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If that’s the case he can do what I said.   He’s doing this instead because he knows she can’t say yes or every dog-whistling idiot with a fan base would feel like they could buy their way onto t

Yea, making sure everyone has access to healthcare is just as disgusting as white supremacy.  

Republican Rep. Ted Yoho on Saturday resigned from the board of the Christian anti-poverty organization Bread for the World days after he verbally attacked Democratic Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.

Just now, IC FBGCav said:

I don't think so.

Maybe I misread her or misunderstood you.

It seems like she was saying medicare will cause long wait times so countries like Canada and the UK have kept the option to also buy private insurance for non-routine procedures.

And you wrote - "Medicare for all is my number one policy proirity .  I think it is the least we can do and it saves money.  You can get increased coverage privately.  No problem with that."

 

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1 minute ago, whoknew said:

Maybe I misread her or misunderstood you.

It seems like she was saying medicare will cause long wait times so countries like Canada and the UK have kept the option to also buy private insurance for non-routine procedures.

And you wrote - "Medicare for all is my number one policy proirity .  I think it is the least we can do and it saves money.  You can get increased coverage privately.  No problem with that."

 

There are not long wait times in those countries for life threatening conditions.  If you want to pay more to get elective tests or procedures done.  Go for it.

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I hear all these horror stories about Canadians waiting for service (mostly by people that have never even visited Canada), yet I have never heard a horror story of a Canadian going bankrupt due to medical cost.  Wonder why??

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9 minutes ago, yak651 said:

I hear all these horror stories about Canadians waiting for service (mostly by people that have never even visited Canada), yet I have never heard a horror story of a Canadian going bankrupt due to medical cost.  Wonder why??

Because their medical bills are covered. 

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21 hours ago, yak651 said:

I hear all these horror stories about Canadians waiting for service (mostly by people that have never even visited Canada), yet I have never heard a horror story of a Canadian going bankrupt due to medical cost.  Wonder why??

Canadians bankrupcy rates have been very similar to ours over the last few decades, but are on the verge of surging past us at alarming rates.  Their household debt-to-income ratio tracked with ours for many years, but now they are 50% higher than we are.  One-third of Canadians now live in fear of bankruptcy,  Some more recent numbers from Canada.

- Number of Canadians who say they don’t make enough to cover their bills and debt obligations increased by 7 points to 31%

- Number of Canadians within $200 of insolvency increased by 6 points to 46%

- Number of Canadians who say they are feeling the effects of interest rate increases jumped 6 points to 51%

- Number of Canadians concerned about their ability to repay debts increased 5 points to 57% 

The number of bankruptcies in the US caused by medical costs have been grossly overstated in the past.  The 50% figure often cited during the Obamacare debate stemmed from reserach done by Elizabeth Warren.  Better numbers from a study published in the New England Journal of Medicine put the figure at 4%.  Considering the Obamacare numbers overstated things by a factor of twelve, you can call that propaganda.  

 

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5 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

Canadians bankrupcy rates have been very similar to ours over the last few decades, but are on the verge of surging past us at alarming rates.  Their household debt-to-income ratio tracked with ours for many years, but now they are 50% higher than we are.  One-third of Canadians now live in fear of bankruptcy,  Some more recent numbers from Canada.

- Number of Canadians who say they don’t make enough to cover their bills and debt obligations increased by 7 points to 31%

- Number of Canadians within $200 of insolvency increased by 6 points to 46%

- Number of Canadians who say they are feeling the effects of interest rate increases jumped 6 points to 51%

- Number of Canadians concerned about their ability to repay debts increased 5 points to 57% 

The number of bankruptcies in the US caused by medical costs have been grossly overstated in the past.  The 50% figure often cited during the Obamacare debate stemmed from reserach done by Elizabeth Warren.  Better numbers from a study published in the New England Journal of Medicine put the figure at 4%.  Considering the Obamacare numbers overstated things by a factor of twelve, you can call that propaganda.  

 

It’s not going to get better any time soon either.  They are sitting on a massive housing bubble.

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On 2/6/2019 at 2:53 PM, Sinn Fein said:
On 2/6/2019 at 2:41 PM, Don't Noonan said:

I already have, will cost over $3 trillion and referrals to specialists you can expect to wait 2-3 months before seeing  doctor.  No thanks!

How does that compare to the current costs of medical care: Insurance + Government 

What is the difference, and what causes the difference?

Did we ever get an answer to this?

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3 minutes ago, The Narrator said:

She's been in office a month and already has her name on significant legislation. 

AOC is not here to #### around. 

To be fair, I think its a non-binding resolution.

 

But, I think what is important - and impressive for any Freshman congresswoman - she is moving the needle on the national conversation.  When she first suggested a 70% tax rate - people snickered.  Now, the right is scared, because a lot of the mainstream conversation has been - "You know what?  70% on income over $10M makes sense."

I think the same thing is taking place with the Green New Deal - it will start out as "unrealistic" - but then it will normalize, and this will probably be a key issue in the 2020 races.

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23 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

I think the same thing is taking place with the Green New Deal - it will start out as "unrealistic" - but then it will normalize, and this will probably be a key issue in the 2020 races.

It’s interesting you used the word “unrealistic.” Things are only “unrealistic” if people complain and make excuses for why it is. The Green New Deal is not unrealistic and when more details spring forward, people will say to themselves, “we can do this.” After all, we did land on the moon. 

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7 minutes ago, Mario Kart said:

It’s interesting you used the word “unrealistic.” Things are only “unrealistic” if people complain and make excuses for why it is. The Green New Deal is not unrealistic and when more details spring forward, people will say to themselves, “we can do this.” After all, we did land on the moon. 

Its also why I put it in quotes - and then went on to say it will be normalized - meaning people will accept that these issues are legitimate and achievable - and it will be an important issue in 2020.

 

 

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54 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Its also why I put it in quotes - and then went on to say it will be normalized - meaning people will accept that these issues are legitimate and achievable - and it will be an important issue in 2020.

Conservative talk radio in Milwaukee right now is harping about The Green New Deal. Dude is over exaggerating and/or misrepresenting how things can get done. Zero clue, sad. 

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58 minutes ago, Mario Kart said:

Conservative talk radio in Milwaukee right now is harping about The Green New Deal. Dude is over exaggerating and/or misrepresenting how things can get done. Zero clue, sad. 

Yep and then people like my neighbor runs with it thinking what he heard is 100% true.  I just bite my tongue and try to change the topic if politics come up, if can't change direction of conversation just say I have to go to eat or some other excuse.

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On 2/6/2019 at 1:41 PM, Don't Noonan said:

I already have, will cost over $3 trillion and referrals to specialists you can expect to wait 2-3 months before seeing  doctor.  No thanks!

Advocates of capitalism are very apt to appeal to the sacred principles of liberty, which are embodied in one maxim: The fortunate must not be restrained in the exercise of tyranny over the unfortunate.

- Bertrand Russell

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3 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I feel like I'm watching an episode of the Flinitstones. 

Yes - but I think once we get the dinosaurs out of office, the younger generation has a bold and ambitious agenda to move us out of the stone age.

Less Fred and Barney, more Pebbles and Bam Bam.

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6 minutes ago, rockaction said:

One trillion dollars in debt right now (approx.)

AOC = Gazillion in debt  --- No planes, no cars, retrofit all buildings to meet guidelines of green new deal.  What the nation needs are real ideas, not fantasies that are not economically possible.   She's the gift that keeps on giving however.  It's enjoyable to watch.

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5 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Yes - but I think once we get the dinosaurs out of office, the younger generation has a bold and ambitious agenda to move us out of the stone age.

Less Fred and Barney, more Pebbles and Bam Bam.

Did you consider the US to be in the stone age just over 2 years ago when Obama was President?

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1 minute ago, jamny said:

Did you consider the US to be in the stone age just over 2 years ago when Obama was President?

No, and they got their health care bill. It'll never end. Trust me. Not with this crew. 

 

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2 minutes ago, jamny said:

Funny, I didn't hear too much of that when he was in office. I'll take your word for it though.

I was a big supporter of Bernie - on the basis of his wealth inequality stances - I think he has the right ideas here.

I am a big supporter of renewable energy - not because I am a tree-hugger - but because it makes too much financial sense not to move in that direction.

Medicare for All (or Single-Payer if you prefer) - i think it will lower the overall costs of the healthcare system - I think healthcare is generally one of the biggest wastes of national resources we have going.

 

I liked Obama - but I wish he had done more.  I wish that he had the foresight to focus on 21st century infrastructure - it is borderline criminal that we are not subsidizing high-speed internet across the country - that is the infrastructure we need to stay competitive in a global economy - we are the wealthiest nation in the world - but we need to be doing a better job using that wealth to investing in our future.

I also recognize that Obama was up against a GOP congress for 6 years - which meant that those agendas would have been DOA - but I think Obama should have pushed harder.

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Just now, Sinn Fein said:

I am a big supporter of renewable energy - not because I am a tree-hugger - but because it makes too much financial sense not to move in that direction.

Medicare for All (or Single-Payer if you prefer) - i think it will lower the overall costs of the healthcare system - I think healthcare is generally one of the biggest wastes of national resources we have going.

 

 

Renewable energy costs significantly more than fossil fuels. The Green New Deal would eliminate fossil fuels from all electricity generation and transportation, forcing Americans to rely largely on expensive and unreliable renewable technologies like wind and solar power.  The Institute for Energy Research estimates that new solar power generation is nearly five times more expensive than using existing fossil fuel-powered electricity. Wind power is 3.5 times costlier.  These higher costs would drive up the price of all goods and services, not just electricity bills. And because all manufacturing would also be required to rely on “green” power, industries in the United States would struggle to match the prices of their foreign competitors, forcing some businesses to either close or move overseas.

Medicare for all - 32 trillion dollars just by itself. 

 

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11 minutes ago, JuniorNB said:

She's doing an even better job of keeping you up at night

#strangeobsession

It's a political subforum. This -- this -- place is where we talk about politics and politicians.  

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5 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

I was a big supporter of Bernie - on the basis of his wealth inequality stances - I think he has the right ideas here.

I am a big supporter of renewable energy - not because I am a tree-hugger - but because it makes too much financial sense not to move in that direction.

Medicare for All (or Single-Payer if you prefer) - i think it will lower the overall costs of the healthcare system - I think healthcare is generally one of the biggest wastes of national resources we have going.

 

I liked Obama - but I wish he had done more.  I wish that he had the foresight to focus on 21st century infrastructure - it is borderline criminal that we are not subsidizing high-speed internet across the country - that is the infrastructure we need to stay competitive in a global economy - we are the wealthiest nation in the world - but we need to be doing a better job using that wealth to investing in our future.

I also recognize that Obama was up against a GOP congress for 6 years - which meant that those agendas would have been DOA - but I think Obama should have pushed harder.

Obama was reactive, not pro-active. I was criticized here for calling him a "do nothing President" on multiple occasions but it becomes more apparent as time goes by. Yes, he had a combative opponent in Congress but so did many previous Presidents. He rarely seemed to really fight for things and his supporters couldn't stop fawning over him long enough to realize that they should be holding his feet to the fire more often. I give him credit for creating a solid foundation for our current economy but there were so many missed opportunities.

 

/hijack...back to AOC.

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2 minutes ago, rockaction said:

It's a political subforum. This -- this -- place is where we talk about politics and politicians.  

This thread goes in predictable cycles:

Poster 1: I love AOC!!!

Poster 2: Look at this tweet!!!  She OWNED that guy!!!

Poster 3: I can't wait until 2024!!! [Note: Huh?  She's going to primary an incumbent Democratic president?  Or is Trump getting reelected?]

Poster 4: I want to have sex with this chick!!!

Random Conservative: Her policy ideas are a little out there.

Chorus: OMG U SO OBSESSED!!!

You just have to get used to it.

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5 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Medicare for all - 32 trillion dollars just by itself. 

Lets start here - because I don't know the answer.

 

Is that more, or less, than what we are currently spending, in toto, for health care in the United States.  If you think that is more than we are currently spending - why is there a difference?

 

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6 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

This thread goes in predictable cycles:

Poster 1: I love AOC!!!

Poster 2: Look at this tweet!!!  She OWNED that guy!!!

Poster 3: I can't wait until 2024!!! [Note: Huh?  She's going to primary an incumbent Democratic president?  Or is Trump getting reelected?]

Poster 4: I want to have sex with this chick!!!

Random Conservative: Her policy ideas are a little out there.

Chorus: OMG U SO OBSESSED!!!

You just have to get used to it.

Gotcha. Somehow, I can see that coming from here.  

eta* I took a hiatus from all politics for six months, completely even missing the Kavanaugh hysteria that filtered down. I was happy.  

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16 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Renewable energy costs significantly more than fossil fuels. The Green New Deal would eliminate fossil fuels from all electricity generation and transportation, forcing Americans to rely largely on expensive and unreliable renewable technologies like wind and solar power.  The Institute for Energy Research estimates that new solar power generation is nearly five times more expensive than using existing fossil fuel-powered electricity. Wind power is 3.5 times costlier.  These higher costs would drive up the price of all goods and services, not just electricity bills. And because all manufacturing would also be required to rely on “green” power, industries in the United States would struggle to match the prices of their foreign competitors, forcing some businesses to either close or move overseas.

And - on this - I think you are being far too short-sighted.

One of the primary reasons why I am in favor of moving in this direction is the innovation opportunities - to get the jump on becoming experts in newer, more efficient technologies - and then exporting those technologies.

The world evolves - and it seems to be accelerating every year.  When you have the wealth to invest - that is the time to spend national resources towards the next big thing.  You don't want to be playing catch-up, because you were content with the status quo and let the world pass you by.

You don't have to believe in human-influenced climate change (you should, but don't have to) to recognize the long-term economic opportunity of continuing to evolve.

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