ball (which is pretty much all I want to see from my DB's). Hopefully they can keep it up.
rockaction
Footballguy
You know what? Despite my immediate reaction to the game yesterday, it's nice to get a win. We should thread celebrate that. We're 1-3, and not the worst team in football, which we had a serious argument for last year.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
1st win I attended in a long time - place was rocking. 1st half the crowd got antsy leading to a Bronx cheer when they finally got a 1st down. But low and behold they have a coaching staff that can make adjustments. The 2d half was noticeably better and Wilson made some big time throws and escapes that gave me glimpses of Favre/Rodgers.....and he also made terrible throws decisions with glimpses of Browning Nagle lol....but all in all it was a great win and much needed. The kid showed some sparks and got the monkey off his back of terrible games. He could really use another big time OL lineman to add when Becton comes back....and a top RB. Their running game is just terrible.
Not going to draft talk to early but looking at the team - I go offense heavy again in next years draft with another stud OL, C and RB as 1st 3 picks. Salah is Rex lite in that I think he can coach up a defense to respectability without drafting premium picks every year....imagine this defense with Lawson...maybe add another stud in FA on D....its amazing how much optimism you get with one win...
Not going to draft talk to early but looking at the team - I go offense heavy again in next years draft with another stud OL, C and RB as 1st 3 picks. Salah is Rex lite in that I think he can coach up a defense to respectability without drafting premium picks every year....imagine this defense with Lawson...maybe add another stud in FA on D....its amazing how much optimism you get with one win...
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TLEF316
Footballguy
Good news is that they have 2 1's and 2 2's next year. (plus their own 3 and THREE 4th rounders). So there's lots of opportunities to fill holes or trade up for someone they really like.
While some of the guys they have now are holding their own, I still think this team could really benefit from adding a high end talent at OLB or CB. I just dont think they can rely on Lawson coming back off an Achilles.
Would be REALLY if Carolina or Seattle go off the rails.
I'm not a big college football guy, but I haven't heard much about any REALLY high end running back prospects. Guess Spiller from A&M is the consensus top guy. I'll probably watch some of the Bama-A&M game this weekend, so I'll give him a look.
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Kiddnets
Footballguy
4 picks in the 1st 2 rds and about $70M will certainly help......I just think they could make a playoff run with some small tweaks to the D where the O is still in need of a big upgrade to OL and playmakers. Id feel a lot better if Carter and Elijah Moore showed some stud traits by the end of the season and Becton returns to form as well.....
jwb
Footballguy
You can also say we've already seen more fight than the Gase years. The O-line has (somehow) improved, and the D has played hard.
rockaction
Footballguy
Thread title is 
Great move in locking up Franklin-Myers. Huff is killing double teams, too. Saw it on the Twitters. Might want to get him more playing time here.
Great move in locking up Franklin-Myers. Huff is killing double teams, too. Saw it on the Twitters. Might want to get him more playing time here.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I hate to see injuries, but the Jets draft pick from Seattle being shaped, in part, by Geno Smith’s arm doesn’t seem like a bad thing.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
5 more Jets wins and I hit my over!
…it’s never gonna happen, is it.
…it’s never gonna happen, is it.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Yearly Breakdown for JFM: 2021: 920K 2022: 1.5M ($10M roster bonus due) 2023: $11.4M 2024: $13.3M 2025: $14.4M 30.2 million guaranteed with 14.8 fully guaranteed at signing. 500k annual roster bonuses with everything post 2022 salary wise unguaranteed @PFF_Brad @Jason_OTC
Another good signing by JD - by doing it now he finally locks up (mostly) homegrown talent which sends a positive message - and also under market value as any young player with his stats would get north of this on the free market.
Im also wondering if the Jets knew about Maye's awful DWI and that played a hand in no contract extension - his loudmouth agent should have kept his mouth shut chirping about the trade deadline when he knew this would come out eventually....doubt he fetches anything now....and crushed his market value in FA
Another good signing by JD - by doing it now he finally locks up (mostly) homegrown talent which sends a positive message - and also under market value as any young player with his stats would get north of this on the free market.
Im also wondering if the Jets knew about Maye's awful DWI and that played a hand in no contract extension - his loudmouth agent should have kept his mouth shut chirping about the trade deadline when he knew this would come out eventually....doubt he fetches anything now....and crushed his market value in FA
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Watching last night's game -
I am so hppy JD traded Adams before he was exposed - what is Seattle doing not only trading an obscene haul for him but then paying him that much....the guy has shown he cant cover at all which is kinda bad for a safety. Nothing but love Jamal - thx for the haul
As for the Wilson injury - hes a fun player to watch so not cheering his injury at all - but the reality is Seattle looks shaky as it is....if he missed extended time you are looking at a much higher pick than expected. Thats something that usually doesnt happen for the Jets - Im expecting the Carolina pick to be bottom of the 2d rd. Just something to watch...Geno only flashed because LA wasnt prepared for him....if he has to play extended time it will be vintage Geno.
I am so hppy JD traded Adams before he was exposed - what is Seattle doing not only trading an obscene haul for him but then paying him that much....the guy has shown he cant cover at all which is kinda bad for a safety. Nothing but love Jamal - thx for the haul
As for the Wilson injury - hes a fun player to watch so not cheering his injury at all - but the reality is Seattle looks shaky as it is....if he missed extended time you are looking at a much higher pick than expected. Thats something that usually doesnt happen for the Jets - Im expecting the Carolina pick to be bottom of the 2d rd. Just something to watch...Geno only flashed because LA wasnt prepared for him....if he has to play extended time it will be vintage Geno.
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trader jake
Footballguy
Thought that same thing during the game last night.Kiddnets said:
...
What's the word on LB Quincy Williams? His box numbers look great, but what do the Jets fans think about him thus far? Any chance the team stumbled into a long-term keeper?
TLEF316
Footballguy
To me, the guy seems like mostly a 1 dimensional heat seeking missile. He's fast and tough and not afraid to just lay someone out.
It seems like that mentality (while very effective at times) causes him to miss out on some potential plays. There were a couple of times last week where a pass was floated or deflected in his direction and he didn't even make a play on the ball (since he was just so intent on laying out the intended target). I think he made one play in coverage late in the game, but I'm not 100% sure that was him.
I do worry that the Titans showed the rest of the league a little bit of a blue print in terms of how to beat the Jets. Their Front 4 is REALLY aggressive, as is Williams. Mosley is a little more versatile but still isn't great in coverage. If I'm scheming against the Jets D, I'm trying screens and dump offs to RB's until they prove they can stop it.
The young corners haven't been the weakness we feared they would be, but this defense isn't talented enough on the back end to stop the passing game completely. I think there's a weakness there that teams are going to try harder to exploit going forward
rockaction
Footballguy
Uhhhh...
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
The team is letting Zach down. That o-lineman dropped a ball that hit him right in the back of the helmet.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
He has been neck and neck with Lawrence- unfortunately because they both have looked terrible.
rockaction
Footballguy
And they were playing so soft. There wasn't even an attempt to rally to the ball because they couldn't get there.
Chemical X
Footballguy
so bereft of talent. would love to see this team employ a TE in the next 10 years. still not part of the league.
TLEF316
Footballguy
Missed the first half of the game, but its not like the 2nd half was THAT much better. Defense was good (in the 2nd) until they rolled over and died on the last drive.
The offense seems to have no plan and Wilson can't make simple throws. The first few weeks you could chalk it up to poor pass pro. That hasn't been the case lately. From what I can see, the only 2 sacks Zach took were the two late game ones where he was running around 15 yards behind the LOS.
Hard to believe we actually believed in this "system" based on the way they called plays during the pre-season. Just proves (although we obviously always knew it anyway) that pre-season doesn't mean anything. LeFleur better fix this crap after the bye.
Does Zach have elite weapons? Of course not. But he has a capable stable of WR's and he just can't find them. Right now he's all flashy roll out throws and just zero consistency on the plays any quarterback (even a rookie QB) should be able to make with their eyes closed.
They've got 2 weeks to figure out what the heck is wrong on the offensive side of the ball. Again...rookie Qb....not throwing dirt on him by any means. But the nightmare scenario I anticipated (regarding Wilson) is pretty much playing out to the letter.
The offense seems to have no plan and Wilson can't make simple throws. The first few weeks you could chalk it up to poor pass pro. That hasn't been the case lately. From what I can see, the only 2 sacks Zach took were the two late game ones where he was running around 15 yards behind the LOS.
Hard to believe we actually believed in this "system" based on the way they called plays during the pre-season. Just proves (although we obviously always knew it anyway) that pre-season doesn't mean anything. LeFleur better fix this crap after the bye.
Does Zach have elite weapons? Of course not. But he has a capable stable of WR's and he just can't find them. Right now he's all flashy roll out throws and just zero consistency on the plays any quarterback (even a rookie QB) should be able to make with their eyes closed.
They've got 2 weeks to figure out what the heck is wrong on the offensive side of the ball. Again...rookie Qb....not throwing dirt on him by any means. But the nightmare scenario I anticipated (regarding Wilson) is pretty much playing out to the letter.
rockaction
Footballguy
Today was just awful. I mean, missing easy throws. Looking out of sorts. Light years behind a Herbert or Hurts, even.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Not good....seems like last week was a mirage or more of a let down by the Titans without 2 of their best players....Atlanta is not good and they dominated the Jets without their 2 best WRs.
Theme of this week is coaching and QB....
Coaching - this is now a pattern - team comes out flat...adjusts at the half and makes a run but usually too far behind. I mean Gase scored almost every opening drive - something is not right here and its not all Wilson. This is on Saleh and ML to take the bye week and figure out what is going on.
QB - I get Wilson is a rookie doing rookie things - cant expect them all to come firing out of the gate like Herbert - although it would be nice for once in 50 yrs! - problem is he's getting better protection and making sub rookie mistakes. I mean hitting guys in the back of the head...grounding balls or firing over wide open receivers.....looking way more like Browning Nagle with a rocket arm that doesnt know where its going and have no insight on defenses. I think JDs biggest gaffe was not bringing in a vet Qb....he simply has to rectify this over the bye....I dont know if they necessarily need to sit Wilson down a week or 2 but he absolutely needs someone who has been there before to talk him through some of this stuff before he is beyond repair. They had a ton of space for a real vet QB....just a terrible decision not bringing one in....sign someone today.
Theme of this week is coaching and QB....
Coaching - this is now a pattern - team comes out flat...adjusts at the half and makes a run but usually too far behind. I mean Gase scored almost every opening drive - something is not right here and its not all Wilson. This is on Saleh and ML to take the bye week and figure out what is going on.
QB - I get Wilson is a rookie doing rookie things - cant expect them all to come firing out of the gate like Herbert - although it would be nice for once in 50 yrs! - problem is he's getting better protection and making sub rookie mistakes. I mean hitting guys in the back of the head...grounding balls or firing over wide open receivers.....looking way more like Browning Nagle with a rocket arm that doesnt know where its going and have no insight on defenses. I think JDs biggest gaffe was not bringing in a vet Qb....he simply has to rectify this over the bye....I dont know if they necessarily need to sit Wilson down a week or 2 but he absolutely needs someone who has been there before to talk him through some of this stuff before he is beyond repair. They had a ton of space for a real vet QB....just a terrible decision not bringing one in....sign someone today.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Yeah, that was odd. I think the "mentoring" aspect is a little over-rated but not having the option to pull Wilson in a game like he had in New England is not ideal.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Also, I think Carolina is wishing they did not pick up that 5th year option on Sam now - 5 interceptions in the last 2 games.
sheerterror
Footballguy
sheerterror
Footballguy
Moved Sam for Deshaun Watson in Dynasty middle of last week (own Mahomes and can wait out Watson situation). Felt good to sell that pixie dust.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Yes, I said something similar earlier. It’s unfortunate for Wilson but of course fortunate for us. Even if Geno has a resurgence and plays well he’s obviously a big drop from Wilson. It has a shot to be real ugly in Seattle though. Seattle isn’t really a good team right now even with Russell.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
rent. free.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
I take no pleasure in seeing Darnold fail....but Adams is another story....guy was a 1st class tool forcing his way out. Watching him brag as usual in his intro followed by making zero impact plays except for a sure int bouncing off his head was pleasing...
I dont expect it to stay this way but as of now Jets have the #6 and #10 picks in the 1st round
I dont expect it to stay this way but as of now Jets have the #6 and #10 picks in the 1st round
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I'm mostly having fun with Sam, since certain Carolina fans got so butt-hurt by honest evaluations of his game after he got traded. Hopefully they're starting to see it wasn't just "sour grapes". The guy just isn't a good NFL QB despite all the excuses made for him.
The Jets are getting their second round pick so Panther losses are also good for the Jets.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Agreed - just dont have the malice toward Sam like I do Adams. Kind of like watching Geno struggle last pm....not surprising but only happy because it helps the picks....I am actually happy to see Adams be exposed though.
As for Sam - IMO - Car did a bad job not fortifying the OL for him. He has been shown to struggle and see ghosts when under tremendous pressure. They really should have drafted Slater over the CB. But you are correct - no more excuses for Sam...he has better weapons and coaching...he should be able to handle a below average OL as of now...unfortunately he just is who he is..decent stopgap/hold fort guy but nowhere near a franchise QB. Jets brass made a mistake in drafting him but at least cut bait before it was too late like Sanchez Who knows if Wilson will be a real franchise QB but I think its clear he has more of that potential in him than Sam.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Well, with a pretty young team and weapons, other than maybe CMC, an average stop gap type QB isn't a bad idea as you build the defense (which is looking good) and the OL (which is not). So I think the Panthers made a nice move getting him and he doesn't need to be a top 10 QB to be valuable for them. Of course, it would be better if he turns into that. I do think he can be better than he was on the Jets, which was the point of the discussion. I'd give it most of the season to see how it goes. He had a ton of passes dropped yesterday, most of which were right on target. But he also didn't look in command of the offense until the end of the game.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
He looked great on that last drive, but was horrible otherwise - but it’s good to see that people still make excuses for him. He also had two (more) interceptions dropped in that game but I guess only drops that hurt him fit your narrative.
I bear no ill will towards him or Panther fans but I do feel that you (and one other guy) didn’t want to hear any honest evaluations of a football player (in HIS topic on a fantasy football board no less) and instead wanted to laugh at the “stupid bitter Jets fans” and jump on the lazy “blame Gase” narrative.
You particularly were also overly giddy - while laughing at old posts- after his 3-0 start against 3 of the worst teams in the league while he was racking up unsustainable rushing TDs and dumping off passes to CMc, which bumped up his numbers and covered some flaws.
Now he’s lost three in a row (while throwing 6 interceptions in those games) and looking lost for large stretches of the game - mixed in with a series or two where he flashes.
This is what Sam is, and that’s all anyone was trying to say - but of course it was just “sour grapes” and him living in our heads, “rent. free.” It’s nice to see you humbled a bit. I love the irony to be honest.
He’s still actually very young and may turn it back around again. He does have good talent around him and what looks like a good coaching staff - but right now giving up a second while also picking up that $20MM fifth year option looks like a blunder. I predicted he would be benched at some point and I still feel that way. We’ll see.
Obviously the Jets are still a laughing stock and haven’t shown the ability to be a competitive NFL team in years - and they still may not have a franchise QB on their roster - but trading Sam away was at the time the right move and I think by seasons end it will look even better.
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