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TRUMP TO INFINITY AND BEYOND HQ - The Great and Positive Place (8 Viewers)

knowledge dropper said:
And both are make believe boogeymen from the left meant to fear monger.  Easiest thing in our country to do is vote.  It’s been that way for decades.  
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Not in Florida. Republicans have slow walked restoring voting rights to felons, on an one by one individual level, under Rick Scott and others. So when Floridians overwhelmingly vote for amendment 4, DeSantis decides to add what amounts to a modern day poll tax and appeal a lower court decision. It's purely political. Police even say it's in the interest of society to give felons the right to vote after serving their criminal sentence.

 
Jackstraw said:
It's saving my best friends life.
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That's great!

My brother lost his insurance...and his doctor....and he was forced to buy a more expensive policy with such a high deductible that he never got to the point where the insurance kicked in.

He was THRILLED!

....mostly because he was promised (numerous times) that if he liked his doctor, if he liked his insurance, he could keep his doctor, he could keep his insurance.

 
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Opie said:
That's great!

My brother lost his insurance...and his doctor....and had buy a more expensive policy with such a high deductible that he never got to the point where the insurance kicked in.

He was THRILLED!

....mostly because he was promised (numerous times) that if he liked his doctor, if he liked his insurance, he could keep his doctor, he could keep his insurance.
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Employer based insurance is a travesty. I think we can all work together for a better system. 

 
Jackstraw said:
Employer based insurance is a travesty. I think we can all work together for a better system. 
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My brother would disagree.

He was very content with what he had before it was taken from him

One of the big reasons that I work where I do is the insurance package my employer offers.

And if Obamacare was so great and employer based insurance is a travesty...why was Congress (those who forced it on us) exempt from it?
I shouldn't blame the entire Congress....after all....not one Republican voted for it.
It was all done by Democrats.

 
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Opie said:
My brother would disagree.

He was very content with what he had before it was taken from him

One of the big reasons that I work where I do is the insurance package my employer offers.

And if Obamacare was so great and employer based insurance is a travesty...why was Congress (those who forced it on us) exempt from it?
I shouldn't blame the entire Congress....after all....not one Republican voted for it.
It was all done by Democrats.
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What’s the Trump/republican plan?

 
Opie said:
He was THRILLED ....mostly because he was promised (numerous times) that if he liked his doctor, if he liked his insurance, he could keep his doctor, he could keep his insurance.
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Fwiw I agreed and I guess I do agree about  the way Obama made those assurances at the time. Yesterday though the Trump/Barr DOJ LLC asked the Supreme Court to invalidate the whole law.

- The ludicrousness of this is that today (really since 2016) Trumppublicans have been attacking Obama for this line while claiming they are for covering Preexisting conditions, lower rates, providing testing and treatment for the pandemic, and keeping your doctor while at the same time trying to knock tens of millions off their insurance: 

 
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Opie said:
My brother would disagree.

He was very content with what he had before it was taken from him

One of the big reasons that I work where I do is the insurance package my employer offers.

And if Obamacare was so great and employer based insurance is a travesty...why was Congress (those who forced it on us) exempt from it?
I shouldn't blame the entire Congress....after all....not one Republican voted for it.
It was all done by Democrats.
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How did Obamacare take his employer based insurance? 

Obamacare has continued to get more popular the longer it has been in place. 

But I agree I think we can do better. If you're clinging to employer based healthcare as a solution to our problems as a nation as a whole I think that you could expand your imagination a bit. Literally no one else in the world does it this way and they have better results.....for lower prices. 

So many horror stories right now. Guy survives covid for 101 days and gets a million dollar bill on the way out the door. That's not the greatest country in the world stuff right there. That's unacceptable.  

But even if I accept your premise that its bad. Why would you jettison even a poor system for none at all during the biggest health crisis in 100 years? During an election even. I can't grok it. 

 
The General said:
Trump last night on Hannity when asked about his 2nd term agenda:

“I always say talent is more important than experience, I always say that." He said. "I never did this before, I never slept over in Washington. I was in Washington, I think, 17 times. All of a sudden, I’m president of the United States. You know the story. I’m riding down Pennsylvania Avenue with our first lady, and I say, ‘This is great.’ But I didn’t know very many people in Washington. It wasn’t my thing. I was from Manhattan, from New York.

Now I know everybody. And I have great people in the administration. You make some mistakes. Like, you know, an idiot like [John] Bolton, all he wanted to do was drop bombs on everybody. You don’t have to drop bombs on everybody. You don’t have to kill people."

Hannity didn’t even bother with a follow-up question :lol:
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T: I’m the most perfect person, isn’t that true?

Hannity:  :unsure:  Lets take a break.

 
Good morning. I read something in another thread that bothered me. @GoBirds wrote about Trump “I don’t think he would purposefully botch a pandemic”. 

I don’t know anyone who believes that Trump purposefully botched anything. I certainly don’t believe it. I think he screwed up and that he’s not competent. And FWIW, I really don’t care that he’s screwed up. Everybody makes mistakes, everybody makes wrong decisions. Great leaders correct. What makes Trump incompetent is not his errors but his refusal to correct them: instead he doubles down. 

GoBirds also made the point that this is a terrible crisis and that any President would have been in trouble. I agree with this. But I certainly don’t agree that no President would have done better. I believe that almost ANY President would have done better and had a significant positive effect. It has nothing whatsoever to do with Trump’s politics or those who support him. 

 
The General said:
Trump last night on Hannity when asked about his 2nd term agenda:

“I always say talent is more important than experience, I always say that." He said. "I never did this before, I never slept over in Washington. I was in Washington, I think, 17 times. All of a sudden, I’m president of the United States. You know the story. I’m riding down Pennsylvania Avenue with our first lady, and I say, ‘This is great.’ But I didn’t know very many people in Washington. It wasn’t my thing. I was from Manhattan, from New York.

Now I know everybody. And I have great people in the administration. You make some mistakes. Like, you know, an idiot like [John] Bolton, all he wanted to do was drop bombs on everybody. You don’t have to drop bombs on everybody. You don’t have to kill people."

Hannity didn’t even bother with a follow-up question :lol:
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Jesus.

I predicted he would quit early in his first term.

Instead it looks like he will quit right at the end so he can say he didn't lose.

 
matuski said:
Jesus.

I predicted he would quit early in his first term.

Instead it looks like he will quit right at the end so he can say he didn't lose.
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I just can’t see him quitting. Think he’ll keep up the divisive shtick since that seems to be his only move, hope he hits the inside straight again. Blame rigged election/media if he loses like he was setting up to do last time.

Leaves him his hardcore base of followers which will still be a very valuable chip in his post-presidency.

These clips from Hannity though are so bad though :lol:  

 
Don could probably pick up a tenth of a point in approval rating and polling every day until Nov. 3 if he'd shut his yap and order Bill Barr to stop protecting their cronies. But he won't do either of those things.

 
The General said:
Trump last night on Hannity when asked about his 2nd term agenda:

“I always say talent is more important than experience, I always say that." He said. "I never did this before, I never slept over in Washington. I was in Washington, I think, 17 times. All of a sudden, I’m president of the United States. You know the story. I’m riding down Pennsylvania Avenue with our first lady, and I say, ‘This is great.’ But I didn’t know very many people in Washington. It wasn’t my thing. I was from Manhattan, from New York.

Now I know everybody. And I have great people in the administration. You make some mistakes. Like, you know, an idiot like [John] Bolton, all he wanted to do was drop bombs on everybody. You don’t have to drop bombs on everybody. You don’t have to kill people."

Hannity didn’t even bother with a follow-up question :lol:
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Guys, just look the other way, Biden is losing it!

 
cobalt_27 said:
I know manufacturing a mental decline angle is all you can go on with Biden.  Problem is you have is the guy you are contrasting with can’t put together a coherent sentence, can’t sip water without using both hands, and is intellectually deficient to understand even basic concepts that his advisors have to repeatedly walk him through.  
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We can go on more, but this is the Trump thread.  Trolls, time to go.

 
Exactly 4 yeas ago TODAY ABC/WaPo put out this devastating in debt poll of the Trump campaign collapsing in every category and demographic. Remember my MAGA brethren, all polls coming out right now need to be laughed at and not taken seriously. Just like 4 years ago.

 -- Hillary Clinton surged to a broad advantage against Donald Trump in the latest ABC News/Washington Post poll, capitalizing on Trump’s recent campaign missteps. Two-thirds of Americans see him as biased against groups such as women, minorities or Muslims, and a new high, 64 percent, call Trump unqualified to serve as president.

These and other doubts about Trump have produced a sharp 14-point swing in preferences among registered voters, from +2 points for Trump in mid-May, after he clinched the GOP nomination, to +12 points for Clinton now, 51-39 percent. That snaps the race essentially back to where it was in March.

The national poll, produced for ABC by Langer Research Associates, finds another apparent impact of Trump’s problems: Perhaps benefitting from comparison, Barack Obama’s job approval rating has gained 5 points, to 56 percent, matching its high since the early days of his presidency. That includes 55 percent approval specifically on handling the economy.

Underlying Views

Trial heats are hypothetical; they ask which candidate people would support if the election were today – which it isn’t. At least as important are the underlying sentiments informing current preferences, and they show the extent of Trump’s troubles given his recent controversial comments. Among them:

• The public by 66-29 percent think he’s unfairly biased against groups such as women, minorities or Muslims.

• Americans by 68-28 percent think his comment about Judge Gonzalo Curiel was racist. Regardless of whether or not it was racist, 85 percent say it was inappropriate.

• While most Americans disapprove of Clinton’s handling of her email while secretary of state (34-56 percent, approve-disapprove), they’re equally disenchanted with Trump’s handling of questions about Trump University (19-59 percent, with more undecided).

• Most generally, the public by 56-36 percent, a 20-point margin, says Trump is standing against their beliefs as opposed to standing up for their beliefs.

Clinton, further, receives substantially better marks than Trump’s for her response to the lone-wolf terrorist attack June 12 in Orlando, Florida: Americans by an 18-point margin, 46-28 percent, say Clinton did a better job than Trump overall in responding to the attack.

Another result marks a rebuke to Trump in his own party. On June 15, referring to Republican leaders, he said, “Just please be quiet. Don’t talk.” In this survey, however, Republicans and GOP-leaning independents by a wide 62-35 percent say party leaders should speak out when they disagree with Trump, rather than avoid criticizing their likely nominee.

Indeed, Trump is supported by just 77 percent of Republican registered voters in the two-way test in this survey, compared with 85 percent in this group last month and, again, essentially back to his in-party support in March. In the four-way trial he’s at 74 percent among Republicans.

Results of this poll temper the notion that last week’s Brexit vote in the United Kingdom marks a broader dissatisfaction with the status quo that advantages Trump on this side of the Atlantic. On one hand, nativist sentiment, populism and economic anxiety clearly benefitted Trump in the race for the Republican nomination. On the other, his general election campaign requires broader support – and he’s had a dreadful few weeks.

Qualifications, Temperament and Anxiety

Doubts about Trump are reflected in yet-sharper questions about his qualifications for office – perhaps the most basic hurdle for a candidate to clear – and continued widespread anxiety about a potential Trump presidency.

Sixty-four percent of Americans now see Trump as unqualified to serve as president, up 6 points from an already-high 58 percent last month. Thirty-four percent see him as qualified.

Clinton’s numbers are essentially the opposite, and unchanged: Sixty-one percent see her as qualified for the office, 37 percent as not qualified. Moreover, while 33 percent feel strongly that Clinton is not qualified, many more – 56 percent – feel strongly that Trump doesn’t pass this test.

Clinton also continues to surpass Trump easily in views of which candidate has the better personality and temperament to serve effectively. Clinton’s vast 61-28 percent lead on this question is essentially unchanged from last month’s 61-31 percent.

For all this, Clinton is hardly beloved. Fifty percent of Americans say they’re anxious about the idea of her as president (vs. 47 percent who are comfortable with it). When it comes to a Trump presidency, however, anxiety rises to 70 percent, with just 27 percent comfortable with the idea. These are about the same as when last asked in January, and the 70 percent anxiety number matches Trump’s unfavorability rating in an ABC/Post poll last week.

Obama

The president’s resurgent approval rating is particularly welcome for Clinton, given his reported eagerness to campaign for her.

His advance is broadly based, and political divisions remain high – 88 percent approval for Obama among Democrats, 50 percent among independents and just 18 percent among Republicans. Tellingly, 85 percent of Obama approvers support Clinton, vs. just 8 percent of Obama disapprovers.

Obama’s approval rating is similar to both Bill Clinton’s 57 percent and Ronald Reagan’s 56 percent at about this point in their presidencies, and far better than George W. Bush’s 29 percent.

That said, discontent with the status quo does remain, and poses some risk for Clinton as the incumbent party’s nominee. Registered voters by 56-39 percent say they’d rather see the next president set the nation in a new direction from Obama’s rather than continuing his course. “New direction” voters favor Trump over Clinton by a wide margin, 64-26 percent – but those who want to stay Obama’s course back Clinton even more widely, 87-6 percent.

It’s notable, too, that the number of Americans who prefer a new direction is about the same now as it was at this stage of Reagan’s presidency – when the nation went on, nonetheless, to elect Reagan’s vice president George H.W. Bush, to the top job.

Groups

Partisanship can follow political preferences, and in this poll Democrats account for 36 percent of all adults and 37 percent of registered voters – a non-significant (+3) difference from last month. (The former is numerically its highest since 2009, the latter, since 2012.) Republicans account for 24 percent of all adults and 27 percent of registered voters, about their average in recent years, with the rest independents.

This accounts for little of the shift in voter preferences, however. Even using the same party divisions from last month’s ABC/Post survey, in which Trump was +2, he’d now be -8. The reason, mentioned above, is his comparatively weak performance among Republicans – 77 percent support – compared with Clinton’s support among Democrats, 90 percent.

Obama’s gain in approval, similarly, is not fundamentally based on any change in partisanship – last month’s partisan divisions would put him at 54-42 percent now, vs. his actual 56-41 percent in this poll.

There are notable shifts among groups in the latest vote preference results. Largest is a 16-point loss for Trump, and 17-point advance for Clinton, among white Catholics, a potentially key group that accounts for one in seven registered voters.

Clinton, further, is now leading among young adults, a group in which Trump was surprisingly competitive last month. Trump is -11, and Clinton +11, among registered voters who don’t have a college degree, as well as among liberals and conservatives alike. And Trump is -10, Clinton +11, among white men.

Clinton continues to prevail mightily among nonwhites – by 77-15 percent now, vs. 69-21 percent last month; that includes 90-8 percent among blacks and 69-20 percent among Hispanics. (For an adequate sample size, this combines results among blacks, and separately among Hispanics, from May and June.) Trump leads Clinton by 50-40 percent among whites, down from 57-33 percent last month.

In another division of potential interest, Clinton leads Trump by 57-33 percent in the states that Obama won in 2012 (+24 points), while Trump leads more narrowly, by 51-41 percent (+10), in the states Mitt Romney won four years ago.
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https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/clinton-opens-12-point-lead-trump-thirds-biased/story?id=40114224
 

 
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Does that make you feel good @Widbil83? 
Im feeling pretty good because I’m drinking sangria tonight. I guess looking at news from 2016 does the same for you as good red wine does for me? 

 
Widbil83 said:
These and other doubts about Trump have produced a sharp 14-point swing in preferences among registered voters, from +2 points for Trump in mid-May, after he clinched the GOP nomination, to +12 points for Clinton now, 51-39 percent. That snaps the race essentially back to where it was in March.
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I’m just going to say I agree with Widbill and Dems better take Trump very seriously no matter the number. They need to go at it like they’re 10 points down and close with maximum effort. Huge dose of arrogance went with Hillary’s campaign. Close.

 
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SaintsInDome2006 said:
I’m just going to say I agree with Widbill and Dems better take Trump very seriously no matter the number. They need to go at it like they’re 10 points down and close with maximum effort. Huge dose of arrogance went with Hillary’s campaign. Close.
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Yes Dems need to take Trump seriously. They need to stay motivated. And they will. 
 

But it’s over. Can’t you sense it? Most people know it. I think Trump knows it. 

 
Widbil83 said:
Exactly 4 yeas ago TODAY ABC/WaPo put out this devastating in debt poll of the Trump campaign collapsing in every category and demographic. Remember my MAGA brethren, all polls coming out right now need to be laughed at and not taken seriously. Just like 4 years ago.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/clinton-opens-12-point-lead-trump-thirds-biased/story?id=40114224
 
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These polls were probably very accurate at the time.

I guess nobody remembers the bomb dropped by Comey two weeks before the election that gave a lot of folks a reason to drop Clinton and vote for DJT. It was always about the the lesser of two evils between these two with the majority of voters and Comey's decision to re-open the investigation into her, and announce it when he did, caused those voters that were only slightly over the fence for Clinton to reverse course. 

5 months away vs. 2 weeks away. Get it?

 
It will definitely tighten up but Biden is obviously the favorite right now by a pretty large margin. Should honestly be way larger given the circumstances.

 
If it wasn’t already over, the attempt to get rid of Obamacare is probably the final nail in the coffin. The word is the Republican leadership begged him not to do this and he refused to go along with them. 
Likely guarantees a Democratic majority in the Senate. 

 
I can only conclude that he knows he’s going to lose and has decided to try and take out Obama’s biggest achievement while he still can as an act of spite. That’s the only way this move makes any sense at all. 

 
rustycolts said:
Looks like this thread has turned into another let's bash Trump party. I guess if the few remaining Trump supporters quit posting all together you guys are going to get awful bored.
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Rather than complain about it why not address the issues? 
You’re mostly  right: if you’re looking for a “safe” thread to cheer Trump without any pushback you’re probably never going to get it. But if you’re looking for a thread to engage in a real discussion about the President, his good points and bad points, his chances at re-election, let’s do it. 

 
timschochet said:
Rather than complain about it why not address the issues? 
You’re mostly  right: if you’re looking for a “safe” thread to cheer Trump without any pushback you’re probably never going to get it. But if you’re looking for a thread to engage in a real discussion about the President, his good points and bad points, his chances at re-election, let’s do it. 
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Nope

 
I think that if I were Donald Trump, I could turn this around even at this late date. Here’s what I would do: 

1. I would make a national speech. Without actually apologizing, I would state that all of my moves in the last several months were based on the emphasis of getting the economy going because if it doesn’t, it could do as much damage as the virus. But I never intended for the virus to rise as a result. 
2. I would call on the entire nation to be careful in reopening. I would urge social distancing. I would say that it was a mistake not to wear a mask and admit that even I make mistakes. And then, on camera, I would put a mask on and call on all Governors to make it mandatory. 
3. I would declare that the federal government is taking over distribution of all tests and PPE; I would explain that this is so the states don’t have to compete with each other. I would call for increased funding and a national effort. I would say, “Call this the Trump virus from this point forward. I am taking responsibility and I’m going to solve it.” 
4. I would explain that while all of my criticisms against Obamacare remain intact, getting rid of it in the middle of a pandemic is too disruptive. I would drop the lawsuit and hint that it might be resumed once the current emergency has been resolved. 
5. I would declare myself open to all issues of police reform and criminal reform, without weakening law and order. I would admit that systemic racism does exist but there are ways to solve it without getting rid of the police: for instance, a national database of the bad police, and making chokeholds illegal. 
6. I would explain that the main reason we can’t elect Biden is because an economic recovery is impossible if taxes are raised. This would be my main focus until November: Biden will raise your taxes. I would drop all other issues. 
7. Finally, I would announce that I am going to all of the banks in this country and calling on them to have a 60 day holiday just as FDR did, with no rents or mortgages due. All landlords would then be required to do the same. This is the best way to have as quick a recovery as possible

Would all of this get Trump re-elected? Who knows? But I believe it would make it a race again. 
 

 
Really doesn't matter who wins. I think I have enough to make it through several Democrat terms in office even if they control all 3 branches before I die. Even have some in gold in case everything really goes to hell if and when the Dems take over and totally wreck our society and economic system.

I only hope that I have enough left over to leave my kids and grandkids something after I'm gone. I fear I won't after the Dems totally destroy the American way.

 
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rustycolts said:
Really doesn't matter who wins. I think I have enough to make it through several Democrat terms in office even if they control all 3 branches before I die. Even have some in gold in case everything really goes to hell of and when the Dems take over and totally wreck our society and economic system.
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In all seriousness congrats on being in this position. Been working my ### off to get to that point and every single time I seem to feel like it’s got a shot to happen the economy/life takes a turn.  I‘ve still got about 20 years but man that feels like 20 lifetimes right now.  Enjoy it my friend.  

 
dkp993 said:
In all seriousness congrats on being in this position. Been working my ### off to get to that point and every single time I seem to feel like it’s got a shot to happen the economy/life takes a turn.  I‘ve still got about 20 years but man that feels like 20 lifetimes right now.  Enjoy it my friend.  
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You will get there just be smart pay yourself first good things will happen. 20 years still plenty of time to secure a nice retirement. Good luck brother.

 
timschochet said:
I suspect we will hear more and more of this from conservatives and Trump supporters during the next few months. 
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Can you give it a rest?  Joe hates the victory laps in the first place and you're taking one 5 months in advance.  We know your prediction.  Noted.  We'll see if you're right in 5 months but Jesus you don't need to come piss in this thread with the same tripe day in and day out.

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Can you give it a rest?  Joe hates the victory laps in the first place and you're taking one 5 months in advance.  We know your prediction.  Noted.  We'll see if you're right in 5 months but Jesus you don't need to come piss in this thread with the same tripe day in and day out.
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He is just frustrated because he always wanted to become a banker.

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Can you give it a rest?  Joe hates the victory laps in the first place and you're taking one 5 months in advance.  We know your prediction.  Noted.  We'll see if you're right in 5 months but Jesus you don't need to come piss in this thread with the same tripe day in and day out.
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I’m not taking any victory laps. I take no pleasure in this whatsoever. 

 
rustycolts said:
Really doesn't matter who wins. I think I have enough to make it through several Democrat terms in office even if they control all 3 branches before I die. Even have some in gold in case everything really goes to hell if and when the Dems take over and totally wreck our society and economic system.

I only hope that I have enough left over to leave my kids and grandkids something after I'm gone. I fear I won't after the Dems totally destroy the American way.
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Guys like us are going to have our nest eggs raided and get harvested for organs.  

 
knowledge dropper said:
Guys like us are going to have our nest eggs raided and get harvested for organs.  
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Biden is not going to tax you like Bernie would have. Biden gets that heavy taxation is bad for economic recovery. 
 

In the coming war between us moderate Dems and the AOC types, you might want to lend us your support. 

 
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