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So how many millions is Kaepernick going to win in his case vs the NFL? (1 Viewer)

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Well, that bit of hyperbole is completely untrue. 

Sure white people make up the vast majority of those who oppose Kap's position, but there are plenty of Hispanics, Indians, and Asians who oppose how Kaepernick went about his protest.  Even some black NFL players opposed how he went about it.  Here's one, and here's another.

Your condemnation of white America on the whole might have made sense if 99% of white people were against Kap, but that's not what we see.  We see a sizable minority of whites siding with Kap in this forum and in America on the whole.

The way you frame your argument helps reinforce the division you presumably want to end.
So......there's that 1%.  Thanks for supporting.

 
Gimme a break.  White america is guilty of using far worse terms.  nothing but hypocrisy and fragile egos.
Wait a minute.....are you for progress or a revolution?  Your rhetoric suggests the latter.....

So essentially youre saying you want every white person in America to admit how much they suck for being white and priveleged......and when "white" America tells you to pound sand, you can say "typical white America".....got it

I think you are misplacing your anger.....most of "white" America is not part of the big money that runs this country and keeps us fighting about emotional topics, while they keep getting wealthier......but GL with that

 
Wait a minute.....are you for progress or a revolution?  Your rhetoric suggests the latter.....

So essentially youre saying you want every white person in America to admit how much they suck for being white and priveleged......and when "white" America tells you to pound sand, you can say "typical white America".....got it

I think you are misplacing your anger.....most of "white" America is not part of the big money that runs this country and keeps us fighting about emotional topics, while they keep getting wealthier......but GL with that
How in the hell did you get that from my statement?  Insinuating things doesn't make them true.  Apparently, you're very oppressed from being white.  

BTW.....weren't you out after your last post?

 
I'm sayin one more thing then I'm out...

For any of this "movement" to work there will need to be an ALL inclusive dialog....the current undertone in our country is heading in a very negative direction.....it doesn't have to, but it is.

We need leaders who are not using terms like "white America"......this automatically offends, and makes people defensive.....it does no good.

People need to stop living in the past, and look towards the future.....If we keep talking about how our forfeathers owned slaves, and we keep trying to erase our history, we are destined to repeat it.....I think beyond a few very racist groups, most Americans want the same thing...
These are two diametrically opposed ideas combined into one thought.

 
I’m not a lawyer, but if teams and the league got hundreds of letters from fans saying they would give up season tickets or sponsors would bail immediately if a team signed Kaepernick, how could a team be expected to sign him? It’s still a business, and I don’t see how a court could force a business to make a business decision that would cause them to lose money. 

 
So......there's that 1%.  Thanks for supporting.
I'd be willing to guess that 99% of white liberals support Kap.....Hyperbole, but you get the point. I think this is much more about the perceived disrespect of the flag than a race issue.

 
These are two diametrically opposed ideas combined into one thought.
Yea, I don't always express things how I want especially in typing........the point being the progressive left wants to disregard all positive aspects of our forefathers and focus on the negative.....while it should never be trivialized, or made light of, it was a different time......those times cannot be compared to today.......the fallout is now we should destroy statues, denounce all our forefathers because they were slave owners.......erase them from history.....it is a slippery slope, and a scary one that creates a mob mentality that does no good 

 
So......there's that 1%.  Thanks for supporting.
Well, feel free to keep believing that 99% of the people opposed to Kaepernick's means of protest are white, but your feelings don't change reality.

Here's the reality:

"The poll, released this week, showed that white Americans of all ages disapprove of the protests by a margin of 63 percent to 30 percent. Hispanic Americans disapprove of the protests by a smaller margin, 45 percent to 36 percent. However, black Americans of all ages approve of the protests 74 percent to 17 percent."

PBS

 
 What's more upsetting is the nonsensical killing that's trying to be brought to your attention doesn't bother you.  Just white America being white America.
The players aren't protesting nonsensical killing. If they were, they'd be more concerned about black-on-black homicides and why the vast percentage of crimes proportionally occur in African American neighborhoods and among African Americans. That's what makes this whole "protest" angle such a farce. 

 
I'd be willing to guess that 99% of white liberals support Kap.....Hyperbole, but you get the point. I think this is much more about the perceived disrespect of the flag than a race issue.
I'd say it's 100%, seeing as thought the very definition of liberal is associated with discarding traditions and embracing change.  Your opinion is off base.  The reason for the kneeling has been stated over and over.

 
Yea, I don't always express things how I want especially in typing........the point being the progressive left wants to disregard all positive aspects of our forefathers and focus on the negative.....while it should never be trivialized, or made light of, it was a different time......those times cannot be compared to today.......the fallout is now we should destroy statues, denounce all our forefathers because they were slave owners.......erase them from history.....it is a slippery slope, and a scary one that creates a mob mentality that does no good 
I'm sort of a pragmatist, not a purist with this stuff.  There is great irony worth discussing that:

1. the same guy who wrote, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness,"

2. owned slaves and was a virulent racist to his dying day.

I see reason in the argument that if we have public monuments to people like that--monuments that ONLY talk about the parts of history that make us feel warm and fuzzy about our history--then we are only telling one part of the story.  Shouldn't we be publicly discussing both sides of this story?  Short of that just seems dishonest.  And I could see how a whole section of people in our country would feel--because we have chosen to only publicly memorialize "the good stuff"--like their history is being devalued or elbowed out.

I'm not a "tear down the monuments" guy... but I am a "we could add some context to these monuments to help make our public treatment of history more honest" guy.

 
Well, feel free to keep believing that 99% of the people opposed to Kaepernick's means of protest are white, but your feelings don't change reality.

Here's the reality:

"The poll, released this week, showed that white Americans of all ages disapprove of the protests by a margin of 63 percent to 30 percent. Hispanic Americans disapprove of the protests by a smaller margin, 45 percent to 36 percent. However, black Americans of all ages approve of the protests 74 percent to 17 percent."

PBS
My undergrad is in sociology, so I'm familiar with polls and surveys.  They don't represent the nation as a whole.  I get it though.  My statement is a little exaggerated, but I'm basing it more on those that I know.  I only know one veteran who disapproves, and he's a cousin who served 3 tours in Iraq.  He has some serious mental and anger issues though.  Including friends, family, and people from high school who have served, I don't know of anyone else that opposes.  I also don't know anyone who isn't caucasian that disapproves. 

 
The players aren't protesting nonsensical killing. If they were, they'd be more concerned about black-on-black homicides and why the vast percentage of crimes proportionally occur in African American neighborhoods and among African Americans. That's what makes this whole "protest" angle such a farce. 
Ah, so their words mean nothing and your OPINION is superior.  That's good to know.  I'll make sure to let everyone know from now on that my opinion trumps everyone else.

 
I'd say it's 100%, seeing as thought the very definition of liberal is associated with discarding traditions and embracing change.  Your opinion is off base.  The reason for the kneeling has been stated over and over.
The biggest problem I see with the progressive movement is their expression of intellectual superiority......this gets in the way of truly trying to understand why people feel or believe the way they do..... when middle America is routinely lumped into a "rural, uneducated, bumpkin, trumpster" stereotype, youre going to get a lot of push back.......as a socialist major you prolly have a better understanding than the typical liberal progressive......and I get that this in turn happens with conservatives.

My point being that the people who will lead us out of this will be those who will not marginalize any group in our country....Zachary R. Wood is a dude that I heard on talk radio (has a book out) that seems to have the mindset that we need......he's a liberal Democrat by the way...

 
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Unemployed lol. He made 39M in the nfl. 
True, plus Kaepernick may make even more than $39M from this Nike campaign.

Attorney Mark Geragos represents Kaepernick in both his lawsuit against the NFL and his negotiations with Nike.  Geragos also has a podcast with Adam Carolla called Reasonable Doubt.  On the most recent episode of Reasonable Doubt Geragos suggested that Nike's current Kaepernick campaign is just the tip of a multi-year campaign that will include a Kaepernick apparel and sneaker line.

Carolla then asked Geragos if Kaepernick will ultimately make more money being out of football as a martyr figure then he would had he stayed in football.  Geragos said that he had pondered that question, but he ultimately didn't give an answer.

Here's that podcast if anyone is interested:

https://www.podcastone.com/episode/RD-162---Stand-For-Something

 
I’m not a lawyer, but if teams and the league got hundreds of letters from fans saying they would give up season tickets or sponsors would bail immediately if a team signed Kaepernick, how could a team be expected to sign him? It’s still a business, and I don’t see how a court could force a business to make a business decision that would cause them to lose money. 
That's not what the case is about. It is about whether two or more teams colluded to not sign Kaep. The burden of proof rests IIRC on Kaep's legal team

 
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This is dumb to even type out but.....but do you think the NFL is the only place he can find employment? 
Gotcha, I was referring to the one profession he had his whole life. Sure, maybe one day in the future he becomes a CPA or you count Nike using him as their political puppet as a career. He’s unemployed from the one career he has ever had....sorry for not making future assumptions for you. 

 
Gotcha, I was referring to the one profession he had his whole life. Sure, maybe one day in the future he becomes a CPA or you count Nike using him as their political puppet as a career. He’s unemployed from the one career he has ever had....sorry for not making future assumptions for you. 
But he’s employed by Nike probably making close to what he made in the nfl.

You can make your dumb unemployment line jokes all you want but dude is getting paid and is winning. 

 
But he’s employed by Nike probably making close to what he made in the nfl.

You can make your dumb unemployment line jokes all you want but dude is getting paid and is winning. 
Being exploited by Nike for profit for purely political reasons as you suck at football is a job now....nice.  :lmao:

Good for him, dude was pouting cause Blaine Gabbert owned him and has parlayed it into cashing in on the anti Trump crazies and will get a big bite out of the NFL to go away I bet. Well played for sure. 

 
It’s not true that he didn’t opt out of his contract?

“if he hadn't opted out of his contract.”

ok, I guess I’m foolish, apparently he didn’t opt out.
You didn't read the article apparently, so yes you are foolish.  Lynch went on record to say he would have been cut if he didn't opt out.  I've been looking to find the answer and haven't yet, but I think that means he gets more guaranteed money.  I could be wrong.

 
You didn't read the article apparently, so yes you are foolish.  Lynch went on record to say he would have been cut if he didn't opt out.  I've been looking to find the answer and haven't yet, but I think that means he gets more guaranteed money.  I could be wrong.
Yep, thanks. Like I’ve said all along, he opted out. 

 
Maybe I am misremembering, but didn't Kaep first kneel after he was officially benched?
That's correct.  

Kaepernick's original sitting for the anthem, both the timing and rationale, kills some of the narratives about his protest.

"He started a conversation about police brutality."

No, he originally sat for the anthem in August 2016.  The Ferguson riots and Baltimore riots over alleged police brutality were in 2015.  The national conversation over police brutality had consumed America for well over a year before Kaepernick allegedly started a conversation about the topic.

"He sacrificed everything."

Then why did he wait until he was benched to protest an issue that was being nationally discussed for over a year when he was a starter?  Presumably he didn't want to sacrifice his starting position, but was more willing to take a position that may cause a distraction for the team when he was benched.

He was also allegedly offered a back-up role in Seattle after his protest so he could have still been in the league if he so chose.

Now he's making millions from Nike and is invited to red carpet events primarily because he's viewed as a martyr figure.

So what exactly did he sacrifice?

"Kaepernick's protest has nothing to do with the flag."

This was the first sentence out of Kaepernick's mouth when asked about sitting for the anthem in August 2016:  "“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses Black people and people of color."

So, yeah, Kap did intend to disrespect a flag that represents a country he believes disrespects black people.  If it wasn't about the flag or anthem that symbolize America then why do the protest during the anthem where people support the flag?

I understand Kap's position and commend him for taking action even if I disagree with the manner in which he has gone about it, I just hate the false narratives that we're told we have to accept as truth.

 
That's not what the case is about. It is about whether two or more teams colluded to not sign Kaep. The burden of proof rests IIRC on Kaep's legal team
Right. It's going to be interesting to see if they can prove this theory. Maybe I'm being obtuse but I just don't see why GMs or owners would have the conversation. 

Jones: "I might sign him if you do but if you don't I won't either"

Hunt: "we were thinking about it, he makes a good backup for Smith, great teammate. But if you won't sign him we won't either" 

Jones: "excellent, now I'll call Danny and you call Pat. He needs to get John back on track" 

Besides, all it would take here is one owner to not go along with the conspiracy. Unless they're going to argue that Roger goddell told everyone he'd go easy on the suspensions if Kap is unemployed. 

 
The biggest problem I see with the progressive movement is their expression of intellectual superiority......this gets in the way of truly trying to understand why people feel or believe the way they do..... when middle America is routinely lumped into a "rural, uneducated, bumpkin, trumpster" stereotype, youre going to get a lot of push back.......as a socialist major you prolly have a better understanding than the typical liberal progressive......and I get that this in turn happens with conservatives.
I think there’s a kernel of truth in there. I grew up in the rural Midwest & lived in midsize cities in Michigan before movingNYC 1999. I have always worked with folks who went the prep school / Ivy League or 7 Sisters path. I think part of the reason I retained my allegiance to the Lions - Red Wings - Tigers is I’ve never fully embraced the eastern elitism that is still very prevalent.

Not that all Dems are Ivy Leaguers, but I think it’s clear to even casual observers that the GOP understands what resonates. They’re pretty good at sloganeering & populism. The Democrats have a more nuanced approach & know policy should be carefully considered because of unintended consequences. Nobody has time for that, even though personally I think they’re often on the right side of history for a lot of things.

Seems like the biggest divide though is between Cities and burbs/rural areas. We are in an era of tribalism where people don’t really exchange ideas or try to compromise but just dig in their heels and back their side. I’ve studied American history all my life as a hobby & certainly we have seen this kind of divide before, but that was after 75 years of compromises and we were on the brink of civil war.

Guess the best you can hope for is to live in interesting times. In that sense we are quite blessed.

 
BassNBrew said:
If he "wins", does Dez or Ray Rice have a case?
TO was coming off a season where he had 983 yds and 9 TDS and teams didn’t sign him

Tebow took a 1-4 team that had just traded its top receiver into the second round of the playoffs and never started another game....

 
I think there’s a kernel of truth in there. I grew up in the rural Midwest & lived in midsize cities in Michigan before movingNYC 1999. I have always worked with folks who went the prep school / Ivy League or 7 Sisters path. I think part of the reason I retained my allegiance to the Lions - Red Wings - Tigers is I’ve never fully embraced the eastern elitism that is still very prevalent.

Not that all Dems are Ivy Leaguers, but I think it’s clear to even casual observers that the GOP understands what resonates. They’re pretty good at sloganeering & populism. The Democrats have a more nuanced approach & know policy should be carefully considered because of unintended consequences. Nobody has time for that, even though personally I think they’re often on the right side of history for a lot of things.

Seems like the biggest divide though is between Cities and burbs/rural areas. We are in an era of tribalism where people don’t really exchange ideas or try to compromise but just dig in their heels and back their side. I’ve studied American history all my life as a hobby & certainly we have seen this kind of divide before, but that was after 75 years of compromises and we were on the brink of civil war.

Guess the best you can hope for is to live in interesting times. In that sense we are quite blessed.
 Then there's college campuses....the lefts equivalent to small town conservative......the idealism is alluring....then you get out in the real world...ha

 
I'm just curious why the more anti-Kaepernick themed thread in the Shark Pool from a couple days ago was deleted, but the now more pro-Kaepernick themed thread in the Shark Pool remains.  Seems suspiciously selective.
Maybe because the OP in the “anti-kaepernick” topic made a blatantly false statement to start the topic? 

By comparison, this topic seems to be asking a valid question about the Kaepernick lawsuit, whether you agree with the OP’s take on it or not.

It’s engaged people in discussion as a result, which is seemingly the purpose of this forum. 

Seems like a pretty big difference.

 
He went 

2014: 8-8

2015: 2-6

2016: 1-10

Maybe the owners just didn’t want to hire a losing quarterback trending in the wrong direction.
Wins are not he accurate measure of a single player in a team sport, even the QB. They don’t list W-L record on player stats pages I’ve seen (I mostly use profootballreference.com). 

I’m not saying the argument can’t be made that Kaepernick isn’t a good NFL QB. Heck, you might even be able to make the argument that Kaepernkck isn’t better than 90% of the current backups in the NFL.

But with all due respect, you’ve failed to make those arguments by listing win/loss records. Heck, Dan Marino went from 14 wins to 12, to 8, to 6 - I guess he sucks & shouldn’t be in the HOF?  :unsure:

Maybe post up Kaepernck’s 2015-2016 QBR vs current NFL backups. Or his TD:INT ratio. 

Those statistics & evaluation methods would seem to make a far more compelling argument against employing Kaepernick, IMO. 

 
That's correct.  

Kaepernick's original sitting for the anthem, both the timing and rationale, kills some of the narratives about his protest.

"He started a conversation about police brutality."

No, he originally sat for the anthem in August 2016.  The Ferguson riots and Baltimore riots over alleged police brutality were in 2015.  The national conversation over police brutality had consumed America for well over a year before Kaepernick allegedly started a conversation about the topic.

"He sacrificed everything."

Then why did he wait until he was benched to protest an issue that was being nationally discussed for over a year when he was a starter?  Presumably he didn't want to sacrifice his starting position, but was more willing to take a position that may cause a distraction for the team when he was benched.

He was also allegedly offered a back-up role in Seattle after his protest so he could have still been in the league if he so chose.

Now he's making millions from Nike and is invited to red carpet events primarily because he's viewed as a martyr figure.

So what exactly did he sacrifice?

"Kaepernick's protest has nothing to do with the flag."

This was the first sentence out of Kaepernick's mouth when asked about sitting for the anthem in August 2016:  "“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses Black people and people of color."

So, yeah, Kap did intend to disrespect a flag that represents a country he believes disrespects black people.  If it wasn't about the flag or anthem that symbolize America then why do the protest during the anthem where people support the flag?

I understand Kap's position and commend him for taking action even if I disagree with the manner in which he has gone about it, I just hate the false narratives that we're told we have to accept as truth.
Except for the fact that it was a veteran who told Kaepernick he shoild kneel. 

Your entire narrative here is false. 

He did not “disrespect the flag”, he did not “disrespect the troops” and he most certainly did not “disrespect the anthem”

those are Trump admin talking points. If anyone is dividing the fan base, it’s Trump & his cohorts, not Collin Kaepernick.

And ironically, in doing so they’ve amplified the protest significantly. Oops.

Here’s the truth about Kaepernick’s kneeing, and who told him to do so. It’s right there on the google, so I’m not sure why this is difficult.  False narratives don’t serve either side of the debate, so maybe best to stick to the truth? 

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/veteran-kaepernick-take-a-knee-anthem/

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/heres-how-nate-boyer-got-colin-kaepernick-to-go-from-sitting-to-kneeling/amp/

As I said in the since-deleted topic: whether I agree with Kaepernick’s decision to do this or not, I’m glad we live in a country where our first amendment rights to freedom of speech (including protest) are guaranteed to us by the constitution.

I know a good number of active duty military & veterans (including among my family) and I’ve spoken with pretty much all of them about this, passionate football fan & patriotic American that I am. And every one of them believes in Kaepernick’s right to peaceful protest. Some have said they “fought for his right” to do so. 

Don’t let an Australian (Murdoch/FOX) decide for you what’s patriotic or not. They’re the network pushing the “kneeling is unpatriotic” narrative. Truth is this country was founded on protest.

Unless of course you think the early Americans were actually protesting the tea, and not taxation without representation?   :shrug:

 
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