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2020: The Race For the White House - The Good Place


Sinn Fein

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On 2/19/2020 at 6:58 AM, timschochet said:

Anyhow, I’ve already written my belief that if Bernie wins the nomination he will likely lose the election- see Jeremy Corbyn- though of course I hope I’m wrong about that. 

But even beyond that, his nomination makes me feel like there is no place for me, or people like me, in our political system at this time. It seems like on both sides the extremists have taken over. 

I guess I can't believe that an AVOWED socialist is going to be the candidate for Dems.  Extreme is a soft term for what that entails.

this is what we have come to?   free stuff if you vote for me.   let that sink in as a citizen in the greatest country in the world.

F/K/A irishidiot

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10 minutes ago, shadrap said:

not in my opinion.  they started the impeachment push on the day he was elected if not sooner.

I don't really have an answer, either. It seems like there were calls for impeachment and investigation as soon as he took office. That said, he seems to have left himself open to legitimate complaint.

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6 minutes ago, shadrap said:

I guess I can't believe that an AVOWED socialist is going to be the candidate for Dems.  Extreme is a soft term for what that entails.

this is what we have come to?   free stuff if you vote for me.   let that sink in as a citizen in the greatest country in the world.

F/K/A irishidiot

Thanks to the great patriots in the Democratic Party, this is being stopped.

Remember to thank them by voting for Joe Biden.

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18 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I don't really have an answer, either. It seems like there were calls for impeachment and investigation as soon as he took office. That said, he seems to have left himself open to legitimate complaint.

Trump won an election over all the blowhard, inside political connected, media included, Harvard experts, political poll experts, et al.   that is his crime.  

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Just now, shadrap said:

Trump won an election over all the blowhard, inside political connected, media included, Harvard experts, political poll experts, et al.   that is his crime.  

I think I'm pretty fair and even-handed about Trump and I think he is somebody who did things that should have caused him to be convicted and censured, not removed. I would have been assuaged if the Senate testimony was benign, but we never even got to hear it. Total sham.

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37 minutes ago, shadrap said:

not going to rehash, but appreciate the question.

Its not rehashing at all...its pointing out who you are referring to in your assertion.  Because its been shown many tomes over that any push right away was by the fringe...yet people keep repeating such things as if it was mainstream.

Why the new name?

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12 hours ago, shadrap said:

I guess I can't believe that an AVOWED socialist is going to be the candidate for Dems.  Extreme is a soft term for what that entails.

You can take comfort in the fact that his most popular policies aren't socialist I guess :shrug:

12 hours ago, shadrap said:

this is what we have come to?   free stuff if you vote for me.   let that sink in as a citizen in the greatest country in the world.

I'm 45 years old and this has been the case ever since I have been allowed to vote :shrug:  This and fear mongering are the greatest hits of our system...this isn't new.

Edited by The Commish
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13 hours ago, sho nuff said:

Its not rehashing at all...its pointing out who you are referring to in your assertion.  Because its been shown many tomes over that any push right away was by the fringe...yet people keep repeating such things as if it was mainstream.

Why the new name?

It's my favorite fishing lure (shadrap).

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Also Warren on Sanders.  I don't understand what her goal is at this point- she has no path to the nomination.  Overstaying in this race poses a real threat to a progressive ending up in the White House.  The centrists are consolidating.  She knows this.  That goes for Tulsi Gabbard too, like what is she even doing.  

If a progressive presidency was the goal, Warren would see what's happening and step aside.  Not posture around like a contested convention is going to break her way, let alone be good for the party.  And what have her actions bore out?  The fake sexism scandal with Sanders two weeks before Iowa.  The little shots at him being an idealist who can't get things done.  Caving to Super PAC money, due to her money running out because progressives don't trust her anymore.  The net impact has been to boost Joe Biden and undercut Sanders.    

It's worth noting what a remarkable campaign the Sanders people have run.  Nina Turner, David Sirota, Briahna Gray- these are impressive, thoughtful, passionate people.  Their organizational skills and ground game (and of course, internet memers) are top-notch.  I believe they've received the most donations of any campaign ever in history.  The way they've canvassed with poor and especially latino communities could end up being one of the biggest ****yous to Trump of all time.  Just in terms of sheer mass scale and top-to-bottom strength I don't think I've ever seen anything like it.  I can't imagine throwing all of that away to support Joe Biden, who will absolutely get stomped on by Trump.  It's just unthinkable.  

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Nathan J Robinson @NathanJRobinson

It's quite obvious that the millions of $$ being poured into Warren's Super PAC to allow her to "persist" are from those trying to prop up her weak but damaging candidacy in order to keep Bernie from getting the nomination. 

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On 4/25/2019 at 7:48 PM, Sinn Fein said:

This is more "funny" than relevant - but I like funny too...

 

Symone Sanders, who was Bernie Sanders' Communications Director in 2016, and is now a part of Joe Biden's campaign team for 2020 - donated $250 to Pete Buttigieg's campaign in March.

 

:lol:  I guess she is just keeping all of her options open.

HOLY COW!!  IS THAT SYMONE SANDERS MUSIC???????  YOU CAN'T GET PAST HER!

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I wonder how widespread the voting problems in Texas were like the one experienced in Harris County last night? The state has closed hundreds of polling places under the pretense of budget issues and there were long waits in some minority-heavy precincts. 

I'm not ready to point the finger at worried GOP pols yet but they could do a lot to ease my concerns if they'd just show a little enthusiasm for expanded voting rights once in a while.

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On 3/4/2020 at 9:21 AM, roadkill1292 said:

I'm not ready to point the finger at worried GOP pols yet but they could do a lot to ease my concerns if they'd just show a little enthusiasm for expanded voting rights once in a while.

:headbang: :clap: :pickle: Yay Expanded Voting Rights :pickle: :clap: :headbang:

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One of the things that occurred to me, as I continue to see complaints that the process resulted in two 70+ yo whit males - if you look at the last 3 Dem Nominees, you have a Black Male, White Female, and White Male.

Over the course of 3 cycles, that is a pretty diverse group.  You shouldn't expect the nominee to be female/minority in every cycle.

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1 hour ago, Sinn Fein said:

One of the things that occurred to me, as I continue to see complaints that the process resulted in two 70+ yo whit males - if you look at the last 3 Dem Nominees, you have a Black Male, White Female, and White Male.

Over the course of 3 cycles, that is a pretty diverse group.  You shouldn't expect the nominee to be female/minority in every cycle.

And there is a pretty decent chance the VP will be a female/minority in this cycle.

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17 hours ago, Phil Elliott said:

Maybe it ends up being anti-climactic but October "surprises" could be released hourly (yes, including both sides).

This thing is starting to have a strong Idiocracy/parody feel to it already.  I fully expect these next 8 months to be one massive display of human stupidity, with each new day surpassing the last.  My state senator just announced he is spearheading an investigation into this ridiculous Ukraine/Hunter Biden thing.  I'm on the verge of checking out completely as this just seems like one big lose/lose.

 

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2 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

Susan Page @SusanPage · 15m

New MICHIGAN poll: Biden 51%-Sanders 27%. 

 

 

A new national poll from CNN with a big Biden lead. Also polls in Illinois and Florida with huge Biden leads. 538 has moved the model to 1 percent chance for Sanders.

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3 hours ago, Drunken Cowboy said:

A new national poll from CNN with a big Biden lead. Also polls in Illinois and Florida with huge Biden leads. 538 has moved the model to 1 percent chance for Sanders.

This race ended when Pete and Amy dropped out - pushing Biden on to a big Super Tuesday.

Sanders has always been capped by a lower ceiling this election cycle than he had in 2016.  His only hope was that his 35% was more than others in a fractured race. 

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14 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

This race ended when Pete and Amy dropped out - pushing Biden on to a big Super Tuesday.

Sanders has always been capped by a lower ceiling this election cycle than he had in 2016.  His only hope was that his 35% was more than others in a fractured race. 

Exactly 

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Nate Silver
@NateSilver538
·
52s
Just to emphasize how quickly Bernie needs to turn this around. If our projections thru 3/17 (next Tuesday) are right, the delegate count at that time would be Biden 1317, Sanders 992, other 139, with 1531 pledged delegates unallocated.

 


If that holds, Sanders would then have to win *65%* of remaining delegates to earn a majority, which is roughly equivalent to beating Biden by 30 points. In fact, probably more than that, because the states that come after 3/17 (e.g. GA, PA, NJ, MD) are mostly good for Biden.

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3 hours ago, wikkidpissah said:

Sanders's failure to turn Liz Warren quickly to his side against the machine is his death knell

The Sanders campaign floated the idea of VP for Warren.  She was never coming around to his side.  She didn't in 2016 and she won't now.  She engineered the fake sexism/mic'ed up handshake scandal before Iowa, flipflopped on SuperPACs, and tried to triangulate a happy middleground between progressives and the corporate state. 

Her interest is acquiring political power for herself.  If it wasn't, and she cared more about a progressive White House than her own ambition- you know, actually fighting for the things she says she believes in- she would have bowed out after SC and endorsed Sanders after the centrists fell inline behind Biden.  According to some it boils down to sheer pettiness over Sanders campaigning in Massachusetts.  

Oh well, I guess the poor will continue to perish in this country but it's cool she got some SNL bookings out of this thing.  

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35 minutes ago, Gr00vus said:

He was done as soon as the centrists consolidated support behind Biden. This is just the cherry on top.

Slightly disagree. If Liz had hopped to Bernie as blithely as the Trump-psychosis copouts had to the Machine, and they'd raised hands together in making this a fight for the soul of the Party, it might have been just that. 

What i thought the Bootyjudge understood and would stand behind is that the left is as or more pissed off as the right and certainly have more reason to be. Their party hadnt had an idea since Bill Clinton's "let's act as grown up as the Republicans" con a gen earlier until Sanders' unlikely '16 candidacy and the rank & file have steadfastly been turning the corner on accepting a socialized agenda ever since. A Sanders/Warren ticket might have helped the voters put hope ahead of fear.

 

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3 minutes ago, wikkidpissah said:

Slightly disagree. If Liz had hopped to Bernie as blithely as the Trump-psychosis copouts had to the Machine, and they'd raised hands together in making this a fight for the soul of the Party, it might have been just that. 

What i thought the Bootyjudge understood and would stand behind is that the left is as or more pissed off as the right and certainly have more reason to be. Their party hadnt had an idea since Bill Clinton's "let's act as grown up as the Republicans" con a gen earlier until Sanders' unlikely '16 candidacy and the rank & file have steadfastly been turning the corner on accepting a socialized agenda ever since. A Sanders/Warren ticket might have helped the voters put hope ahead of fear.

 

It seems like the liberal wing still just doesn't have the numbers to run the show yet.

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3 minutes ago, Gr00vus said:

It seems like the liberal wing still just doesn't have the numbers to run the show yet.

First thing is to right now eliminate el shmucko on the gop side.

4 years from now anything can happen if Biden decides one term is enough.

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13 minutes ago, Gr00vus said:

It seems like the liberal wing still just doesn't have the numbers to run the show yet.

no, they do - for the first time since the counterculture, they do. this party is 70% leftist right now. Democrats' fear of Trump 2.0 is simply greater than their convictions & DNC is exploiting that. their loss -

ETA: believe me - i been watching this party for almost 60 yrs. they dont do courage -

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13 minutes ago, wikkidpissah said:

no, they do - for the first time since the counterculture, they do. this party is 70% leftist right now. Democrats' fear of Trump 2.0 is simply greater than their convictions & DNC is exploiting that. their loss -

ETA: believe me - i been watching this party for almost 60 yrs. they dont do courage -

Not the ones that actually show up and vote. I think we'll get there in a few more years. 

The thing that gives me hope is that the history of this country (and of much of the developed world) is that things generally trend liberal, and what many things that were "crazy leftist/radical pipe dreams" decades ago became mainstream eventually.

I think single payer, criminal justice system reform (and prisons for profit), cleaner energy, decriminalization of recreational drugs, and some other stuff are just around the corner.

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Just now, Gr00vus said:

Not the ones that actually show up and vote. I think we'll get there in a few more years. 

The thing that gives me hope is that the history of this country (and of much of the developed world) is that things generally trend liberal, and what many things that were "crazy leftist/radical pipe dreams" decades ago became mainstream eventually.

I think single payer, criminal justice system reform (and prisons for profit), cleaner energy, decriminalization of recreational drugs, and some other stuff are just around the corner.

it'll be too late. THIS is the window. next time the left will have this kind of chance, we'll be inexorably descending into a drone economy

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Just now, wikkidpissah said:

it'll be too late. THIS is the window. next time the left will have this kind of chance, we'll be inexorably descending into a drone economy

Of the candidates available, I think only Yang had a realistic handle on this. Bernie has a very ambiguous take on it and I don't see how his policies will really address it.

There are fundamental questions about what kind of society we want to have that are brought up in any realistic consideration of this issue. Most people, liberals included, just aren't comfortable with or willing to face them with the kind of honesty and emotional disengagement necessary to adapt proactively. Work for pay, the anachronistic attitude that hard work = worthwhile work, stuff like that. We're not psychologically prepared as a nation to have that discussion. That is where the next potential actual revolution lies. Do we want to be mostly serfs living at the pleasure of those who own everything, or can we head towards a different, post-capitalist society where we employ technology to alleviate the need for most types of "work" we engage in and much of the scarcities we deal with now?

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  • 2 weeks later...

Not sure where else to put this but for people who enjoy this stuff and have some free time now “The Circus” on Showtime is 7 episodes or so of the Dem nom process. Started in Iowa was made each week it looks like.

I watched up to NH and they are just heading into the Bloomberg debate, they are throwing dirt on Biden. 

Not sure if they are going to make anymore but they went up to early March.

Pretty good background watch.

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I think if I were Joe, it might be good to announce the nominees projected for his administration and then have those people making all the stops as well.  It would be good to have a VP nominee speak about Pence (this will be done anyways), same for SOS and AG and maybe a couple more

Then I would have those guys attend the Joe rallies as well as tour themselves - especially if the nominees are a good demographic mix.

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On ‎3‎/‎22‎/‎2020 at 12:37 AM, The Dude said:

I think if I were Joe, it might be good to announce the nominees projected for his administration and then have those people making all the stops as well.  It would be good to have a VP nominee speak about Pence (this will be done anyways), same for SOS and AG and maybe a couple more

Then I would have those guys attend the Joe rallies as well as tour themselves - especially if the nominees are a good demographic mix.

Joe needs to take a back seat right now let some younger bloods who he will appoint attend the rallies and try pump the crowd up.  Plus that will limit blunders that will be used against him. Joe does nothing for the younger voters and I am worried they will not turn out for him.

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6 hours ago, mrip541 said:

Friend is arguing that the pandemic will result in Trump reelection. Thoughts?

I think come November, most swing voters will realize that the Dem nominee would have handled COVID-19 much, much better than Trump. As well as basically every other issue in the past 3+ years. 

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6 hours ago, mrip541 said:

Friend is arguing that the pandemic will result in Trump reelection. Thoughts?

Seems kind of premature right now to tell, since we are still early in the pandemic. Generally the president gets a favorability boost during a tragedy (9/11, Iran hostage crisis etc), but it is also transient and contingent on a positive outcome. If the bodies pile up it would probably not be beneficial for his election campaign. The ads would write themselves, just show him talking about how it is not a big deal from Jan to Feb. 

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